How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few radio stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3 doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
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Minneapolis, Atlanta, Boston FM dial a mess.
- Thread starter e-dawg
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K
KMRichards
Guest
> How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few radio
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
Mostly it has to do with the fact that the table of allocated FM channels was pretty much in place in the metropolitan areas before the urban expansion into the suburbs.
The same thing happens here in Los Angeles, where there are several simulcasts of weaker signals to improve market coverage, notably three signals combined for "Que Buena", two for "Recuerda", and two for "Indie". And even then, those signals still cannot cover the entire market like a single stronger signal.
The trouble is that, in large metropolitan areas such as Minneapolis, Atlanta, Boston, Los Angeles, San Francisco, etc. etc. etc., there is no way to amend the allocation tables to allow higher power on the rimshots without affecting other stations on the same or adjacent frequencies.
You have correctly identified that there is a problem, but there is no solution to it, so you will have to live with it.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
Mostly it has to do with the fact that the table of allocated FM channels was pretty much in place in the metropolitan areas before the urban expansion into the suburbs.
The same thing happens here in Los Angeles, where there are several simulcasts of weaker signals to improve market coverage, notably three signals combined for "Que Buena", two for "Recuerda", and two for "Indie". And even then, those signals still cannot cover the entire market like a single stronger signal.
The trouble is that, in large metropolitan areas such as Minneapolis, Atlanta, Boston, Los Angeles, San Francisco, etc. etc. etc., there is no way to amend the allocation tables to allow higher power on the rimshots without affecting other stations on the same or adjacent frequencies.
You have correctly identified that there is a problem, but there is no solution to it, so you will have to live with it.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>
R
robk
Guest
> How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few radio
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
>
I'm glad you brought up Minneapolis. A very large market, with very, very few stations......the least number of stations i've seen for any market nearly that large.
and here's the shocker.......there is a station owned by Hubbard.....WFMP, looks like a female targeted fm talk station. The shocker is that this station is allowed to continue despite pathetic ratings that won't budge. They pulled a (deleted) 12+ this time around.......I don't think they ever break a 2.0 at all...
This is a valuable full market signal ! Is it just that Hubbard doesn't want to compete in the same way that the larger players do ?.....if not, they should cash out.......and likley get a heck of a payday from one of the big boys......maybe Infinity.
There's gotta be a pretty good size format hole there......this isn't Dallas here......there are very few stations !
Rob
Edited by moderator to remove reference to Arbitron ratings. Rob, you're a moderator, you know better than that ...<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by KMRichards on 10/26/05 02:30 AM.</FONT></P>
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
>
I'm glad you brought up Minneapolis. A very large market, with very, very few stations......the least number of stations i've seen for any market nearly that large.
and here's the shocker.......there is a station owned by Hubbard.....WFMP, looks like a female targeted fm talk station. The shocker is that this station is allowed to continue despite pathetic ratings that won't budge. They pulled a (deleted) 12+ this time around.......I don't think they ever break a 2.0 at all...
This is a valuable full market signal ! Is it just that Hubbard doesn't want to compete in the same way that the larger players do ?.....if not, they should cash out.......and likley get a heck of a payday from one of the big boys......maybe Infinity.
There's gotta be a pretty good size format hole there......this isn't Dallas here......there are very few stations !
Rob
Edited by moderator to remove reference to Arbitron ratings. Rob, you're a moderator, you know better than that ...<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by KMRichards on 10/26/05 02:30 AM.</FONT></P>
> The same thing happens here in Los Angeles, where there are
> several simulcasts of weaker signals to improve market
> coverage, notably three signals combined for "Que Buena",
> two for "Recuerda", and two for "Indie". And even then,
> those signals still cannot cover the entire market like a
> single stronger signal.
Los Angeles has a signal problem? Are you joking?
