J
j-man2004
Guest
Any ideas on this. We would like to do some remotes with our LPFM, but want to stay within the rules. Any creative ideas?
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W
wernerradio
Guest
> Any ideas on this. We would like to do some remotes with our
> LPFM, but want to stay within the rules. Any creative ideas?
>
What are you asking about, what equipment or where to do remotes?
<P ID="signature">______________
Joshua Werner
http://www.wisconsinbroadcasting.com
90.3 WRST-FM Oshkosh
Station Manager & Webmaster
http://www.uwosh.edu/wrst
[email protected]</P>
> LPFM, but want to stay within the rules. Any creative ideas?
>
What are you asking about, what equipment or where to do remotes?
<P ID="signature">______________
Joshua Werner
http://www.wisconsinbroadcasting.com
90.3 WRST-FM Oshkosh
Station Manager & Webmaster
http://www.uwosh.edu/wrst
[email protected]</P>
J
j-man2004
Guest
the wording....on underwriting, we cannot use call to action and such....have you executed a remote and what kind of creativity did you use to make it beneficial to the client.......
> > Any ideas on this. We would like to do some remotes with
> our
> > LPFM, but want to stay within the rules. Any creative
> ideas?
> >
>
> What are you asking about, what equipment or where to do
> remotes?
>
> > Any ideas on this. We would like to do some remotes with
> our
> > LPFM, but want to stay within the rules. Any creative
> ideas?
> >
>
> What are you asking about, what equipment or where to do
> remotes?
>
R
radiomike
Guest
First of all, remotes at business locations, unless there is some overwhelming public service, is risky at best. You can not tell people to come down to see you, or encourage them to come into the business. An exception might be inside a shopping mall, in more "public space". Live concert broadcasts, ie, of bands at a venue, as long as you are broadcasting the programming, and not telling people to come on in, would be permissible.
The fact you used the wording "benefical to the client" indicates you likely already may be heading down the wrong route. Once a business grants you any consideration, and this can include money, trade, space, electricity, phone lines, etc., then you are boarding on being illegal. Walk very very carefully on any remotes at a commercial venue.
BTW, keep in mind you can not do on air fundraising for anyone but yourself. So, the radiothons to raise money for the Red Cross or Jerry's kids are also prohibited, unless you get a waiver from the FCC, which is not in any hurry to grant them. To date, only about 5 have ever been granted to allow non-commercial stations to fundraise on air for someone other than themselves.
> the wording....on underwriting, we cannot use call to action
> and such....have you executed a remote and what kind of
> creativity did you use to make it beneficial to the
> client.......
>
> > > Any ideas on this. We would like to do some remotes with
>
> > our
> > > LPFM, but want to stay within the rules. Any creative
> > ideas?
> > >
> >
> > What are you asking about, what equipment or where to do
> > remotes?
> >
>
The fact you used the wording "benefical to the client" indicates you likely already may be heading down the wrong route. Once a business grants you any consideration, and this can include money, trade, space, electricity, phone lines, etc., then you are boarding on being illegal. Walk very very carefully on any remotes at a commercial venue.
BTW, keep in mind you can not do on air fundraising for anyone but yourself. So, the radiothons to raise money for the Red Cross or Jerry's kids are also prohibited, unless you get a waiver from the FCC, which is not in any hurry to grant them. To date, only about 5 have ever been granted to allow non-commercial stations to fundraise on air for someone other than themselves.
> the wording....on underwriting, we cannot use call to action
> and such....have you executed a remote and what kind of
> creativity did you use to make it beneficial to the
> client.......
>
> > > Any ideas on this. We would like to do some remotes with
>
> > our
> > > LPFM, but want to stay within the rules. Any creative
> > ideas?
> > >
> >
> > What are you asking about, what equipment or where to do
> > remotes?
> >
>
> BTW, keep in mind you can not do on air fundraising for
> anyone but yourself. So, the radiothons to raise money for
> the Red Cross or Jerry's kids are also prohibited, unless
> you get a waiver from the FCC, which is not in any hurry to
> grant them. To date, only about 5 have ever been granted to
> allow non-commercial stations to fundraise on air for
> someone other than themselves.
I thought it was okay as long as it was a non-profit.
Does EMF have one of these permits for K-Love then? Because K-Love and Air1 networks both regularly raise money for other nonprofits.
