Well thank you radio fan. I'm interested in just about any local market where I can get in. I sent a resume to Forever to Ron Haney for a board op job recently. He emailed me back and said he would forward it to the PDs there. He said they are always happy to talk to people and to check back when I wanted to. That job was posted in Feb but since it was still on the site I sent my resume anyway. Never know what might happen.
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- Thread starter Double M
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Those things left to themselves inevitably get worse.
Just wanted to let some of you nice guys know that I just started doing work at WQOX 88.5 FM again. I am doing traffic now Wed, Thur, and Friday afternoons. Just got my feet wet again today. Hopeing to be doing more work for the great folks over there soon. If you haven't listened to the station lately tune in it sounds really good now. They have a nice jazz and R&B format. And again thanks for your previous post. Look forward to your new ones.
Michelle, I know there are a lot of differing opinions, and there are a lot of people that will tell you not to go for your dream of being on the radio. Let me put my spin on it, and then everyone could disagree.
There are a lot of people who go to a broadcasting school somewhere and come out of the place thinking they are going to immediately ascend to throne and end up with an offer to do mornings on FM100 the minute they drop that tape and resume off. Unfortunately many of us who have aspired to be that star DJ or talk show host have ended up in a small market somewhere just barely scraping up enough money to pay the bills. A lot of us have gotten burned out because of the fact that we end up working twenty-hour days trying to build a career, and at the end of the day, that yearly salary is still what some lawyer or doctor makes in a two week paycheck. Yes... that is frustrating. And the fact that good people are unceremoniously getting let go in this corporate culture makes it even worse.
If you truly love radio, and you want to make a good living doing it, you really have to be versatile both on and off the air. If you shut the door to sales, you'd better marry rich because the wages aren't going to be great and in some cases may be barely livable. I may be wrong, and guys you can correct me if I am, but I would guess the yearly salaries for a full-timer with 2-5 years experience in Jackson, TN are in the $24,000-$30,000 range. That may be conservative, that may be generous. But I would be willing to bet I am near the ballpark. If you go into the business knowing that, and realizing that while there are some neat perks, it isn't going to make you rich, then I would encourage to do what you love.
There are a lot of people who weren't as obsessed with money as I am, and they have found this business to be very rewarding on other ways than the pocketbook. Many people will tell you that yes, they lived paycheck to paycheck, but this was the best job they ever had. Many of us on this board got into radio at a time when the corporate budget didn't reign over everything and it was a lot of fun. For a lot of people, the fun days are gone and it is easy to get mad at the way things have turned out twenty and thirty years later. That is where a lot of the percieved negativity comes from.
But if you like money a whole lot, you've got to get into the sales side of it. Not that a lot of people are getting super-rich, but there are a lot of people whose earnings are more than adequate. In a market like Memphis, there are a lot of account executives, sales managers, and general managers who are pulling down mid-to-high six-digit salaries. The ones who are successful are masters at the art of networking and building relationships. It's all about earning that decisionmakers trust, and treating them right. The things an honest person like you would do anyway. (There are probably a lot that could be much more honest in what they could do...)
There are very hard working sales managers and top account executives in markets of 15,000-30,000 people that do $60,000-$80,000 a year. That's a big difference over that person down the hall who is doing the morning show or midday show for not even half that. Please don't think that I am being demaning to those on-air personalities in ANY way (I've been on the air since I was fourteen and just gave up doing a daily airshift or news shift this past year..) but financially, that's just the reality of this business.
There are people in small to medium markets who have been able to do both sales and on-air and make a comfortable living. J. Boyd Ingram is a good example of someone who did it all, went to a market and stayed, and did good radio and probably made an okay living for himself if I were to guess.
