Oldies 106.7 - Your Impressions?

[cigarboy]

Some of you people are so old school! With the way people listen to music there is no ryhm or reason what people want. Variety is the key now days with iPods and MP3 players. Have you ever looked at somebody's iPod? There is stuff on there that makes you say "why do you have that on here". Atlanta Radio Plays the same stuff every day. I can set my clock to when 97.1 The Creek plays low rider and when 94.1 plays Fergie. I Love True Oldies 106.7 and Rock 100.5... What is wrong with Atlanta Radio? The same people are programming it. We need new ideas and GM's with big balls... If you are in your 40 and 50's move on. We need young blood in this business. The old timers just sit back and do the same dam thing day in and day out. I said my peace!

 

[semoochie]

Beep Beep: Playmates #4 1958. Glen Campbell was a huge pop star with a country style, not unlike John Denver.

 

[jabba17]

Beep Beep: Playmates #4 1958. Glen Campbell was a huge pop star with a country style, not unlike John Denver.

And a part-time Beach Boy.

 

[semoochie]

Dance Dance Dance

 

[Uriah]

Oldies 106.7
Day One

It appears this is an extremely broad-based Gold format that will likely erode TSL and cume for Dave FM and 97.1 The River.

Oldies 106.7 is much too broad for a major market, where major market programmers must identify and superserve a niche within any format (for example, V103 superserves 25-54 Urban female, while Kiss 104.1 superserves 35+ Urban female). As it is, Oldies 106.7 vacillates between Classic Gold (Beach Boys, The Monkees, Beatles) and Classic Hits (Eagles, Fleetwood Mac). This leaves 106.7's flank open to attack from 97.1 and Dave, which can tighten their respective playlists and re-brand as Classic Hits. Perhaps, 106.7 may even be vulnerable to attack on the upper end from even another Classic Gold station.

Biggest critique: 106.7 must tighten focus, playlist and branding to reflect either Classic Gold or Classic Hits. Not both.

Fleetwood Mac is 30 years old. Motown, Beatle, etc. records are 50+-. "True" to his form, Shannon is defining what an oldie is - not a demo, not a near 60 year old programming rule. What radio insiders call a train wreck segue or a violation of cluster analysis is suspect - especially when you hear an iPod playlist or mix from Pandora. It's the mood that drives them - familiar and sing along is primary criteria for True Oldies. BTW: The True Oldies Brand may be consumer/payoff defined as the "Escape" of "Feel Good" button versus my oldies button. As for ratings: qualitative, reach and cume have a sales story that is often stronger than rating or share with so many stations clumped together. Right now the stations oh-wow! factor is huge and that drives buzz. Any playlist eventually gets tired – personal iPod and Pandora included. They’ll platoon songs and eras to sustain energy. Reality-check on consumers: B98 is sitting on a pretty nice share and played Billy Ocean every 2.5 days for 20 years.

 

[bgwilde1]

Uriah, is your last name Heep??

 

[Uriah]

Uriah, is your last name Heep??

yes.

 

[itburnswhenipee]

Oldies 106.7
Day One

It appears this is an extremely broad-based Gold format that will likely erode TSL and cume for Dave FM and 97.1 The River.

Oldies 106.7 is much too broad for a major market, where major market programmers must identify and superserve a niche within any format (for example, V103 superserves 25-54 Urban female, while Kiss 104.1 superserves 35+ Urban female). As it is, Oldies 106.7 vacillates between Classic Gold (Beach Boys, The Monkees, Beatles) and Classic Hits (Eagles, Fleetwood Mac). This leaves 106.7's flank open to attack from 97.1 and Dave, which can tighten their respective playlists and re-brand as Classic Hits. Perhaps, 106.7 may even be vulnerable to attack on the upper end from even another Classic Gold station.

Biggest critique: 106.7 must tighten focus, playlist and branding to reflect either Classic Gold or Classic Hits. Not both.