The signal lineup in New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, and to an extent, Denver, Miami, and a few other cities, allows for a ton of signals. Not all of them are powerful, and simulcasts, but it leaves for big-city stations on 92.3, 93.1, 93.9, 94.7, 95.5, 96.3, 97.1, 97.9, 98.7, 99.5, 100.3, 101.1, 101.9, 102.7, 103.5, 104.3, 105.1, 105.9, 106.7, and 107.5. That's 20 big signals, with plenty of other rimshots, many of which simulcast to create full signals (the LA examples that you gave, Chicago's 93.5/103.1, etc.)
Ready for Boston's full-city signals? 92.9, 94.5, 96.9, 98.5, 100.7, 102.5, 103.3, 104.1, 105.7, 106.7, 107.9. That's 11 big signals. Where are the rest? In the established markets such as Providence (#34) and Worcester (#107), which contributes 107.3B to the Boston market. Because of the lousy frequency assignments, rimshots make up a larger portion of the market's ratings (though stations like 93.7, 97.7, 99.1, 101.7, and 107.3 aren't good examples, 99.5 is).
The other markets mentioned have problems as well. The Minneapolis 105 trimulcast has never generated significant ratings. Atlanta has many stations, but many are rimshots (like 93.3) that target Atlanta yet cannot be heard within the city borders. Atlanta has benefited from many move-ins, (100.5, a move-in from a state away, 107.9 the former WPEZ), however, which provide more listening options.
> several simulcasts of weaker signals to improve market
> coverage, notably three signals combined for "Que Buena",
> two for "Recuerda", and two for "Indie". And even then,
> those signals still cannot cover the entire market like a
> single stronger signal.
Los Angeles has a signal problem? Are you joking?
The signal lineup in New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, and to an extent, Denver, Miami, and a few other cities, allows for a ton of signals. Not all of them are powerful, and simulcasts, but it leaves for big-city stations on 92.3, 93.1, 93.9, 94.7, 95.5, 96.3, 97.1, 97.9, 98.7, 99.5, 100.3, 101.1, 101.9, 102.7, 103.5, 104.3, 105.1, 105.9, 106.7, and 107.5. That's 20 big signals, with plenty of other rimshots, many of which simulcast to create full signals (the LA examples that you gave, Chicago's 93.5/103.1, etc.)
Ready for Boston's full-city signals? 92.9, 94.5, 96.9, 98.5, 100.7, 102.5, 103.3, 104.1, 105.7, 106.7, 107.9. That's 11 big signals. Where are the rest? In the established markets such as Providence (#34) and Worcester (#107), which contributes 107.3B to the Boston market. Because of the lousy frequency assignments, rimshots make up a larger portion of the market's ratings (though stations like 93.7, 97.7, 99.1, 101.7, and 107.3 aren't good examples, 99.5 is).
The other markets mentioned have problems as well. The Minneapolis 105 trimulcast has never generated significant ratings. Atlanta has many stations, but many are rimshots (like 93.3) that target Atlanta yet cannot be heard within the city borders. Atlanta has benefited from many move-ins, (100.5, a move-in from a state away, 107.9 the former WPEZ), however, which provide more listening options.
Re: Columbus Ohio
If you want a market that lacks Class C and B stations, check out Columbus Ohio
Most of our stations are Class A's or rimshooters.
<P ID="signature">______________
Lenks
Program Director/Music Director
X Music Online
The X
Today's Best Music
http://www.xmusiconline.com/</P>
If you want a market that lacks Class C and B stations, check out Columbus Ohio
Most of our stations are Class A's or rimshooters.<P ID="signature">______________
Lenks
Program Director/Music Director
X Music Online
The X
Today's Best Music
http://www.xmusiconline.com/</P>
Re: Columbus Ohio
> If you want a market that lacks Class C and B stations,
> check out Columbus Ohio Most of our stations are Class
> A's or rimshooters.
