My coversation with Whit Adamson & AM Stations in General

[scottwmro]

I had a nice discussion with Whit Adamson , President of the TAB yesterday afternoon. He told me his focus was to make sure every licensee is protected from being pushed around by the Federal Government. That is a good thing. My main statement I made to him was we must (the AM stations) operate in accordance with our license.

I told Whit that I think with now all the FCC has going on now, such as DTV, Satellite, Cell Phones, consumer part 15 devices, etc. the FCC has put AM Radio on the back burner and wished it would just go away, since to them, it's old technology.

An idea that I presented to Whit was AM stations that can operate at night with powers anywhere from 2 watts to 125 watts should all be authorized to operate at 250 watts at night. Whit and I know this would get the DX'ers in an uproar, but Whit says they have no say in it anyway.

Example: Why should WMDB-AM 880 (authorized for 2 watts at night) should be running such low power to protect WCBS in NYC? Nobody in this day in this age (the general public) is listening to WCBS at night outside thier 2.5 Mv/m contour anyway. The only AM station that has some sort of an audience at night on AM is WSM. But here's the thing, WSM can be moved to XM, and so can the other Class A clears like WGN, KDKA, WINS, KXEL, WLW, etc. if they have programming that can't be found anywhere else, like the Opry.

With AM at it's death door, stations going dark, local AM should be able to operate at 250 watts (non directional) at night and the protection on Class A stations should be reduced from 750 miles to 400 miles. This way, the small town stations can be heard broadcasting the local high school ballgames at night, and too, local programming would become more realistic.

I know I'll have many disagree here, but if we want local radio to stay alive, since the big companies have move the local FM's to the metro areas, and LPFM is NOT an option, something is got to give here. Comments?

 

[deltas69]

i know i'm old and out of the loop..but what the he!! is a DX'ER ? i see this term bandied about..just want to add one more crease to the ole brain

 

[scottwmro]

i know i'm old and out of the loop..but what the he!! is a DX'ER ? i see this term bandied about..just want to add one more crease to the ole brain

A DX'er is deomgraphic that consist of mostly men, 50 plus (although there few younger ones) that go buy AM Receivers that are a expensive as a field strengh meter/receiver. As a hobby, they log stations they receive and ask stations to send them QSL cards to verify reception of that station. That's about the best way I can explain it to you. They have clubs like the "NRC" (National Radio Club) & the IRCA.

Most of them are good folk, but as always, there are a few in these clubs that think they are the FCC and make threats to stations, especially daytimers. I guess in all large clubs, there are a few bad apples.

 

[radiorob2.0]

You will only make the problem worse. The solution is a use it or lose it mentality. If a license holder does nothing more with an AM signal than occupy bandwidth so no one else can compete against him, then sell it or shut it down.

AM is in trouble and IBOC has made it worse. Everyone on 880 powering up at night may not affect WCBS in the NY/NJ/CT area. But AM operators on regional class frequencies, especially those using directional antennas producing signals that didn't cover the population growth, might have issues if a daytimer elsewhere decided to pump up the power at night.

i know i'm old and out of the loop..but what the he!! is a DX'ER ? i see this term bandied about..just want to add one more crease to the ole brain

http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/board,301.0.html

 

[radioguybroadcasting]

You will only make the problem worse. The solution is a use it or lose it mentality. If a license holder does nothing more with an AM signal than occupy bandwidth so no one else can compete against him, then sell it or shut it down.

AM is in trouble and IBOC has made it worse. Everyone on 880 powering up at night may not affect WCBS in the NY/NJ/CT area. But AM operators on regional class frequencies, especially those using directional antennas producing signals that didn't cover the population growth, might have issues if a daytimer elsewhere decided to pump up the power at night.

i know i'm old and out of the loop..but what the he!! is a DX'ER ? i see this term bandied about..just want to add one more crease to the ole brain

http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/board,301.0.html

Yup, radiorob.. well said.... I like to think of the addage "give people and inch, they'll take a mile"

The noise floor is going to get raised considerably...

I don't think that more power is the answer exactly, better programming is..... stations that run ALL satelitte programming *ahem*... aren't helping matters.