Fleetwood Mac is 30 years old. Motown, Beatle, etc. records are 50+-. "True" to his form, Shannon is defining what an oldie is - not a demo, not a near 60 year old programming rule. What radio insiders call a train wreck segue or a violation of cluster analysis is suspect - especially when you hear an iPod playlist or mix from Pandora. It's the mood that drives them - familiar and sing along is primary criteria for True Oldies. BTW: The True Oldies Brand may be consumer/payoff defined as the "Escape" of "Feel Good" button versus my oldies button. As for ratings: qualitative, reach and cume have a sales story that is often stronger than rating or share with so many stations clumped together. Right now the stations oh-wow! factor is huge and that drives buzz. Any playlist eventually gets tired – personal iPod and Pandora included. They’ll platoon songs and eras to sustain energy. Reality-check on consumers: B98 is sitting on a pretty nice share and played Billy Ocean every 2.5 days for 20 years.

Thanks, Uriah. You brought up some excellent points. It's also true that Gold-based formats are inherently disadvantaged in that they may not, by definition, rotate playlists to integrate Currents and Re-Currents. Hence, Classic Rock stations such as 97.1 suffer TSL erosion due to "high burn." A broader, more loosely defined Gold format (such as True Oldies 106.7) may ameliorate high burn.

However, the loosely defined playlists may also concurrently compromise TSL as Classic Rock fans (Eric Clapton, Eagles, Doobie Brothers) will tune away when they hear Earth, Wind & Fire. The Motown fans will tune out when Lynyrd Skynyrd hits the rotation.

Again, the musical latitude of 106.7 is limited in major markets like Atlanta, when the P2 and P3 listeners have so many other radio options.

 

[amos]

as Classic Rock fans (Eric Clapton, Eagles, Doobie Brothers) will tune away when they hear Earth, Wind & Fire. The Motown fans will tune out when Lynyrd Skynyrd hits the rotation.

what about those of us that like clapton, eagles, doobies, supremes, earth wind and fire, marvin gaye, tommy james, looking glass, chairmen of the board, beatles, etc? in other words, true oldies.

 

[jabba17]

as Classic Rock fans (Eric Clapton, Eagles, Doobie Brothers) will tune away when they hear Earth, Wind & Fire. The Motown fans will tune out when Lynyrd Skynyrd hits the rotation.

what about those of us that like clapton, eagles, doobies, supremes, earth wind and fire, marvin gaye, tommy james, looking glass, chairmen of the board, beatles, etc? in other words, true oldies.

I get your point, but Clapton, Eagles, and Doobies easily qualifies as classic rock/classic hits, not what I would consider "oldies" by the traditional definition (post-rock 50s, 60s, and MAYBE 70s AM gold, and not including classic AOR). And EW&F is too new/urban/disco to be considered 70s AM Gold.

My first point is that it's hard to program an oldies station today without bleeding into 70s AM Gold, disco/funk/soul/urban, or classic rock; or sticking with the Beatles/Beach Boys/Motown 60s stuff and suffering a lot of burn and accusations of a shallow playlist; or playing a lot of 50s "golden oldies" (doo-w0p, beach/shag music, early rockers like Berry/Lewis/Haley, etc.) and alienating a lot of baby boomers who fancy themselves as too young to listen to that "old folks" stuff.

The other problem with programming 50s is the other primary audience is people, like myself, who weren't alive during that time (I'm 40) but like it anyway. Unfortunately, for us young'uns 50s music is usually a button-pushing choice and not a set-it-and-forget-it choice. Not the demo+TSL you want!

My second point is that "oldies" is hard to define, and even harder to program when you arbitrarily refuse to play a lot of 50s, without people (including myself) complaining about how it could be done better or complaining about burn ("good times and eight oldies"). As a parallel example, what's funny is when you see people try to classify an 80s station--is it oldies? alternative? AAA? CHR? classic rock? AC? A lot of that, of course, depends on the playlist.

True Oldies has IMO wisely chosen to focus on the 60s and 70s, including some classic rock and some funk and soul, but no disco and no harder/deeper 60s/70s AOR (Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, KISS ["Beth" doesn't count], Deep Purple)--and certainly no other late-70s formats like punk and new wave. Any more diverse--whether it's to include 50s, late 70s disco/new wave, or hard classic rock--and while you'll appeal more to the button-pushers like myself, you'll lose the set-it-and-forget-it listeners who can't stand "doo-w0p"/"disco"/"punk"/"heavy metal" and change the station, with TSL suffering accordingly.