Also, I know of a local station where I live that has a yearly television/radio simulcast auction that benefits a local charity. Local people donate all the items to be auctioned, and all proceeds go to the charity. I highly doubt they have one of these permits. I'll admit I don't know, but if there are only 5 in the nation it would seem the odds are low.
> anyone but yourself. So, the radiothons to raise money for
> the Red Cross or Jerry's kids are also prohibited, unless
> you get a waiver from the FCC, which is not in any hurry to
> grant them. To date, only about 5 have ever been granted to
> allow non-commercial stations to fundraise on air for
> someone other than themselves.
I thought it was okay as long as it was a non-profit.
Does EMF have one of these permits for K-Love then? Because K-Love and Air1 networks both regularly raise money for other nonprofits.
Also, I know of a local station where I live that has a yearly television/radio simulcast auction that benefits a local charity. Local people donate all the items to be auctioned, and all proceeds go to the charity. I highly doubt they have one of these permits. I'll admit I don't know, but if there are only 5 in the nation it would seem the odds are low.
R
radiomike
Guest
>> Does EMF have one of these permits for K-Love then? Because
> K-Love and Air1 networks both regularly raise money for
> other nonprofits.
You only can raise money, ie on air fund drives, pledge drives, radiothons, for the station itself. If the station is indeed doing what you describe, it is illegal. Now, it is perfectly legal to run PSAs for the Red Cross, United Negro College Fund, or the Church of your Choice, asking you to donate for a cause. However, a fund drive that interrupts regular programming can only fundraise for the station itself, not the church, school, or whoever the licensee is.
> Also, I know of a local station where I live that has a
> yearly television/radio simulcast auction that benefits a
> local charity. Local people donate all the items to be
> auctioned, and all proceeds go to the charity.
If it is a non-commercial station, it is illegal. Commercial stations can do whatever they want in this regard, in fact, it is encouraged. Non-commercial stations can only fundraise for themselves. Thus, what you describe can not be done on a non-commercial station, unless the station is getting the $$$$.
>I highly
> doubt they have one of these permits. I'll admit I don't
> know, but if there are only 5 in the nation it would seem
> the odds are low.
The only waivers that have been issued for special fundraisers were:
Minnesota Public Radio to save an Orchestra
WETA to fundraise to restore a burned out Wolftrap
Blanket waivers for 9/11 fundraisers
Tsunami relief fundraisers on a case by case basis
and the last one escapes me at the moment.
>
> K-Love and Air1 networks both regularly raise money for
> other nonprofits.
You only can raise money, ie on air fund drives, pledge drives, radiothons, for the station itself. If the station is indeed doing what you describe, it is illegal. Now, it is perfectly legal to run PSAs for the Red Cross, United Negro College Fund, or the Church of your Choice, asking you to donate for a cause. However, a fund drive that interrupts regular programming can only fundraise for the station itself, not the church, school, or whoever the licensee is.
> Also, I know of a local station where I live that has a
> yearly television/radio simulcast auction that benefits a
> local charity. Local people donate all the items to be
> auctioned, and all proceeds go to the charity.
If it is a non-commercial station, it is illegal. Commercial stations can do whatever they want in this regard, in fact, it is encouraged. Non-commercial stations can only fundraise for themselves. Thus, what you describe can not be done on a non-commercial station, unless the station is getting the $$$$.
>I highly
> doubt they have one of these permits. I'll admit I don't
> know, but if there are only 5 in the nation it would seem
> the odds are low.
The only waivers that have been issued for special fundraisers were:
Minnesota Public Radio to save an Orchestra
WETA to fundraise to restore a burned out Wolftrap
Blanket waivers for 9/11 fundraisers
Tsunami relief fundraisers on a case by case basis
and the last one escapes me at the moment.
>
H
hangbush
Guest
>...However, a fund drive that interrupts
> regular programming can only fundraise for the station
> itself, not the church, school, or whoever the licensee is.
>
The secret is to be creative, like radio people are expected to be. Don't interrupt regular programming for a fundraiser. Make it a PART of the regular programming. Unless the station is 100% block programmed, there is probably space where announcers talk about things. These things can easily and legally be the fundraising activity. For example, if your station runs lots of music shows from CD, then there are plenty of places to put fund drive announcements on the air that do not interrupt regular programming. And as long as you don't interrupt regular programming, you're not breaking the law. Assuming you're not rasing funds for some for-profit venture, of course.
