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New Orlando 50kw AM

jmtillery

jmtillery

I believe this topic was briefly discussed a few years ago; However, I thought it may be worth mentioning again in case there may be any new information.

Dating back as far as 1986, Family Stations, Inc. [Dr. Harold Camping] was granted a CP to construct a new AM station to be licensed to Longwood. The original CP specified operation on 890kHz with 50kw-D and 500W-N; DA-2 [2-towers during the day and 5-towers at night]. The original CP has long since expired; However a new application is currently on file with the FCC whereas Family Stations is seeking the same facilities but daytime only class D operation. Is there anyone here who has any information as to whether or not this station will ever be constructed, assuming the FCC approves a second CP? I'm also curious why the FCC accepted the current application considering it specifies daytime only operation and also considering the FCC discontinued accepting applications for new class D AM stations years ago.
 
jmtillery said:
I believe this topic was briefly discussed a few years ago; However, I thought it may be worth mentioning again in case there may be any new information.

Dating back as far as 1986, Family Stations, Inc. [Dr. Harold Camping] was granted a CP to construct a new AM station to be licensed to Longwood. The original CP specified operation on 890kHz with 50kw-D and 500W-N; DA-2 [2-towers during the day and 5-towers at night]. The original CP has long since expired; However a new application is currently on file with the FCC whereas Family Stations is seeking the same facilities but daytime only class D operation. Is there anyone here who has any information as to whether or not this station will ever be constructed, assuming the FCC approves a second CP? I'm also curious why the FCC accepted the current application considering it specifies daytime only operation and also considering the FCC discontinued accepting applications for new class D AM stations years ago.
Click to expand...

If you read the application itself on CDBS, it looks to me as if it's an application to amend the daytime portion of the 1986 CP. I would read that to indicate they intend to leave the 500w night facility as-is.

How the underlying permit can possibly still be valid after 25 years I don't know. (but remember that channel 59 in Connecticut was allowed to sit idle for over 50 years before they destroyed tradition by actually building the station...)
 
w9wi said:
If you read the application itself on CDBS, it looks to me as if it's an application to amend the daytime portion of the 1986 CP. I would read that to indicate they intend to leave the 500w night facility as-is.

How the underlying permit can possibly still be valid after 25 years I don't know. (but remember that channel 59 in Connecticut was allowed to sit idle for over 50 years before they destroyed tradition by actually building the station...)
Click to expand...

Although I haven't actually reveiwed the application, I would tend to agree with you if it were not for the fact it isn't showing as a CP any longer but rather it only shows as a New Application for a new Class D AM operating on 890kHz with 50kw-DA-D, two tower directional:

http://transition.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/a...&slat2=&NS=N&dlon2=&mlon2=&slon2=&EW=W&size=9

Also, considering Family is selling its remaining commercially licensed FM stations, I’m having my doubts this CP will ever be built out.
 
After further review, it appears the former expired CP was reinstated with an application pending specifying a modification from Class B status to a Class D operation.
 
jmtillery said:
Although I haven't actually reveiwed the application, I would tend to agree with you if it were not for the fact it isn't showing as a CP any longer but rather it only shows as a New Application for a new Class D AM operating on 890kHz with 50kw-DA-D, two tower directional:

http://transition.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/a...&slat2=&NS=N&dlon2=&mlon2=&slon2=&EW=W&size=9
Click to expand...

I took a look at the raw CDBS data, as downloaded Thursday morning.

This does indeed appear to be an application, however, *not* for a Class D station.

In the am_eng_data table for facility_id 21025, there is one set of technical parameters. It lists the station_class as B and the broadcast_schedule as U (unlimited time). However, it also lists the am_dom_status as A. (application) application_id is 86897.

The am_ant_sys table for application_id=86897 does still show the 500-watt nighttime facility, and lists the station as DA-2. (strangely enough with *six* towers at night...)

Compare to WRRD. (Waukesha, Wis., a true Class D station on 1510, facility_id 70771) The station_class is D and so is the broadcast_schedule.

There's probably an explanation in the six Longwood Engineering attachments, but I can't get them to open...

I'm wondering if what's going on here is:
- the construction permit expired this spring
- Commission staff deleted the permit itself from the CDBS
- but they forgot to delete the amendment?

I'm also wondering if it's showing up daytime only because they only wanted to amend the daytime facility, but the FCC software wouldn't let them enter it as Class B without re-entering all the nighttime parameters? (although you'd think the easier thing to do would be to just enter the nighttime parameters again...)

Also, considering Family is selling its remaining commercially licensed FM stations, I’m having my doubts this CP will ever be built out.
Click to expand...

Fully agreed. (and really, it looks to me as if this CP is expired, they couldn't build it even if they wanted to)
 
I looked into a few of the amendments and it appears the reason the initial CP was canceled is due to a late filing regarding commercial applicants; However, the CP was reinstated after the FCC determined the initial cancellation was in error since the new Longwood application specifies NCE operation and the amendment in question was not required of NCE applicants. It appears the cancellation was essentially an “across the board” CP cancellation involving several CPs.

Additionally, the Mexican government had complained about possible nighttime interference with Mexican co-clear channel stations XEPY1 Merida and XEUL Progreso, Yukatan. For this reason I hypothesized the nighttime operation on the Longwood application was eliminated resulting in class D operation.

It also appears the proposed TL is somewhere near Sanford although FAA clearance is still in the pending stage. I’m wondering how close the proposed AM TL site is in relation to the Orlando-Sanford International Airport. Two towers, even at ¼ wave, tuned to 890khz will require several acres. Five or six towers will require a much larger land parcel.

I’m wondering if the former AM 540 towers are still in place just South of Clermont… After WFLF moved to the WYGM 740 towers, the former 540 towers may be an option for the new 890. I believe there may be as many as 8-towers at that site.
 
w9wi - I have had no luck opening any of the engineering attachments. Perhaps there is a problem with the FCC website.

tanner - That settles any ideas of using the former 540 towers for anything. Do you happen to know if the land is vacant?
 
Maybe Dr Camping is now predicting that the world will end during daylight hours, so there's no need for a nighttime signal.
 
jmtillery said:
I looked into a few of the amendments and it appears the reason the initial CP was canceled is due to a late filing regarding commercial applicants; However, the CP was reinstated after the FCC determined the initial cancellation was in error since the new Longwood application specifies NCE operation and the amendment in question was not required of NCE applicants. It appears the cancellation was essentially an “across the board” CP cancellation involving several CPs.
Click to expand...

It does beg the question: if an application for a new Class B station was filed before the FCC stopped accepting applications for new Class D operations, can it be amended into a Class D application? If a CP exists for a new Class B station -- but the station hasn't been licensed yet -- can the CP be modified to Class D?
 
JM,

I was out in that area off of SR33 about a year ago and the land is vacant as is most land in that area. 540 had a grade A signal in those days in Orlando and Tampa, both day and night. Now 540's null completely destroys any westbound signal at night.
 
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