PANDORA - WHY ARE WE EVEN DISCUSSING IT?

[joshzz]

PANDORA is nothing more than a more than a flash in the pan. The only reason it is getting any hype is because those behind it, have deep pockets. They buy noncommercial mentions on shows like David Letterman, etc. Newspapers and even Radio Magazines hype the streaming company because they're being paid and we the unsuspecting public are led to believe it's a major player . .. The masses start listening to it, because everyone wants in on the next big thing......

The truth is, Krispy Kreme started out the same way. A few big players decided they were going to make Krispy Kreme huge. They did exactly what Pandora did.... bought mentions on popularly viewed programs and then all of a sudden everyone was talking about it. In my opinion, the viewing public should not be manipulated like this and all these type actions including product placement in movies for payment should be eliminated but I'll save that discussion for another day.
Pandora will pass .. Actually, it will be replicated a million times over by others doing the same thing. Really, how difficult is it to write a script for an automation system that plays music geared towards what might interest a listener.
Someone can easily make a better Pandora --instead of asking each listener what ONE band they like (which is pretty lame), ask each listener, what are your top 3 favorite bands and then create a playlist using those parameters.

 

[Roger That]

Spoken like someone who obviously has no idea how the technology behind Pandora works.

 

[jackandcoke]

We (the radio junkies on the board) are discussing Pandora because among the thousands of online audio services that have surfaced in the past few years, this is the one that has attracted the most usage--what we in radio call "listening"--with a huge lead over everything else. Last estimate I saw was 48 million users. Check your station's cume for a comparison. If it's 48 million, you're okay.

There's no reason to think that Pandora's technology won't continue to develop. But even now the damn thing (i.e., the Music Genome Project) factors in around 400 musical attributes ("genes") to build individual playlists. As a longtime programmer, I certainly see the parallel between what we've been trying to do on the radio station level for the past 30+ years and what these guys have designed their computer programs to do.

No, I don't think Pandora is going to run radio out of business. But, yeah, they're a serious competitor in the broader field of our chosen craft.

And, hey--as any Southerner can tell you--Krispy Kreme is hardly a "flash in the pan." They've been around since 1937, for crying out loud. Just because you Yankees never saw a Krispy Kreme until five years ago...

 

[quadraphonic]

Why wouldn't we discuss it?
It's current events, and seems kinda important.

 

[OldNumber7]

Pandora is in a great position. We are still in the first wave of the mass upgrade from a cell phone culture to a smart phone culture, and even the geeks and early adapters recognize that Pandora is one of the first practical apps they want. Imagine what happens when the non-geeks get their smart phones and are wondering what to do with them? Yep; they will get Pandora. Pandora was interesting when it was strictly Web based, but it is becoming huge as a portable music app. Thanks to timing and word of mouth, they are way out in front of the potential competitors -- but either way, portable and mobile music apps (i.e. using your phone for passive entertainment, unlike programming it with your own songs) are gonna be tremendous.

 

[TheBigA]

You're the one who brought it up. But my view is they're doing good PR. There was a great article, first at RBR, then picked up by AllAccess, asking if Westergren is a pathological liar. There's no question they have a lot of registrants. So does Twitter. Big deal. There was a time when XM was everyone's darling. Where are they now? I predict the same for Pandora in a few years. Especially once new competitors pop up, which they will. Both Apple and Google want a piece of what Pandora is doing. And I'm hearing lots of others in the wings. So they better get the cash while they can.

 

[joshzz]

You guys are making me question why I'm in radio. I was a computer programmer with one of the largest defense corporations in the world -- I developed serious computer programs.

Maybe I should dust off my credentials, get back in the game, and develop a rival, Pandora program.

I've listened to Pandora and have not been impressed. It's brain or lack thereof, hasn't been right very often in guessing my music tastes. josh

 

[12 In a Row]

PANDORA is nothing more than a more than a flash in the pan. The only reason it is getting any hype is because those behind it, have deep pockets. They buy noncommercial mentions on shows like David Letterman, etc. Newspapers and even Radio Magazines hype the streaming company because they're being paid and we the unsuspecting public are led to believe it's a major player . .. The masses start listening to it, because everyone wants in on the next big thing......

