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Nick
Guest
Can anyone give me some feedback on the Lansing market? Best/worst sounding stations...best/worst group to work for...etc.
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OldiesCat
Guest
WITL (country) is typically the top-performer in Lansing; WFMK (AC) is pretty consistent. WJIM-FM switched from Oldies to CHR last year when WHZZ dropped CHR for the Jack format, as "Mike FM". IMHO, Mike is not a very good sounding VAriety Hits station. WJXQ is usually the rock leader plus there are two pretty good classic rock stations in WVIC and WMMQ.
Citadel probably gets the nod as the least-objectionable company to work for. MacDonald is a family company with the typical family micro- managing. Rubber City has a small-market mindset rap but you have to give them credit for doing pretty well in Lansing.
Hey-day of Lansing radio was WVIC's 20 year dominance as a top 40 station- one of the great med-market top 40s in America for quite awhile and WITL has been THE country leader since the early seventies.
Citadel probably gets the nod as the least-objectionable company to work for. MacDonald is a family company with the typical family micro- managing. Rubber City has a small-market mindset rap but you have to give them credit for doing pretty well in Lansing.
Hey-day of Lansing radio was WVIC's 20 year dominance as a top 40 station- one of the great med-market top 40s in America for quite awhile and WITL has been THE country leader since the early seventies.
If you want a slightly outdated look at the market, check out my http://theradioblog.blogspot.com/2005/11/first-annual-south-central-michigan.html]"Radio Round-Up"[/url]. I'm working on another one (I've determined that bi-annual is the way to go as opposed to annually as I originally planned), but most of what's there is still applicable. What has changed between when I wrote the post and now:
WJKN's imaging is getting better (thanks to the direction of my good friend Steven Hudson).
WQTX recently flipped to oldies, and while it's straight off the bird, it fills the gap WJIM left when they flipped to CHR.
WVKS (technically not in the market, but can be heard throughout the southeastern parts of the state) is progressively getting worse and worse with stale playlists and a morning show that's about as interesting as foam rubber.
WVIC is sounding more and more like a classic rocker every day, and Lord knows we need more of that format around here. :
Thanks to a split in the church that runs the station's parent network, WCVM is now known as RadioX, but there really isn't much of a difference in programming.
WUFN is somewhat picking up the slack that WSAE left when they flipped to "Home.fm", but for the most part they've stayed the same.
WJIM is sounding better and better. The music is still great, and the morning show is continually improving, as are the midday girl ("The" Anne) and the night girl (Madison Rally). Unfortunately, afternoon jock Domingo doesn't seem to be making much progress towards improvement. The addition of weekender Sean Kelley was a good move, and he proves that weekends in Mid-Michigan actually can have personality.
WNWN seems to be shaking up their morning show, but it appears to only be the sidekick who's leaving.
WITL recently started advertising on TV, a good move to retain their dominance.
WHZZ brought Tim Barron in to do mornings, which made a lot of people happy.
WBZV still sucks. I know that's not a change; I just like to bring it up whenever I can. ;D
As mentioned in a later post, Keith Curry was canned at WKFR for doing his own thing against the will of Cumulus corporate (despite the fact that listeners were responding extraordinarily well to the changes he made). The station did keep at least some of the modern sound Curry brought in, but for the most part they've turned right back into the station they had been. Except during the night show, which Ray Thomas has dubbed "Ray's Pig Pen Radio". His show has improved greatly, and the music from 7-Midnight is just about dead-on for what a CHR should be. They got rid of DJ Latin Assassin's 10:00 Mini-Mix, though, which was a bad mistake (management's decision, though, not Ray's). Thankfully, they've also eliminated that stereo-separated echo I continuously complained about (and an inside source told me it was due to an older, faulty ISDN line).
WKHM seems to be evolving into a Hot AC lately (as opposed to the AC/Hot AC hybrid masquerading as a CHR that it had been). J-Rod seems to be changing his show up a bit to suit the formatics changes, as well, and they've been changes for the better.
WSAE is slowly... you'd miss it if you didn't look very closely... slowly growing a new listener base. It's not exactly something that's caught Jackson on fire, but they're building. The imaging and production is stellar, thanks again to Steven Hudson, and it seems like they're returning to students as the main talent for the station, which is excellent. They never should have removed the student staff from the station in the first place. The music in the new format still seems to clash, though.
WJR recently turned on IBOC. It's entirely inaudible now... no kidding at all. The sidebands are so loud that they drown out the analogue audio It sounds like utter crap.
WKHM is, like it's FM counterpart, slowly improving. After being caught with their pants down when the first batch of strong storms rolled through (they didn't air any of the watches or warnings that were issued), they've been regularly doing live updates on the weather every time severe storms come this way. It would be nice to have them do all of their weather and news live throughout the daytime hours, but apparently that's still asking too much. Also, Nakisha Page was either fired or left of her own volition.