>
Milwaukee's lineup is: 93.3, 94.5, 95.7, 96.5, 97.3, 99.1, 102.1, 102.9, 103.7, 106.1, & 107.7. That's 11. Milwaukee has a suburban station on 100.7, licensed to Racine, but is heard in Milwaukee because the signal is as close to Milwaukee as allowed to protect 100.5 in Watertown and 101.1 up in Green Bay. Milwaukee also has 2 Class A stations with primary contour over Milwaukee, 98.3, and 105.3, but 105.3 is so low in wattage that it sounds more like a rimshot, and can actually get 105.1 from Chicago with no problem. I'm not sure about spacing with 92.5, licensed to West Bend Wisconsin, but if spacing allowed with any nearby 92.3's, 92.7 in Arlington Heights, IL, and any 92.9's, then 92.5 could move closer to Milwaukee if the owners wanted to. They have a sister station on 92.1, licensed to Racine, so it could be short-spaced if they're willing to accept any interference. But the owners are going to keep it a West Bend station, so 92.5 will stay where it's at.
South Bend Indiana has only 3 Class B stations, 92.9 & 101.5, licensed to South Bend, and 100.7, licensed to Elkhart, but is in the tower farm with the South Bend radio & TV stations, and a suburban station on 99.9, licensed to Benton Harbor Michigan. Otherwise it's mostly a Class A market that's mostly rimshots, and a Class B1 on 94.3, licensed to Plymouth Indiana, but has primary coverage over South Bend.
Lafayette Indiana only has 2 Class B stations, 96.5 & 105.3, both licensed to Lafayette. The rest are Class A and many are rimshot, plus a Class B1 from Earl Park Indiana, also a rimshot.
Now Grand Rapids Michigan has 2 grandfathered Class B stations that cover both Grand Rapids & Kalamazoo markets, 93.7 & 105.7, both owned by CC.
> If you want a market that lacks Class C and B stations,
> check out Columbus Ohio
Most of our stations are Class> A's or rimshooters.
>
Milwaukee's lineup is: 93.3, 94.5, 95.7, 96.5, 97.3, 99.1, 102.1, 102.9, 103.7, 106.1, & 107.7. That's 11. Milwaukee has a suburban station on 100.7, licensed to Racine, but is heard in Milwaukee because the signal is as close to Milwaukee as allowed to protect 100.5 in Watertown and 101.1 up in Green Bay. Milwaukee also has 2 Class A stations with primary contour over Milwaukee, 98.3, and 105.3, but 105.3 is so low in wattage that it sounds more like a rimshot, and can actually get 105.1 from Chicago with no problem. I'm not sure about spacing with 92.5, licensed to West Bend Wisconsin, but if spacing allowed with any nearby 92.3's, 92.7 in Arlington Heights, IL, and any 92.9's, then 92.5 could move closer to Milwaukee if the owners wanted to. They have a sister station on 92.1, licensed to Racine, so it could be short-spaced if they're willing to accept any interference. But the owners are going to keep it a West Bend station, so 92.5 will stay where it's at.
South Bend Indiana has only 3 Class B stations, 92.9 & 101.5, licensed to South Bend, and 100.7, licensed to Elkhart, but is in the tower farm with the South Bend radio & TV stations, and a suburban station on 99.9, licensed to Benton Harbor Michigan. Otherwise it's mostly a Class A market that's mostly rimshots, and a Class B1 on 94.3, licensed to Plymouth Indiana, but has primary coverage over South Bend.
Lafayette Indiana only has 2 Class B stations, 96.5 & 105.3, both licensed to Lafayette. The rest are Class A and many are rimshot, plus a Class B1 from Earl Park Indiana, also a rimshot.
Now Grand Rapids Michigan has 2 grandfathered Class B stations that cover both Grand Rapids & Kalamazoo markets, 93.7 & 105.7, both owned by CC.