 

[radioguybroadcasting]

By the way, I think the protection for clears shouldn't be reduced from 750 miles to 400 miles.. but from 750 miles to 400 miles

 

[scottwmro]

You will only make the problem worse. The solution is a use it or lose it mentality. If a license holder does nothing more with an AM signal than occupy bandwidth so no one else can compete against him, then sell it or shut it down.

AM is in trouble and IBOC has made it worse. Everyone on 880 powering up at night may not affect WCBS in the NY/NJ/CT area. But AM operators on regional class frequencies, especially those using directional antennas producing signals that didn't cover the population growth, might have issues if a daytimer elsewhere decided to pump up the power at night.

i know i'm old and out of the loop..but what the he!! is a DX'ER ? i see this term bandied about..just want to add one more crease to the ole brain

http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/board,301.0.html

The plan would be the stations on "regional" channels would be taken in as a case by case deal. The idea directional patterns for AM stations (especially regionals) was the worse thing that had happen, but that was a different time and day. We are past that. Regionals should be able to do away with those old directional paterns, especially where the directional pattern only covers an Urban area, and all the people that need to be reached live now in the suburbs.

Everyone compains about local programming. Local Programming is expensive and it is WHY a lot of AM stations have gone dark like WATO in Oak Ridge. The economic situation in the U.S. today for small businness is so bad that stations can't even make payroll, and you expect local programming out of small AM stations? You're wishing for the good ole D.J./Live Announcer days, where small radio stations and even stations in medium markets can't afford it.

Small businesses have taken a hit and many have died. Your local Wal-Mart doesn't need to advertise on the local AM station. Big Business has hurt the little man being a part of the media. Now I wonder why your taking a hit a the small AM station license holder? Satellite & Local Automation has kept AM stations on the air that would have been dark a long time ago.

So tell me, in this gloomy economic situation we face, with a new president coming in and a new administration, you think you would take a local AM station, hire jocks, and keep in mind they need more than minimum wage for a salary, they need to make a living from working at your station. Radio Sales are DOWN these days because big business says......word of mouth is the best advertising, along with TV, print, and the internet. If you think to go in that direction, you'll loose your tail if you borrowed money from the bank!

 

[radiorob2.0]

I've worked for regionals that would have done anything to move the array but it takes money and land. In the end that may not be enough if the signal is locked to a very restricted directional pattern no matter where you move the antenna farm. The past and present owner of 1300 Nashville could attest to this issue. Doing away with the directional facilities brings us back to the same problem, more noise.

 

[w9wi]

An idea that I presented to Whit was AM stations that can operate at night with powers anywhere from 2 watts to 125 watts should all be authorized to operate at 250 watts at night. Whit and I know this would get the DX'ers in an uproar, but Whit says they have no say in it anyway.

Example: Why should WMDB-AM 880 (authorized for 2 watts at night) should be running such low power to protect WCBS in NYC? Nobody in this day in this age (the general public) is listening to WCBS at night outside thier 2.5 Mv/m contour anyway. The only AM station that has some sort of an audience at night on AM is WSM. But here's the thing, WSM can be moved to XM, and so can the other Class A clears like WGN, KDKA, WINS, KXEL, WLW, etc. if they have programming that can't be found anywhere else, like the Opry.

With AM at it's death door, stations going dark, local AM should be able to operate at 250 watts (non directional) at night and the protection on Class A stations should be reduced from 750 miles to 400 miles. This way, the small town stations can be heard broadcasting the local high school ballgames at night, and too, local programming would become more realistic.

I know I'll have many disagree here, but if we want local radio to stay alive, since the big companies have move the local FM's to the metro areas, and LPFM is NOT an option, something is got to give here. Comments?

Remember that if you authorize WMRO to run 250 watts non-DA at night, you're going to have to authorize the same for the other 36 Class D operations on 1560. That includes eleven in states bordering Tennessee and WBOL out in Hardeman County. Don't think WBOL and the two 1560s out of Kentucky aren't going to limit WMRO's night coverage almost as effectively as the power cut. Take a listen to the Class C frequencies (1230, 1240, 1340, 1400, 1450, 1490) at night. That's what happens when you allow a blanket night power increase...