Another way to look at it is a "core" 60s oldies/70s AM gold playlist, plus 60s/70s soft classic rock and some funk and soul to help prevent so much burn and also attract other listeners who might otherwise be listening to the River or an urban AC station. Yet another way to look at it is B98.5, wound back about two or three decades--essentially an older AC station.

 

[OutOfTheBiz]

Oldies 106.7
Day One

It appears this is an extremely broad-based Gold format that will likely erode TSL and cume for Dave FM and 97.1 The River.

Oldies 106.7 is much too broad for a major market, where major market programmers must identify and superserve a niche within any format (for example, V103 superserves 25-54 Urban female, while Kiss 104.1 superserves 35+ Urban female). As it is, Oldies 106.7 vacillates between Classic Gold (Beach Boys, The Monkees, Beatles) and Classic Hits (Eagles, Fleetwood Mac). This leaves 106.7's flank open to attack from 97.1 and Dave, which can tighten their respective playlists and re-brand as Classic Hits. Perhaps, 106.7 may even be vulnerable to attack on the upper end from even another Classic Gold station.

Biggest critique: 106.7 must tighten focus, playlist and branding to reflect either Classic Gold or Classic Hits. Not both.

Fleetwood Mac is 30 years old. Motown, Beatle, etc. records are 50+-. "True" to his form, Shannon is defining what an oldie is - not a demo, not a near 60 year old programming rule. What radio insiders call a train wreck segue or a violation of cluster analysis is suspect - especially when you hear an iPod playlist or mix from Pandora. It's the mood that drives them - familiar and sing along is primary criteria for True Oldies. BTW: The True Oldies Brand may be consumer/payoff defined as the "Escape" of "Feel Good" button versus my oldies button. As for ratings: qualitative, reach and cume have a sales story that is often stronger than rating or share with so many stations clumped together. Right now the stations oh-wow! factor is huge and that drives buzz. Any playlist eventually gets tired – personal iPod and Pandora included. They’ll platoon songs and eras to sustain energy. Reality-check on consumers: B98 is sitting on a pretty nice share and played Billy Ocean every 2.5 days for 20 years.

Thanks, Uriah. You brought up some excellent points. It's also true that Gold-based formats are inherently disadvantaged in that they may not, by definition, rotate playlists to integrate Currents and Re-Currents. Hence, Classic Rock stations such as 97.1 suffer TSL erosion due to "high burn." A broader, more loosely defined Gold format (such as True Oldies 106.7) may ameliorate high burn.

However, the loosely defined playlists may also concurrently compromise TSL as Classic Rock fans (Eric Clapton, Eagles, Doobie Brothers) will tune away when they hear Earth, Wind & Fire. The Motown fans will tune out when Lynyrd Skynyrd hits the rotation.

Again, the musical latitude of 106.7 is limited in major markets like Atlanta, when the P2 and P3 listeners have so many other radio options.

How long did 96Rock survive with gold-only playlist without suffering the "TSL erosion due to high burn" you speak of? 30 years?

 

[jabba17]

Oldies 106.7
Day One

It appears this is an extremely broad-based Gold format that will likely erode TSL and cume for Dave FM and 97.1 The River.

Oldies 106.7 is much too broad for a major market, where major market programmers must identify and superserve a niche within any format (for example, V103 superserves 25-54 Urban female, while Kiss 104.1 superserves 35+ Urban female). As it is, Oldies 106.7 vacillates between Classic Gold (Beach Boys, The Monkees, Beatles) and Classic Hits (Eagles, Fleetwood Mac). This leaves 106.7's flank open to attack from 97.1 and Dave, which can tighten their respective playlists and re-brand as Classic Hits. Perhaps, 106.7 may even be vulnerable to attack on the upper end from even another Classic Gold station.

Biggest critique: 106.7 must tighten focus, playlist and branding to reflect either Classic Gold or Classic Hits. Not both.

