Local Programming

[nickelodeonfan97]

Why is there so little local programming on Canadian TV stations? It seems like every hour is programmed by the networks.

Also, how come Canadian TV stations don't use local branding? Most stations just go by the network name and that's it. Why not call CJOH in Ottawa ''CTV 13'', CFTO in Toronto ''CTV 9'', etc.?

 

[Yeziknoradio]

Why is there so little local programming on Canadian TV stations? It seems like every hour is programmed by the networks.

Also, how come Canadian TV stations don't use local branding? Most stations just go by the network name and that's it. Why not call CJOH in Ottawa ''CTV 13'', CFTO in Toronto ''CTV 9'', etc.?

It's all about cutting costs to the extreme of cutting costs to maximize profits.

There used to be a time when City TV Toronto was exactly that, with no other City TV in the Country.
It aired Toronto Rocks and many other fine local shows.
(even Cityline was once a local Toronto program...not today!)

Today, it's all about getting everyone across Canada to watch the exact same show at a designated time because it's a lot cheaper that way.

As for using numbers, good idea, but the days of numbers (for station id) are over. Digital boxes changed everything.

It's still a good strong point that they should make better effort to say "CTV Toronto" Or CTV Ottawa" more often.
Sometimes the CTV 11pm newscast runs late, misleading the viewer into believing they're watching a local newscast at 11:30 when they're not.

I liked things better when it was CFTO news for Toronto, and CJOH news for Ottawa etc, myself, but business is business, I guess.

 

[nickelodeonfan97]

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[FreddyE1977]

Sorry to hear this. I used to really enjoy "Good Day, Melonville"

 

[fybush]

As for using numbers, good idea, but the days of numbers (for station id) are over. Digital boxes changed everything.

It changed long before the digital boxes.

Canadian regulators require cable systems to put local VHF signals on different channel numbers to prevent signal ingress, and so long before digital cable, anyone watching CTV in Toronto was seeing CFTO on channel 8 on cable, or CBC on channel 6. And because cable penetration is so high and OTA viewing levels so low, I'd bet that barely 5% of viewers in Toronto would even recognize CFTO as "channel 9" or CBLT as "channel 5."

 

[mjlarochelle]

Canadian regulators require cable systems to put local VHF signals on different channel numbers to prevent signal ingress, and so long before digital cable, anyone watching CTV in Toronto was seeing CFTO on channel 8 on cable, or CBC on channel 6. And because cable penetration is so high and OTA viewing levels so low, I'd bet that barely 5% of viewers in Toronto would even recognize CFTO as "channel 9" or CBLT as "channel 5."

That is definitely true, but in some U.S. cities the channel numbers used in branding have nothing to do with cable position. For example in Detroit, Comcast carries WJBK (FOX 2) on Cable 12, WDIV (Local 4) on Cable 14, WXYZ (Channel 7) on Cable 17, WMYD (MyTV20) on Cable 3, and WKBD (CW50) on Cable 5. WWJ/62 and WTVS/56 haven't promoted their OTA channel numbers in years.

From my limited experience Time Warner tends to keep OTA and cable channel numbers more consistent than Comcast does, at least with VHF (pre-6/12/09) stations.

 

[nickelodeonfan97]

DirecTV and Dish Network carry local stations on their OTA channel numbers.

 

[w9wi]

DirecTV and Dish Network carry local stations on their OTA channel numbers.

"Channel 6" on Dish or Direct is a different frequency from "Channel 6" OTA. The two don't interfere with each other.

OTA "Channel 6" and "Channel 6" on analog cable are the *same* frequency. If there's an OTA station on RF channel 6 in Ottawa, and the Ottawa cable system carries a signal on analog cable channel 6, and the cable isn't perfectly shielded -- the OTA signal will leak into the cable and interfere with analog cable 6. Symptom is a ghost -- sometimes a SEVERE ghost.

IIRC the CRTC term is "impaired channel", and that a signal that is required to be carried may not be carried on the same channel as an OTA station. Unfortunately the practice is perfectly legal here in the U.S..

 

[mjlarochelle]

"Channel 6" on Dish or Direct is a different frequency from "Channel 6" OTA. The two don't interfere with each other.

I think the point that was being made was that the OTA channel number is used for channel position on a variety of modern digital platforms. The channel lineups on Canada's two satellite providers are a real hodgepodge; I'd rather find CFTO on 9 no matter what, instead of 2xx or 3xx on some platforms and 8 on others.