Otherwise, everything in that post is the same.
WJKN's imaging is getting better (thanks to the direction of my good friend Steven Hudson).
WQTX recently flipped to oldies, and while it's straight off the bird, it fills the gap WJIM left when they flipped to CHR.
WVKS (technically not in the market, but can be heard throughout the southeastern parts of the state) is progressively getting worse and worse with stale playlists and a morning show that's about as interesting as foam rubber.
WVIC is sounding more and more like a classic rocker every day, and Lord knows we need more of that format around here. :
Thanks to a split in the church that runs the station's parent network, WCVM is now known as RadioX, but there really isn't much of a difference in programming.
WUFN is somewhat picking up the slack that WSAE left when they flipped to "Home.fm", but for the most part they've stayed the same.
WJIM is sounding better and better. The music is still great, and the morning show is continually improving, as are the midday girl ("The" Anne) and the night girl (Madison Rally). Unfortunately, afternoon jock Domingo doesn't seem to be making much progress towards improvement. The addition of weekender Sean Kelley was a good move, and he proves that weekends in Mid-Michigan actually can have personality.
WNWN seems to be shaking up their morning show, but it appears to only be the sidekick who's leaving.
WITL recently started advertising on TV, a good move to retain their dominance.
WHZZ brought Tim Barron in to do mornings, which made a lot of people happy.
WBZV still sucks. I know that's not a change; I just like to bring it up whenever I can. ;D
As mentioned in a later post, Keith Curry was canned at WKFR for doing his own thing against the will of Cumulus corporate (despite the fact that listeners were responding extraordinarily well to the changes he made). The station did keep at least some of the modern sound Curry brought in, but for the most part they've turned right back into the station they had been. Except during the night show, which Ray Thomas has dubbed "Ray's Pig Pen Radio". His show has improved greatly, and the music from 7-Midnight is just about dead-on for what a CHR should be. They got rid of DJ Latin Assassin's 10:00 Mini-Mix, though, which was a bad mistake (management's decision, though, not Ray's). Thankfully, they've also eliminated that stereo-separated echo I continuously complained about (and an inside source told me it was due to an older, faulty ISDN line).
WKHM seems to be evolving into a Hot AC lately (as opposed to the AC/Hot AC hybrid masquerading as a CHR that it had been). J-Rod seems to be changing his show up a bit to suit the formatics changes, as well, and they've been changes for the better.
WSAE is slowly... you'd miss it if you didn't look very closely... slowly growing a new listener base. It's not exactly something that's caught Jackson on fire, but they're building. The imaging and production is stellar, thanks again to Steven Hudson, and it seems like they're returning to students as the main talent for the station, which is excellent. They never should have removed the student staff from the station in the first place. The music in the new format still seems to clash, though.
WJR recently turned on IBOC. It's entirely inaudible now... no kidding at all. The sidebands are so loud that they drown out the analogue audio It sounds like utter crap.
WKHM is, like it's FM counterpart, slowly improving. After being caught with their pants down when the first batch of strong storms rolled through (they didn't air any of the watches or warnings that were issued), they've been regularly doing live updates on the weather every time severe storms come this way. It would be nice to have them do all of their weather and news live throughout the daytime hours, but apparently that's still asking too much. Also, Nakisha Page was either fired or left of her own volition.
Otherwise, everything in that post is the same.
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dubya3qt
Guest
What makes Whittle so dominant for so long? Are they that good or is Lansing just a country market and they win by default? Could another country station knock them off?
WITL is not that great and never has been.
This situation is typical in medium sized markets around the country. Country listeners are the most loyal. Any direct competitor would have to spend so much money and be so patient for results, that the station wouldn't be profitable.
Basically, it's not worth the effort financially.
This situation is typical in medium sized markets around the country. Country listeners are the most loyal. Any direct competitor would have to spend so much money and be so patient for results, that the station wouldn't be profitable.
Basically, it's not worth the effort financially.
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OldiesCat
Guest
What are you talking about?
This isn't so much about critical/artistic brilliance but it is about performance. And, WITL has been a top performer in the Lansing market for about 30 years. And, they bill out the wazoo; their revenue number is literally always #1 in the market. How is that not worth the effort financially?
I really don't like country music, but you have to tip your hat to WITL, if for nothing more than being a ratings winner and cash cow for 3 decades.
This isn't so much about critical/artistic brilliance but it is about performance. And, WITL has been a top performer in the Lansing market for about 30 years. And, they bill out the wazoo; their revenue number is literally always #1 in the market. How is that not worth the effort financially?