>
> If it is a non-commercial station, it is illegal. Commercial
> stations can do whatever they want in this regard, in fact,
> it is encouraged. Non-commercial stations can only fundraise
> for themselves. Thus, what you describe can not be done on a
> non-commercial station, unless the station is getting the
> $$$$.
Hidebound thinking like this can suck the life out of NCE stations.
If you want to raise money for a good cause and you are afraid to fundraise for anybody buy your own station, then do a fundraiser for the KXXX "Relief to Family Farms Fund" or the "KXXX Tsunami Cleanup Drive." Then give the money the station has received to whoever it's supposed to go to. The rules do not prohibit NCE stations raising money for themselves, then supporting other non-profit entities. Stations give money to other organizations all the time.
Yeah, it requires thinking outside the box. But we all end up in a box way too soon anyway, and I object to people who want to put us in one before our time has come.
If you're trying to do some good in the world, the FCC isn't going to kick down the doors and make you stop raising money for starving orphans or homeless shelters. At least, they haven't done so yet.
Strict interpretation of the FCC rules went out with the Reagan administration.
> regular programming can only fundraise for the station
> itself, not the church, school, or whoever the licensee is.
>
The secret is to be creative, like radio people are expected to be. Don't interrupt regular programming for a fundraiser. Make it a PART of the regular programming. Unless the station is 100% block programmed, there is probably space where announcers talk about things. These things can easily and legally be the fundraising activity. For example, if your station runs lots of music shows from CD, then there are plenty of places to put fund drive announcements on the air that do not interrupt regular programming. And as long as you don't interrupt regular programming, you're not breaking the law. Assuming you're not rasing funds for some for-profit venture, of course.
>
> If it is a non-commercial station, it is illegal. Commercial
> stations can do whatever they want in this regard, in fact,
> it is encouraged. Non-commercial stations can only fundraise
> for themselves. Thus, what you describe can not be done on a
> non-commercial station, unless the station is getting the
> $$$$.
Hidebound thinking like this can suck the life out of NCE stations.
If you want to raise money for a good cause and you are afraid to fundraise for anybody buy your own station, then do a fundraiser for the KXXX "Relief to Family Farms Fund" or the "KXXX Tsunami Cleanup Drive." Then give the money the station has received to whoever it's supposed to go to. The rules do not prohibit NCE stations raising money for themselves, then supporting other non-profit entities. Stations give money to other organizations all the time.
Yeah, it requires thinking outside the box. But we all end up in a box way too soon anyway, and I object to people who want to put us in one before our time has come.
If you're trying to do some good in the world, the FCC isn't going to kick down the doors and make you stop raising money for starving orphans or homeless shelters. At least, they haven't done so yet.
Strict interpretation of the FCC rules went out with the Reagan administration.
R
radiomike
Guest
Actually, anything you do off air is fine. However, your on air fundraising activities, if done in the form of fund drives, membership drives, or radiothons, are very limited by FCC rules. And if you think strict interpretation no longer applies, a quick call to the enforcement bureau will certainly correct that assumption. The examples you give will get you into trouble, maybe not this year, but eventually. And sad to say, if not the FCC, the IRS will come a knocking too.
Oh, and btw, "being creative" is what got the likes of Enron and Arthur Anderson in trouble. Announcers can talk about things, but if they spend their time during breaks asking people to call XXX-XXXX and make a pledge to support the Orphans, then it violates the rules. It becomes an on air fundraiser for the Orphanage. However, a once an hour mention in a PSA or community calender, is legal and is not muddling into the quicksand of FCC interpretation. If an non-commercial staiton has some good attorneys and big bucks, then throw caution to wind and go for it. However, so much has been staked at getting stations on the air, including LPFM, that it would be a shame for an LPFM to get socked with a fine that could knock them out for good.
