J
Jeff_Davis
Guest
Cincinnati's first Radio En Espanol is on AM 1320. They must have flipped sometime around 1:00 this afternoon.
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Oboy. Racist radio. Just what Hamilton County needs.
T
Toddy-0
Guest
Can't wait for those $13.20 gift certificate giveaways to Taco Bell!
Will Fischer Homes buy time?
Will Fischer Homes buy time?
Que?major said:
It is such a shame that my family immigrated to this country legally, fought in two world wars to keep our enemies from invading us, just to have knuckleheads make fun of us who want to keep what our families fought and died for. These "south of the border" illegals do not want to become Americans, if they did they would learn English. To pander to them is wrong. To cater to them is wrong.
Press 1 for English, press 2 until you learn English.
Press 1 for English, press 2 until you learn English.
T
Toddy-0
Guest
No offense but there are a lot of LEGAL immigrants who speak spanish in Cincinnati. Just like the late 1880's and 90's and the flow of German and Rhine Valley immigrants into Cincinnati.
Cincinnati's make up of Latinos isn't just of Mexico, but all of Central America and South America. There is a strong Peruvian influx.
In a course I took at UC (Greater Cincinnati and the Tri-State Region), you learn about the genesis and evolution of Cincinnati, how certain neighborhoods became Over-The-Rhine, Tusculum, Western Hills, Hyde Park, etc. A true melting pot. You also learned of the generational curve. Cincinnati tends to change every 3rd or 4th generation. Take the 1880's. A german influx, a great deal of german-english dialogue, including street signs in both language. As that generation formed the next, and so on, the use of German waned and English became dominant. I think this is the case here. 1st generation Latino/Hispanics move into Cincinnati, produce the 2nd and 3rd generation and you'll see that English will still be the common language.
You know, I haven't heard much derogatory comments about the amount of Asian or Koreans that live in the metropolis of Cincinnati. Why the Mexicans? I know that the issue is illegal vs legal. But painting with a broad stroke is poor judgment.
Cincinnati's make up of Latinos isn't just of Mexico, but all of Central America and South America. There is a strong Peruvian influx.
In a course I took at UC (Greater Cincinnati and the Tri-State Region), you learn about the genesis and evolution of Cincinnati, how certain neighborhoods became Over-The-Rhine, Tusculum, Western Hills, Hyde Park, etc. A true melting pot. You also learned of the generational curve. Cincinnati tends to change every 3rd or 4th generation. Take the 1880's. A german influx, a great deal of german-english dialogue, including street signs in both language. As that generation formed the next, and so on, the use of German waned and English became dominant. I think this is the case here. 1st generation Latino/Hispanics move into Cincinnati, produce the 2nd and 3rd generation and you'll see that English will still be the common language.
You know, I haven't heard much derogatory comments about the amount of Asian or Koreans that live in the metropolis of Cincinnati. Why the Mexicans? I know that the issue is illegal vs legal. But painting with a broad stroke is poor judgment.
My complaint is against ALL ILLEGALS. The comment was specifically "south of the border". Central and South America, which you mention, are "south of the border".
My complaint is threefold. 1. The majority of these new immigrants are ILLEGAL. I see no way anyone can argue this. 2. Most refuse to learn English. 3. They are changing the American culture of assimilation. They do not want to be Americans, they just want to make $$ here to send home.
I welcome them if: 1. They enter this country legally, 2. Learn English, 3. Swear allegiance to the United States of America.
It does not matter to me where they are from. However, there must be a limit. Not everyone on planet earth can live in this country.
Your comment about what has happened in the past was true about the past....Present day "illegal invaders" are not assimilating. That is the problem. If they would assimilate, you wouldn't notice them.
So....for the purpose of this thread, wanting broadcast stations to broadcast in English 20 hours a day would force the assimilation issue. A good thing in my opinion.
Thanks for your comments.