To be perfectly honest, most Class D stations should never have existed in the first place. They came into being only because there was so little competition for radio that the "crumbs" left over after the big full-timers had their feed was more than enough to be profitable.

Today, you have TV, cable, and a dialful of FM to compete with. You're not going to put any of that back in the bottle.

The one bright spot I see for Class D stations are FM translators. A 10-watter could easily cover Gallatin or any other outlying local town.

 

[w9wi]

i know i'm old and out of the loop..but what the he!! is a DX'ER ? i see this term bandied about..just want to add one more crease to the ole brain

I think a fair definition of "DXer" is a hobbyist interested in the reception of broadcast stations outside their normal coverage area.

To over-generalize, DXers tend to be unhappy with the introduction of additional night service on AM because it tends to interfere with reception of weaker, more exotic, and more distant stations.

The source of the term "DX" is an old Morse Code abbreviation for "distance". I believe the term predates broadcasting.

 

[scottwmro]

An idea that I presented to Whit was AM stations that can operate at night with powers anywhere from 2 watts to 125 watts should all be authorized to operate at 250 watts at night. Whit and I know this would get the DX'ers in an uproar, but Whit says they have no say in it anyway.

Example: Why should WMDB-AM 880 (authorized for 2 watts at night) should be running such low power to protect WCBS in NYC? Nobody in this day in this age (the general public) is listening to WCBS at night outside thier 2.5 Mv/m contour anyway. The only AM station that has some sort of an audience at night on AM is WSM. But here's the thing, WSM can be moved to XM, and so can the other Class A clears like WGN, KDKA, WINS, KXEL, WLW, etc. if they have programming that can't be found anywhere else, like the Opry.

With AM at it's death door, stations going dark, local AM should be able to operate at 250 watts (non directional) at night and the protection on Class A stations should be reduced from 750 miles to 400 miles. This way, the small town stations can be heard broadcasting the local high school ballgames at night, and too, local programming would become more realistic.

I know I'll have many disagree here, but if we want local radio to stay alive, since the big companies have move the local FM's to the metro areas, and LPFM is NOT an option, something is got to give here. Comments?

Remember that if you authorize WMRO to run 250 watts non-DA at night, you're going to have to authorize the same for the other 36 Class D operations on 1560. That includes eleven in states bordering Tennessee and WBOL out in Hardeman County. Don't think WBOL and the two 1560s out of Kentucky aren't going to limit WMRO's night coverage almost as effectively as the power cut. Take a listen to the Class C frequencies (1230, 1240, 1340, 1400, 1450, 1490) at night. That's what happens when you allow a blanket night power increase...

To be perfectly honest, most Class D stations should never have existed in the first place. They came into being only because there was so little competition for radio that the "crumbs" left over after the big full-timers had their feed was more than enough to be profitable.

Today, you have TV, cable, and a dialful of FM to compete with. You're not going to put any of that back in the bottle.

The one bright spot I see for Class D stations are FM translators. A 10-watter could easily cover Gallatin or any other outlying local town.

Doug,

I don't know if you heard about this yesterday, I think it came from the NAB's daily email they send out to us, but the deal is now the commission wants to do away with these STA's where AM station are already using FM translators. It blew me away when I read it. It's like the AM's who already have them have wasted thier time in buying or building one, and now the they want to take them away and the whole idea of AM's having FM translators.

If this is to happen, and the rules stay in effect as far as LPFM, then like Whit and I were discussing, what's an AM daytimer going to do?

Like I said, the FCC has thier attention focused on DTV, satellite, cell phones, and more interest in the digital spectrum, that AM has taken a back seat and it's sad that there are people out there that don't see this happening. IBOC on AM is a joke! There is so much interference on AM that the FCC seems to not care, unless they get a major complaint, then it's hard to get them to do anything about it. That's the reason why I said, turn some of these regional channels on the AM dial to a local channels OR they should of have moved moved as many Classs D stations to the the X-band, 1610-1700, with 250-1000 watts day & night. I think the FCC has forgot all about the X-band. They will not grant any new licensed stations to those channels.

