NEW SPORTS STATION

[OhioMediaWatch]

If this does happen, I do think they will have it on 98.5 (the Fan) and move WNCX to 92.3.

I'm not hearing this among the rumblings I'm getting, but I've said this before...I wouldn't be surprised.

But I also am guessing that Maxwell's little stint on 92.3 this week was solely to give CBS engineers/management a chance to drive around town for 4 hours to see how a mono signal holds up (for the new sports station). If they were happy with that, maybe 92.3 will stay as the home of the sports station.

Going mono doesn't make the signal "go farther", per se. It just removes the flutter at the edges of the signal, flutter caused by the radio trying to lock on the stereo pilot. That extends the outer listenable range.

All of this is just speculation on my part. We're getting no word if the thing will be on 92.3 or 98.5.

Its way early to guess the timetable for this, but I would think they want this thing running around January 2012

We are hearing they are aiming for MUCH sooner than that, perhaps as soon as August 1st or by the day after Labor Day. The goal is to be in place for the Browns season start.

Since a PD is definitely incoming - he's no longer with his current-until-now station as of this week - I can buy that. August 1st may be too soon to ask, but I can see Labor Day.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

Remember, though...

Rover started his local "empire" as 92.3's morning driver.

O&A put a ratings scare or two into Triv as the (delayed) afternoon drive show on 92.3.

It's certainly possible to be a market leader on that signal.

 

[Rusty Muck]

Remember, though...

Rover started his local "empire" as 92.3's morning driver.

O&A put a ratings scare or two into Triv as the (delayed) afternoon drive show on 92.3.

It's certainly possible to be a market leader on that signal.

And "Jammin' 92" commanded an audience right when it was foolishly flipped to "Jammin' Oldies."

 

[Rusty Muck]

If this does happen, I do think they will have it on 98.5 (the Fan) and move WNCX to 92.3. Its way early to guess the timetable for this, but I would think they want this thing running around January 2012, which would be the time when Browns season would either be over or their in the playoffs and Ohio State football talk. If CBS can gain Ohio State pbp beginning fall 2012 or 2013, they will be in great shape. I love the fact that The Fan is "All local, All Day," but if they have the opportunity to take Rome, for now I think they do it just to stick it to KNR.

A big problem is that WNCX's audience is so loyal, and the station so stable and consistent, they probably would be outraged if it was scooted over to 92.3. And I couldn't blame them. Maybe if/when CBS nabs PBP of one of the "big three" teams? Now, THAT could be a different story and a swap is very feasible.

I know that in Boston, CBS moved WBMX "Mix" from 98.5 to 104.1 in order to launch the "Sports Hub." But it's not an equal situation - and CBS extinguished longtime rocker WBCN in the process.

 

[AntDog152]

If this does happen, I do think they will have it on 98.5 (the Fan) and move WNCX to 92.3.

I'm not hearing this among the rumblings I'm getting, but I've said this before...I wouldn't be surprised.

But I also am guessing that Maxwell's little stint on 92.3 this week was solely to give CBS engineers/management a chance to drive around town for 4 hours to see how a mono signal holds up (for the new sports station). If they were happy with that, maybe 92.3 will stay as the home of the sports station.

Going mono doesn't make the signal "go farther", per se. It just removes the flutter at the edges of the signal, flutter caused by the radio trying to lock on the stereo pilot. That extends the outer listenable range.

All of this is just speculation on my part. We're getting no word if the thing will be on 92.3 or 98.5.

Its way early to guess the timetable for this, but I would think they want this thing running around January 2012

We are hearing they are aiming for MUCH sooner than that, perhaps as soon as August 1st or by the day after Labor Day. The goal is to be in place for the Browns season start.

Since a PD is definitely incoming - he's no longer with his current-until-now station as of this week - I can buy that. August 1st may be too soon to ask, but I can see Labor Day.

Wow if that's true, then I am a bit surprised how early they want this to happen. I'm sure they can promote the new station for a Labor Day launch, but are they going to be able to have a full lineup of local talent ready to go by then? If not, the next best option for them should be New Year's.

 

[AntDog152]

If this does happen, I do think they will have it on 98.5 (the Fan) and move WNCX to 92.3. Its way early to guess the timetable for this, but I would think they want this thing running around January 2012, which would be the time when Browns season would either be over or their in the playoffs and Ohio State football talk. If CBS can gain Ohio State pbp beginning fall 2012 or 2013, they will be in great shape. I love the fact that The Fan is "All local, All Day," but if they have the opportunity to take Rome, for now I think they do it just to stick it to KNR.