Re: Columbus Ohio
> Milwaukee's lineup is: 93.3, 94.5, 95.7, 96.5, 97.3, 99.1,
> 102.1, 102.9, 103.7, 106.1, & 107.7. That's 11. Milwaukee
> has a suburban station on 100.7, licensed to Racine, but is
> heard in Milwaukee because the signal is as close to
> Milwaukee as allowed to protect 100.5 in Watertown and 101.1
> up in Green Bay. Milwaukee also has 2 Class A stations with
> primary contour over Milwaukee, 98.3, and 105.3, but 105.3
> is so low in wattage that it sounds more like a rimshot, and
> can actually get 105.1 from Chicago with no problem. I'm
> not sure about spacing with 92.5, licensed to West Bend
> Wisconsin, but if spacing allowed with any nearby 92.3's,
> 92.7 in Arlington Heights, IL, and any 92.9's, then 92.5
> could move closer to Milwaukee if the owners wanted to.
> They have a sister station on 92.1, licensed to Racine, so
> it could be short-spaced if they're willing to accept any
> interference. But the owners are going to keep it a West
> Bend station, so 92.5 will stay where it's at.
I don't know the market all that well, but would Milwaukee's Relevant Radio affiliate, WPJP 100.1, be considered part of the market? The signal appears pretty non-existant in Milwaukee judging by Radio-Locator.
> Milwaukee's lineup is: 93.3, 94.5, 95.7, 96.5, 97.3, 99.1,
> 102.1, 102.9, 103.7, 106.1, & 107.7. That's 11. Milwaukee
> has a suburban station on 100.7, licensed to Racine, but is
> heard in Milwaukee because the signal is as close to
> Milwaukee as allowed to protect 100.5 in Watertown and 101.1
> up in Green Bay. Milwaukee also has 2 Class A stations with
> primary contour over Milwaukee, 98.3, and 105.3, but 105.3
> is so low in wattage that it sounds more like a rimshot, and
> can actually get 105.1 from Chicago with no problem. I'm
> not sure about spacing with 92.5, licensed to West Bend
> Wisconsin, but if spacing allowed with any nearby 92.3's,
> 92.7 in Arlington Heights, IL, and any 92.9's, then 92.5
> could move closer to Milwaukee if the owners wanted to.
> They have a sister station on 92.1, licensed to Racine, so
> it could be short-spaced if they're willing to accept any
> interference. But the owners are going to keep it a West
> Bend station, so 92.5 will stay where it's at.
I don't know the market all that well, but would Milwaukee's Relevant Radio affiliate, WPJP 100.1, be considered part of the market? The signal appears pretty non-existant in Milwaukee judging by Radio-Locator.
> > How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few
> radio
> > stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> > Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM
> dial
> > service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters
> into
> > the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
>
> > Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> > signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> > doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
> >
>
> I'm glad you brought up Minneapolis. A very large market,
> with very, very few stations......the least number of
> stations i've seen for any market nearly that large.
>
> and here's the shocker.......there is a station owned by
> Hubbard.....WFMP, looks like a female targeted fm talk
> station. The shocker is that this station is allowed to
> continue despite pathetic ratings that won't budge. They
> pulled a (deleted) 12+ this time around.......I don't think
> they ever break a 2.0 at all...
>
> This is a valuable full market signal ! Is it just that
> Hubbard doesn't want to compete in the same way that the
> larger players do ?.....if not, they should cash
> out.......and likley get a heck of a payday from one of the
> big boys......maybe Infinity.
>
> There's gotta be a pretty good size format hole
> there......this isn't Dallas here......there are very few
> stations !
>
> Rob
The situation in the Twin Cities is an interesting one.
Most of the stations there are 100kw. And there's quite a few stations outside the metro that are as well. (in places like Rochester, St. Cloud and Mankato).
The 105's are rimshots. 105.1 signed on around 1991 and is licensed to south suburban Lakeville. They cannot power up or move because of nearby stations that could cause interference. Same with 105.7, which debuted about the same time in Eden Prarie. 105.3 to the north has been around a while. All three stations are pretty much stuck where they're at.
Other stations have the same problem there as well (such as 96.3).