The others here keep screaming localism, but that comes with a BIG price tag in 2009. I do agree with you on on thing, from 1960-1988, too many Class D, daytime only station were "shoehorned" into channels that should have been kept clear. I tried to find a Class "C" channel to move WMRO to. There is nothing. The only thing I could find that MIGHT work was 1400. Gary Brown and I looked at it but there was not enough space between WJZM and WHUB to fit in a 250 watt Class "D" in Gallatin. We looked at 1490, 15 years before Bill Barry put on today's WCOR 1490, but my site was too close to WLAC.

In 1989, there was a proposal for Class "D" stations to use Class "C" local channels at night, but the commission got so much objection from full-time Class "C" stations, that that never happen.

 

[scottwmro]

I've worked for regionals that would have done anything to move the array but it takes money and land. In the end that may not be enough if the signal is locked to a very restricted directional pattern no matter where you move the antenna farm. The past and present owner of 1300 Nashville could attest to this issue. Doing away with the directional facilities brings us back to the same problem, more noise.

Rob,

There is nothing you can do about the noisefloor on AM. New electronic devices we use in homes and at work cause the noise floor to rise more on AM in the past 15-20 years. One thing you are correct on, it is not worth the time, nor money to throw up a big directional station on a regional channel these days. Heck, the property is worth more than the license. 1300 is a perfect example. Jason Cooper and I were talking one night and it may come to a point that those 5 towers out there may need to be replaced. Is it worth it?

 

[deltas69]

so..a dx'er is someone who doesn't have a life..ok...was 1300 (old wmak) always a 5 tower system ? i know back in the golden days 1240 and 1300 were the stations of choice at the local swimming pool during daytime..and we had nothing at night..until we discovered WLS..(boogiecheck!)..was 1240 the same system..thusly we couldn't get them at night in grundgy and graffling gallatin ?

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

The one bright spot I see for Class D stations are FM translators. A 10-watter could easily cover Gallatin or any other outlying local town.

The FM band is not as big a sponge as some of us dream of it being. Several months ago I began a study of the possibilities for LPFM. I didn't do a search for Nashville or Gallatin, but every other metro situation that I looked at has no available frequency to squeeze in an LPFM. To be fair about that statement: under pressure from those who did not want this new class of service the draconian 3rd adjacent channel protection rule was included.

Second issue: Practical coverage is rather limited. The basic premise on LPFM is 100 watts at a maximum of 100 feet above average terrain. What they expect you to get out of that is 3-1/2 miles each direction. I drove around town recently to observe one of these little hummers and on my car radio that is about what I got: 3 to 4 miles. Now maybe with an antenna stuck up there 300 fee or so the coverage would improve. I assume some of the people who are talking about what kind of coverage they get with their low power translators, etc. are including the listeners serious enough to install a direction yagi receiving antenna 30 feet or more in the air.

I have for my own purposes decided that FM transmitters of 100 watts or so would be a godsend for county seat radio stations where population is highly clustered near the town. Once you get a legal foothold of that kind from the FCC you have some credibility with the advertisers. Then the heavy lifting begins. You work out deals to also get your audio on cable TV systems to get out past your 3 to 5 mile limit. You focus on helping people at the edges of your county, your market, to understand streaming and you get on the Internet. But it will still be a far cry from having a 6kw FM tower out behind the studio.

 

[K4WRF]

With AM at it's death door, stations going dark, local AM should be able to operate at 250 watts (non directional) at night and the protection on Class A stations should be reduced from 750 miles to 400 miles. This way, the small town stations can be heard broadcasting the local high school ballgames at night, and too, local programming would become more realistic.

Due to the diurnal nature of medium frequencies (AM), this concept is impossible. A direct comparison is the night-time power increase granted “Class IV” operations back in the early 1980’s, a net loss in individual station coverage. What you contribute, you get back times four. Translator is your best bet and I don’t think you will see the FCC provide anymore spectrum any time soon.

Good luck....

 

[w9wi]

I don't know if you heard about this yesterday, I think it came from the NAB's daily email they send out to us, but the deal is now the commission wants to do away with these STA's where AM station are already using FM translators. It blew me away when I read it. It's like the AM's who already have them have wasted thier time in buying or building one, and now the they want to take them away and the whole idea of AM's having FM translators.