A big problem is that WNCX's audience is so loyal, and the station so stable and consistent, they probably would be outraged if it was scooted over to 92.3. And I couldn't blame them. Maybe if/when CBS nabs PBP of one of the "big three" teams? Now, THAT could be a different story and a swap is very feasible.

I know that in Boston, CBS moved WBMX "Mix" from 98.5 to 104.1 in order to launch the "Sports Hub." But it's not an equal situation - and CBS extinguished longtime rocker WBCN in the process.

CBS of course will have to be smart with this decision. Hopefully, CBS sees the NCX audience the way you see it as loyal and valuable enough to leave it alone and just flip 92.3 to sports. Based on what OMW has said about launching between August 1st and Labor Day, the idea of swapping stations is less realistic. Me personally, I love sports talk but as a loyal WZAK listener, it would be much easier to just move down the dial than flipping to AM radio just to listen to tRBS.

 

[Rusty Muck]

If this does happen, I do think they will have it on 98.5 (the Fan) and move WNCX to 92.3.

I'm not hearing this among the rumblings I'm getting, but I've said this before...I wouldn't be surprised.

But I also am guessing that Maxwell's little stint on 92.3 this week was solely to give CBS engineers/management a chance to drive around town for 4 hours to see how a mono signal holds up (for the new sports station). If they were happy with that, maybe 92.3 will stay as the home of the sports station.

Going mono doesn't make the signal "go farther", per se. It just removes the flutter at the edges of the signal, flutter caused by the radio trying to lock on the stereo pilot. That extends the outer listenable range.

All of this is just speculation on my part. We're getting no word if the thing will be on 92.3 or 98.5.

Its way early to guess the timetable for this, but I would think they want this thing running around January 2012

We are hearing they are aiming for MUCH sooner than that, perhaps as soon as August 1st or by the day after Labor Day. The goal is to be in place for the Browns season start.

Since a PD is definitely incoming - he's no longer with his current-until-now station as of this week - I can buy that. August 1st may be too soon to ask, but I can see Labor Day.

Wow if that's true, then I am a bit surprised how early they want this to happen. I'm sure they can promote the new station for a Labor Day launch, but are they going to be able to have a full lineup of local talent ready to go by then? If not, the next best option for them should be New Year's.

It's obvious now that this has quietly been in the works for several months. If what both me and the Primary(tm) are both hearing turn out to be true, this will probably be the best-kept secret in all of Cleveland radio (mostly because it was likely planned outside of Cleveland).

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

It's obvious now that this has quietly been in the works for several months. If what both me and the Primary(tm) are both hearing turn out to be true, this will probably be the best-kept secret in all of Cleveland radio (mostly because it was likely planned outside of Cleveland).

I'd agree with that. There may only be one person inside the CBS cluster who has known the whole story all along - VP/MM Tom Herschel.

I get the idea that CBS has been eyeing this (so to speak), but only recently made the corporate (outside Cleveland) decision to spend the money and do this.

Meanwhile, potential names are basically falling out of the sky and into my inbox. I'm not willing to name anyone yet, but CBS has apparently identified a number of potential hosts. How far along are they? I'm not sure, but I'll be less and less surprised if this thing launches by Labor Day.

I'd now say a launch on 98.5 is a very, very outside shot. It would appear the Maxwell Experiment was mostly to hear how well spoken word programming does on 92.3. My guess is that WNCX stays on 98.5.

 

[vjm]

It's obvious now that this has quietly been in the works for several months. If what both me and the Primary(tm) are both hearing turn out to be true, this will probably be the best-kept secret in all of Cleveland radio (mostly because it was likely planned outside of Cleveland).

I'd agree with that. There may only be one person inside the CBS cluster who has known the whole story all along - VP/MM Tom Herschel.

I get the idea that CBS has been eyeing this (so to speak), but only recently made the corporate (outside Cleveland) decision to spend the money and do this.

Meanwhile, potential names are basically falling out of the sky and into my inbox. I'm not willing to name anyone yet, but CBS has apparently identified a number of potential hosts. How far along are they? I'm not sure, but I'll be less and less surprised if this thing launches by Labor Day.

