NYC Metro Radio Ratings: September 2022

[macattack]

Once again, KPNT wouldn't get those good numbers without Rizzuto in the Morning. The music isn't the attraction. It's Rizzuto.

Also, as far as "the wrong currents," that wouldn't happen if you had record label promotion staffs prioritizing the songs so radio would have more information in picking songs. Otherwise it's all based on personal taste, which is not how it's supposed to work. Since the record labels no longer promote rock or alt to radio, those stations have little guidance or information about what to play. That doesn't happen in other formats.

Rizzuto was #1 in STL when KPNT was pulling 2.5-3 shares. Yes he’s definitely a huge force to be reckoned with and has pulled in an even larger audience than he used to have, but the rest of the station has caught up.

The radio add board says otherwise with the promotion. Arista is pushing a new Maneskin song very hard. Concord has ads for Ghost’s “Mary On A Cross” on AllAccess. Fueled By Ramen is pushing a new All Time Low song hard too. Atlantic is pushing a 2nd Matt Maeson single from his new record hard to Alt as well. Epitaph has managed to get Falling In Reverse to gradually crawl up the Alt chart with a lot of hard work to get many stations to try out a heavy band. Labels definitely still try.

 

[TheBigA]

The radio add board says otherwise with the promotion.

Looking at add boards on AllAccess really doesn't tell the story. That just shows results.

 

[macattack]

Looking at add boards on AllAccess really doesn't tell the story. That just shows results.

I’m not talking about the results. I meant the lists of songs going for adds. Alt typically has 3-5 songs going for adds every week. 8 songs went for adds in one week earlier this year. The labels, major and indie alike, do still try. And that’s why the barrier for entry on the Mediabase top 50 is the highest I’ve seen in years. Alt stations have a huge variety of currents to choose from right now.

 

[TheBigA]

Alt stations have a huge variety of currents to choose from right now.

That's the problem. Lack of focus. That's why you end up with stations picking "the wrong currents."

The genre needs to get more organized and more focused on what it wants to be. That comes from music people, not radio.

 

[davideduardo]

I’m not talking about the results. I meant the lists of songs going for adds. Alt typically has 3-5 songs going for adds every week. 8 songs went for adds in one week earlier this year. The labels, major and indie alike, do still try. And that’s why the barrier for entry on the Mediabase top 50 is the highest I’ve seen in years. Alt stations have a huge variety of currents to choose from right now.

The online add reports are the result of programmer selections, and there is no causal evidence that there was a concerted promotion effort behind the adds. In fact, adds are often made based on a PD seeing a release getting play on a station they respect, taking another listen, and (if there is an opening) adding it.

 

[macattack]

That's the problem. Lack of focus. That's why you end up with stations picking "the wrong currents."

The genre needs to get more organized and more focused on what it wants to be. That comes from music people, not radio.

Alt is dazed and confused at the start of every decade, I’ve noticed. Usually by the third or fourth year of a decade the format sorts itself out for the remainder of said decade.

This is nothing new for Alt. I have a feeling the format will figure things out either next year or 2024 at the latest. Until then things are going to be chaotic. It’s just how it is with this uniquely bizarre format.

EDIT: to get back on topic, it’s clear that WNYL is doing a uniquely bad job at finding its way through this crazy period compared to other Alts, including sister Audacy stations. I think we can all agree on that, even if we disagree on some of the specific factors.

 

[kevtronics]

WNYL tends to almost completely ignore the 00’s like they never happened outside of a few stray songs like “Mr. Brightside” or “Float On”.

SiriusXM's "PopRocks" channel plays a lot of '00s and '10s alternative/pop crossover hits that I've never heard on Alt 92.3. For example, O.A.R.'s "Shattered" (2008) and Neon Trees' "Everybody Talks" (2012).