Let's face it guys... if we were plumbers or bricklayers would we have a message board dedicated to our craft? Would we get to talk about where we were the day Elvis died and how we broke the news to people? How people come up to us on the streets and say, "Thank you for what you do. You feel like a member of my family?" How we've been able to call ballgames that people talk about twenty years later and make a small but memorable impact on people's lives? We have one of the most special jobs in the world. I know that with the Clear Channels and the corporate culture of our industry, it's easy to get bitter. But if people go into it knowing that it's going to get harder and knowing they won't get rich, and knowing that their position can be eliminated with the next line-item veto at the board meeting... if they know the negatives going in and still feel it's a calling, can you really tell them it is the worst thing they could ever do?
I can't imagine doing anything else. I've finally got the position I've always wanted. But I had to pay a lot of dues and come to the harsh realization that for it to be financially rewarding, I had to be willing to sell and get told no a lot, and spend twenty hour days not just pulling airshifts and doing ballgames, but crunching numbers and prospecting for new advertisers.
Michelle, I hope you do very well in the business. Just work hard, and go into it knowing that it won't be easy, and that if you stay in the on-air side, there may be some financial sacrifices and a morning gig in Memphis may need to be on the ten to thirty year goal list. I hope for your sake that you are the next Rick Dees and we all end up saying, "Hey.. I remember when she was getting advice on the radio boards and people were telling her not to do it..."
There are a lot of people who go to a broadcasting school somewhere and come out of the place thinking they are going to immediately ascend to throne and end up with an offer to do mornings on FM100 the minute they drop that tape and resume off. Unfortunately many of us who have aspired to be that star DJ or talk show host have ended up in a small market somewhere just barely scraping up enough money to pay the bills. A lot of us have gotten burned out because of the fact that we end up working twenty-hour days trying to build a career, and at the end of the day, that yearly salary is still what some lawyer or doctor makes in a two week paycheck. Yes... that is frustrating. And the fact that good people are unceremoniously getting let go in this corporate culture makes it even worse.
If you truly love radio, and you want to make a good living doing it, you really have to be versatile both on and off the air. If you shut the door to sales, you'd better marry rich because the wages aren't going to be great and in some cases may be barely livable. I may be wrong, and guys you can correct me if I am, but I would guess the yearly salaries for a full-timer with 2-5 years experience in Jackson, TN are in the $24,000-$30,000 range. That may be conservative, that may be generous. But I would be willing to bet I am near the ballpark. If you go into the business knowing that, and realizing that while there are some neat perks, it isn't going to make you rich, then I would encourage to do what you love.
There are a lot of people who weren't as obsessed with money as I am, and they have found this business to be very rewarding on other ways than the pocketbook. Many people will tell you that yes, they lived paycheck to paycheck, but this was the best job they ever had. Many of us on this board got into radio at a time when the corporate budget didn't reign over everything and it was a lot of fun. For a lot of people, the fun days are gone and it is easy to get mad at the way things have turned out twenty and thirty years later. That is where a lot of the percieved negativity comes from.
But if you like money a whole lot, you've got to get into the sales side of it. Not that a lot of people are getting super-rich, but there are a lot of people whose earnings are more than adequate. In a market like Memphis, there are a lot of account executives, sales managers, and general managers who are pulling down mid-to-high six-digit salaries. The ones who are successful are masters at the art of networking and building relationships. It's all about earning that decisionmakers trust, and treating them right. The things an honest person like you would do anyway. (There are probably a lot that could be much more honest in what they could do...)
There are very hard working sales managers and top account executives in markets of 15,000-30,000 people that do $60,000-$80,000 a year. That's a big difference over that person down the hall who is doing the morning show or midday show for not even half that. Please don't think that I am being demaning to those on-air personalities in ANY way (I've been on the air since I was fourteen and just gave up doing a daily airshift or news shift this past year..) but financially, that's just the reality of this business.
There are people in small to medium markets who have been able to do both sales and on-air and make a comfortable living. J. Boyd Ingram is a good example of someone who did it all, went to a market and stayed, and did good radio and probably made an okay living for himself if I were to guess.