As for 107.1, I haven't the vaguest idea why they're sticking with female talk. My guess is that if they stuck with country when they moved in to the metro from Wisconsin, K102 and Clear Channel would have destroyed them, since they'll do anything to protect their country dominance, even going so far as to flip one of their other stations to country. ABC does the same thing with their 'wall of rock', which is why Drive 105 exists.
But, getting back to the question, I guess the allottments just fell where they did.<P ID="signature">______________
The Liberal Talk Radio Update</P>
> radio
> > stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> > Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM
> dial
> > service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters
> into
> > the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
>
> > Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> > signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> > doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
> >
>
> I'm glad you brought up Minneapolis. A very large market,
> with very, very few stations......the least number of
> stations i've seen for any market nearly that large.
>
> and here's the shocker.......there is a station owned by
> Hubbard.....WFMP, looks like a female targeted fm talk
> station. The shocker is that this station is allowed to
> continue despite pathetic ratings that won't budge. They
> pulled a (deleted) 12+ this time around.......I don't think
> they ever break a 2.0 at all...
>
> This is a valuable full market signal ! Is it just that
> Hubbard doesn't want to compete in the same way that the
> larger players do ?.....if not, they should cash
> out.......and likley get a heck of a payday from one of the
> big boys......maybe Infinity.
>
> There's gotta be a pretty good size format hole
> there......this isn't Dallas here......there are very few
> stations !
>
> Rob
The situation in the Twin Cities is an interesting one.
Most of the stations there are 100kw. And there's quite a few stations outside the metro that are as well. (in places like Rochester, St. Cloud and Mankato).
The 105's are rimshots. 105.1 signed on around 1991 and is licensed to south suburban Lakeville. They cannot power up or move because of nearby stations that could cause interference. Same with 105.7, which debuted about the same time in Eden Prarie. 105.3 to the north has been around a while. All three stations are pretty much stuck where they're at.
Other stations have the same problem there as well (such as 96.3).
As for 107.1, I haven't the vaguest idea why they're sticking with female talk. My guess is that if they stuck with country when they moved in to the metro from Wisconsin, K102 and Clear Channel would have destroyed them, since they'll do anything to protect their country dominance, even going so far as to flip one of their other stations to country. ABC does the same thing with their 'wall of rock', which is why Drive 105 exists.
But, getting back to the question, I guess the allottments just fell where they did.<P ID="signature">______________
The Liberal Talk Radio Update</P>
Re: Columbus Ohio
> I don't know the market all that well, but would Milwaukee's
> Relevant Radio affiliate, WPJP 100.1, be considered part of
> the market? The signal appears pretty non-existant in
> Milwaukee judging by Radio-Locator.
>
It's licensed to Port Washington, but it barely reaches Milwaukee. The only reason it reaches Milwaukee is because it's in mono. Otherwise the station might not reach Milwaukee all that well. Since Ozaukee County is in the Milwaukee Arbitron rating area, it's part of the Milwaukee market, though it only covers the northern suburbs of Milwaukee.
I forgot to mention about Chicago to the person who mentioned that there's many Class B stations. When Chicago was given the allocations they got, it was pre-1964, which makes many of them short-spaced with many of the suburban stations, particularly around Joliet and 50kw WRZA on 99.9, which is short-spaced with a 99.9 in Janesville, WI; 99.5 & 100.3 in Chicago, 99.9 in Benton Harbor Michigan (I know this one from listening experience because I live on the edge of the primary & secondary contours), and a 99.9 (I believe in southern Illinois. 107.9 was lucky to upgrade their station to a Class B to put primary contour over Chicago, but they had to put a null to the north to protect 107.7 in Milwaukee. 106.7 signed on under the current rules, so unless Univision could make an offer to Crawford for 106.3, they have no chance to move that signal into Chicago. Even if they could get 106.3, there's still the issue with 107.1 licensed to Lowell Indiana, a 3kw equivalent station. If 105.9 had signed on under the current rules, they would only be a Class A station in the Chicago market as it's short-spaced with 105.5 up in Woodstock, Il & 106.3 in Lansing IL. Also mentioning about simulcasts for a major market like Chicago. The reason La Kalle (WVIV 103.1/ WVIX 93.5) is a simulcast is because CC & INfinity Broadcasting hog most of the frequencies. Univision has the money to buy a Chicago station, but none are available at this time. Newsweb is the same way too. But their situation is different. They're an independent, so they wouldn't have enough money to buy a city stick if one were available. So the best they could do was 92.5/92.7/99.9.