I'd now say a launch on 98.5 is a very, very outside shot. It would appear the Maxwell Experiment was mostly to hear how well spoken word programming does on 92.3. My guess is that WNCX stays on 98.5.

Without naming names, are these potential hosts familiar names, imports from other markets, or some combination thereof?

 

[Tim]

In a market with rabid-sports fans, a good-coverage FM should do very well, and common sense tells us that one of the big 3 teams (Browns, Indians, Cavs) would want to affilliate with such an FM sports station as soon as contracts allow it to happen.

If CBS intends to achieve 5-county Cleveland metro ratings with an FM sports talk...such a big move IMHO is risky on 92.3....as it's directional FM antenna pattern has huge holes in the market's MSA.

On AM you can often listen through static of a marginal coverage station, if you want to. FMs have what's called "line of sight" coverage. To us laymen, that means the signal's either there, or it isn't...and going mono provides only marginal improvement over stereo.

For the short run, moving WNCX to 92.3 will be painful. But, in the long run, it'd probably be the smart move from a $$$$$ standpoint, as 98.5's current classic rock music format is rapidly aging out of the advertising world's "beauty contest" demo: adults age 25-54. Sportstalk formats attract listeners of all ages, as well as passionate advertisers.

So...whether CBS intends to keep, operate, and profit from a local FM talker, or create a 3rd big winner in their local 4-station cluster so it's more attractive to a potential buyer down the road...local sports talk to me makes the most sense on 98.5. But, hey...it's obviously not my money!

 

[Tim]

Anything new about this rumor this morning?

 

[Rusty Muck]

Without naming names, are these potential hosts familiar names, imports from other markets, or some combination thereof?

I have not heard names... but it sounds indeed like a combo.

 

[Tim]

While a marginal metro area signal certainly isn't the only reason for limited ad revenue & ratings success for many different owners & formats over nearly 50 years on 92.3, limited coverage is a major factor.

And, regardless of format and mono/stereo operation...that's not going to change.

A properly run sportstalk using 98.5's excellent NE Ohio signal could be a revenue & ratings monster even in a rustbelt market like Cleveland.

 

[Rusty Muck]

In a market with rabid-sports fans, a good-coverage FM should do very well, and common sense tells us that one of the big 3 teams (Browns, Indians, Cavs) would want to affilliate with such an FM sports station as soon as contracts allow it to happen.

If CBS intends to achieve 5-county Cleveland metro ratings with an FM sports talk...such a big move IMHO is risky on 92.3....as it's directional FM antenna pattern has huge holes in the market's MSA.

On AM you can often listen through static of a marginal coverage station, if you want to. FMs have what's called "line of sight" coverage. To us laymen, that means the signal's either there, or it isn't...and going mono provides only marginal improvement over stereo.

For the short run, moving WNCX to 92.3 will be painful. But, in the long run, it'd probably be the smart move from a $$$$$ standpoint, as 98.5's current classic rock music format is rapidly aging out of the advertising world's "beauty contest" demo: adults age 25-54. Sportstalk formats attract listeners of all ages, as well as passionate advertisers.

So...whether CBS intends to keep, operate, and profit from a local FM talker, or create a 3rd big winner in their local 4-station cluster so it's more attractive to a potential buyer down the road...local sports talk to me makes the most sense on 98.5. But, hey...it's obviously not my money!

Totally agree.

If CBS corporate is spearheading this - and for all practical purposes, they are, with Herschel in the loop - "eying" 98.5 for sports can't be out of the question. And as the Primary(tm) pointed out, the Maxwell show was likely a test for mono purposes, possibly requested by CBS' end (but with Herschel making the request).

As Maxwell is now an entirely all-talk show again, the stereo pilot light for 98.5 can be turned off at any point during his normal morning show without anyone really noticing. Pretty shrewd way to compare both 98.5 and 92.3's signal reception in mono, among other technical stuff. It's already been proven how both stations perform in stereo.

Had the CBS Cleveland cluster management been behind all of this, sports on 98.5 would be a non-starter. No way would Cleveland management even think of exiling WNCX - probably the most stable radio station in the entire market outside of WCLV - over to a more marginal signal. But none of those people reside in New York, and those people care about the $$$.

It's all in what CBS Radio chief Dan Mason (no relation) wants.

 

[vjm]

I think a more realistic possibility of what's gonna go down is this:

92.3 is gonna flip to sports talk, while WNCX stays as is.