Let's face it guys... if we were plumbers or bricklayers would we have a message board dedicated to our craft? Would we get to talk about where we were the day Elvis died and how we broke the news to people? How people come up to us on the streets and say, "Thank you for what you do. You feel like a member of my family?" How we've been able to call ballgames that people talk about twenty years later and make a small but memorable impact on people's lives? We have one of the most special jobs in the world. I know that with the Clear Channels and the corporate culture of our industry, it's easy to get bitter. But if people go into it knowing that it's going to get harder and knowing they won't get rich, and knowing that their position can be eliminated with the next line-item veto at the board meeting... if they know the negatives going in and still feel it's a calling, can you really tell them it is the worst thing they could ever do?
I can't imagine doing anything else. I've finally got the position I've always wanted. But I had to pay a lot of dues and come to the harsh realization that for it to be financially rewarding, I had to be willing to sell and get told no a lot, and spend twenty hour days not just pulling airshifts and doing ballgames, but crunching numbers and prospecting for new advertisers.
Michelle, I hope you do very well in the business. Just work hard, and go into it knowing that it won't be easy, and that if you stay in the on-air side, there may be some financial sacrifices and a morning gig in Memphis may need to be on the ten to thirty year goal list. I hope for your sake that you are the next Rick Dees and we all end up saying, "Hey.. I remember when she was getting advice on the radio boards and people were telling her not to do it..."
R
RoyBoy
Guest
I remember attending a monthly meeting at WHBQ in the mid-80's. The PD told us we were doing a great job, and he was sorry that he couldn't pay us more. Unfortunately, this position doesn't pay much traditionally. If you want to make more money, you need to go into a different profession - he said.
That was good advice.
That was good advice.
My advice for all new traffic pronouncers in Memphis... Delano (like the FDR's middle name, not de-LAY-no) and Trezevant is two syllables... TREZ-vunt (but not VANT, like one would be tempted).
Trust me, I married into Frayser years ago.
Trust me, I married into Frayser years ago.
The 24K to 30K range is probably generous for an "on-air" only position in the Jackson, TN market.
But I suppose if you count any and all extra income (from remotes, talent fees, and etc...) you could expect to be in that range.
I left the Memphis market (afternoons) in early 2001, the production talent fees, remotes, and such,
(God Bless "Shooters" and "World Rental Car Sales" and the like) made it fairly tolerable money-wise.
I did have to get out of radio (I HATED RADIO SALES) completely to make decent money.
Oddly enough-sales is how I make a living now.
Not to offend any sales professionals that view and participate here, but... there are some people on every radio sales team, that make a GREAT DEAL of money and aren't exactly blessed with a powerful intelect or
Zig Ziglar-type sales skills.
(Ever seen a BEAUTIFUL saleslady that didn't make a decent living at YOUR station? I hate to stereotype, but stereotypes BECOME stereotypes for a reality-based reason)
There are a lot of truly professional sales persons that make very serious money in radio advertising sales- both male and female. They work very hard and serve their customer's needs and provide excellent service.
But, we must remember... it's the lesser-paid, on-air talent and programmers that provide the value of the product the talented salespeople offer.
(Unless, of course the book was down and sales can blame programming for poor numbers)
Those of us that stayed always with the "programming" side, made our sacrifices for all the glory of being in "Show business" I guess.
Basically, listen to the man.
If it's a really nice living you'd like to make- and you'd like to make it in the radio industry- you may just want to consider the possibility of becoming involved in sales.
Or..marry a partner who makes a comfortable living in another industry, so you can roll with the low-pay, sorry benefits, and lack of job security that comes with being a modern-day "On-Air Personality."
;D
But I suppose if you count any and all extra income (from remotes, talent fees, and etc...) you could expect to be in that range.
I left the Memphis market (afternoons) in early 2001, the production talent fees, remotes, and such,
(God Bless "Shooters" and "World Rental Car Sales" and the like) made it fairly tolerable money-wise.
I did have to get out of radio (I HATED RADIO SALES) completely to make decent money.
Oddly enough-sales is how I make a living now.
Not to offend any sales professionals that view and participate here, but... there are some people on every radio sales team, that make a GREAT DEAL of money and aren't exactly blessed with a powerful intelect or
Zig Ziglar-type sales skills.
