Last Act for Don Barrett's LARadio.com?

[davideduardo]

I'm sure anybody would be more than happy to host his archives for no charge given that the articles remain unaltered and attributed to Don. I could set up a special archive site to host and maintain them on a subdomain.

There is a lot of content stored on his site; I don't think the cheap accounts would work as there is both a storage and a bandwidth issue. I usually log at least 4 to 5 TB a month of transfers on my site, and the cheap plans won't allow that.

 

[michael hagerty]

But I cannot imagine how much of an overhead he must have that he cannot continue doing it. Webhosting these days is about 8 bucks a month and writing the daily blog post maybe takes an hour or two at the most. Hundreds of regular housewives are writing online posts these days and I doubt they spend more than that time. I doubt Don is listening to every radio station 24/7 and reporting upon it. He probably has a large array of contacts that now feed him the leads and so this can continue. All he has to do is articulate it in a daily post.

Oh, man. Tell you what. Find me one of those "regular housewife" blogs that covers 18 different items in a day (as Don's did today), depends on input from outside the author's own life (as Don's does every day), and that has to get the details right or lose credibility that's taken 15-plus years to build. Then we'll ask her if she does it day in, day out, start to finish in 2 hours.

Try 5 or 6, I would imagine. And that's just to gather the information, write and edit. He can't not answer the phone, can't skip checking the e-mail, and new stuff undoubtedly comes up. Add time for deciding what not to run and chasing down leads that can't be confirmed.

For somebody who "loves" Don and thinks LARadio is a "bargain", you (intentionally or not) insulted both him and his work with your comparison.

 

[Tim L]

While I admit that I havent been to Don's site more than a handful of times, I applaud anyone that tries to keep a good news and history site going..The sniping is really unneccessary..

 

[westfield60]

Michael

I realize that my comments were "rough around the edges" but I think that is what the perception is out there. Then the yearly threat of ending the site also adds to this perception of where is the big expense of running a one-man site. What Don needs to figure out is why on earth are people not subscribing for $3.95 a month. That is an insanely low amount and if people aren't even biting at that then the problem needs to be re-examined. I know he tried a free site and looked for advertisers but maybe that wasn't tried long enough or if I recall it was tried during the worst period when online advertising was down to it's lowest point. All signals indicate that online advertising is back up again and maybe it might be worth trying something like that again before pulling the plug.

I don't recall how much he used to charge before but $3.95 seems so low that I know there is some truth in that if it is so dirt cheap then people's natural bias would lead them to believe it has no value. Maybe he should find an annual number that people find is fair but one that also relays some value in what they will be getting. I know I pay $60 for my yousendit account which I probably use twice a year, I spend about the same on my usergroup account which I similarly use once or twice a year.

Another problem I think in perception is that his site looks old. He needs an uplift. I think advertisers need to feel their ads are reaching a larger audience and that the owners of the site are not just "housewives" doing this as a hobby. Look at this site radio-info. They did a face lift a few years ago and while I don't know about their revenue stream they do always seem to have ads on the site. It looks like its a corporate run page. It doesn't take much to do a face lift.

I think Don needs to consult with a top notch marketing company. He certainly has value for what he does but I think he has no marketing skills.

 

[ChannelFlipper]

I love how after 15 years of doing the site on a shoestring, testing different pricing models and consulting with literally dozens of industry experts, and relying on the fruits of his website to support his family, and finally reaching the sad conclusion that perhaps there just isn't enough of a market for the product he is selling, here come our dimestore experts telling him how to run a site, what facelift he ought to have, what pricing model he should use and how much time and money it costs to produce the site. Honestly, charge more for a service that he can't get people to buy at a lower price point? That is your enlightened contribution?

With all due respect to the members of the peanut gallery, and to paraphrase Iron Mike Tyson, you all couldn't live two minutes in Don's world. The fact that he made what was always a dicey business model work for 15 years is a testament to his ingenuity and entrepreneurship.

 

[fybush]

Over here on the other side of the country, I've been at it for just a little longer than Don with my NorthEast Radio Watch/fybush.com venture. I can echo much of what Don's been saying - it's hard to get readers to pay, even for specialized information, when the "Internet=free" ethos is so dominant. Unlike Don, I do sell advertising, but that's a challenge, too: it's a full-time job to itself (which, thankfully, I have a spouse/business manager to help with), and the market is still painfully soft. I also do some merchandising related to the site (Tower Site Calendar, anyone?), and that helps a bit, but the upside there is limited as well.

And then there's that perception, as seen in this thread, that "it's a blog, it's not actual work." I think Michael Hagerty, if anything, underestimated the amount of time and effort that Don puts into LARadio.com. What Don's doing is actual journalism, and good journalism at that, and it takes a hell of a lot more than "an hour or two a day" to make that happen. (I know NERW and its sister publications are a full-time job and then some for me, and by themselves they don't make enough to pay the bills here, which is why I have to wear a couple of other hats, too, to make ends meet.)