 

[victorres43]

I have been analyzing the WNYL playlist and they actually play significantly more 90’s gold than the average Audacy. WNYL tends to almost completely ignore the 00’s like they never happened outside of a few stray songs like “Mr. Brightside” or “Float On”. This is the polar opposite approach of the most successful Alts in the country including Audacy’s best performing Alts. The 2000’s and early 10’s are taking up more and more of the gold slots on these Alts, whether KPNT, KVIL, WXDX, WBUZ and so on, with the 90’s retreating to speciality programming. Some 90’s songs still relevant to 18-34 listeners such as “Everlong”, “Friday I’m In Love”, “Shimmer”, or “The Distance” remain on the standard playlist though.

Considering that Williamsburg was a hotbed for hipster culture during the 00s / 10s, it may be an odd choice to eschew the "hits" during that time period.

Then again, perhaps Audacy believed that the 90s stuff tested insanely well in NYC compared to the 00s stuff.

 

[Theater of My Mind]

Since the record labels no longer promote rock or alt to radio, those stations have little guidance or information about what to play.

The online add reports are the result of programmer selections, and there is no causal evidence that there was a concerted promotion effort behind the adds.

Please. Do you guys even think about what you are posting to this site or do you just write things for the sake of hearing yourself talk? David, at least you should know better.

The suggestion that the major labels are not promoting their new music to radio is frankly ridiculous. Of course they are.

 

[TheBigA]

The suggestion that the major labels are not promoting their new music to radio is frankly ridiculous. Of course they are.

They've cut back drastically in rock and alt. Comparatively, they're very active in country, pop, and urban. Having worked in multiple formats, I can see the difference between when the labels are aggressive in promotion, and when they're not. You wouldn't have the confusion in alternative that you see now if the music side was more organized. As I've said in other posts, the alt labels seem to be just throwing spaghetti at the wall, in the hopes that something sticks.

 

[davideduardo]

Please. Do you guys even think about what you are posting to this site or do you just write things for the sake of hearing yourself talk? David, at least you should know better.

The suggestion that the major labels are not promoting their new music to radio is frankly ridiculous. Of course they are.

The major labels have cut way back on their active promotion to all rock formats. They have almost eliminated the promotion people who visit stations, and don't do the phone activity they used to. It's pretty much a download or something delivered, but that is it.

The pandemic exacerbated the situation because stations were not accepting visitors and promotion people were told not to go out. But that just "finished off" the trend of fewer, if any, station visits as well as far fewer artist-based promotions. Those "fly to Atlanta to see Big Loud Band" promotions are pretty much gone if you are in Knoxville or Montgomery, and so are the t-shirts and other artist stuff.

 

[davideduardo]

They've cut back drastically in rock and alt. Comparatively, they're very active in country, pop, and urban. Having worked in multiple formats, I can see the difference between when the labels are aggressive in promotion, and when they're not. You wouldn't have the confusion in alternative that you see now if the music side was more organized. As I've said in other posts, the alt labels seem to be just throwing spaghetti at the wall, in the hopes that something sticks.

Hint: given some of the more recent releases, that stuff they are throwing is NOT spaghetti.

 

[TheBigA]

The pandemic exacerbated the situation because stations were not accepting visitors and promotion people were told not to go out.

In addition, the touring business shut down and musicians were being told not to go into studios to make new music during this time. Some may have used the time off to do songwriting, but there was about a year when very little new music was getting released. It ended up hurting several currents-based formats.

Hint: given some of the more recent releases, that stuff they are throwing is NOT spaghetti.

Agreed. That's another aspect that's missing. At one time, there were gatekeepers at the labels who stopped the crap from getting released. I've heard stories of label presidents rejecting albums delivered by artists, telling them to go back to the drawing board. I wonder if anyone does that today. I go to music conferences where new musicians are being told "Just release your music directly to streaming services and people will find it." That's not how to build a career. The streaming services are just platforms, they don't get into the marketing business. They have tried to curate the music, but most of that gets overlooked by users. So it's a form of musical anarchy. The result is the musical confusion we have now.

 

[Theater of My Mind]

The major labels have cut way back on their active promotion to all rock formats. They have almost eliminated the promotion people who visit stations, and don't do the phone activity they used to.