(Ever seen a BEAUTIFUL saleslady that didn't make a decent living at YOUR station? I hate to stereotype, but stereotypes BECOME stereotypes for a reality-based reason)
There are a lot of truly professional sales persons that make very serious money in radio advertising sales- both male and female. They work very hard and serve their customer's needs and provide excellent service.
But, we must remember... it's the lesser-paid, on-air talent and programmers that provide the value of the product the talented salespeople offer.
(Unless, of course the book was down and sales can blame programming for poor numbers)
Those of us that stayed always with the "programming" side, made our sacrifices for all the glory of being in "Show business" I guess.
Basically, listen to the man.
If it's a really nice living you'd like to make- and you'd like to make it in the radio industry- you may just want to consider the possibility of becoming involved in sales.
Or..marry a partner who makes a comfortable living in another industry, so you can roll with the low-pay, sorry benefits, and lack of job security that comes with being a modern-day "On-Air Personality."
;D
That's #216 in the JokeMaster's Manual...politician makes his first visit to an Indian reservation and makes a speech to the assembled folk. After every political promise, the crowd yells, "Hoya!" The politician puffs up and makes more promises and the crowd yells "Hoya!" even louder. After the speech, the chief takes the politico on a brief tour of the rez. At one point they walk across a field toward the tribe's new dairy barn and the chief says, "Careful, sir, don't step in the hoya."
(obligatory rim shot)
(obligatory rim shot)
R
rapmaster
Guest
hey double m...why don't you marry the meepster and change his sour look on life. How can he sell anything/
y0u go girl. spellcheck and everything will be smooth. I'll see ya at "senses"...sunday night is my night to play
y0u go girl. spellcheck and everything will be smooth. I'll see ya at "senses"...sunday night is my night to play
Thanks rapmaster and Michael for the encouraging words, I need them. So tell me about Senses rapmaster. I think Meepster is already married. Yes there seem to be some bitter comments on the board, especially from people who aren't even in the business anymore. Everyones entitled to their opinon I guess. I know these folks are just trying to caution me. I do enjoy the positive comments,though. I have had quite a few of them.
I have had along time to think about my decision and I am aware of the many changes in radio. I really love it and despite that I've decided to roll with the changes and go for it. I'd like to say a big thank you to Chris, Sherman, and Rick at 'QOX for their encouragement and the chance to be on the air again.
I have had along time to think about my decision and I am aware of the many changes in radio. I really love it and despite that I've decided to roll with the changes and go for it. I'd like to say a big thank you to Chris, Sherman, and Rick at 'QOX for their encouragement and the chance to be on the air again.
This would probably be better suited to the Tennessee Board, but since ya'll talked about Jacksson I'll do the same.
Double M, it's possible to make a great living in radio, I've seen plenty of people doing it in my time, of course it usually helps if you own the station, or have just sold one, and stayed on for name recognition.. ha ha anyway, if you are looking into the Jackson Market, don't forget the smaller unrated markets around the area.
Dyersburg, Martin, and other areas will often pay about the same as Jackson and there will be less hassle. I worked in Jackson for a while, the pay wasn't great but I was having a good time and working like crazy...
Now I'm at a smaller local station (in Selmer) and I'm making the same money, with not nearly as much work, and I'm getting to do more of what I wanted
the only down side is, I'm now doing sales, on-air, and production... of course it's alot easier without all the people breathing down your neck that you will get some places..
don't give up, I haven't and I don't plan to.
Double M, it's possible to make a great living in radio, I've seen plenty of people doing it in my time, of course it usually helps if you own the station, or have just sold one, and stayed on for name recognition.. ha ha anyway, if you are looking into the Jackson Market, don't forget the smaller unrated markets around the area.
Dyersburg, Martin, and other areas will often pay about the same as Jackson and there will be less hassle. I worked in Jackson for a while, the pay wasn't great but I was having a good time and working like crazy...