Don't get me wrong - I love doing what I do, and I know Don's derived tremendous enjoyment from doing LARadio (he's told me as much)...and maybe someday one of us will find a model to make it pay for itself.

 

[SDRadio]

Over here on the other side of the country, I've been at it for just a little longer than Don with my NorthEast Radio Watch/fybush.com venture. I can echo much of what Don's been saying - it's hard to get readers to pay, even for specialized information, when the "Internet=free" ethos is so dominant. Unlike Don, I do sell advertising, but that's a challenge, too: it's a full-time job to itself (which, thankfully, I have a spouse/business manager to help with), and the market is still painfully soft. I also do some merchandising related to the site (Tower Site Calendar, anyone?), and that helps a bit, but the upside there is limited as well.

Amen Scott. My costs for SDRadio.net is $2,000 a year. I have traffic; but pale in comparison to LARadio -- or NERW. I tried the eight buck hosting service and they suck worse than an eight tower array out of phase. It's more than hosting, folks. There's phone service, computers, and oh yes, the time per day. My loudest critics are those who offer nothing but complaints and that wears thin. On costs: Thankfully WordPress is inexpensive. I salute you, Scott, for what you do; but frankly I too see the business model of being one for love; not for profit.

Thanks and see YOU on the radio, in ((Stereo)) where available.

 

[michael hagerty]

And then there's that perception, as seen in this thread, that "it's a blog, it's not actual work." I think Michael Hagerty, if anything, underestimated the amount of time and effort that Don puts into LARadio.com. What Don's doing is actual journalism, and good journalism at that, and it takes a hell of a lot more than "an hour or two a day" to make that happen. (I know NERW and its sister publications are a full-time job and then some for me, and by themselves they don't make enough to pay the bills here, which is why I have to wear a couple of other hats, too, to make ends meet.)

Scott: I estimated 5 to 6 hours just of actively putting a single day's post together. I have my own automotive website and a single review (about the length of a single one of Don's longer features) routinely takes me an hour to 90 minutes to write. And I've been writing professionally for 40 years now.

I'm willing to bet that for Don, it's not how to fill the other hours of the day, it's how to stop. I've been privileged to spend an hour or so with him in person, and we keep up a correspondence. I'm certain that if Don's not sleeping, he's working on LARadio.com.

Westfield60's "hour or two a day" is painfully off the mark, as are estimations of the revenue attainable through online advertising for a site with a narrow audience.

Here's Alexa.com's analysis:

Statistics Summary for laradio.com

Laradio.com is ranked #1,056,623 in the world according to the three-month Alexa traffic rankings. The site's visitors view 1.5 unique pages each day on average. This site's content places it in the “Industry News” category of internet sites. Roughly 68% of visits to Laradio.com are bounces (one pageview only). Visitors to the site spend approximately two minutes per visit to the site and 64 seconds per pageview.


Online advertising is still measured in dimes, not dollars. Unless you're in the Top 100,000, you're probably not making significant money.

 

[LKellerIII]

I've stayed out of this conversation - primarily because I stopped reading laradio.com about 4 years ago. But it was not due to any dissatisfaction with the site on my part. Frankly, if anything, it was because Don was so devoted, and provided so much content that I didn't have time to read it all. Simply stated, I got much busier at work; I'm not a speed-reader, and I just didn't have the time.

The other factor was - I'm only a radio fan (not a radio professional), so my interest was primarily in the nostalgia he provided, given that I left Los Angeles 37 years ago. I loved hearing stuff about old Top 40 station reunions, Steele, Morgan, Ballance, BMR, and Hull, but had no real interest in Tim Conway Jr, John and Ken, etc. - given that I've only heard them for a few minutes at most during my short trips to the Southland. Frankly, I mostly listen to KRTH and KIIS-FM when I visit (I have a teenage daughter).

But if I were a radio professional, or just a radio fan who lived in LA, I would still consider laradio.com an invaluable resource, and would mourn its loss. I hope it doesn't happen.

And Michael - being an amateur car enthusiast, I love your website too, and really appreciate it...when I have the time to read it.

 

[Tim L]

I realize my situation isnt nearly as similar to Scott or my friend that runs Ohio Media Watch. I started Cleveland Classic Media over four years ago with the idea of posting once or twice a week about Vintage Cleveland area broadcasting..I thought about doing Google ads but was never comfortable with the possibility that inappropriate ads might sneak through..Once I figured out how to actually scan and post pictures and videos, I found that to do a good post correctly could take 2-3 days, plus the expense of traveling to Akron and Cleveland to purchase research material(I dont drive) can be limiting at times..

