New Ipod Nano with FM tuner. PPM fails.

[Buckethead]

Today Apple unveiled a new Ipod Nano with an FM tuner.
This sounds like great news for radio on the surface.
Huge breakthrough.
BUT...
I pods can only be listened to using headphones.
This will not register with PPM, am I correct?
This is a failure of PPM.
Maybe some users listen through a dock,
but there is no way PPM can accurately measure these portable FM listeners.

Discuss.

 

[pjc1961]

Arbitron can supply a PPM carrier with a device that can accomodate a walkman/headphone setup. Basically the device acts as an intermediary between the headphones & the walkman/ipod: headphones get plugged into the device to which the PPM meter is attached, then a cord runs from the device to the walkman/ipod jack. In essence, for a PPM carrier to have their walkman/ipod listening measured, that person would have to simultaneously carry 2 portable devices, admittedly cumbersome.

 

[Buckethead]

What is the size of this device?

Yes, most likely defeats the purpose of the tiny Nano.
Wouldn't it be wonderful if there was a software patch for the Nano that would measure usage.
The same could be said for the Zune, but the Nano is the largest selling portable player.

 

[pjc1961]

The device is basically a leather cover for the PPM meter (the meter itself is the size of a large "beeper"-remember those?! technology changes quickly!) with a headphone jack which leads to a connection to the meter.

 

[avtosalon]

Why doesn't this product have an AM tuner??????????

What were the idiots at Apple thinking when they decided to blow-off AM on this product?

 

[davideduardo]

Why doesn't this product have an AM tuner??????????

What were the idiots at Apple thinking when they decided to blow-off AM on this product?

Third, an AM antenna would not fit in a small case like that, and second, in the demographic of those that use a nano, AM is hardly used at all... most don't even know it exists.

And in first place, AM does not play music. Apple can make lots of money from the purchasing of songs tagged on FM listening, but not from AM.

 

[avtosalon]

Then how do explain all of the portable Walkman-type radios that have FM and AM? Apparently those manufacturers (Sony, RCA, Panasonic, Coby, and everyone else) could figure out how to include an antenna for both FM and AM in a small device.

You're also wrong about AM not playing music. Although the amount of music on AM is alot less than FM, there are still plenty of AM music stations, like Radio Disney (47 AM affiliates nationwide). You'll find Oldies stations on AM in many areas, and niche-music formats like Gospel, Foreign Language, and there's even a Heavy Metal station on AM near Chicago.

By the way, some of the non-music stations on AM have higher ratings than FM stations so there are definitely alot of people still listening to AM.

http://www.apple.com/ipodnano/features/fm-radio.html

This is too bad, because this Apple product looks nice. They don't say that this is an 'FM HD' radio, so you also will not be able to hear AM stations which have started to simulcast on HD2/HD3 sister-stations.

 

[davideduardo]

Then how do explain all of the portable Walkman-type radios that have FM and AM? Apparently those manufacturers (Sony, RCA, Panasonic, Coby, and everyone else) could figure out how to include an antenna for both FM and AM in a small device.

The Nano is principally an MP3 player, not a radio. And it is nearly credit card sized, much smaller than those other devices you mention that have AM in them. And we know Apple would try not to produce a device that did not perform, so it is unlikely they would have considered putting an AM stage in... since much of the interference caused by the processor for the device would fall right in the AM band.

It's a marvelous step that Apple recognizes that FM is still a part of the entertainment mix of the group that buys most of the iPods and derivitive products.

I'm also quite sure that a cost analysis made of adding AM vs. lost sales due to not having AM would find that there was absolutely no reason to put AM on the devices.

You're also wrong about AM not playing music.

Exceptions make the rule.

Although the amount of music on AM is alot less than FM, there are still plenty of AM music stations, like Radio Disney (47 AM affiliates nationwide).

And with nearly no audience. The whole of the Radio Disney group has less listening than one mid-tier LA FM music station. And how many pre-teens, the target of Disney, buy songs on iTunes?

You'll find Oldies stations on AM in many areas,

Very few in all but small, small markets and with very little listening.

and niche-music formats like Gospel, Foreign Language, and there's even a Heavy Metal station on AM near Chicago.

Do you think that the listeners of stations in Farsi and Vietnamese buy a lot of iPods?

By the way, some of the non-music stations on AM have higher ratings than FM stations so there are definitely alot of people still listening to AM.

AM listening is declining each year, and most of it is amoung persons over 55... the percentage of listening by persons 18-34 to AM is around 5%, give or take.

And those AMs with big numbers, again with a couple of exceptions, tend to look great in the 12+ share rank, but often are below 10th or 15th in the ages advertisers want. And that is also the group that is most likely to buy a Nano.

 

[avtosalon]

And it is nearly credit card sized, much smaller than those other devices you mention that have AM in them.

There were 'pens' produced with AM radios built inside them. I don't believe the 'lack of space' excuse.

And how many pre-teens, the target of Disney, buy songs on iTunes?