Really?

I knew they were dragging their feet on "permanentizing" the translators-of-AM-stations proceeding, but I figured they were just waiting for the localism proceeding to be completed. It seems strange that they'd think they could put that genie back in the bottle. (I'm sure they'd love to put an end to the satellite-fed translator fiasco, but they know it would be a political firestorm to simply try to prevent new ones, let alone revoke the ones that already exist)

Like I said, the FCC has thier attention focused on DTV, satellite, cell phones, and more interest in the digital spectrum, that AM has taken a back seat and it's sad that there are people out there that don't see this happening. IBOC on AM is a joke! There is so much interference on AM that the FCC seems to not care, unless they get a major complaint, then it's hard to get them to do anything about it. That's the reason why I said, turn some of these regional channels on the AM dial to a local channels OR they should of have moved moved as many Classs D stations to the the X-band, 1610-1700, with 250-1000 watts day & night. I think the FCC has forgot all about the X-band. They will not grant any new licensed stations to those channels.

See Watt's comments about across-the-board power increases. We've tried it. (on the Class C stations) DXers still call Class C stations "graveyard" stations, and with good reason.

The FCC certainly seems to be overwhelmed. One would think there has to be some way to get faster action on new-station and major-change proceedings, not to mention bigger things like LP10 and the X-band.

The others here keep screaming localism, but that comes with a BIG price tag in 2009. I do agree with you on on thing, from 1960-1988, too many Class D, daytime only station were "shoehorned" into channels that should have been kept clear. I tried to find a Class "C" channel to move WMRO to. There is nothing. The only thing I could find that MIGHT work was 1400. Gary Brown and I looked at it but there was not enough space between WJZM and WHUB to fit in a 250 watt Class "D" in Gallatin. We looked at 1490, 15 years before Bill Barry put on today's WCOR 1490, but my site was too close to WLAC.

(and I wonder if Bill is regretting bothering to build a 1490 station that close to WLAC... their IBOC really eats a hole in his coverage...)

Actually the problem goes back somewhat further than 1960. The number of AM stations more than doubled in the three years following the end of World War II. By 1960 there were 3-1/2 times as many stations as at the end of the war.

At the end of the war, there were only 59 daytimers. There were NO daytimers in Tennessee. (ironically, one of the 59 daytimers was WMRO! - but that was the WMRO in Aurora, Illinois that is today WBIG) Today, there are 115 Class D stations in Tennessee alone!

I would strongly suggest that the number of stations on the air at the end of WWII is a very close approximation to the number the AM dial could handle.

In 1989, there was a proposal for Class "D" stations to use Class "C" local channels at night, but the commission got so much objection from full-time Class "C" stations, that that never happen.

They cause enough interference to each other, they really can't deal with having yet more stations piled on their channels.....

 

[scottwmro]

I don't know if you heard about this yesterday, I think it came from the NAB's daily email they send out to us, but the deal is now the commission wants to do away with these STA's where AM station are already using FM translators. It blew me away when I read it. It's like the AM's who already have them have wasted thier time in buying or building one, and now the they want to take them away and the whole idea of AM's having FM translators.

Really?

I knew they were dragging their feet on "permanentizing" the translators-of-AM-stations proceeding, but I figured they were just waiting for the localism proceeding to be completed. It seems strange that they'd think they could put that genie back in the bottle. (I'm sure they'd love to put an end to the satellite-fed translator fiasco, but they know it would be a political firestorm to simply try to prevent new ones, let alone revoke the ones that already exist)

Like I said, the FCC has thier attention focused on DTV, satellite, cell phones, and more interest in the digital spectrum, that AM has taken a back seat and it's sad that there are people out there that don't see this happening. IBOC on AM is a joke! There is so much interference on AM that the FCC seems to not care, unless they get a major complaint, then it's hard to get them to do anything about it. That's the reason why I said, turn some of these regional channels on the AM dial to a local channels OR they should of have moved moved as many Classs D stations to the the X-band, 1610-1700, with 250-1000 watts day & night. I think the FCC has forgot all about the X-band. They will not grant any new licensed stations to those channels.