Fleetwood Mac is 30 years old. Motown, Beatle, etc. records are 50+-. "True" to his form, Shannon is defining what an oldie is - not a demo, not a near 60 year old programming rule. What radio insiders call a train wreck segue or a violation of cluster analysis is suspect - especially when you hear an iPod playlist or mix from Pandora. It's the mood that drives them - familiar and sing along is primary criteria for True Oldies. BTW: The True Oldies Brand may be consumer/payoff defined as the "Escape" of "Feel Good" button versus my oldies button. As for ratings: qualitative, reach and cume have a sales story that is often stronger than rating or share with so many stations clumped together. Right now the stations oh-wow! factor is huge and that drives buzz. Any playlist eventually gets tired – personal iPod and Pandora included. They’ll platoon songs and eras to sustain energy. Reality-check on consumers: B98 is sitting on a pretty nice share and played Billy Ocean every 2.5 days for 20 years.

Thanks, Uriah. You brought up some excellent points. It's also true that Gold-based formats are inherently disadvantaged in that they may not, by definition, rotate playlists to integrate Currents and Re-Currents. Hence, Classic Rock stations such as 97.1 suffer TSL erosion due to "high burn." A broader, more loosely defined Gold format (such as True Oldies 106.7) may ameliorate high burn.

However, the loosely defined playlists may also concurrently compromise TSL as Classic Rock fans (Eric Clapton, Eagles, Doobie Brothers) will tune away when they hear Earth, Wind & Fire. The Motown fans will tune out when Lynyrd Skynyrd hits the rotation.

Again, the musical latitude of 106.7 is limited in major markets like Atlanta, when the P2 and P3 listeners have so many other radio options.

How long did 96Rock survive with gold-only playlist without suffering the "TSL erosion due to high burn" you speak of? 30 years?

For most of those 30+ years, they played current AOR with classic rock. Their weak periods were the "Pure Rock & Roll" classic rock days, although they did OK by default as the only AOR station in the ATL until Z93 flipped to classic rock. Alternative/active rock was tough for them to deal with, considering how many listeners it alienated and still alienates (often into the arms of a waiting Z93).

 

[RTibbs]

Don't foget one thing about 96 Rock they always has strong morning shows. I don't think Imus is going to draw in this market to prop up the reest of the day. Z93 lack of a good morning shows is also why it could never get ahead of 96 rock

 

[itburnswhenipee]

How long did 96Rock survive with gold-only playlist without suffering the "TSL erosion due to high burn" you speak of? 30 years?
[/quote]

For most of those 30+ years, they played current AOR with classic rock. Their weak periods were the "Pure Rock & Roll" classic rock days, although they did OK by default as the only AOR station in the ATL until Z93 flipped to classic rock. Alternative/active rock was tough for them to deal with, considering how many listeners it alienated and still alienates (often into the arms of a waiting Z93).
[/quote]

My point exactly. 96 Rock survived 30 years with a broad AOR/Classic Rock hybrid precisely because there was NO format competitor for most of the time. In today's competitive marketplace (30+ signals in Atlanta, plus Sirius Satellite Radio), True Oldies 106.7 faces attacks on all flanks. Kiss 104 will erode the P2's who enjoy Classic Soul. Dave FM, 97.1 and 100.5 all take a chunk of the P2's who enjoy Classic Rock. B98.5 takes a sizeable bite of the P2's who grew up with 1980s CHR.

106.7 will have the greatest chance for success if it tightens the playlist, narrows its programming niche, and superserves a more clearly defined demo.

 

[jabba17]

How long did 96Rock survive with gold-only playlist without suffering the "TSL erosion due to high burn" you speak of? 30 years?

For most of those 30+ years, they played current AOR with classic rock. Their weak periods were the "Pure Rock & Roll" classic rock days, although they did OK by default as the only AOR station in the ATL until Z93 flipped to classic rock. Alternative/active rock was tough for them to deal with, considering how many listeners it alienated and still alienates (often into the arms of a waiting Z93).
[/quote]

My point exactly. 96 Rock survived 30 years with a broad AOR/Classic Rock hybrid precisely because there was NO format competitor for most of the time. In today's competitive marketplace (30+ signals in Atlanta, plus Sirius Satellite Radio), True Oldies 106.7 faces attacks on all flanks. Kiss 104 will erode the P2's who enjoy Classic Soul. Dave FM, 97.1 and 100.5 all take a chunk of the P2's who enjoy Classic Rock. B98.5 takes a sizeable bite of the P2's who grew up with 1980s CHR.

