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One way the style could live on...

W

Wildstyle K

IF PEOPLE CONTINUE TO TEACH THEIR KIDS ABOUT THE SOUND:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFGCBmacTT0&feature=player_embedded

Chances are, one of these days, one of these kids will take it to heart and seriously consider producing or singing an electro-freestyle track, based purely on the old school "pure melody production & heartfelt lyrics style". Who knows how far it could go or what COULD happen if more kids were inspired by hearing certain sounds before the brainwashing of what's cool and acceptable becomes concrete and dominates the thinking within their brains. All it takes is ONE kid to "get a specific sound / idea stuck within them" with a serious passion and intent to SOMEDAY let it out (or share the idea with someone else) and they just happen to do it successfully to the point where others will copy and imitate the style, even if some of the copiers are copying based purely on the fact that the sound successfully worked for someone else. After all, remember Timbaland and Missy. All they had to do was create one production that stood out and was different from the times (which happened TWICE, by the way,) that set off a whole chain reaction of imitators, which lead to a whole new trend in music. First, in the later part of the mid 90's, it was with the slower, complicated futuristic (new millennium) style beats. Second, while everyone was still slowed down in the mid 00's, Missy hit back with "lose control" featuring Ciara, while Timbaland hit back with "sexy back" featuring Justin Timberlake. The Second time around, it was nothing more than them recycling old school break & disco style beats in a modernized fashion, BUT.... look how far mainstream music has come today on the uptempo side ALL BECAUSE ONE PERSON / PRODUCER in top 40 music wasn't afraid to try / do something different by "going back" to a sound that once "started it all" and that was also the "opposite" of what was going on at the time.

A lot of the breakbeats you hear in top 40 hit music probably wouldn't be around to this degree today - IF Missy never attempted to release the breakbeat styled "lose control" with Ciara. A lot of the house style beats today wouldn't be around to this degree in hit music - IF Timbaland never attempted to release the disco / soft house beat styled "sexy back" record with Justin Timberlake. Do I believe in a creator? Yes. Do I believe in evolution? Yes. Someone created the beats, sounds, and trends. Then, they evolved over time. A lot of the David Guetta shuffle style throbbing thumping bass beat sounds in today's hit music and even dance music evolved from the simple, super watered down "sexy back", that kicked off the whole "second generation" (2005+) of... well, quasi dance music. The beats and melodies just got harder over time (and also permitted flukes such as an unusually successful "day'n'nite" Crookers Remix by Kid Cudi to happen earlier than expected). It all also paved the way for a trend to evolve to the point where Lady Gaga's style would perfectly match in with the current style of sound so she could utilize the opportunity to HELP push things even farther and deeper dance and electro-pop-wise (which Cascada has also benefited from to some degree).

NOW LOOK HOW FAR WE'VE COME.

Well, I believe a "newbie" could also be a trend setter as well.
You expose your kids to certain sounds, You NEVER know what it could lead to. A whole new modernized generation of the latin freestyle sound could be created, the same way urban dance was brought back today in a more electrofied fashion. ALL trends were created by ONE person with a new or different idea that became successful.
 
I played this video for my 8 year old niece last week and she loved it.I had to play it more than once. It was the only freestyle track she did liked. Of course,it makes sense since all the kids in the video seem to be around her age group.

More thoughts later...
 
Dang that video is awful....

Missy and Timbaland simply took it back to the roots, to a time when music was fun and upbeat. "Lose Control" is nothing but rap over Cybotron's "Clear" (a breakdancing classic). I don't really feel it influenced much of the uptempo out today. Sexyback? Perhaps....it was only 117, but surely it created a trend where alot of songs were in that tempo range and had a similar feel with their beat patterns. I think it just opened up producer's eyes that its OK to use beats that are 115 or higher.
 
DJ_Perry said:
I think it just opened up producer's eyes that its OK to use beats that are 115 or higher.
Click to expand...

YES.....

And

DJ_Perry said:
However, Guetta and Crookers were not influenced by this Pop trend....as they were making Dance records long before it was in the spotlight. If anything, they influenced Timbaland and everybody after.
Click to expand...

