MUSIC on AM Radio:

[Savage]

BL-40 Modulimiters typically generated lower-register (200 Hz and below) distortion of FORTY percent. But hey, they were loud! (Add that kind of processing to typical tube AM transmitters of the 1970s with their characteristic power supply tilt and carrier shift, plus the incredibly lousy car radios ca. 1973-1985, and small wonder FM took over quickly back then.)

DAP-310s were marvels for their day, but the limiting was done with good ol' diodes. This produced odd-order harmonic distortion when the boxes were pushed. The multiband design tended to mask a lot of the distortion but on some records when one of the three passbands predominated, you'd get some pretty nasty audio effects. I know A Certain Buffalo Engineer and On-Air Personality who devised a way to hot-rod 310s removing the limiter cards and simply using the discrete processors. The Dorroughs sounded WAY better that way.

Ed Buterbaugh was indeed a genius who had great respect for AM and its potential to actually sound good. He devised multiband discrete processing and ran prototypes on WEAM in 1971-72, later on CKLW, whose rig was a 1940s RCA BTA-50F fed by phone lines between Windsor and Harrow. The extant airchecks prove just how good AM could sound. I remember it well when I was there in '73.

WKBW (WWKB) sounded fantastic in AM stereo. Thanks, Tom Atkins and Dan Gurzynski.

 

[Whiplash]

I still deliver music on two of the three AM's I own in Erie, PA and Youngstown, OH. Standards and Oldies still work very well. I think the future of oldies on AM is very strong, especially is there's no FM's doing it.

 

[jefflaurence]

Guess this should be on the engineering board at this point..but the DAP's that we used when Taft owned WDAE in Tampa were literally gutted by Ted Ruscetti..via Randy Michaels. In place of the compressor cards they used three LA4a UREI units..and wow did that sound nice. Whatever Ed Butterbaugh did at the Big 8 was magic. Still have never heard anything like that station. One of the coolest things they had in the rack at CKLW when I went over to visit with RCS one night in 73..was an oscilloscope with a clear plastic overlay map of the USA and Canada. It showed the "approximate" coverage area with a pulsating green circle..probably for psyche purposes but it was very cool. Remember that Bob?

And..yeah a well designed part 15 system is really amazing. Coverage is more than adequate, and it is FCC certified, and installed exactly according to specs..including the ground system, and lead wire lengths. We use a great simple automation program with on board AGC called Zara Studio. Inexpensive and completely solid. Went by today and it was playing "Soul Coaxin" by Raymond LeFevre..and it was just amazing.

 

[Mike Sheridan]

Back in the FREE Napster days I found airchecks of WKBW from 1964. Wow you can hear the rich warm sound the station had.

Other good sounding AM's I have heard: 50KW WINZ Miami when they went through the place and replaced the old RCA Ampliphase with a nice new Harris MW-50, not sure what the used for processing but man it sounded great! Same for 5 KW WGMA in Hollywood Florida, they replaced the awful sounding Gates BC-5H with new Collins 5KW Power Rock. It was hard to believe these stations were on AM.

 

[Bill Myers]

Hi Mr. Savage,

You mentioned 'KB radio's sound in Stereo. How did that compare to WGR 550 when they flipped Stereo in the late 80's? GR always seemed to have the deep resonant sound.
How did GR compare to KB audio wise after both went Stereo?

 

[chrish]

Few things are more pleasing to my ear than an extremely well engineered and processed AM station playing music, I'm talking about a warm friendly JUKE BOX sound with a rich sweet bottom and the nice spacial aura of a high end just short of FM. Boy did 50's and 60's make music especially motown sound great, Sam Cooke, Mary Wells etc. This juke box sound coming from an old Wurlitzer or Seeburg in an ice cream parlor was almost addicting to the patrons. The best of the best AM's during those days went to great lengths to mimic that sound on the supurb GM Delco car radios. What a pleasure to listen to. No audio fatigue problems there.

 

[Element9]

I still deliver music on two of the three AM's I own in Erie, PA and Youngstown, OH. Standards and Oldies still work very well. I think the future of oldies on AM is very strong, especially is there's no FM's doing it.

^^^ This post, in all its brevity, summarizes the thread. We have people writing about the merits of music on AM, reminiscing about the 60s and 70s. It's 2012. The only format that can draw listeners under the age of 50 to the AM band is Sports. Any station owner-operator choosing to program music on AM with any degree of success, even with the help of an FM translator, has little choice but to program Oldies or Standards. The formats appeal to persons 55+, but this demographic has an awareness of the band and will seek out the format.

 

[Tom Wells]

I still deliver music on two of the three AM's I own in Erie, PA and Youngstown, OH. Standards and Oldies still work very well. I think the future of oldies on AM is very strong, especially is there's no FM's doing it.