 

[e-dawg]

Speaking of Local Canadian Programming and National Canadian Program. I was in Montreal for a while and I'm amazed how many local programming in the French Market (7 million in Quebec) vs the English Market. In Quebec, they have a local/french version of The Doctors (Les Docteurs) on SRC, Family Fued (La Guerre de las Clans), Cash Cab (Taxi Payant), Hole in the Wall (cancel by FOX) (Le Mur), Big Brother (Loft Story) on V, Are you Smarter than a 5th Grade (La Classe de 5eme), Deal or No Deal (La Banquier) on TVA. Even the French Canadian has more local/regional production than their English Counterpart like their own sitcom, Camera Cafe, Virginie, Double Occupation. etc. On the English side, I only find Little Mosque on the Pararie, Degrassi:TNG, no Canadian version of the game shows, like Deal or No Deal, Who wants to be a Millionaire, The Price is Right etc. (Even they did, it only last for 1 season). 25 English speaking Canadians has to rely on the United States for television programming and with little or no local Canadian programming. Is there something wrong with this picture?

 

[Bluenoser]

Speaking of Local Canadian Programming and National Canadian Program. I was in Montreal for a while and I'm amazed how many local programming in the French Market (7 million in Quebec) vs the English Market. In Quebec, they have a local/french version of The Doctors (Les Docteurs) on SRC, Family Fued (La Guerre de las Clans), Cash Cab (Taxi Payant), Hole in the Wall (cancel by FOX) (Le Mur), Big Brother (Loft Story) on V, Are you Smarter than a 5th Grade (La Classe de 5eme), Deal or No Deal (La Banquier) on TVA. Even the French Canadian has more local/regional production than their English Counterpart like their own sitcom, Camera Cafe, Virginie, Double Occupation. etc. On the English side, I only find Little Mosque on the Pararie, Degrassi:TNG, no Canadian version of the game shows, like Deal or No Deal, Who wants to be a Millionaire, The Price is Right etc. (Even they did, it only last for 1 season). 25 English speaking Canadians has to rely on the United States for television programming and with little or no local Canadian programming. Is there something wrong with this picture?

There are also local versions of $xx,000 Pyramid (Pyramide, SRC) and Match Game (Atomes crochus, V) as well. There's also a local version of Thank God You're Here (Dieu merci, TVA) that does a lot better in the rating than NBC's ever got . V also runs the original British version of Top Gear, voiced over in French. Infomercials on Quebec TV are a mixed bag, running from local ones for psychics and a Montreal sex shop to voiced over or dubbed US ones (Thane features prominently in TVA's late-night block).

 

[azumanga]

In Quebec, they have a local/french version of...Big Brother (Loft Story) on V...

"Loft Story" was actually based on the French version of the same name, which in turn was based on "Big Brother". In 2010, V decided to replace Loft Story with the original Big Brother format.

On the English side... no Canadian version of the game shows, like Deal or No Deal, Who wants to be a Millionaire, The Price is Right etc. (Even they did, it only last for 1 season).

DOND and Millionaire had Canadian versions, though they were all short-lived (DOND Canada for only a few weeks; Millionaire Canada for only a couple of special episodes). In terms of Millionaire, the Canadian specials gave CTV its highest ratings ever, yet it was never brought back, opting only for the US version straight off ABC.

In addition, there were some game shows produced in Canada that were also seen in the US, some using the original American formats -- examples include the 1980 "Let's Make a Deal" with Monty Hall from Vancouver, and the early 1970s "Beat The Clock" from Montreal with American hosts Jack Narz and, later, Gene Wood.

 

[mjlarochelle]

Speaking of Local Canadian Programming and National Canadian Program. I was in Montreal for a while and I'm amazed how many local programming in the French Market (7 million in Quebec) vs the English Market. In Quebec, they have a local/french version of The Doctors (Les Docteurs) on SRC, Family Fued (La Guerre de las Clans), Cash Cab (Taxi Payant), Hole in the Wall (cancel by FOX) (Le Mur), Big Brother (Loft Story) on V, Are you Smarter than a 5th Grade (La Classe de 5eme), Deal or No Deal (La Banquier) on TVA. Even the French Canadian has more local/regional production than their English Counterpart like their own sitcom, Camera Cafe, Virginie, Double Occupation. etc. On the English side, I only find Little Mosque on the Pararie, Degrassi:TNG, no Canadian version of the game shows, like Deal or No Deal, Who wants to be a Millionaire, The Price is Right etc. (Even they did, it only last for 1 season). 25 English speaking Canadians has to rely on the United States for television programming and with little or no local Canadian programming. Is there something wrong with this picture?