My complaint is threefold. 1. The majority of these new immigrants are ILLEGAL. I see no way anyone can argue this. 2. Most refuse to learn English. 3. They are changing the American culture of assimilation. They do not want to be Americans, they just want to make $$ here to send home.
I welcome them if: 1. They enter this country legally, 2. Learn English, 3. Swear allegiance to the United States of America.
It does not matter to me where they are from. However, there must be a limit. Not everyone on planet earth can live in this country.
Your comment about what has happened in the past was true about the past....Present day "illegal invaders" are not assimilating. That is the problem. If they would assimilate, you wouldn't notice them.
So....for the purpose of this thread, wanting broadcast stations to broadcast in English 20 hours a day would force the assimilation issue. A good thing in my opinion.
Thanks for your comments.
"Major":
There are several assumptions in your statements that are wrong. Unfortunately, this thinking is widespread across the country. What makes it sad is that many of these anti-Latino comments come from the grandchildren and great-grandchildren of immigrants who suffered the same kind of abuse: hard work at low pay and long hours; living in crowded tenements and low-grade housing; discrimination in schools and workplace. Children were beaten for speaking foreign languages on the school grounds-- I kid you not! There are many instances in personal records of the kids who got the beatings. --immigrants got only the jobs nobody else wanted.
Then they were called with epithets -- Kraut, Bohunk, Dago, Frog, Greaser, etc.
Nothing ever changes in human behavior. The same old prejudice prevails against immigrants today, only now it comes from high levels of government and media and is clothed in all sorts of legitimate, noble-sounding excuses: "They are taking American jobs!" "They don't want to assimilate!" "They don't want to speak English!" "All they want is money!" "They are a threat to our government!" "I am not opposed to immigrants, you understand, just that they ought to be controlled."
Requiring radio stations to broadcast 20 hrs/day in English, as you suggest, is clearly opposed to freedom of speech, which is guaranteed by the Constitution, something I am sure you and people of your persuasion would uphold. It does not bother me that several Houston AM stations broadcast long hours in Asian languages. What does that do to me? Why should a single station broadcasting in Cincinnati, one station among three dozen, bother you?
Before radio, in the late 1800's and 1900-1920, each of America's largest cities held several daily foreign-language newspapers. My own city had two German and one French paper. Newspapers were THE media of the day back then, and I suppose there were people who thought foreign language newspapers were a menace back then, supposedly undermining the American way of life. But no one who thought about the matter seriously thought these posed a threat to our culture. I suggest you read H.L. Mencken's work on the American Language; he was a famous writer and newspaperman in Baltimore back in the early 1900's.
Why were and are they no threat? Any sociologist or anthropologist will tell you that the first generation, the immigrants, tend to move to the same cities or areas of the country, to be among people and ways of living that are familiar to them. They continue to speak their language, maintain their customs, and keep in touch with the Old Country as much as they can. The foreign language is spoken in the home and the immigrants learn English as they can, some more, some less, some not at all.
But their children go to school and learn English, and they make friends who speak English, and they are fascinated with American ways especially youthful ways of life. They speak the foreign language with their parents and elders and often act as a bridge between their parents and relatives and friends and the American culture. They are brought up by their parents and friends in the Old Country ways and language. That is all their parents know, but the kids are learning quickly to become Americans, and they speak English well and often without accent.
By the time they are grown and marry and start families, they tend to raise their children to speak English, and these children, the immigrants' grandchildren, are thoroughly acculturated to the American culture and prefer to speak English, even if they have mastery of the foreign language.
This pattern has been repeated over and over in America's history-- and unless you are a Native American, it was true of your ancestors. My own father and his brothers were raised by a German father who was grandson of German immigrant parents, and my father and uncles knew not a word of German.
This will prove to be the pattern with Hispanics, too. In fact, a Hispanic marketing corporation says that, in three generations, their studies show that only 13% of Hispanic children/grandchildren will prefer Spanish as their language-- the rest will prefer to speak in English. That already is proving true for many young Hispanics-- look at the successful Hispanic magazines that are published in English; look at the NBC cable channel MunDos and the new Hispanic English channel Sí TV.