BUT.... if it weren't for the trend, they would've most likely never seen the "light of day". Many people have been doing Dance records for a long time, but it wasn't until the trends went in that direction that their chances of mainstream approval were increased (or brought back into the spotlight).

DJ_Perry said:
Missy and Timbaland simply took it back to the roots, to a time when music was fun and upbeat. "Lose Control" is nothing but rap over Cybotron's "Clear" (a breakdancing classic). I don't really feel it influenced much of the uptempo out today. ... I think it just opened up producer's eyes that its OK to use beats that are 115 or higher.
Click to expand...

It was only after Missy's "Lose control" that a whole bunch of uptempo break-booty style pop hits started resurfacing. I doubt

LL Cool J - Control Myself
Ciara - get up
Black Eyed Peas - My humps (lil jon remix)
Fergalicious - Fergie
Hilary Duff - with love
Christina Aguilera - Ain't no other man
Rihanna & Sean Paul - Break it off .... etc etc etc

style productions would've been thought of as "early" in the 00's as they were - almost too coincidentally right after the success of Missy's "lose control" record. The LL Cool J came too too quickly afterwards with almost an IDENTICAL formula - recycled old school breakbeat with rapping and singing put over it. The break beat style chain reaction only took off from there.

As far as the disco/house patterned beats, one could argue whether Rihanna's S.O.S. started it, or if Timbaland's "sexy back" started it. I just know if it weren't for the success of "s.o.s." by Rihanna, Nelly Furtado's "maneater" would've never been that heavily considered and believed in. However, more records started creeping back up in tempo with the "sexy back" style before Neyo finally came along and took r&b/pop dance to another level.
 
Ok, I'm done eating, so I can finish what I want to say in entirety with two hands instead of one!

Remember, in both trend changing situations, Timbaland and Missy released one record with a hint of the "new sound" that the follow up actual trend changing release record would fully contain. Before Aaliyah's "One in a million" was released with that "futuristic beat style" that drove people crazy in high schools when they heard this new sound of r&b, Timbaland produced Ginuwine's "Pony", which - if you listen closely, has a hint of the futuristic style beats he was about to unleash that had 702, TLC, Destiny's Child, Sisqo, Total, Something For The People, and even Trick Daddy, Ludacris, Jay - Z... Basement Jaxx "U can't stop me", all the way up to the Spice Girls second album attempt sounding "futuristic" as "everyone" jumped on the trend. It even help to push the uptempo version of that futuristic style to grow even harder "across the pond" in the form of 2 Step (which 702's "you don't know" and Sisqo's "thong song" was to some degree).

Flash forward to the start of the second (mid 00's) generation of dance, and before "Lose control" set off a chain reaction, There was "1, 2 Step" by Missy, which was only a hint of what was to come. I would give some credit to Nelly Furtado "promiscuous" for helping to start the trend, but not all the credit since even faster pop/dance break beats were well on the way before that record was even put out.

Notice how Gwen Stefani's "what you waiting for" didn't do much to start any new dance trend. It, along with Britney's "toxic" were somewhat alone in the uptempo top 40 world (not counting Nina Sky or Pitbull's first releases, or D12 "my band"). Eminem's "Just lose it" didn't influence anything to continue or restart either.

Anyway, bottom line is we are where we are now, and with Edward Maya featuring.... Alicia or Vika or whoever breaking into the scene, we've successfully come a long way, based on the fact that this entire trend/sound was (re)started to make it perfect timing for other people with that sound to possibly crossover. If it weren't for it to be restarted (regardless of where Missy or Timbaland originally got their dance ideas from), Lady Gaga probably would've never had the chance to break into the sound with her "outrageous sound". The only way Lady Gaga made it was because Akon decided to show his true colors and started confidently producing that elecrtro-pop style, which may have never happened so quickly if Missy and Timbaland never proved to everyone that... IT COULD WORK, UNBELIEVEABLY, BUT SUCCESSFULLY in 2005! Imagineif the whole Romanian dance sound (Edward Maya style) takes off and influences people to use those sounds in different forms of music (the same way Rihanna, Chris Brown, and others have a hint of trance elements in their slow r&b/pop productions). That would mean

A WHOLE NEW GENERATION OF SOUND within A WHOLE NEW GENERATION OF SOUND!
Despite the criticism of today's pop music, I believe the possibilities of improvements in creativity in today's music are endless, and we've already started with taking advantage of the fact that creativity and being genuine are once again in.  Combine all that with the advances of media technology that are to come and it's almost like we're going to be in a whole new world and dimension of music. It's like the musical version of a parallel universe. By the time this dance trend ends, it's possible that we may no longer have to "depend on radio" to get "our" sound out, so there may actually be no real death of the sound!