> I don't know the market all that well, but would Milwaukee's
> Relevant Radio affiliate, WPJP 100.1, be considered part of
> the market? The signal appears pretty non-existant in
> Milwaukee judging by Radio-Locator.
>
It's licensed to Port Washington, but it barely reaches Milwaukee. The only reason it reaches Milwaukee is because it's in mono. Otherwise the station might not reach Milwaukee all that well. Since Ozaukee County is in the Milwaukee Arbitron rating area, it's part of the Milwaukee market, though it only covers the northern suburbs of Milwaukee.
I forgot to mention about Chicago to the person who mentioned that there's many Class B stations. When Chicago was given the allocations they got, it was pre-1964, which makes many of them short-spaced with many of the suburban stations, particularly around Joliet and 50kw WRZA on 99.9, which is short-spaced with a 99.9 in Janesville, WI; 99.5 & 100.3 in Chicago, 99.9 in Benton Harbor Michigan (I know this one from listening experience because I live on the edge of the primary & secondary contours), and a 99.9 (I believe in southern Illinois. 107.9 was lucky to upgrade their station to a Class B to put primary contour over Chicago, but they had to put a null to the north to protect 107.7 in Milwaukee. 106.7 signed on under the current rules, so unless Univision could make an offer to Crawford for 106.3, they have no chance to move that signal into Chicago. Even if they could get 106.3, there's still the issue with 107.1 licensed to Lowell Indiana, a 3kw equivalent station. If 105.9 had signed on under the current rules, they would only be a Class A station in the Chicago market as it's short-spaced with 105.5 up in Woodstock, Il & 106.3 in Lansing IL. Also mentioning about simulcasts for a major market like Chicago. The reason La Kalle (WVIV 103.1/ WVIX 93.5) is a simulcast is because CC & INfinity Broadcasting hog most of the frequencies. Univision has the money to buy a Chicago station, but none are available at this time. Newsweb is the same way too. But their situation is different. They're an independent, so they wouldn't have enough money to buy a city stick if one were available. So the best they could do was 92.5/92.7/99.9.
Re: Columbus Ohio
> Newsweb is the same way too.
> But their situation is different. They're an independent,
> so they wouldn't have enough money to buy a city stick if
> one were available. So the best they could do was
> 92.5/92.7/99.9.
Actually... There'd be no problem. They can afford a city stick (they actually own a class C AM licensed to Chicago). Fred and Co. have the money from the sale of WPWR-TV to Fox.
-A<P ID="signature">______________
</P>
> Newsweb is the same way too.
> But their situation is different. They're an independent,
> so they wouldn't have enough money to buy a city stick if
> one were available. So the best they could do was
> 92.5/92.7/99.9.
Actually... There'd be no problem. They can afford a city stick (they actually own a class C AM licensed to Chicago). Fred and Co. have the money from the sale of WPWR-TV to Fox.
-A<P ID="signature">______________
</P>
Re: Columbus Ohio
> > Newsweb is the same way too.
> > But their situation is different. They're an independent,
>
> > so they wouldn't have enough money to buy a city stick if
> > one were available. So the best they could do was
> > 92.5/92.7/99.9.
>
> Actually... There'd be no problem. They can afford a city
> stick (they actually own a class C AM licensed to Chicago).
> Fred and Co. have the money from the sale of WPWR-TV to Fox.
