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Looking for AGC

For a budget setup, I'd suggest using a stereo dBx as the AGC and then feeding it into a TC Electronic Triple C - They appear on eBay fairly often for not alot of $$$. Compared to the DSP9024, they are only 3-band of digital processing but the menu is easier to navigate and the limiter section has a fast release unlike the piffy 500mS you get on the 9024. This gives you some gain-riding, 3 bands of processing and a final limiter.

Another tip while I'm here - I have used the Triple C on the insert point of a microphone channel a few times and it really brings a vocal to life... As well as the YellowTec VIP, many stations here in the UK are actually using TC Finalizers on the mic chain, too - nothing budget there when the mic is a u87 ;D
 
I appreciate the suggestions on the RDL products, and have used them many times before (and still do), but the units recommended are all mono, and I would prefer the stereo image (even though many patrons of the bar don't probably notice it) be kept as much in phase as possible. Sure I could run two together for stereo, but trying to balance them may be too time consuming. Due to the structure of the RDL boxes, I have had problems with them picking up noise in the past too. I'm looking for something with blinky lights or meters to give me some indication of how aggressively (or not) it is working. I was not aware of the TC Electronics Triple C. That is more of what I am looking for. I will check that out. Thanks Charlie. Yes, and the DBX 166XS or 1066 look like good boxes to use too. I like multiband though, if I can get it. EQ is already in the bar, so that really isn't necessary in the box I'm looking for. I really do like the Symetrix 422 I'm using. I'll probably keep that as the first box the signal hits. Just listening to it all by itself last night, it does the job fairly well. Another box after it should hit my sweet spot.
 
I've used the TC Finalizer Express on a web stream, and it sounds punchy and transparent, with reasonable tweakability. For a hardware solution, it's in current production, and relatively inexpensive on eBay.

Breakaway Live would be my current choice for streaming or in that club application, however, but in my recent experience, it's glitchy on a 64 bit OS. (OT: anyone using the Telos ProStream streaming appliance with the internal Omnia 3 band?)

The RDL stick-on comp limiter sounds surprisingly good, but there's no adjustability and it's not really suitable for processing foreground music in a club. Perfect for protective limiting for non-critical (i.e. newsroom actuality) recording! :)
 
All of a sudden the canvas has changed. With all of this discussion, it got me thinking a little bit. I may completely re-evaluate what I was using. It is possible the Symetrix 422 I was using could be replaced by a Aphex 320 Compellor. The Behringer Ultra Dyne DSP 9024 could also end up being replaced with a TC Electronics Finalizer or Triple C. One of which might also be paired with a Aphex 723 Dominator II...and with no PD's, or GM's looking over my shoulder. I had completely forgotten about the old Aphex standards. I just realized I have a total of 4 rack spaces to work with. Thanks again. I appreciate the info and suggestions.
 
Brian Bowers said:
I appreciate the suggestions on the RDL products, and have used them many times before (and still do), but the units recommended are all mono, and I would prefer the stereo image (even though many patrons of the bar don't probably notice it) be kept as much in phase as possible. Sure I could run two together for stereo, but trying to balance them may be too time consuming. Due to the structure of the RDL boxes, I have had problems with them picking up noise in the past too. I'm looking for something with blinky lights or meters to give me some indication of how aggressively (or not) it is working. I was not aware of the TC Electronics Triple C. That is more of what I am looking for. I will check that out. Thanks Charlie. Yes, and the DBX 166XS or 1066 look like good boxes to use too. I like multiband though, if I can get it. EQ is already in the bar, so that really isn't necessary in the box I'm looking for. I really do like the Symetrix 422 I'm using. I'll probably keep that as the first box the signal hits. Just listening to it all by itself last night, it does the job fairly well. Another box after it should hit my sweet spot.
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Brian,

If you are already running EQ, I would just do the dbx before that. If you get a multiband, take the eq out or they will fight each other. I think you would be really happy with a dbx running relatively light level control. It won't be 'pumpy' and I believe it will get you where you want to be. I used one on a radio stream for a while (before I bought a larger multi channel compressor to do all the stations). I had great results and the jocks on that station sucked on level control.