Actually the target of Radio Disney includes teens (not just pre-teens). The station almost sounds like CHR at times.

Do you think that the listeners of stations in Farsi and Vietnamese buy a lot of iPods?

Absolutely, as well as Russian, Korean, Polish, and other ethnic groups. These immigrant people are more tech-savy than Americans.

And those AMs with big numbers, again with a couple of exceptions, tend to look great in the 12+ share rank, but often are below 10th or 15th in the ages advertisers want. And that is also the group that is most likely to buy a Nano.

In major markets, the AM that is number 1 in the ratings often has the highest revenue too, so advertisers are attracted to AM.

I guess sportsfans are screwed with this product, because they can't hear their hometown teams (unless the game is on FM).

 

[davideduardo]

There were 'pens' produced with AM radios built inside them.

And they got about one or two stations. And they sounded awful. And they did not have a microprocessor in them, producing AM band interference.

Actually the target of Radio Disney includes teens (not just pre-teens). The station almost sounds like CHR at times.

Sorry, the expressed target of RD is pre-teens. Teens listen to AMP and KIIS.

Absolutely, as well as Russian, Korean, Polish, and other ethnic groups. These immigrant people are more tech-savy than Americans.

Polish speaking Poles are mostly seniors, now. There are only a couple of stations with Polish on them, same for Korean. Russian even less. Spanish has migrated to FM, as Hispanics listen to AM even less than non-Hispanics.

In major markets, the AM that is number 1 in the ratings often has the highest revenue too, so advertisers are attracted to AM.

One by one, those big AMs are either moving to FM (KIRO, WIBC, ktar, KSL, WWL, etc) or suffering badly declining revenues. That is not an issue for a Nano.

I guess sportsfans are screwed with this product, because they can't hear their hometown teams (unless the game is on FM).

The only remaining reason for anyone under 60 to listen to AM is sports... but you still can't put a micropocessor and an am radio in a card-sized case without squeals and squaks all over the dial...
.
Again, a nano is basically an MP3 player, not a radio. The fact they got FM in it is good for radio: AM is dying anyway.

 

[Buckethead]

Hopefully it is a step toward HD as well.
As we've learned from Apple, they improve on products with each new release.

 

[oldies76]

You'll find Oldies stations on AM in many areas,

Very few in all but small, small markets and with very little listening.

Any ratings data on Cruisin' Oldies 950 KRWZ out of Denver? Seems like a popular oldies station, complimenting classics hits KOOL 105.1.

 

[davideduardo]

Hopefully it is a step toward HD as well.
As we've learned from Apple, they improve on products with each new release.

HD, like AM, is pretty much dead.

 

[davideduardo]

Any ratings data on Cruisin' Oldies 950 KRWZ out of Denver? Seems like a popular oldies station, complimenting classics hits KOOL 105.1.

26th in the market, almost no listening under age of 55.

 

[radiojomo]

HD Radio always seems like a rip. When HD Radio is working properly, it's awesome. But there's more cons than pros,the signal is always weak and it ends up that you can't even listen to the HD signal of a station, especially stations like KROQ and KYSR. Not only that but not all stations are broadcasting in HD, the selection of music on HD 2 and HD 3 channels are still pretty lame and worse of all, it's still so freckin' expensive! The HD Radio I have cost me around $100! While they are selling the Insignia receiver at Best buy for $50, that's still around the same price for a cheap home stereo system.

 

[ChannelFlipper]

Hopefully it is a step toward HD as well.
As we've learned from Apple, they improve on products with each new release.

HD, like AM, is pretty much dead.

The difference is that AM once had a life. HD came stillborn.

 

[ButtnPushr]

An FM tuner..? Sounds like another one of those USELESS apps..

 

[gcreedle239]

David is correct. Putting an AM receiver in a computer device is impractical due to interference generated by the clock of the processor. Move your AM radio close to your computer and see what happens.

 

[RadioFixerCLE]

And they got about one or two stations. And they sounded awful. And they did not have a microprocessor in them, producing AM band interference.

The remote control for my Sony Mini-Disk player has an AM band tuner. It's about half the length of a ball point pen. I cracked it open once. The size of the antenna coil is tiny -- but it's enough to get all local stations properly - even in high-noise areas. Don't know how they did it, but it works wonders. This proves the size argument moot.

Again, a nano is basically an MP3 player, not a radio. The fact they got FM in it is good for radio: AM is dying anyway.

Agree with your first statement. The radio is just icing on the cake.
Now as for your second statement. It's a chicken and the egg argument. AM is dying. Why? Because programmers like you don't care to program compelling material. Why? Because AM is dying. Why? Because programmers like you.....bla bla bla....the beat goes on. See what I mean?

I work for a very high-billing AM station. We're not gonna be going out in a pine box any time soon.

 

[PapiYankee]

So let's assume that a PPM panelist is listening to FM radio with their iPod nano and has their headphone adapter working and the data is being properly collected by their PPM. What happens when they pause the live radio signal and a few minutes later resume listening?