Anyway.. I need to make a correction:
KDM 7000 said:
As far as the disco/house patterned beats, one could argue whether Rihanna's S.O.S. started it, or if Timbaland's "sexy back" started it. ....
Click to expand...

"REstarted" was the correct term here.
 
But, it was a modernized, new generation sound for the mid 00's hip hop generation who saw it as "out there and different". All you really need to create a trend is to be different from what the norm is at any point in time. There will be a time when a future hip hop remix or rock n roll remake will once again be "outrageous and different" to a future generation, the same way Black Eyed Peas sounded "futuristic" to today's generation.
 
Your examples of SOS and Lose Control only illustrate that History is Repeating. In addtion to those, the following recent hits are simply uptempo because they are based off 80's tracks.

I Got it From My Mama sampled Magazine 60 "Don Quichotte"
1, 2 Step sampled Planet Rock
Right Round borrowed Dead or Alive
Check it Out sampled The Buggles "Video Killed the Radio Star"
Don't Stop the Music sampled MJ
Flo's Sugar borrowed Eiffel's "Blue" (not 80's but still fits)
In Da Ayer sampled Freestyle "The Party Has Just Begun"
LL's Control Myself sampled "Looking for the Perfect Beat"
Fergalicious sampled Afro Rican "Give It all You Got"
Universal Mind Control sampled Afrika Bambaataa (not sure which track)

There are countless others. Sooo....is what is going on today really new and "futuristic"? Its just repackaged, which is fine. At least its enjoyable again. But don't give today's producers too much credit.
 
They get the credit for being the ones brave enough to be first to bring back (or start a new generation trend) of this sound (or in other words, they get the credit for causing history to repeat in a modernized fashion).

Bottom line is they were the ones that encouraged a rejumpstart of an uptempo trend during the hip hop era, which caused us to be where we are in sound now. If it weren't for someone to be brave enough and take things back uptempo, we'd probably just now be getting around to the Justin Timberlake "Sexy back", or maybe something else (like country or something else) would've taken over the spotlight. It's not about who sampled who, it's about who restarted the entire uptempo trend for this generation's version of the mainstream. The second person was only brave enough to finally try it after the first person blatantly & successfully passed with it, causing the chain reaction to start from there, to the point where almost everyone in the mainstream has jumped on the sound to some extent.
 
But the topic is "One way the style could live on..." implying that we are focusing on today's and future generations. It's all about living on today and using past sounds to modernize this and future generations.  Each generation will have their "pioneers" of a trend, regardless of whether or not the idea that changed the sound of that generation was original or not. In the 2005+ category, Missy and Timbaland were the "pioneers" of binging back the modernized, modern dance trend and eventually "washing out" the whole hip hop phase.

They say Adam and Eve are claimed to be the first people; Lets say this is guaranteed true, start back from that time, and time continues on for some years and someone is born today. In any conversation talking about how we could make today and the next generation better for the kids, we wouldn't consider Adam and Eve as their parents, even though they are the ones who were claimed to originally start mankind. We'd call / consider the most recent parents' "the parents", or "pioneers" of this and the next generation of kids, even though they weren't the ones who first and originally started the entire birthing process. The same with a topic discussing how a style can live on from present to future.

So, in this case, it's not about who sampled who. It's about who restarted the entire uptempo trend for this generation's version of mainstream dance, and hypothesizing who could possibly be the ones to take a specific sound in dance (latin freestyle), modernize it, and make that modernized version of it a heavy part of the future trends to come (the same way it was done with urban dance, today). Since we cannot predict whether the hypothesized "future latin freestyle sound" will stem off of this recent new generation dance trend or another dance trend that happens to come years later, we must use the most recent one as the example on how it could unfold or happen. The original pioneers can only "invent" an original, first time, new sound once. The bringing back of a sound with a modern twist can happen multiple times. The point and topic here in this case is "bringing back" a sound, but in a present / future modernized fashion.
 
