Merkel out at 3WS

[Talk_Dude]

[
One series of questions, does the fact that you're such a long time listener, and such a fan of music of the 50's and early 60's indicate that you have lived long enough to have reached the age that no radio station cares about whether you listen or not? Have you had enough birthdays that you've moved into the upper age demographic that advertisers don't care about? I have. If I am counted on a ratings report, it means nothing. As one old guy to another, one of the things that sucks about getting old is that our taste in things like popular culture or music don't matter any more.

To answer your question, I am the ripe old age of 51. Does that mean I am dead in the eyes of the Clear Channel execs? Most of the commercials I hear on 3WS have to do with things like hair loss, home refinancing, and losing weight. Wouldn't I fall into their core audience just by that?

51 is a little "iffy". My guess is that it would depend on the advertiser. As an even more undesirable to advertiser person aged 59, I share your dismay at not being wanted by advertisers. I also do not think that most advertisers, especially the suits who make the decisions about airtime purchases, are any more in touch with reality than radio station suits.

But here's how I suspect the suits might think. This is speculation, but I believe it makes sense.

Regarding hair loss, single guys hoping to get lucky with the ladies are extremely concerned about becoming bald. But when a guy hits 50, he's usually married and has given up on the chase. You can sell a guy on baldness cures when he's in his 20's or 30's, but if I guy hasn't done the Hair Club for Men deal or something like it by the time he's 50, odds are he's learned to accept being follicularly challenged.

Regarding a mortgage re-fi, some guy in his 20's or 30's might pick a financial institution for a refinance based on a good radio ad, but by the time a guy has hit 50, he's settled on a reliable financial planner he works with, and though he might be a good candidate to refinance, he's not going to be swayed by anyone who sounds like Ray Vincent.

Regarding losing weight, that's a lot like losing hair. Guys in their 20's and 30's will sign on for mass-market advertised programs they hear about on the radio. Once a guy hits 50, he takes the advice of his doctor. He doesn't shell out for canned weight-loss programs.

Maybe those observations are right, maybe they're wrong. I don't know for sure, but I suspect that when deciding what audience to "rent" from a radio station, thinking along those lines influences decisions.

Also, as someone who's only 51, if you're a fan of music from before you were born, you don't fit the pattern that the suits expect you to fit. I know a lot of people who like music from before they were born, but based on the things radio suits do, they don't know such people. Like I've often said, radio suits seem to be really out of touch with their audiences. The suits picking the songs for oldies stations think that if a song was released before a listener was in at least junior high, he doesn't want to hear it. So, even though you like music that's older than you are, the suits programming oldies stations don't believe you exist. They think that if you were born around 1959, you couldn't possibly want to hear any song recorded before 1969. If they think that, they are wrong, but their actions indicate that they believe that wrong thing.

 

[db59]

Yes, I would be considered an abnormality by radio execs. I was born in '59, graduated high school in '77, but was already liking '50's & '60's music in the '70's. That's not to say that I also didn't listen to a station like 13Q during those glorious years of pop & disco (yes, I liked disco) in the mid '70's. But this also around the time that WTAE-AM was playing tons and tons of oldies, and I was in my glory. I kept listening to current music until about 1984, and then just didn't like it anymore. By the late '80's/early '90's, 3WS entered the scene with "all oldies, all the time", and I have been listening to them ever since. Anothe thing about liking music older than you are. I have a 14 year old daugher, and although she is a Jonas Brothers/Miley Cyrus fanatic, she also loves the music of the Beatles, Elvis Presley, Queen, Journey, and even Herman's Hermits. So these pretty boys in suits involved in radio programming may think they know it all, but in my house they don't know diddley (as in Bo).

 

[altexpert]

However, as 3WS moved forward in their musical playlist, they have totally forgotten their core audience, that is those of us who enjoy oldies, especially from the '60's which they have totally abandoned. I hope many long-time 3WS listeners would agree that both the music and the on-air talent made 3WS a fun station back in the day. Now it's just the same stuff from the late '70's and '80's all the time. As another posted suggested, this town needs an actual traditional oldies station once again. For those who say this format is dead, let me remind you, this is Pittsburgh, and oldies will never die here.