Maxwell moves over to do the morning show, with nuts and bolts sports talk the rest of the day.

WNCX goes to a more music intensive morning show, be it Jeff Kinzbach or whoever.

"92.3 The Fan" picks up whatever PBP they can to start (a good bet they snag CSU, and they'll make a play for the Monsters and/or Gladiators).

Then the next step is to snag the Buckeyes. The football PBP is obviously the big prize, but a firm commitment to the basketball team will have OSU listening to CBS Cleveland, since KNR does sometimes bump Buckeye hoops due to other programming, especially in the evening. (During daytime coflicts, the Buckeyes roundballers migrate over to KNR2 1540).

Once the Browns PBP becomes avalible, CBS could do something similar to what the Buffalo Bills have, and that's a double FM flagship (classic rock WGRF 96.9, and active rocker WEDG 103.3--both owned by Citadel).

CBS could simulcast the Browns on "92.3 The Fan" as well as WNCX. That should put to rest any qualms about 92.3's signal, since there'll be a simulcast partner.

I think all this talk of 92.3 and 98.5 switching formats is a little far fetched.

 

[Dave Sarnoff]

I think all this talk of 92.3 and 98.5 switching formats is a little far fetched.

No kidding. All of you radio experts are going to look pretty silly whan none of this happens.

Seriously, 14 pages to this rediculous thread? I have some oceanfront property in Kansas to sell you guys...

 

[Catmando]

I think all this talk of 92.3 and 98.5 switching formats is a little far fetched.

No kidding. All of you radio experts are going to look pretty silly whan none of this happens.

Seriously, 14 pages to this rediculous thread? I have some oceanfront property in Kansas to sell you guys...

Dave IT WILL HAPPEN and it will be in the next 6 weeks!!

 

[Rusty Muck]

I think all this talk of 92.3 and 98.5 switching formats is a little far fetched.

No kidding. All of you radio experts are going to look pretty silly whan none of this happens.

Seriously, 14 pages to this rediculous thread? I have some oceanfront property in Kansas to sell you guys...

For what I know, only 92.3 will be affected. Throwing up the 92.3-98.5 thing was just for speculation purposes only.

On good confidence, I can't tell all that I know right now. But there's more than enough info that's been told to me to say right now, that this is drifting away from the impossible category, and over into the very possible category. It isn't CBS Cleveland doing this. It's CBS Corporate in New York City.

By next Monday (8/1) a very significant auditory clue will be given by one of the established stations in town. That's all I will say. ;D

 

[Tim]

Cleveland is a PPM market. PPM monitors measure actual listening across markets metro survey area, at the very least...if not their TSA/DMA.

In Cleveland, the metro area is 5 counties (Medina, Lorain, Cuyahoga, Lake, & Geauga). Maybe it's easy for the PPM monitors to hear encoded signals, but why would people tune into and try to listen to a station they have trouble hearing?

92.3 has spotty coverage in about half the Cleveland metro...even in mono.

If you can't hear the station adequately, you can't score the ratings you'll need to help drive advertising revenues.

If CBS wants to invest hundreds of thousands of dollars a year+ in multiple live local personalities, and other start-up expenses...and get a marginal return, so be it. It's their company, obviously.

Hey, I may be totally wrong. But, I think CBS is smarter than that.

Do it right, or why bother?

 

[Rusty Muck]

Cleveland is a PPM market. PPM monitors measure actual listening across markets metro survey area, at the very least...if not their TSA/DMA.

In Cleveland, the metro area is 5 counties (Medina, Lorain, Cuyahoga, Lake, & Geauga). Maybe it's easy for the PPM monitors to hear encoded signals, but why would people tune into and try to listen to a station they have trouble hearing?

92.3 has spotty coverage in about half the Cleveland metro...even in mono.

If you can't hear the station adequately, you can't score the ratings you'll need to help drive advertising revenues.

If CBS wants to invest hundreds of thousands of dollars a year+ in multiple live local personalities, and other start-up expenses...and get a marginal return, so be it. It's their company, obviously.

Hey, I may be totally wrong. But, I think CBS is smarter than that.

Do it right, or why bother?

Because CBS Radio CEO Dan Mason appears to be driving this, I wouldn't be shocked to see George "Space Ghost" Lowe having to record new "92.3 NCX: Cleveland's Classic Rock" promos... just a thought...