Now I'm at a smaller local station (in Selmer) and I'm making the same money, with not nearly as much work, and I'm getting to do more of what I wanted
the only down side is, I'm now doing sales, on-air, and production... of course it's alot easier without all the people breathing down your neck that you will get some places..
don't give up, I haven't and I don't plan to.
Thanks J-Rod and yes I have been looking into the other towns as well. On the TN board I talk about sending a resume to Jackson but I also sent one to SL 100 in Dyersburg for a board op position ( both will train ) and the PD there will not respond back to me as Ron did in Jax. I have emailed Brian at SL several times. I am not giving up though. I check station web sites to see whats out there. I even look at some of the NE Ark stations. Haven't seen any openings there. I live in the Millington area so this helps some with traveling to some of the smaller towns. Some stations do not have a site or don't list jobs on the web site, so I don't know what's happening at all the area stations. But I am grateful and excited to be back on the air again at my old home. This gives me the opportunity to learn the new technology and get my feet wet on the air again. Hoping to get some air checks while I'm there.
Not "sour" Rapmaster! I loved every minute of it. Just decided to go ahead and make some money.
How can I sell anything?..hahahaha!
Care to compare tax forms?
(You DO pay taxes, right?)
J/K
All the silliness aside...While I don't truly mean to discourage a youngster from chasing something they want to do...I DO think it's wise to try to give them a realistic view of some of the difficulties they can expect along the way.
Radio is different now than ever before, and it is undoubtedly more difficult to break into today than any time prior.
If money is not a major issue, it will be that much easier.
Although I AM already married...I am getting to a position in life where some fairly comfortable fellas begin their search for a Mistress to keep up....Hmm?
(Again..just kidding...Mrs. Meepster would then soon OWN all my stuff and I'd be workin' for her!)
How can I sell anything?..hahahaha!
Care to compare tax forms?
(You DO pay taxes, right?)
J/K
All the silliness aside...While I don't truly mean to discourage a youngster from chasing something they want to do...I DO think it's wise to try to give them a realistic view of some of the difficulties they can expect along the way.
Radio is different now than ever before, and it is undoubtedly more difficult to break into today than any time prior.
If money is not a major issue, it will be that much easier.
Although I AM already married...I am getting to a position in life where some fairly comfortable fellas begin their search for a Mistress to keep up....Hmm?
(Again..just kidding...Mrs. Meepster would then soon OWN all my stuff and I'd be workin' for her!)
Media Mogul said:
..and they DO get that offer , because the owners only want folks who will work cheap, and don't really care about the product. THAT's what sours the real pros in this business.
How many interns to afternoon (or other full-time large market slots) stories do you know about? I'm no longer in the business, and I can name 3 right now.
Yeah, 'Saur, preach on!
I never had time to attend one of those "Schools of Broadcasting" what with starting full-time in radio DURING my Junior year of high school. (4 til 10 PM Monday-Friday @ Country 105FM, WTPR in Paris, TN) 1978.
Even without all that "training" I made a living for a lot of years doing it.
Many of these youngsters today will work for peanuts and they rely almost exclusively upon technology to sound the way they do. They can be pretty darn talented in the use of that technology, but can lack the actual senses of timing, emphasis, dialect, and more.
More and more it seems, the "in" thing is to have somebody that sounds like a professional skateboarder on MTV that just been moved into the studio to introduce songs and be "cool."
It's like all we need is "Rob and Big" do radio...and we're set.
(Actually, I like that show...the "Black Lavender" episode nearly took me out)
What if they actually had to time into breaks and networks news?
What if what they "adlibbed" really had to make sense?
I know I'm waaaaay old school; but I just think that a lot of actually DOING airshifts is a lot easier now.
I know for a fact that the Maestro system we used at Froggy was spaceship stuff when compared to the two turntable, dual-mcrophone (for stereo) three-stack cart machine world in which I started.
Oh, well...times change and I had to get a real job.