Oh, and btw, "being creative" is what got the likes of Enron and Arthur Anderson in trouble. Announcers can talk about things, but if they spend their time during breaks asking people to call XXX-XXXX and make a pledge to support the Orphans, then it violates the rules. It becomes an on air fundraiser for the Orphanage. However, a once an hour mention in a PSA or community calender, is legal and is not muddling into the quicksand of FCC interpretation. If an non-commercial staiton has some good attorneys and big bucks, then throw caution to wind and go for it. However, so much has been staked at getting stations on the air, including LPFM, that it would be a shame for an LPFM to get socked with a fine that could knock them out for good.
H
hangbush
Guest
> Actually, anything you do off air is fine. However, your on
> air fundraising activities, if done in the form of fund
> drives, membership drives, or radiothons, are very limited
> by FCC rules. And if you think strict interpretation no
> longer applies, a quick call to the enforcement bureau will
> certainly correct that assumption. The examples you give
> will get you into trouble, maybe not this year, but
> eventually. And sad to say, if not the FCC, the IRS will
> come a knocking too.
Yeah, and now a tax expert too. Wow, a real renaissance man here.
Now the IRS is going to get involved in a transfer of funds from one non-profit to another. This stuff goes on all the time kids, and it's not illegal, it's encouraged if it's for the public good.
Just being paranoid is not a good way to operate a radio station, or much of anything else in this world.
>
> Oh, and btw, "being creative" is what got the likes of Enron
> and Arthur Anderson in trouble.
Slightly different context here. It's unlikely that Arthur Anderson was trying to offer a public service when they advised people to steal from their shareholders. What kind of evil-doer could compare these two things?
> Announcers can talk about
> things, but if they spend their time during breaks asking
> people to call XXX-XXXX and make a pledge to support the
> Orphans, then it violates the rules.
No it doesn't. As long as it doesn't interrupt the normal programming. We're supposed to be here to support our community. You've apparently lost sight of that in your obsession with strict enforcement of rules that were never designed for that.
> It becomes an on air
> fundraiser for the Orphanage. However, a once an hour
> mention in a PSA or community calender, is legal and is not
> muddling into the quicksand of FCC interpretation. If an
> non-commercial staiton has some good attorneys and big
> bucks, then throw caution to wind and go for it. However, so
> much has been staked at getting stations on the air,
> including LPFM, that it would be a shame for an LPFM to get
> socked with a fine that could knock them out for good.
Come off it. You're scaring people with no good reason. Either a station is committed to serve the community, or it's just taking up space like the commercial stations.
Despite your apparent belief, the FCC is not here to prevent stations from serving the needs of their communities. I have never come across a notice of apparent liability for a station deciding it needed to jump behind a local cause. Show us some examples, please. That would be a lot more convincing than the "Big Bad Wolf" technique.
Sure, you can't do the right thing if you're too scared to do it. And I don't think scaring people away from doing the right thing is so much a public service as some kind of weird-ass power trip.
> air fundraising activities, if done in the form of fund
> drives, membership drives, or radiothons, are very limited
> by FCC rules. And if you think strict interpretation no
> longer applies, a quick call to the enforcement bureau will
> certainly correct that assumption. The examples you give
> will get you into trouble, maybe not this year, but
> eventually. And sad to say, if not the FCC, the IRS will
> come a knocking too.
Yeah, and now a tax expert too. Wow, a real renaissance man here.
Now the IRS is going to get involved in a transfer of funds from one non-profit to another. This stuff goes on all the time kids, and it's not illegal, it's encouraged if it's for the public good.
Just being paranoid is not a good way to operate a radio station, or much of anything else in this world.
>
> Oh, and btw, "being creative" is what got the likes of Enron
> and Arthur Anderson in trouble.
Slightly different context here. It's unlikely that Arthur Anderson was trying to offer a public service when they advised people to steal from their shareholders. What kind of evil-doer could compare these two things?
> Announcers can talk about
> things, but if they spend their time during breaks asking
> people to call XXX-XXXX and make a pledge to support the
> Orphans, then it violates the rules.
No it doesn't. As long as it doesn't interrupt the normal programming. We're supposed to be here to support our community. You've apparently lost sight of that in your obsession with strict enforcement of rules that were never designed for that.
> It becomes an on air
> fundraiser for the Orphanage. However, a once an hour
> mention in a PSA or community calender, is legal and is not
> muddling into the quicksand of FCC interpretation. If an
> non-commercial staiton has some good attorneys and big
> bucks, then throw caution to wind and go for it. However, so
> much has been staked at getting stations on the air,
> including LPFM, that it would be a shame for an LPFM to get
> socked with a fine that could knock them out for good.