I agree, Pgh will always have an oldies fan base in the same way that Pgh is perceived by all as a sports town. BUT, even 3WS at it's best through the 80's and 90's were ALWAYS a heavily skewed sounding station, quite possibly because they researched themselves into a corner. Think about 60's AM radio and you will quickly remember something that 3WS forgot, namely the British Invasion. 3WS was notorious for Motown-ing us to death when what we really needed was some Beatles and Stones and Kinks and all the rock that was part of pop in the 60's as well. For every time I heard the Mamas & Papas on 3WS, I was visibly aching to hear a Jefferson Airplane song or The Doors. The 3WS "version" of 60's radio considered Johnny Rivers a core artist. Let's go back a decade more, if you're going to spice it up, where was all the Little RIchard, the Chuck Berry, the Bo Diddley?????? Nope, just Doo-Wop confined to a specialty show and no Jerry Lee Lewis to get your blood cooking. Nothing. 3WS isn't just boring now, it was boring when it was higher in the ratings too. Let's not romanticize them too much.

 

[Parttimer]

I agree, Pgh will always have an oldies fan base in the same way that Pgh is perceived by all as a sports town. BUT, even 3WS at it's best through the 80's and 90's were ALWAYS a heavily skewed sounding station, quite possibly because they researched themselves into a corner.

So after they did the research they were supposed to ignore it?

 

[Talk_Dude]

I agree, Pgh will always have an oldies fan base in the same way that Pgh is perceived by all as a sports town. BUT, even 3WS at it's best through the 80's and 90's were ALWAYS a heavily skewed sounding station, quite possibly because they researched themselves into a corner.

So after they did the research they were supposed to ignore it?

They weren't supposed to ignore it, but if a common sense "reality check" shows that the results don't make sense, then maybe it's time to double-check the research process. If anyone who was actually alive in the 1960's saw that the research said "All Motown, no British Invasion", they should have noticed a clue that maybe the research process had a glitch. And maybe it didn't have a glitch, I don't know. I'm not saying that the research was necessarily flawed. Even though those results just flat-out make no sense, maybe it is right. But it just doesn't seem right.

All of the research said that "New" Coke and Crystal Pepsi would both be winners. Research is one decision-making tool, but it isn't the only tool. Research can be wrong. Every one of the products on this list were carefully researched.

 

[db59]

Just who in the hell do they do research on? It's not on their regular listeners, because if it was, their playlist, both now and back then, would have had many more songs on it. I'll give you a prime example of how bad the music has become. Today when my alarm went off at 5 A.M., Piano Man was playing. When I left my house around 7:30 A.M., guess what? Piano Man was playing again. If there is one song I am sick to death of, it is frickin' PIANO MAN. I swear there is not one day that goes by that I don't hear Piano Man. Does their precious research say that I want to hear Piano Man until it makes me want to hurl? I guess as a stupid listener I don't understand the scientific nature of radio programming. You would think with a format like 3WS has (or had), there would be literally thousands of songs to choose from. I could care less if a song did not "fit". I could listen to doo-wop, pop, British Invasion, soul, Motown, country crossovers, folk,etc all mixed together on one station and I would love it. It would be something called "variety." We once had a station like this in town, and it was WTAE-AM in it's heyday. Where is Ted Adkins now when you need him?

 

[altexpert]

So after they did the research they were supposed to ignore it?

YES!!!!! As others have already stated, research is a tool, it's not a commandment! Thou shalt not play rock on oldies stations! Ridiculous isn't it?

 

[Pratte4Life]

Just who in the hell do they do research on? It's not on their regular listeners, because if it was, their playlist, both now and back then, would have had many more songs on it. I'll give you a prime example of how bad the music has become. Today when my alarm went off at 5 A.M., Piano Man was playing. When I left my house around 7:30 A.M., guess what? Piano Man was playing again. If there is one song I am sick to death of, it is frickin' PIANO MAN. I swear there is not one day that goes by that I don't hear Piano Man. Does their precious research say that I want to hear Piano Man until it makes me want to hurl?

Bless you, sir!

 

[Knisha1]

meanwhile, over on WJPA, where they probably don't care about research, they were playing "When The Man Comes Around" by Johnny Cash. I think that fine oldie came out in 2002.

 

[Talk_Dude]

meanwhile, over on WJPA, where they probably don't care about research, they were playing "When The Man Comes Around" by Johnny Cash. I think that fine oldie came out in 2002.

Yes, it was written and recorded in 2002. But it sounds like it was written and recorded in 1962. That's what they mean by "The New Sound of the Oldies". :

 

[corporateradiosucks]

I agree with altexpert and db59. 3WS played Motown into the ground, now they're doing the same with Piano Man and Love Shack. The thing is, when they were playing the Motown into the ground, they kind of had an excuse for it as I think the time period they were drawing on was narrower. Now it's just plain damn laziness.