See Watt's comments about across-the-board power increases. We've tried it. (on the Class C stations) DXers still call Class C stations "graveyard" stations, and with good reason.

The FCC certainly seems to be overwhelmed. One would think there has to be some way to get faster action on new-station and major-change proceedings, not to mention bigger things like LP10 and the X-band.

The others here keep screaming localism, but that comes with a BIG price tag in 2009. I do agree with you on on thing, from 1960-1988, too many Class D, daytime only station were "shoehorned" into channels that should have been kept clear. I tried to find a Class "C" channel to move WMRO to. There is nothing. The only thing I could find that MIGHT work was 1400. Gary Brown and I looked at it but there was not enough space between WJZM and WHUB to fit in a 250 watt Class "D" in Gallatin. We looked at 1490, 15 years before Bill Barry put on today's WCOR 1490, but my site was too close to WLAC.

(and I wonder if Bill is regretting bothering to build a 1490 station that close to WLAC... their IBOC really eats a hole in his coverage...)

Actually the problem goes back somewhat further than 1960. The number of AM stations more than doubled in the three years following the end of World War II. By 1960 there were 3-1/2 times as many stations as at the end of the war.

At the end of the war, there were only 59 daytimers. There were NO daytimers in Tennessee. (ironically, one of the 59 daytimers was WMRO! - but that was the WMRO in Aurora, Illinois that is today WBIG) Today, there are 115 Class D stations in Tennessee alone!

I would strongly suggest that the number of stations on the air at the end of WWII is a very close approximation to the number the AM dial could handle.

In 1989, there was a proposal for Class "D" stations to use Class "C" local channels at night, but the commission got so much objection from full-time Class "C" stations, that that never happen.

They cause enough interference to each other, they really can't deal with having yet more stations piled on their channels.....

Doug,

As you recall in 1988-89, the FCC ended the taking applications for new "daytime only" stations. Bill Barry must have almost not made it getting 760, WENO on the air before the ruling came down. Watt is correct. If we all say on 1560 started runing 250 watts at night, with the exception of WQEW and KNZR, where they would run thier current nighttime authorized power, I agree the noisefloor would raise to the point to where you would get much than the flea power we all currently have a night.
WBOL in Boliver doesn't have any nighttime power. I think Johnny Shaw who owns the station, has an FM that he more interested in than the WBOL. He could apply for nighttime with WBOL, and get about 5 watts or so, but I guess he figures, why was my time.
With this said, on our channel, I'm the closest to NYC that has any night power, 3 watts. The rest of the stations going towards NYC have nothing, and some probably could get even 1/2 watt anyway.
Doug, have you had a chance to monitor 1560 during Critical Hours? Boy, what a mess! My thinking was if the stations that have "flea power" at night could operate at 250 during post sunset, would this cause a rage?
On Friday Nights, in the fall, would it be possible for WMRO and WHIN to operate anywhere from 125 to 250 watts during the ballgames, and then back down after the ballgame. I guess what I'm saying is to extend Post-Sunset for both stations from 2 hour to 4 hours of post-sunset.
Both Gallatin stations protect a NYC station. With more power in the month of December with Post-Sunset, like being able to operate until 10 PM during the winter with some kind of higher power, say 100 watts, what bad factor can this cause the Class A stations we protect.
With a small town AM like WMRO and WHIN, if your not running a football game, it's really a waste of time to be on due to the general public is home watching TV, on the computer, and doing other family things. Nobody is listen to either WMRO or WHIN,.... UNLESS it is an emergency like the 2 tornados that have hit this town, then a that point, we should run daytime power to get important information out to the community.

I would love to hear the opinions of the brain trust, you Doug, Watt, Dale Howard, and other engineers on this list.

Oh Doug, by the way, you are probably are right about Bill Barry wishing he had not built 1490 in Lebanon. The IBOC has really wipes him out until you get to HY 109 towards Lebanon, then the signal is strong enough to override WLAC's IBOC hash.