At this point I do maybe 1-3 posts a month on average..I use Facebook a lot with a "Cleveland Classic Media" Page..I can put something up quickly and easily and sometimes get immediate response..On the blog itself I average 85-120 visitors a day..It's definitely a labor of love as I dont ever expect to make money from it at all..I hope Don can keep things going as there are never enough good sites out there..

 

[michael hagerty]

Tim L: Google Ads is safe, and allows you to block categories of ads from appearing on your site, but at your traffic level, you could be as much as two years away from seeing your first check (which happens when your account reaches $100). If you can boost your readership, or they are more active at clicks than the average, it could happen quicker, but you get the basic idea.

 

[Fornax]

I love how after 15 years of doing the site on a shoestring, testing different pricing models and consulting with literally dozens of industry experts, and relying on the fruits of his website to support his family, and finally reaching the sad conclusion that perhaps there just isn't enough of a market for the product he is selling, here come our dimestore experts telling him how to run a site, what facelift he ought to have, what pricing model he should use and how much time and money it costs to produce the site. Honestly, charge more for a service that he can't get people to buy at a lower price point? That is your enlightened contribution?

With all due respect to the members of the peanut gallery, and to paraphrase Iron Mike Tyson, you all couldn't live two minutes in Don's world. The fact that he made what was always a dicey business model work for 15 years is a testament to his ingenuity and entrepreneurship.

Hey Flipper don't you have to admit that's mostly what gets posted on this board? A lot of back seat driving without a lot of expertise.

 

[kenglish]

We run a local TV show here in SLC, which sometimes seems to focus more on bloggers than anything else.
I'll always remember when one of them, who "coaches" other bloggers, said that "a really good blogger, working full time, can make as much as twelve thousand dollars a year".

Sounds like a Labor of Love, not a big money making enterprise.

 

[BossRadioDJ]

I've read the posts on this thread with great interest, and concur with those regarding the work that goes into doing a radio-related website and/or blog.

The amount of work that goes into every aspect of researching and writing a blog that is attempting to have at least a modicum of journalistic integrity, let alone a website/virtual museum that attempts to cover the entire history of the fourth-largest radio market in the United States, can be daunting. Try it sometime, just for kicks! (Seriously. I dare you.)

After about a year, the blog was earning about $12 a month in Google AdSense revenue. Hosting for the museum website, out of my pocket, was about ten times that each month.

Add to that the pure joy of hundreds of emails each week telling me how I should be doing the website, or questioning why I don't have a recording of their grandfather from his show back in 1936 (I still don't know why I don't) -- as well as the constant flow of messages from folks who worked for two years as vacation relief at some pea-shooter station demanding to know why I was personally blocking them from being inducted into the Bay Area Radio Hall of Fame. (Why? Because I ain't got anything better to do!) -- and my sense of satisfaction and fulfillment with my choice of doing this is easy to understand.

Meanwhile, I was ignoring my "real job" by spending three or four hours a day on radio-related "fun." Once I got my priorities straight, everything got good again!

Don Barrett has been one of my heroes for years, and while my situation isn't the same, I empathize with him 110%. Walk a mile on his keyboard before making any judgements about him and his unquestionably exceptional work.

By the way, if you're up in our neck of the woods this Saturday, stop by for Radio Day By The Bay at the CHRS Bay Area Radio Museum in Berkeley. I'll be the happy, smiling guy who no longer does 99% of the work any more!

 

[OCradiodude]

Well I see ChannelFlipper made it into Don's column yesterday! Congratulations!
===
Radio-Info.com provides a rich perspective on the radio business. A huge component of the website is a message board for the top markets. The site allows opinions to be published anonymously so I have no idea who ChannelFlipper is, but this was posted on July 8:

“I love how after 15 years of doing the site on a shoestring, testing different pricing models and consulting with literally dozens of industry experts, and relying on the fruits of his website to support his family, and finally reaching the sad conclusion that perhaps there just isn't enough of a market for the product he is selling, here come our dime store experts telling him how to run a site, what facelift he ought to have, what pricing model he should use and how much time and money it costs to produce the site. Honestly, charge more for a service that he can't get people to buy at a lower price point? That is your enlightened contribution?

With all due respect to the members of the peanut gallery, and to paraphrase Iron Mike Tyson, you all couldn't live two minutes in Don's world. The fact that he made what was always a dicey business model work for 15 years is a testament to his ingenuity and entrepreneurship.”

 

[ChannelFlipper]

This was sent to Don by someone who who reads the site unbeknownst to me. I was as surprised as anyone to see it. Since Don didn't know who 'ChannelFlipper' was, I identified myself (as the nobody I am) to him in a letter he posted today.

 

[SDRadio]

This was sent to Don by someone who who reads the site unbeknownst to me. I was as surprised as anyone to see it. Since Don didn't know who 'ChannelFlipper' was, I identified myself (as the nobody I am) to him in a letter he posted today.

That was a very nice, thoughtful and to the point letter.