I really don't like country music, but you have to tip your hat to WITL, if for nothing more than being a ratings winner and cash cow for 3 decades.
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OldiesCat
Guest
WITL
You're right in that it would be very expensive to directly attack and defeat WITL.
But, to say WITL "is not great and never has been"? There are country and other stations all over America who would love to have WITL's ratings and revenue success over the past 30 years.
Please just keep it in perspective.
You're right in that it would be very expensive to directly attack and defeat WITL.
But, to say WITL "is not great and never has been"? There are country and other stations all over America who would love to have WITL's ratings and revenue success over the past 30 years.
Please just keep it in perspective.
WITL does produce results, but I think it's a result of heritage, signal strength, and the country audience being the most loyal of all formats. They have also been smart, played it safe and not made any huge mistakes. But it takes more than that to be a "great" station.
What has WITL done the is truely inovative?
Name one jock that has ever been on that station that transcends the format, someone that people who don't listen to country would still tune in for becuase they are such a great personality. When people talk about true personalities in Lansing radio history, they talk about Tim Baron, Jazz McKay, George McFly, and plenty of others....but none from WITL.
What has WITL done the is truely inovative?
Name one jock that has ever been on that station that transcends the format, someone that people who don't listen to country would still tune in for becuase they are such a great personality. When people talk about true personalities in Lansing radio history, they talk about Tim Baron, Jazz McKay, George McFly, and plenty of others....but none from WITL.
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OldiesCat
Guest
WITL
Who cares if it's "critically acclaimed"? It works and has for over 3 decades.
And, what does "truly innovative" mean? I bet it's a lot different to radio people that it is to the only people who really count: their listeners.
There are a lot of radio stations across America that radio people think are "great" but haven't had near the success or consistency as stations like WITL. Again, I'm not a "country guy", don't know anybody there or really give a rip about them. But all this "well, they're not this/they're not that" is all quite moot, since they've dominated the market since the early seventies.
U2CCU said:
Who cares if it's "critically acclaimed"? It works and has for over 3 decades.
And, what does "truly innovative" mean? I bet it's a lot different to radio people that it is to the only people who really count: their listeners.
There are a lot of radio stations across America that radio people think are "great" but haven't had near the success or consistency as stations like WITL. Again, I'm not a "country guy", don't know anybody there or really give a rip about them. But all this "well, they're not this/they're not that" is all quite moot, since they've dominated the market since the early seventies.
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fredflintstone
Guest
Josh C. said:
Let's not skip this one. 'JR - with a dynamite signal - used to do well in Lansing, and in other outstate markets (Flint, Jackson). Now they flush all that down the toilet. And for what? Dozens of people with HD radios. I suppose this is good for Lansing market sales - especially JIM; now advertisers can't buy JR and get Lansing (or Jackson and Flint, for that matter).
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OldiesCat
Guest
WJR
That line of thinkig (buy WJR and you'll also get Flint, Lansing, Ann Arbor, etc.) is about 35 years old. Nobody buying radio in Detroit, nor specifically buying WJR, does so with even the thought it'll do them any good in Lansing.
That line of thinkig (buy WJR and you'll also get Flint, Lansing, Ann Arbor, etc.) is about 35 years old. Nobody buying radio in Detroit, nor specifically buying WJR, does so with even the thought it'll do them any good in Lansing.
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hammondo
Guest
Heritage means alot. I know that way of thinking is "35 years old" - actually alot OLDER, When we owned several stations about a hundred miles from Chicago (ALL of them with killer ratings that BEAT ALL the Chicago stations ) many BUYS wound up ONLY on WGN "because of the signal that covered our counties" despite their distance from us.
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kirkiefan
Guest
Anything new about Owosso's WOAP "Michigan Catholic Radio" ever returning to the air???
Supposedly they wanted to move to the Lansing area and nothing ever happened...I venture to guess that idea was nixed by the FCC
1080 is dead in Michigan and Ohio.(except for WTIC, Hartford)
Supposedly they wanted to move to the Lansing area and nothing ever happened...I venture to guess that idea was nixed by the FCC
1080 is dead in Michigan and Ohio.(except for WTIC, Hartford)
U2CCU said:
Banana Don Jefferson.
kirkiefan said:
According to the FCC, they were granted the CP to go to Waverly, but only for daytime power. This is what I don't get...they apply for a COL to go directional with SIX towers, one of the most complicated and costly arrays to build, yet they're applying to the FCC at least once a year for silent station STA's.
Though they withdrew the application for it, they're still pleading their case for nighttime power, stating that nighttime power would have no bearing on WTIC. At 4500 watts of nighttime power at that dial position, that's highly open to argument.
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