Canadian Price is Right? When did that air? I've never heard of it...

The Canadian networks are simply too lazy. Corner Gas was an excellent show, but nobody seems to want to produce a sizable number of good Canadian-made shows.

Mexico, with a lower GDP per capita than Canada (albeit a larger population) seems to have no trouble producing a large amount of domestic prime-time programming. And the language difference doesn't seem to be the reason, as most major American shows are readily available with Spanish dubbing.

 

[Yeziknoradio]

deleted

 

[Yeziknoradio]

??? Ok I am confused. Were those American shows with French voice overs? Or actual French programming locally.

 

[azumanga]

Canadian Price is Right? When did that air? I've never heard of it...

There was no canuck version of TPIR, other than a French version, "Misez Juste", which ran on TQS in 1994-1995.

 

[stationless listener]

You would think that with cosmopolitan cities such as Vancouver and Toronto that there would be more diversity in terms of what local television can offer than what's been shown so far. The only diversity, outside of Quebec, on broadcast channels are the OMNI's (actually OMNI 2) and the French CBC. Even then, the OMNI's also air imported (read: American) programming. Of course, nothing can beat Los Angeles when it comes to having diverse programming on broadcast television in North America. Still, I would think that television in Toronto could be much more localized and diverse.

 

[mjlarochelle]

You would think that with cosmopolitan cities such as Vancouver and Toronto that there would be more diversity in terms of what local television can offer than what's been shown so far. The only diversity, outside of Quebec, on broadcast channels are the OMNI's (actually OMNI 2) and the French CBC. Even then, the OMNI's also air imported (read: American) programming. Of course, nothing can beat Los Angeles when it comes to having diverse programming on broadcast television in North America. Still, I would think that television in Toronto could be much more localized and diverse.

One of the problems in Toronto is that all of the stations there cover very large parts of Ontario. That means local advertisers in the Toronto area are less likely to advertise on Toronto television, as their advertising dollars would be wasted broadcasting ads to London, Ottawa, and Sudbury. Advertisers want their advertising to reach a certain geographic area, and a coverage map for CBLT, for instance, would be a turnoff for a local Toronto business wanting to target the GTA. It works great for national advertisers, but not local ones. With less local advertising dollars there's less money for local programming.

That said, I have to wonder if the mom-and-pop stores in Woodbridge advertising on OMNI Television during The Price is Right realize they're wasting their money advertising to me. No matter how much I might like their store, I'm not driving two hours to Woodbridge.

 

[e-dawg]

Except for CKVR A 3, and CFTO CTV 9 which doesn't serve the rest of the province of Ontario like CBLT CBC 5, CHCH 11, CBLFT SRC 25, CITS CTS 36, CIII-TV Global 41, CFMT OMNI 1 47, CKXT SUN TV 52, and CJMT OMNI-2 69. Others stations have repeaters thru out Ontario especially Ottawa, and London.

 

[spunker88]

"Channel 6" on Dish or Direct is a different frequency from "Channel 6" OTA. The two don't interfere with each other.

OTA "Channel 6" and "Channel 6" on analog cable are the *same* frequency. If there's an OTA station on RF channel 6 in Ottawa, and the Ottawa cable system carries a signal on analog cable channel 6, and the cable isn't perfectly shielded -- the OTA signal will leak into the cable and interfere with analog cable 6. Symptom is a ghost -- sometimes a SEVERE ghost.

IIRC the CRTC term is "impaired channel", and that a signal that is required to be carried may not be carried on the same channel as an OTA station. Unfortunately the practice is perfectly legal here in the U.S..

The cable companies should have their cables better insulated against that, otherwise signal loss would be high and cables would act as an antenna. Older less insulated first generation lines for cable TV did have this problem. For example inWatertown, NY WWNY wasn't ever carried on cable channel 7 and I do remember some interference on cable channel 7 from the OTA signal coming in. But CKWS is carried on channel 11 with a fairly strong signal originating on OTA 11 and doesn't cause any problems with today's better insulated system. Some of this also had to deal with older TVs, which seemed to grab a strong OTA signal without an antenna much easier than newer TVs. This may have been from the 300 ohm terminals used on older TVs which had less shielding than coax cable does.