Major, you and many good people like you are being misled by a bunch of radio ranters who are misinformed people. Sure, there are problems. Personally, I do not think the government ought to have to print ballots, driver license instruction pamphlets, etc., in Spanish or any other language. But that is the result of U.S. court decisions, not some ranting liberals.
In short, the Hispanics who are here in the overwhelming majority want their kids to learn English and be proficient in it, want to stay in this country and earn a good living by hard work, and want to buy into the American dream. Are they illegal? Yes. Are they to be despised? No. Look, Major, I asked a Mexican who was working as a janitor in the local K-Mart why an educated man like him was doing the work of a janitor-- it was obvious by his conversation and bearing that this man had been well educated and brought up. He calmly replied, "If I do not work here, my family back in Guanajuato will have nothing to eat."
They are not here for a handout. They are here to work. They deserve our respect for this; they do not want a handout, and they are not here to get on social security to live the life of bums. (We have enough Americans who do that already.) You would deny them a radio station with which to be informed and entertained?
MikeSFNM
There are several assumptions in your statements that are wrong. Unfortunately, this thinking is widespread across the country. What makes it sad is that many of these anti-Latino comments come from the grandchildren and great-grandchildren of immigrants who suffered the same kind of abuse: hard work at low pay and long hours; living in crowded tenements and low-grade housing; discrimination in schools and workplace. Children were beaten for speaking foreign languages on the school grounds-- I kid you not! There are many instances in personal records of the kids who got the beatings. --immigrants got only the jobs nobody else wanted.
Then they were called with epithets -- Kraut, Bohunk, Dago, Frog, Greaser, etc.
Nothing ever changes in human behavior. The same old prejudice prevails against immigrants today, only now it comes from high levels of government and media and is clothed in all sorts of legitimate, noble-sounding excuses: "They are taking American jobs!" "They don't want to assimilate!" "They don't want to speak English!" "All they want is money!" "They are a threat to our government!" "I am not opposed to immigrants, you understand, just that they ought to be controlled."
Requiring radio stations to broadcast 20 hrs/day in English, as you suggest, is clearly opposed to freedom of speech, which is guaranteed by the Constitution, something I am sure you and people of your persuasion would uphold. It does not bother me that several Houston AM stations broadcast long hours in Asian languages. What does that do to me? Why should a single station broadcasting in Cincinnati, one station among three dozen, bother you?
Before radio, in the late 1800's and 1900-1920, each of America's largest cities held several daily foreign-language newspapers. My own city had two German and one French paper. Newspapers were THE media of the day back then, and I suppose there were people who thought foreign language newspapers were a menace back then, supposedly undermining the American way of life. But no one who thought about the matter seriously thought these posed a threat to our culture. I suggest you read H.L. Mencken's work on the American Language; he was a famous writer and newspaperman in Baltimore back in the early 1900's.
Why were and are they no threat? Any sociologist or anthropologist will tell you that the first generation, the immigrants, tend to move to the same cities or areas of the country, to be among people and ways of living that are familiar to them. They continue to speak their language, maintain their customs, and keep in touch with the Old Country as much as they can. The foreign language is spoken in the home and the immigrants learn English as they can, some more, some less, some not at all.
But their children go to school and learn English, and they make friends who speak English, and they are fascinated with American ways especially youthful ways of life. They speak the foreign language with their parents and elders and often act as a bridge between their parents and relatives and friends and the American culture. They are brought up by their parents and friends in the Old Country ways and language. That is all their parents know, but the kids are learning quickly to become Americans, and they speak English well and often without accent.
By the time they are grown and marry and start families, they tend to raise their children to speak English, and these children, the immigrants' grandchildren, are thoroughly acculturated to the American culture and prefer to speak English, even if they have mastery of the foreign language.