>
>
> -A
>
I was talking about an FM stick in Chicago. I doubt they have the money to buy one, should one be available right now. BTW, 1240AM doesn't even cover the entire city. 1kw only covers downtown and the north side, plus a couple of nearby suburbs. 1230AM from Hammond Indiana keeps 1240 from being heard in most south side neighborhoods, especially at night.
As for WPWR-TV, if you think about it, Newsweb got that station cheap because it's licensed to Gary Indiana and was off the air for a 4 year period from 1983 (when it was originally owned by the Lake Central School System in St. John Indiana) to 1987, if my memory is correct on that one. Since the station was off the air all that time, the value of the license wasn't worth a lot. Putting the stick on the Sears Tower increased the value of the station many times over. If the stick had been put in Lake County Indiana, like it originally was, the station wouldn't be worth as much. <P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by dave73 on 10/28/05 01:33 AM.</FONT></P>
> > Newsweb is the same way too.
> > But their situation is different. They're an independent,
>
> > so they wouldn't have enough money to buy a city stick if
> > one were available. So the best they could do was
> > 92.5/92.7/99.9.
>
> Actually... There'd be no problem. They can afford a city
> stick (they actually own a class C AM licensed to Chicago).
> Fred and Co. have the money from the sale of WPWR-TV to Fox.
>
>
> -A
>
I was talking about an FM stick in Chicago. I doubt they have the money to buy one, should one be available right now. BTW, 1240AM doesn't even cover the entire city. 1kw only covers downtown and the north side, plus a couple of nearby suburbs. 1230AM from Hammond Indiana keeps 1240 from being heard in most south side neighborhoods, especially at night.
As for WPWR-TV, if you think about it, Newsweb got that station cheap because it's licensed to Gary Indiana and was off the air for a 4 year period from 1983 (when it was originally owned by the Lake Central School System in St. John Indiana) to 1987, if my memory is correct on that one. Since the station was off the air all that time, the value of the license wasn't worth a lot. Putting the stick on the Sears Tower increased the value of the station many times over. If the stick had been put in Lake County Indiana, like it originally was, the station wouldn't be worth as much. <P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by dave73 on 10/28/05 01:33 AM.</FONT></P>
I lived in Boston. There are stations in surrounding cities with a significant population. Providence, Lawrence and Lowell, to name a few of them.
> How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few radio
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
>
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> How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few radio
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
Re: Austin And Indianapolis
I have been told that Austin and Indianapolis have fewer FM stations than other cities of a similar size.
Austin will not use a frequency that is used by a major station in Houston, Dallas or San Antonio. There are a few stations that use additional frequencies in Waco and one or two in Temple, Georgetown and New Branfeuls/San Marcos. A new station in Georgetown uses the same frequence as 106.7 in San Antonio, but that is a new station and a weak one.
Indianapolis will not use frequencies from Chicago, Cincinatti or Louisville. That is what I have been told, so it is all I know, because I never lived near any of those places.
> How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few radio
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
I have been told that Austin and Indianapolis have fewer FM stations than other cities of a similar size.
Austin will not use a frequency that is used by a major station in Houston, Dallas or San Antonio. There are a few stations that use additional frequencies in Waco and one or two in Temple, Georgetown and New Branfeuls/San Marcos. A new station in Georgetown uses the same frequence as 106.7 in San Antonio, but that is a new station and a weak one.
Indianapolis will not use frequencies from Chicago, Cincinatti or Louisville. That is what I have been told, so it is all I know, because I never lived near any of those places.
> How could a city with a large metropolilitan have few radio
> stations and/or lots of rim shots into the city, like
> Minneapolis, which have 3 radio stations on the 105 FM dial
> service the city, or Altanta which so many rimmshooters into
> the metro area, that not all radio stations covers the ATL
> Metro area. Same thing for Boston, which has lack of full
> signal or frequency. 95.3, 101.7, 104.9, 97.7, and 107.3
> doesn't cover the entire Boston metro area.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
Re: Austin And Indianapolis
> Indianapolis will not use frequencies from Chicago,
> Cincinatti or Louisville. That is what I have been told, so
> it is all I know, because I never lived near any of those
> places.