Come off it. You're scaring people with no good reason. Either a station is committed to serve the community, or it's just taking up space like the commercial stations.
Despite your apparent belief, the FCC is not here to prevent stations from serving the needs of their communities. I have never come across a notice of apparent liability for a station deciding it needed to jump behind a local cause. Show us some examples, please. That would be a lot more convincing than the "Big Bad Wolf" technique.
Sure, you can't do the right thing if you're too scared to do it. And I don't think scaring people away from doing the right thing is so much a public service as some kind of weird-ass power trip.
R
radiomike
Guest
> Yeah, and now a tax expert too. Wow, a real renaissance man
> here.
Yes, I am! Perhaps you have not followed the IRS's keen interest in non-profits and where their money goes in the wake of 9/11 and all the accounting messes in the corporate world. It is not paranoid. Check with your auditors for your station accounts.
> No it doesn't. As long as it doesn't interrupt the normal
> programming. We're supposed to be here to support our
> community. You've apparently lost sight of that in your
> obsession with strict enforcement of rules that were never
> designed for that.
Actually, the rules were created to prevent abuse of the process, of channeling funds away from the station to the parent or other organizations. The rules were in fact designed to do that. Once again, nothing wrong with off air or limited PSA's.
> Come off it. You're scaring people with no good reason.
> Either a station is committed to serve the community, or
> it's just taking up space like the commercial stations.
> Despite your apparent belief, the FCC is not here to prevent
> stations from serving the needs of their communities. I have
> never come across a notice of apparent liability for a
> station deciding it needed to jump behind a local cause.
> Show us some examples, please. That would be a lot more
> convincing than the "Big Bad Wolf" technique.
Once again, there have been NAL's issued to stations for doing illeagl fundrasing. You have to did to find them. There are very few stations that actually try to do this, as they really need to raise money to keep themselves afloat. A station can be committed to serving the community without breaking laws or in this case, fundraising for another entity.
> Sure, you can't do the right thing if you're too scared to
> do it. And I don't think scaring people away from doing the
> right thing is so much a public service as some kind of
> weird-ass power trip.
Not a power trip, but reality. A close read of FCC rules and the implications for LPFM stations would do some good in this case. The Commission does not prohibit you from serving the community, within the rules. Thus, you get an FCC license, operate at the proper power level, and provide a service to your community, all within the rules. It is part of being a responsible broadcaster. It is the right thing to do.
> here.
Yes, I am! Perhaps you have not followed the IRS's keen interest in non-profits and where their money goes in the wake of 9/11 and all the accounting messes in the corporate world. It is not paranoid. Check with your auditors for your station accounts.
> No it doesn't. As long as it doesn't interrupt the normal
> programming. We're supposed to be here to support our
> community. You've apparently lost sight of that in your
> obsession with strict enforcement of rules that were never
> designed for that.
Actually, the rules were created to prevent abuse of the process, of channeling funds away from the station to the parent or other organizations. The rules were in fact designed to do that. Once again, nothing wrong with off air or limited PSA's.
> Come off it. You're scaring people with no good reason.
> Either a station is committed to serve the community, or
> it's just taking up space like the commercial stations.
> Despite your apparent belief, the FCC is not here to prevent
> stations from serving the needs of their communities. I have
> never come across a notice of apparent liability for a
> station deciding it needed to jump behind a local cause.
> Show us some examples, please. That would be a lot more
> convincing than the "Big Bad Wolf" technique.
Once again, there have been NAL's issued to stations for doing illeagl fundrasing. You have to did to find them. There are very few stations that actually try to do this, as they really need to raise money to keep themselves afloat. A station can be committed to serving the community without breaking laws or in this case, fundraising for another entity.
> Sure, you can't do the right thing if you're too scared to
> do it. And I don't think scaring people away from doing the
> right thing is so much a public service as some kind of
> weird-ass power trip.
Not a power trip, but reality. A close read of FCC rules and the implications for LPFM stations would do some good in this case. The Commission does not prohibit you from serving the community, within the rules. Thus, you get an FCC license, operate at the proper power level, and provide a service to your community, all within the rules. It is part of being a responsible broadcaster. It is the right thing to do.
- Status