I never had time to attend one of those "Schools of Broadcasting" what with starting full-time in radio DURING my Junior year of high school. (4 til 10 PM Monday-Friday @ Country 105FM, WTPR in Paris, TN) 1978.
Even without all that "training" I made a living for a lot of years doing it.
Many of these youngsters today will work for peanuts and they rely almost exclusively upon technology to sound the way they do. They can be pretty darn talented in the use of that technology, but can lack the actual senses of timing, emphasis, dialect, and more.
More and more it seems, the "in" thing is to have somebody that sounds like a professional skateboarder on MTV that just been moved into the studio to introduce songs and be "cool."
It's like all we need is "Rob and Big" do radio...and we're set.
(Actually, I like that show...the "Black Lavender" episode nearly took me out)
What if they actually had to time into breaks and networks news?
What if what they "adlibbed" really had to make sense?
I know I'm waaaaay old school; but I just think that a lot of actually DOING airshifts is a lot easier now.
I know for a fact that the Maestro system we used at Froggy was spaceship stuff when compared to the two turntable, dual-mcrophone (for stereo) three-stack cart machine world in which I started.
Oh, well...times change and I had to get a real job.
Meepster, when I started 15 years ago I didn't have all this new technology either. I learned how to cue up vinyl and tapes. I also used a cart machine and cd player. I didn't have voice tracking or any editing to make me sound better. I did my show live and had to learn to be fluent and witty on my own. I had to run my own board and learn to run it tight. No computer already programmed with everything ready to go. I had to get every song and ad off, so I had to be alert at all times. Just thought I'd let you know all this new stuff is new to me now. And though I would like to make good money in radio and some do, I do it because I love it not for money. What I'm doing now is strictly volunteer work.
> but I just think that a lot of actually DOING airshifts is a lot easier now.
I am not sure that "easier" is quite the right word. It is, though, certainly different.
Back when I started in radio the week before Hurricane Frederick in beautiful Pascagoula, MS, it was as basic as it gets -- records, carts that didn't always work, and a transmitter that was less-than-reliable. Ahh, the Good Ole' Days.
As I was leaving for my self-imposed radio hiatus in 1998, it was CD cart decks, and assorted high-tech items. But, no real automation, to speak of. Then, when I went back on-air a couple of years ago, it was different -- I had to learn Prophet. Once I got used to the system, I came to really like it. Without having to mindlessly fire songs and voicers, etc., I found I am free to do more important things -- work on content, manipulate audio, edit, and practice (or even pre-record) breaks. In short, it doesn't make the shift easier, it makes it better.
With Prophet, I am as busy as I was in the past; I am just doing other things.
DE
I am not sure that "easier" is quite the right word. It is, though, certainly different.
Back when I started in radio the week before Hurricane Frederick in beautiful Pascagoula, MS, it was as basic as it gets -- records, carts that didn't always work, and a transmitter that was less-than-reliable. Ahh, the Good Ole' Days.
As I was leaving for my self-imposed radio hiatus in 1998, it was CD cart decks, and assorted high-tech items. But, no real automation, to speak of. Then, when I went back on-air a couple of years ago, it was different -- I had to learn Prophet. Once I got used to the system, I came to really like it. Without having to mindlessly fire songs and voicers, etc., I found I am free to do more important things -- work on content, manipulate audio, edit, and practice (or even pre-record) breaks. In short, it doesn't make the shift easier, it makes it better.
With Prophet, I am as busy as I was in the past; I am just doing other things.
DE
Don't get me wrong...I LOVED the Maestro System...
Back in the day,
When we first got music on carts and trip tones to fire the next cart...sometimes I'd use the restroom when I didn't really need to just because I could step out longer.
I remember "segue" ing from record to record. To make that tight...you had to be good!
Maybe you're right...maybe "different" is better than "easier".
Back in the day,
When we first got music on carts and trip tones to fire the next cart...sometimes I'd use the restroom when I didn't really need to just because I could step out longer.
I remember "segue" ing from record to record. To make that tight...you had to be good!
Maybe you're right...maybe "different" is better than "easier".
- Status