>
Well, it looks like your source was wrong...94.7 FM Chicago (True Oldies) and 94.7FM Indianpolis WFBQ. Granted WZZN chicago is only 4.4 KW. There is also overlap on 95.5, 97.1, 99.5, and 107.9. There might be others that I didn't catch.
> Indianapolis will not use frequencies from Chicago,
> Cincinatti or Louisville. That is what I have been told, so
> it is all I know, because I never lived near any of those
> places.
>
Well, it looks like your source was wrong...94.7 FM Chicago (True Oldies) and 94.7FM Indianpolis WFBQ. Granted WZZN chicago is only 4.4 KW. There is also overlap on 95.5, 97.1, 99.5, and 107.9. There might be others that I didn't catch.
Re: Austin And Indianapolis
The Indy and the Chicago area have several frequencies in common, including 94.7, 97.1, 99.5 and 92.3 (Bloomington).
Indianapolis may have come out a little better than Columbus.
(Full-power Class B's in Indy (licensed or originally licensed to city itself)
93.1, 94.7, 95.5, 103.3, 104.5, 107.9.
Columbus:
92.3, 94.7, 96.3, 99.7 (did I miss anyone)?
The Indy and the Chicago area have several frequencies in common, including 94.7, 97.1, 99.5 and 92.3 (Bloomington).
Indianapolis may have come out a little better than Columbus.
(Full-power Class B's in Indy (licensed or originally licensed to city itself)
93.1, 94.7, 95.5, 103.3, 104.5, 107.9.
Columbus:
92.3, 94.7, 96.3, 99.7 (did I miss anyone)?
Re: Austin And Indianapolis
> > Indianapolis will not use frequencies from Chicago,
> > Cincinatti or Louisville. That is what I have been told,
> so
> > it is all I know, because I never lived near any of those
> > places.
> >
> Well, it looks like your source was wrong...94.7 FM Chicago
> (True Oldies) and 94.7FM Indianpolis WFBQ. Granted WZZN
> chicago is only 4.4 KW. There is also overlap on 95.5,
> 97.1, 99.5, and 107.9. There might be others that I didn't
> catch.
>
There's a 96.3 in the Indianapolis market, but it's a Class A since WAZY's predecessor was on 96.7 at 3kw, but switched to 96.5 in the late 60's or early 70's and boosted to the max. of 50kw. Because of that, 96.3 can't upgrade any further. Also a 93.9, but too also a Class A. But Indianapolis market also has some grandfathered Class B stations, which Chicago doesn't have anymore because the signals couldn't penetrate the skyscrapers, and every station that had grandfathered licenses decided to give them up for better coverage in downtown Chicago. The exception was non-commercial station WMBI-FM, which still has their 100kw stick in Addison IL.
> > Indianapolis will not use frequencies from Chicago,
> > Cincinatti or Louisville. That is what I have been told,
> so
> > it is all I know, because I never lived near any of those
> > places.
> >
> Well, it looks like your source was wrong...94.7 FM Chicago
> (True Oldies) and 94.7FM Indianpolis WFBQ. Granted WZZN
> chicago is only 4.4 KW. There is also overlap on 95.5,
> 97.1, 99.5, and 107.9. There might be others that I didn't
> catch.
>
There's a 96.3 in the Indianapolis market, but it's a Class A since WAZY's predecessor was on 96.7 at 3kw, but switched to 96.5 in the late 60's or early 70's and boosted to the max. of 50kw. Because of that, 96.3 can't upgrade any further. Also a 93.9, but too also a Class A. But Indianapolis market also has some grandfathered Class B stations, which Chicago doesn't have anymore because the signals couldn't penetrate the skyscrapers, and every station that had grandfathered licenses decided to give them up for better coverage in downtown Chicago. The exception was non-commercial station WMBI-FM, which still has their 100kw stick in Addison IL.
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