106.7 will have the greatest chance for success if it tightens the playlist, narrows its programming niche, and superserves a more clearly defined demo.
[/quote]

For 96Rock's first 10 years (1974-1984), a LOT of classic rock WAS then-current AOR. A lot of 60s AOR acts that are commonplace today (a great example is the Doors) weren't as popular in the late 70s as they became later--believe it or not, 60s classic rock was not the thing to listen to in the late 70s. And 96Rock got an AOR monopoly once 94Q drifted from AOR to Top 40 in the late 70s that lasted until 1989 when Z93 flipped.

I think that True Oldies greatest competitor is River-lots of overlap there. Much less with Rock 100.5, as long as Rock 100.5 goes easy on the classic rock, as when they first flipped. Little overlap with Dave, which rarely goes older than the 80s. Some more overlap with B98.5, but Rock 100.5, Dave, and B98.5 play too much new stuff to really compete (except among button-pushers). True Oldies doesn't play 80s, and the other three competitors (Dave, Rock 100.5, and B98.5) play lots of 80s and 90s.

My point is, is that True Oldies competes heavily with River and not really at all with anyone else. If they were concerned about reducing overlap, they would add more 50s. But they're not, nor should they be. Adding light classic rock, while it creates more overlap, reduces burn without alienating your target demo (and might pick up some bonus out-of-demo listeners).

Agreed with RTibbs' comment about morning shows. From Mark McCain's Wake Up Crew through Rude and through TRG (and after Ross & Wilson left), they always beat Z93 who tried everything from the Greaseman to Moby to an aging, past-his-prime Gary McKee. Nobody remembers any Z93 morning show since Ross & Wilson as anything successful (although you could argue about the Greaseman), while people still speak highly of those 3 96Rock shows I mentioned.

 

[ck dexter haven]

Been interesting reading all these comments from different people, and I respect the views expressed.

Speaking from bitter experience, I can tell you that there's a MAJOR difference between an audience reacting this way:

• Wow, I haven't heard THAT song in a LONG TIME!

vs.

• That song is one of my all time favorites

Prime example: Stealer's Wheel, Stuck In The Middle With You. There's a song that was a huge hit; featured prominently in the movie Reservoir Dogs, and "everyone likes it". Yet test after test yields a low passion score for the song. Having been one of the original CBS Arrow program directors, I can tell you that every time that song played, the phones went berserk. Did that song (and numerous others like it) translate into ratings? Not so much.

So, Oldies 106.7 is primed with the "I haven't heard THAT song in a LONG TIME" kind of records, and for that, it's fun to listen to. But after the fourth time hearing the second single from the Brooklyn Bridge, or fill-in-the-blank with any other obscure 60's oldies song/group, you have to wonder how it'll be sustained.

 

[chascook]

A .9 by this time next year.

 

[monkeymanmoi]

The station is very listenable and that's about the highest praise I can ever give a music station these days. I had it on while working around the house yesterday and didn't hear anything that made me want to turn it off. I even heard a song or two I'm not sure I had heard before. (big plus!) I don't care for some of that sappy, mid-70's mellow goo, but overall it's a welcome station.

 

[jacq421]

I am so happy to have an oldies station back in Atlanta. I couldn't understand that a city the size of Atlanta wouldn't be able to support an oldies station. I will support any product that advertises on 106.7 to make sure that this station stays on the air.

 

[Uriah]

B98 Oldies Weekend

Did anyone catch B98's oldies weekend? To the point about the Oh-wow! oldie buzz wearing off after several listens - What a great flank - take the buzz off the songs before True Oldies gets off the ground.

About Z93/Dave morning shows. Red Noise had the best shot at success - he didn't try to be a stand up comic, knew the music and stayed out of its way. We lost him way too soon.