This pattern has been repeated over and over in America's history-- and unless you are a Native American, it was true of your ancestors. My own father and his brothers were raised by a German father who was grandson of German immigrant parents, and my father and uncles knew not a word of German.
This will prove to be the pattern with Hispanics, too. In fact, a Hispanic marketing corporation says that, in three generations, their studies show that only 13% of Hispanic children/grandchildren will prefer Spanish as their language-- the rest will prefer to speak in English. That already is proving true for many young Hispanics-- look at the successful Hispanic magazines that are published in English; look at the NBC cable channel MunDos and the new Hispanic English channel Sí TV.
Major, you and many good people like you are being misled by a bunch of radio ranters who are misinformed people. Sure, there are problems. Personally, I do not think the government ought to have to print ballots, driver license instruction pamphlets, etc., in Spanish or any other language. But that is the result of U.S. court decisions, not some ranting liberals.
In short, the Hispanics who are here in the overwhelming majority want their kids to learn English and be proficient in it, want to stay in this country and earn a good living by hard work, and want to buy into the American dream. Are they illegal? Yes. Are they to be despised? No. Look, Major, I asked a Mexican who was working as a janitor in the local K-Mart why an educated man like him was doing the work of a janitor-- it was obvious by his conversation and bearing that this man had been well educated and brought up. He calmly replied, "If I do not work here, my family back in Guanajuato will have nothing to eat."
They are not here for a handout. They are here to work. They deserve our respect for this; they do not want a handout, and they are not here to get on social security to live the life of bums. (We have enough Americans who do that already.) You would deny them a radio station with which to be informed and entertained?
MikeSFNM
D
Dirty_Harry
Guest
MikeSFNM said:
I generally agree with most of what you wrote in this article except for this. This sounds like a candidate for the smallest violin in the world. Wah! Wah! Life is so tough ... people are so prejudiced ... a colored man can't get ahead in the white man's world. None of this stuff means SQUAT ... it is ALL about what you think about yourself and how you treat others. If you get a good education, take advantage of what this country offers, be a nice, polite person and not go around with a chip on your shoulder thinking someone owes you a living, then everything will be alright.
Oh, and lest you think I am just some insensitive conservative person, I'm not. I grew up in one of those very same homes you described along with a parish full of kids just like myself. I have a good life and it doesn't particularly bother me if people might not care for my foreign background. Again, it's all about what you think about yourself.
We have to stop with this whiny talk about people being victims and hate, and "hate crimes", because some people really buy into this stuff. All this sort of mentality does is hold people back.
MikeSFNM said:
I have mixed feelings on the subject. English was a second language in our home. I went to elementary school not knowing much English except for what I saw on Bugs Bunny. I had to see the speech therapist until 4th grade to get rid of my eastern European accent. I still had a little bit of my accent through my teens but now speak am excellent in speech ... but have a horrible accent in my native tongue.
My pattern pretty much follows what you wrote above, except my people usually ended up in the same towns as their relatives. We spoke our language probably through college at home ... but now are primarily english speakers, even with the parents. Most of the people in my parish are very productive citizens, have their houses paid for, don't carry a lot of debt, and nobody I know of is on welfare or public assistance except for temporary unemployment or if they have some kind of debilitating medical condition.
Our working class parish back home is full of factory workers, tailors, construction workers, auto mechanics, restaurant owners (not exactly people who hob-nob with the Tafts), but there are several doctors, lawyers and educated professionals among their children. There are a few trouble-makers, but an above-average, actually way above-average (I would say 50 or 60%), number of their children get college and graduate degrees.
Anyway, bottom line is don't hate the Mexicans. They are good Christian people and most of them are hard-working, family oriented.
If you want to hate a group of immigrants, hate the Somalis. In any city where they are large in number, they flood the court system with their bad behavior. Go to any courthouse and look and see how many of them you find. The prosecutors hate them. They are completely lawless.
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