Oldies, PPM Basic questions.

[davideduardo]

Hey all my home run hitters, and cool baby sitters. Got somethin’ here ‘ya may want to see.

Whatever. You think the only users of the university ISPs are kids? Nobody works there?

Condsidering a half dozen Philadelphia staitons have cumes of a million or more, 850 hits hardly seems impressive. Unless you know the demos of the users, the data is meaningless.

 

[qtpieislit]

Arbitron, PPM, it’s all estimates. That’s the fact jack.

 

[davideduardo]

Arbitron, PPM, it’s all estimates. That’s the fact jack.

Any statistic short of a census is an "estimate" based on some kind of poll or sample that represents a representative portion of a universe. The fact that the margin of error is predictable and the results replicable validates the Arbitron (PPM is Arbritron) data and makes it usable for its intended purpose, the buying and selling of advertising. And that's the rest of the story...

 

[lalumia]

that CBS FM was off 20% in billing since 2000 and the market was up. So they were falling further and further behind. Good move? Not really insofar as


yeah, and it was in the 2000's that they started dumping the core 50s rock hits and doo wop, and started easing in unwanted 80s hits, thereby imploding an already existing audience of all ages that enjoyed this fare(or are people that listen to classical stations all 500 years old? how does THAT demo work?)
if CBSFM hadn't listened to the know nothing 'consultants' who have brought radio to the brink of destruction, then all would still be well in the kingdom..

 

[davideduardo]

yeah, and it was in the 2000's that they started dumping the core 50s rock hits and doo wop, and started easing in unwanted 80s hits, thereby imploding an already existing audience of all ages that enjoyed this fare(or are people that listen to classical stations all 500 years old? how does THAT demo work?)
if CBSFM hadn't listened to the know nothing 'consultants' who have brought radio to the brink of destruction, then all would still be well in the kingdom..

The mistake was not dumping all the 50's and early and mid-60's stuff earlier and more agressively.

CBS did NOT have an audience "of all ages" and they did have one that was rapidly moving to mostly 55+.

It does not take a consultant or a math major to know that if you were 12 in 1957 and liked Sea Cruise or At the Hop you are about 62 now, and anyone older than 12 in that year is even older. In fact, using 12 as a benchmark, music from earlier than 1964 is going to get you an entirely 55+ core... if you want a 40-54 core, you need to play very late 70's to early 80's.

P. S. The classical station in LA went country earlier this year as the music has such old, old appeal that billings had slipped to the point that they were not covering expenses. In any case, classical music is about the only exception insofar as listening to a form of music that is not contemporary with each listener... and even then, a very, very niche format which is why most classical stations are non-coms.

It is all about delivering demos with each station, irrespective of its format, that are wanted by advertisers. Under 18 or over 55 and there is little to no agency revenue available. Without revenue, stations can not play anything, whether it is do-wop or hip-hop.

 

[lalumia]

CBS did NOT have an audience "of all ages" and they did have one that was rapidly moving to mostly 55+.
..at least, not one that would ADMIT to listening, perhaps...these new devices will tell the tale, won't they, they seem to be doing so already...
as I've said, tv commercials and movie soundtracks, American Idol and various other outlets have made the 60s especially ,quite consumable to under 55s and even under 45s, it would appear,as millions of kids from coast to coast learn Supremes and Four Tops song to perform in auditions on the most watched mass tv event in america, year after year,and that should be a selling point for 'oldies 'radio right there..

 

[davideduardo]

..at least, not one that would ADMIT to listening, perhaps...these new devices will tell the tale, won't they, they seem to be doing so already...

Yes, they, the PPMs, do a fine job. And they do not show any significant listening to oldies stations outside of the audience that "grew up one the music" whethter that be 40-54 for Classic Hits or 50-64 for conventional oldies. I have been looking at PPM data since the first Philly test, over 5 years ago, and see nothing like what you refer to.

as I've said, tv commercials and movie soundtracks, American Idol and various other outlets have made the 60s especially ,quite consumable to under 55s and even under 45s, it would appear,as millions of kids from coast to coast learn Supremes and Four Tops song to perform in auditions on the most watched mass tv event in america, year after year,and that should be a selling point for 'oldies 'radio right there..

One thing is to pick up an old song and modernize it, and quite another is to go for a steady diet of songs from another generation or era than the one that you are part of.

Intentional listening to any form of oldies by out-of-demo people is just totally a myth. While the people meter shows exposure (you heard what someone else was listening to) that only indicates "captive listening" and not a taste or preference.

 

[RADIOGM]

"If you play 50's, you will get a predominantly 60+ audience, and in today's advertising market, that is not salable. "

David is basically correct with this answer. And yes, some of the BETTER RATED Oldies stations like WOGL, KOOL FM, WODS, K-Earth, and KLUV may not be billing (revenue) as high as the numbers indicate. It is all about Madison Avenue these days.

RGM