 

[w9wi]

As you recall in 1988-89, the FCC ended the taking applications for new "daytime only" stations. Bill Barry must have almost not made it getting 760, WENO on the air before the ruling came down. Watt is correct. If we all say on 1560 started runing 250 watts at night, with the exception of WQEW and KNZR, where they would run thier current nighttime authorized power, I agree the noisefloor would raise to the point to where you would get much than the flea power we all currently have a night.

The other factor I haven't already mentioned are the Class B stations. There are a handful on 1560. Paducah is probably the one that's relevant here. Presumably they too would be allowed to continue to operate at their current night power. At 250 watts non-DA at night, WMRO (and WBOL) are going to interfere with this one.

Doug, have you had a chance to monitor 1560 during Critical Hours? Boy, what a mess! My thinking was if the stations that have "flea power" at night could operate at 250 during post sunset, would this cause a rage?

In 1966, there were only four stations on 830. The Class A operation was WCCO, Minneapolis. The other stations were KBOA Kennett, Mo. (daytime only), WNYC New York (limited-time, could stay on the air until sundown in Minneapolis and could operate any night hours WCCO chose not to operate), and KIKI Honolulu.

On Sunday nights at midnight, WCCO would go off the air until 6:00 Monday morning. WNYC could have legally returned to the air, but they didn't feel there was much point to signing on at 1:00 in the morning! So for a few hours, the only station operating in the U.S. on 830 was in Honolulu.

KIKI was widely reported heard throughout all of North America, including the East Coast.

Their power: 250 watts.

My point being, a 250-watt station 5,000 miles away can generate enough signal to be heard. You'd better believe one 800 miles away is capable of causing interference.

 

[scottwmro]

As you recall in 1988-89, the FCC ended the taking applications for new "daytime only" stations. Bill Barry must have almost not made it getting 760, WENO on the air before the ruling came down. Watt is correct. If we all say on 1560 started runing 250 watts at night, with the exception of WQEW and KNZR, where they would run thier current nighttime authorized power, I agree the noisefloor would raise to the point to where you would get much than the flea power we all currently have a night.

The other factor I haven't already mentioned are the Class B stations. There are a handful on 1560. Paducah is probably the one that's relevant here. Presumably they too would be allowed to continue to operate at their current night power. At 250 watts non-DA at night, WMRO (and WBOL) are going to interfere with this one.

Doug, have you had a chance to monitor 1560 during Critical Hours? Boy, what a mess! My thinking was if the stations that have "flea power" at night could operate at 250 during post sunset, would this cause a rage?

In 1966, there were only four stations on 830. The Class A operation was WCCO, Minneapolis. The other stations were KBOA Kennett, Mo. (daytime only), WNYC New York (limited-time, could stay on the air until sundown in Minneapolis and could operate any night hours WCCO chose not to operate), and KIKI Honolulu.

On Sunday nights at midnight, WCCO would go off the air until 6:00 Monday morning. WNYC could have legally returned to the air, but they didn't feel there was much point to signing on at 1:00 in the morning! So for a few hours, the only station operating in the U.S. on 830 was in Honolulu.

KIKI was widely reported heard throughout all of North America, including the East Coast.

Their power: 250 watts.

My point being, a 250-watt station 5,000 miles away can generate enough signal to be heard. You'd better believe one 800 miles away is capable of causing interference.

Doug,

Don't take what I'm saying the wrong way,

What's the solution to the problem? Everyone is unhappy with the AM Band, it sounds like crap, thanks to Clear Channel's idea of trimming the high end down to almost land line telephone audio. Oh yes, IBOC....creating a mess!

Do you think all Class D stations should have thier license revolked? That would kill off alot of stations, & make the DX'ers happy, then open that will open the Class B regionals that have 10 KW or more to increase power, like WPAD.

I have spoken to the operations manager of WPAD and he told me they would love to do away with it, but I feel at the same time they wouldn't sell it or turn in the license. It makes no money, their FM's make all the cash. He told me that one of the ideas was to just go up with one stick and turn it off at night, or rework the directional to make the operation simple, much simple than it is now.

 

[radioguybroadcasting]

WPAD is in an interesting situation.... 10KW Day/2 towers with a peanut shaped pattern, then 1KW ND till Bakersfield Sunset, then 5KW, 3 towers at night.