I'll sum it up with- we're going back to the future.

Back because there's a lot of sampling of 80's dance and future because it has become today's sound.

I think Sexy Back was more of a catalyst for the commercial dance that's on the radio now.It was the summer hit of that year and from an established pop/r&b act.It set the ground work for producers like RedOne to do dancier tracks with the house beat but with a drumk kick. So it's not the predictable 4 on the floor monotonous house beat. Or like my niece calls it the boom boom boom lol.

Missy's Lose Control was more of a breakthrough for the uptempo rhythmic songs that were to come.Akon should get some credit too with his electro planet style beats.It allowed artist like Jay Sean to crossover and even the Far East Movement. Which I'm loving this sample of It's a fine day by Miss Jane.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXhaseNZwus

I would says there's two uptempo styles out there right now. There's the water down house beats with the drum kick and the electro planet style sound.
 
Forgive me for saying it like this, but...

Can't we just allow things to "be" for the pure sake of "being"? I mean, if the "Gen Y" generation think of things today as dance, and not see it from what the elements of the past were, then let it be so that we can SLOWLY merge our "brand" (the core perspective) into it.

It's not about being gutsy, hate to say it...it's about making bucks.
 
Getting back to Katia Nicole's cover of Take me in your arms....It's a cute song for the Disney crowd and hence why the video might give you diabetes.It's not meant for those of us over 30 (or 20 for that matter). In reality,if I was to promote freestyle I would push it onto the rhythmic crowd.The Freestyle sound in the 80's was club but in the 90's it either was more pop or hip hop depending on the artist. The only songs that had some club spins were the progressive house freestyle fusions and that was short lived.

Freestyle has survived without commercial or club play.It's not necessary to always conform to the masses.
 
The whole point in the video was to show how kids could work with and possibly grow a passion for the things their parents / siblings teach them in music. That girl knows the Lil Suzy "take me in your arms" sound. You never know what that girl could do with that knowledge (she will forever have tattooed in her mind) when she gets older. We have a lot of kids thinking hip hop, rap, r&b, and pop music, and now even the new dance pop trend (that every new artist on myspace seems to have jumped on all the sudden). However, you don't see that many kids with freestyle formula ideas in their minds. This girl could someday become a producer, singer, or even both, and will always have that freestyle sound in their subconscious mind (along with the parents / siblings who taught her that sound). As time passes on, she may take in elements of modern music and combine them with that sound in her mind, either consciously or subconsciously. Who knows what could come of it.

Just look at the discussion she inspired on this board so far alone. You never know how far something could go or who might see it and be inspired by it. (I'm sure the poster of the video isn't even aware that this is still getting replies today, a day later from when I originally posted it, or did they even know I'd mention it here yesterday to begin with..).
 
Morpheux said:
Freestyle has survived without commercial or club play.It's not necessary to always conform to the masses.
Click to expand...

Yet if the sound is stuck to the core fans that don't want anything to change or evolve, then it's all moot. The freestyle that HAD survived were the peak stuff of the 80's and 90's. Artists are STILL trying to put new stuff out and I AM trying to do my part, but if the music sounds crappy nor if anyone wants to SUBMIT material to me (I WILL play it if it's good) then really, is the music "surviving"?

Morpheux, you're a good guy and don't think of my posts as "hating". It's more "frustration" on my part with reality mixed in there.
 
I thought it was a cute video.. if I could contact this little girl I would even give it some spins.. The little girl was adorable,,, and the thing I always liked about Lil Suzy,, was unlike the child stars of today,, LIL SUZY actually was always fully dressed and didnt act sexual or ghetto or be underdressed. I hate the parents of kids that let their 10 and 12 year old daughter dress up and act like they are 25. If I ever have a little girl, she will be over protected and dressing in a way that shows skin will not be tolerated until she is 18,, and no dating or BFs will be allowed until she is at least 16 or 17,, My Mom was strict on me,, which though it was a pain at the time,, I turned out to be a polite gentleman and never got invloved with underage sex,,, Drugs,, or Gangs.
 
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