^^^ This post, in all its brevity, summarizes the thread. We have people writing about the merits of music on AM, reminiscing about the 60s and 70s. It's 2012. The only format that can draw listeners under the age of 50 to the AM band is Sports. Any station owner-operator choosing to program music on AM with any degree of success, even with the help of an FM translator, has little choice but to program Oldies or Standards. The formats appeal to persons 55+, but this demographic has an awareness of the band and will seek out the format.

And wisdom appears foolish to youth. Have a popsicle, man. They're meltin' all over the place.

How's that smartphone data plan workin? Still free forever, and unlimited data? Didn't think so.......

 

[klutch00]

BL-40 Modulimiters typically generated lower-register (200 Hz and below) distortion of FORTY percent. But hey, they were loud! (Add that kind of processing to typical tube AM transmitters of the 1970s with their characteristic power supply tilt and carrier shift, plus the incredibly lousy car radios ca. 1973-1985, and small wonder FM took over quickly back then.)

DAP-310s were marvels for their day, but the limiting was done with good ol' diodes. This produced odd-order harmonic distortion when the boxes were pushed. The multiband design tended to mask a lot of the distortion but on some records when one of the three passbands predominated, you'd get some pretty nasty audio effects. I know A Certain Buffalo Engineer and On-Air Personality who devised a way to hot-rod 310s removing the limiter cards and simply using the discrete processors. The Dorroughs sounded WAY better that way.

Ed Buterbaugh was indeed a genius who had great respect for AM and its potential to actually sound good. He devised multiband discrete processing and ran prototypes on WEAM in 1971-72, later on CKLW, whose rig was a 1940s RCA BTA-50F fed by phone lines between Windsor and Harrow. The extant airchecks prove just how good AM could sound. I remember it well when I was there in '73.

WKBW (WWKB) sounded fantastic in AM stereo. Thanks, Tom Atkins and Dan Gurzynski.

I guess this goes to show that AM can broadcast a quality signal once again. Which engineers on which stations are willing to make this happen remains the question. I might suggest that a move be made to get underground, free-form formats to consider such a move. I can think of three stations which exist now that are doing free-form or alternative of some kind:
KKSN 910 Vancouver WA/Portland OR http://www.947.fm/ Go to 94/7 too.
KVOQ 1340 Denver CO http://www.openaircpr.org/
WBZH 1370 Pottstown PA http://www.wbzh.net/

 

[heydaybegone]

How's that smartphone data plan workin? Still free forever, and unlimited data? Didn't think so.......

Good point TW....however...they WILL give up those McD fries (or more likely get more $ from Mom & Dad), to keep the umbilical cords attached to THAT smartphone!!

BTW - without more $ from Mom & Dad, they will "see what's in their wallet"..without concern for financial needs in the future! (Hey, the providers aren't stupid...survival of the "smartest" )
BTW---the "phone" progresses to be smarter than the user!!

HDBG

disclaimer: this poster assumes the correct point being made by Mr. Wells)

 

[Play Freebird]

Any station owner-operator choosing to program music on AM with any degree of success, even with the help of an FM translator, has little choice but to program Oldies or Standards. The formats appeal to persons 55+, but this demographic has an awareness of the band and will seek out the format.

Say what? We're programming country on WCJW (admittedly with the help of four translators) and doing quite well. And based on response to our Facebook page, we're reaching plenty of listeners under 55.

 

[Element9]

Cheers! Good to know things are working out for CJ Country in Warsaw and Wyoming-Genesee-Livingston counties and you're doing well Facebook 25-54. My comments were made in reference to the Buffalo market.

 

[Whiplash]

Posted before: "The only format that can draw listeners under the age of 50 to the AM band is Sports"

The many AM stations that simply grab ESPN or Fox Sports and put them on, sometimes in the same market, are mostly wasting their time, and wasting a signal.

 

[Savage]

Bill, I honestly don't recall WGR being in stereo when I was KB for my second stint (the first was in the winter of '69-'70; the second was only from April to the end of December '86, at which point I left to build the current WYSL.) And I had made many a trip out to Big Tree Road with Tom and/or Dan back then, doing my share of poking around the former Buffalo Broadcasting Corporation shared site. I don't remember seeing any C-Quam gear on the WGR side of the transmitter gallery. But then again I can't remember what I had for dinner last night.

Tom Atkins had an ingenious system built into the KB control room on Delaware Avenue, conceived to discourage jock tinkering with audio or constant gassification to the engineering staff about subjective processing preferences. In the rack was an audio chain feeding the studio monitors and headphones called "The K-Big Pacifier." You could use various controls including a graphic equalizer to make everything sound just how you liked it - which of course, had nothing to do with what was actually going out over the air.

KB in AM stereo sounded so great, I would set all the Pacifier controls to Flat - and leave them.

 

[Mike Sheridan]

KB in AM stereo sounded so great, I would set all the Pacifier controls to Flat - and leave them.