 

[Parttimer]

I'll give you a prime example of how bad the music has become. Today when my alarm went off at 5 A.M., Piano Man was playing. When I left my house around 7:30 A.M., guess what? Piano Man was playing again. If there is one song I am sick to death of, it is frickin' PIANO MAN.

While I'm not defending that in any way, here's how it could happen....

Most likely they didn't intend to repeat that song after 2 1/2 hours. Most programmers, when they put the day's music together, start the day with morning drive and do overnights last. It's possible that the 5AM spin was actually the last record of the 4AM hour, so it would have been on the previous day and the person doing the music might have overlooked it.

Very often, overnights aren't even specifically programmed, just other hours from the previous day are recycled.

If anyone besides you was listening both at 5AM and 7:30, you could probably count those people on your two hands.

That may be a lack of attention to detail, but it's reality as far as how music is programmed.

 

[db59]

Two points to touch on from earlier comments. It's not so much that Piano Man was played two and a half hours apart, but that that damn song is played each and every day. They even have two versions that they play, one full version and one shorter edited version. I just know that they play that particular song to death. As far as WJPA playing a Johnny Cash song from 2002, I will admit that is a little odd for an oldies station, but I enoy listening to WJPA much more than 3WS. You'd probably also hear them playing "Ring of Fire" (1963) and that would be fine with me. They seem to be a lot more relaxed in their format and definitely play a wider variety of music. My biggest problem with them is picking up their signal. I live in the eastern suburbs of Allegheny County and while I can hear them fine most times in the car, I cannot tune in to them where I work because of their weak signal and their Washington PA location. That is why I hear 3WS all day and know so much about what they are playing, because I can't pick up WJPA at work. The other problem with them is that they are too committed to local sports broadcasts which cuts into their music time. If WJPA was located closer to Pittsburgh, I bet they could be a major player in the radio wars and would give 3WS a run for their money, especially now that 3WS has fallen into such a rut

 

[Knisha1]

I agree with everything you said db59.

Though I am willing to accept the sports as part of keeping a "local presence".

 

[db59]

It is 11:46 a.m. and guess what, Piano Man is playing and it's the long version. Let's all get excited!!! I haven't heard this since yesterday!!

 

[Pratte4Life]

Piano Man is, without question, the most overplayed song by a national artist in the history of Pittsburgh radio.

I remember when WRRK was a rock station they'd play it (and I assume they still do as BOB-FM).

 

[FreddyE1977]

let's see......Pittsburgh is a big Catholic town....and Billy Joel had that record that all of the Catholics used to complain
and write letters about....what was it called again?....oh, well, can't remember....but I know it wasn't Piano Man....should
be safe if I keep Piano Man in the rotation every six hours....

 

[Talk_Dude]

Piano Man is, without question, the most overplayed song by a national artist in the history of Pittsburgh radio.

I remember when WRRK was a rock station they'd play it (and I assume they still do as BOB-FM).

I don't know about that. In 2007 and 2008, WDVE wouldn't let a day pass without playing "LaGrange", by ZZ Top. Maybe it wasn't played quite as often as "Piano Man", but since it's even more annoying (Haw Haw Haw), it's more obvious.

The album Piano Man also included some other really good songs that could be substituted for the song Piano Man for Billy Joel fans, like "You're My Home", "Somewhere Along the Line", and "Ain't No Crime". There are others that are even better, but they're too long for typical oldies format. Anyone who owned that album and like the title song should like hearing those three songs just as much. They could also play, "Only the Good Die Young" from a later album.

And before anyone points out that those weren't "hits" almost 40 years ago, so what? They sound good.

 

[db59]

"Only the Good Die Young" is the anti-Catholic song referred to, and 3WS also plays that one. They do play alot of Billy Joel, and I do like his music quite a bit. Off hand, from what I can remember, they play, Movin' Out(Anthony's Song), She'a Always A Woman, It's Still Rock & Roll to Me, Uptown Girl, My Life, You May Be Right, She's Got A Way, Big Shot, and The Longest Time. But none of these equal the airtime of Piano Man, my original subject of scorn. Sorry to keep rambling about Piano Man, but it's provided for some good comments.

 

[Talk_Dude]

Sorry to keep rambling about Piano Man,

That's better than pianoing about "Ramblin' Man".

Though 3WS probably wouldn't play "Ramblin' Man".