That's because big radio has consolidated so much that they don't need to visit stations. The relationships are with the corporate format heads now.

These are multi-billion dollar companies, obviously they have promotion people. Are they driving around from station to station? Well it's not the 1980s anymore.

Are those songs and artists the best they could come up with? That's another topic. But they do promote what they've got.

Alternative = a big part the labels' new music roster so obviously it's a priority for them to promote it. Are you really going to keep doubling down on this nonsensical argument that it's unimportant to them? Maybe to you it is because it's not Latin or Country. To the labels these are key artists they are working to market.

 

[davideduardo]

That's because big radio has consolidated so much that they don't need to visit stations. The relationships are with the corporate format heads now.

That is not exactly true. In most formats, the local PDs make final decisions. If they are in a market that still does the equivalent of call-out, they may or may not need to fill current positions each week.

And there are lots of small group or independent rock stations. And, of course, all college stations are "independent".

For example, if a song is stiffing in one market, they may kill it there and add a new one that others in the company are not ready for yet.

Further, back when there were promotion people making visits, stations would often do an add for an artist visiting the market and even do some kind of contest... whether artist memorabilia or the old "sweaty T-shirt worn by Jon during the concert" kind of stuff.

These are multi-billion dollar companies, obviously they have promotion people. Are they driving around from station to station? Well it's not the 1980s anymore.

They cut back on promotion people in all the rock formats. They don't even have people doing calls like they used to.

Are those songs and artists the best they could come up with? That's another topic. But they do promote what they've got.

Not in rock they don't. Compared with 20% years ago, there is maybe 20% of the promotion effort. And, as Big A said, the product has lost focus at the labels and a lot of it sucks.

Alternative = a big part the labels' new music roster so obviously it's a priority for them to promote it. Are you really going to keep doubling down on this nonsensical argument that it's unimportant to them? Maybe to you it is because it's not Latin or Country. To the labels these are key artists they are working to market.

I've done, in the past, the most listened to rock station in the Western Hemisphere. And "Latin" is not a format, it is a culture. There are dozens of formats that appeal to Latinos and English language rock is one of them (outside the US, mostly). I've done Top 40/CHR (one of the first FM-Only Top 40's the same month that Bartell launched WMYQ, KSLQ and WDRQ) and AC and classic rock and Urban / Churban and even disco.

Again, as Big A said, labels are letting Alternative sink or swim on its own. They just, as he said, sling it against the wall to see if it works on its own.

 

[TheBigA]

That's because big radio has consolidated so much that they don't need to visit stations. The relationships are with the corporate format heads now.

That SHOULD make it easier and more efficient for labels. Not the case for rock and alt.

However the other currents-based formats haven't consolidated very much. They can't because in order to maintain their status with trade music charts, the stations have to have local staff to make music decisions. If they lose the reporting status, they lose the promotional goodies they give listeners. We're talking markets 1 to 125. Below that there aren't many chart reporters. But music charts require local decision makers. If the decisions are made at corporate, all of the stations in the group count as one entity. Obviously not an issue for formats where the majority of the music is old stuff.

 

[davideduardo]

I recall reading on this board that WNYL 92.3 has been billing quite well.

There are 3 ESB FMs that are the very lowest billing of all those that have full facilities or are 50 kw AMs: WXNY, WEPN-FM and WNYL. There are 15 stations billing more than those three each do.

 

[MVB13]

They need to play the songs they played when they first launched back in 2017.

 

[macattack]

They need to play the songs they played when they first launched back in 2017.

That would require giving Kaplan the pink slip. Even now he’s trying to force “Another Love” by Tom Odell onto Alt as a current, a song that is both older than dirt and clashes violently with the burned 90’s gold. He just can’t help himself.

 

[101tm]

There are 3 ESB FMs that are the very lowest billing of all those that have full facilities or are 50 kw AMs: WXNY, WEPN-FM and WNYL. There are 15 stations billing more than those three each do.

Wow, I wouldn’t expect WEPN-FM to do that poorly considering that sports stations generally can get poor numbers but still bill well.