Bob You know most of us are deaf from crankin' the audio in our headphones! ;D

 

[cee]

Bill, I honestly don't recall WGR being in stereo when I was KB for my second stint (the first was in the winter of '69-'70; the second was only from April to the end of December '86, at which point I left to build the current WYSL.) And I had made many a trip out to Big Tree Road with Tom and/or Dan back then, doing my share of poking around the former Buffalo Broadcasting Corporation shared site. I don't remember seeing any C-Quam gear on the WGR side of the transmitter gallery. But then again I can't remember what I had for dinner last night.

IIRC, WGR went stereo first in 1983. Also, IIRC, KB was doing the finishing touches on their AM stereo late one night in the shared xmtr site. GR already had it's stereo equipment installed, but it wasn't being used yet. Some astute GR employee(Dave Mason? Doug Wolf?) was at the shared site while this was going on and flipped on the GR stereo switch(or whatever they had to do) and GR was thus Buffalo's first AM stereo station.

Bob, by the time you came to KB, GR may have given up on it.

 

[heydaybegone]

jock tinkering with audio

THAT is a complete fallacy...never happened(s)....false accusations....this is Radio after all ;D

Bob You know most of us are deaf from crankin' the audio in our headphones

I have mentioned about turning up the volume on these boards...but no response from the webmaster yet ???

 

[Paul_Warren]

...Some astute GR employee(Dave Mason? Doug Wolf?) was at the shared site while this was going on and flipped on the GR stereo switch(or whatever they had to do) and GR was thus Buffalo's first AM stereo station...

I recall hearing at the time that 'KB was actually operating in stereo first, but holding off promoting it, when WGR started promoting the "first in AM stereo" bit. I was also told some folks at 'KB were incensed that they'd been beaten to the public announcement, despite the fact WGR had only mono programming running with the subcarrier on just to light up the receivers.

 

[DaveMasonsd]

Having been at the Big Tree facility many times, I think I have somewhat of a handle (albeit a poor memory) of the AM stereo story. 'KB was indeed FIRST in AM stereo in Buffalo. Not full time. Tom Atkins had been experimenting with it - and had it sounding pretty good. In our 'GR opinion, KB was always a little flat. That's from the first time I heard it "close up" in the 60's. Never a lot of processing. The thought was that to be in stereo you STILL had to be very lightly processed. On ' GR we felt the opposite. Notwithstanding, we planned a Saturday night installation for the AM Stereo exciter for WGR. The wiring (with the help of a rep from Harris and Ted Ruscitti, Taft Director of Engineering) took a few hours. Myself, our promotions director and several others waited in the parking lot on Big Tree putting away a few beers waiting for them to finish. Tom Atkins (who spent LOTS of time at the transmitter-to his credit) was also there finalizing his wiring to put KB into permanent stereo. Those of us in the parking lot were shocked and dismayed when we heard a loud "Ka-Rack!!!" coming from the upstairs on Big Tree. Thinking we were doomed, Ted came out into the parking lot. When asked what happened, he said "no one's hurt, but it looks like something in the transmitter shorted". We were crushed-but he then said "KB's Transmitter". Long story short-our installation was flawless. By 2am the stereo light would have been lit on AM radios all over Western New York. If there were any. The following week we bought a full-page ad in the Evening News-- "GR55- Buffalo's FIRST Station is now Buffalo's FIRST in AM STEREO". It was my suggestion. We sounded GREAT in AM Stereo. 'KB also sounded great in AM stereo. I don't know this for a fact, but Buffalo was one of the few cities in the country to have TWO AM stereo stations. Yes it was 1983 and to have 2 AM stations playing MUSIC was a stretch. Nonetheless - no one since has asked me, or Ted Ruscitti or Tom Atkins or anyone else how that AM stereo thing did. My wife that year bought a Jeep that had an AM stereo radio in it - and a few years later I bought an Infiniti that had the same. Both would nicely switch into wideband mode when the stereo light lit. No one knew, no one cared -and it was a boondoggle. (HD Radio please note.) Just because FM had it, didn't mean it was right for AM. But we certainly had fun. To further the MONO vs. Stereo programming- - Initially we had a "stereo simulator" in the line to make our Mono signal sound like stereo - but eventually we (at my suggestion) did put the stereo into the transmitter. I think we had the Harris system. My old 79 Honda Prelude's analog radio would sound great when you tuned it slightly off center-to get more highs out of it. With Stereo, you could tune out one of the channels (!) .

Many of these posts are correct ..i just thought I'd add a few details. It wasn't our first foray into AM Stereo - a story I'd love to share at another time. It also included KB and GR.

 

[GeorgeKramer]

Really like how it sounds on 102.9 FM but that signal just doesn't work for most. I also don't see much in terms of print advertising promoting the station. There were some Buffalo News display ads, but those are still few and far between. I think the average WNYer doesn't know that music is available on 102.9 FM unless they accidently stumble upon it flipping from 102.5 FM to 103.3 FM or 104.1 FM.