Chris
 
Hey Chris, from my experience with most compressors, DBX included, they are great at reducing (compressing) levels, but not really great in bringing up gain (AGC) if needed. Of course most major highly expensive Orbans and Omnias do that just wonderfully, but most of the 1 rack and 2 rack units don't really ride gain like the big boys. The Symetrix 422 seems to do a halfway decent job of that, but I haven't played with a Aphex 320 in a while now either. Maybe it does it better than the 422. And I really don't want to always apply too much compression, which to me reduces dynamics, just so my outcome resembles AGC. Does that make sense? BTW, EQ is after processing.
 
Too bad you don't have more rack space. I threw in an old 8200 at a bar that I work with, backed off the settings, turned off the PreEmph and Boom.... everything in one box... Never has to be rebooted or anything. Just runs.
 
Sgeirk said:
It might cost $400, if you bought a gently used computer (or built one) and an emu 0404, for example.

Sounds like all you really need is the cheapest version of the software. Enhancer? Which is $30, I believe.
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Breakaway enhancer is great! It is installed on the PC on which I am typing right now. I like that it even has the "FM" mode that limits highs according to the 75us pre-emphasis (but with a flat output)

Problem is it will only process on-board audio files or web streams. It will not process audio passing 'through' the PC.

I like the old 8200 idea, and for this purpose an Optimod-TV unit (8282) could be used, as well as one of the DAB units (6200 or 6300) They tend to be still a little pricey used, so if you had the budget, I might go for the Omnia One.

It all depends on how much you "get off" on processing! I would love to install 'real' audio processing in a bar, or particularly a dance club, where some DJs can produce sudden and ear-splitting level differences!
 
I think you'll be pretty darn happy with a Aphex Compellor, used. You're not looking for as much limiting in a bar as leveling. Compellors are one of the best options for that now that they are available on the used market. I agree in a bar enviroment you don't want to overcomplicate things with a computer. What can go wrong will in a place like a bar. I own a FMR and a Compellor. The Compellor is a superior box, without a doubt.
 
OKCRadioGuy said:
I think you'll be pretty darn happy with a Aphex Compellor, used. You're not looking for as much limiting in a bar as leveling. Compellors are one of the best options for that now that they are available on the used market. I agree in a bar enviroment you don't want to overcomplicate things with a computer. What can go wrong will in a place like a bar. I own a FMR and a Compellor. The Compellor is a superior box, without a doubt.
Click to expand...

The Compellor is a great piece of hardware. I agree.
 
For those interested, after pondering this for some time, I ended up purchasing an Aphex 720 limiter, to replace the non-repairable Behringer Ultra Dyne DSP 9024. Truthfully, I couldn't be happier with my decision. Here are some of the reasons I went with the Aphex 720:

-audio remains in analog form, as compared to adding another A-D and D-A conversion, which may possibly contribute to cascading bit reduction on the already bit reduced TouchTunes jukebox audio files
-no extra EQ was needed, as I already have it in the bar after processing
-needed to keep in mind I'm really only interested in achieving consistent audio levels, while still retaining as much of the original mix as possible
-no need for the Aphex 722 or 723 version, as those have pre-emphasis and de-emphasis circuits that I don't need for this application

I put this unit on the bench, hooked up a mixer with some CD players, and played various songs from CD. All the while listening to my favorite headphones of choice, paired with a decent headphone amp, but also monitoring audio levels on a set of Dorrough Loudness meters. Talk about peak ceiling control! Not only did I hear it, I was also able to visually observe it. Wow, exactly what I was looking for. And when it comes to audio processing, I can't stand hearing the box working. And with the Aphex 720, I don't. I can't wait to install it in the bar. Frankly, this box sounds so amazing, I actually want to keep it for myself. Since I'm loving the sound of this 720 so much, I'm sure it won't be long before I am replacing the Symetrix 422 with an Aphex 320 Compellor.
 
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