The truth is, Krispy Kreme started out the same way. A few big players decided they were going to make Krispy Kreme huge. They did exactly what Pandora did.... bought mentions on popularly viewed programs and then all of a sudden everyone was talking about it. In my opinion, the viewing public should not be manipulated like this and all these type actions including product placement in movies for payment should be eliminated but I'll save that discussion for another day.
Pandora will pass .. Actually, it will be replicated a million times over by others doing the same thing. Really, how difficult is it to write a script for an automation system that plays music geared towards what might interest a listener.
Someone can easily make a better Pandora --instead of asking each listener what ONE band they like (which is pretty lame), ask each listener, what are your top 3 favorite bands and then create a playlist using those parameters.

???? Are we not in the advertising business? Would you suggest to a client, no paid mentions, no product placement, no buzz, no moving the masses to buy your product? Interesting

 

[SirRoxalot]

Pandora? Just a symptom of radio's illness. Here's the real epidemic that's looming on the horizon:

http://www.buy.com/prod/logitech-squeezebox-radio/q/loc/111/212543844.html

Make sure you scroll all the way down and read about what this thing does...

If you're not prepared to deliver something more than "the most music" (picked by somebody else), good luck.

 

[TheBigA]

If you're not prepared to deliver something more than "the most music" (picked by somebody else), good luck.

The choice then is clear: For radio to succeed, it needs to stop playing music, and go all news/talk/sports. No device does that now. Because when people want music, they don't want interruptions, as evidenced by these devices.

 

[Prais]

Josh,
You and I are polar opposites.

I LOVE Pandora. It works very well for me with alot of "right on" picks. Figure out an RCS "Selector" clone w/Pandora's capabilites, and cheap. Then people will say, "I knew Josh whwen he was pimping useless loser Southern radio properties, and went on to knock over Selector."

I'm happy that you and I both love the Lord.

 

[SirRoxalot]

If you're not prepared to deliver something more than "the most music" (picked by somebody else), good luck.

The choice then is clear: For radio to succeed, it needs to stop playing music, and go all news/talk/sports. No device does that now. Because when people want music, they don't want interruptions, as evidenced by these devices.

No, it's been amply demostrated in the past that SOME people want only music, and they've rarely been primary consumers of radio. The majority of people want MORE than music. They want a connection, a shared experience, and context for the music. They appreciate a "flow" decided by humans with taste, not just computers with a human-produced program. They also appreciate being introduced to new music IF it's done effectively and with context.

Why does talk radio flourish? Because it's the last bastion of talented humans relating to listeners on the radio.

 

[radioboy]

I haven't done a lot of listening to Pandora, but started listening again after seeing this thread. Matter of fact, I'm listening right now.

The picks for me are right on, and because I entered some classic country artists, I'm hearing some older songs that I haven't heard in a while (and don't own.)

I notice a lot on these boards that the majority of people touting radio are in the biz. The listeners don't seem to be.

I started my internet station in 2001. I was working for a station that became a Christian talker and I found myself nodding off at the control board. I started my station to have something to listen to to fend off some of the boredom of those long hours, especially since it was a standalone AM with no one else there.

Since 2001 I've only listened to over the air radio while traveling, and sometimes, not even then. There are a few stations that I like. Unfortunately, none of them are in Tallahassee.

KWKH, with Elaine in the morning, is an example of terrestrial radio that I like. I have to listen via the internet for that.

 

[12 In a Row]

If you're not prepared to deliver something more than "the most music" (picked by somebody else), good luck.

The choice then is clear: For radio to succeed, it needs to stop playing music, and go all news/talk/sports. No device does that now. Because when people want music, they don't want interruptions, as evidenced by these devices.

No, it's been amply demostrated in the past that SOME people want only music, and they've rarely been primary consumers of radio. The majority of people want MORE than music. They want a connection, a shared experience, and context for the music. They appreciate a "flow" decided by humans with taste, not just computers with a human-produced program. They also appreciate being introduced to new music IF it's done effectively and with context.

Why does talk radio flourish? Because it's the last bastion of talented humans relating to listeners on the radio.

I can think of 3 former music d.j.'s that are making 100X+ more money since moving over to talk radio.
Howard, Imus and Rush. Goes to show, if you're really talented, put away your favorite tunes entertain and cash those LARGE checks.

 

[Carmine5]

I've listened to Pandora a few times on my Blackberry and found myself skipping more songs than listening. Of course, that is part of the charm of it, not having to wait while a song you hate finishes.

But traditional radio has it's strengths also, the point-to-multipoint advantage of terrestrial broadcasting as well as not having to pay those burdensome royalty fees. I understand that about 45% of the money Pandora takes in goes toward to paying royalties. That must hurt. Plus radio can be local with local personalities, weather and news--something a national service like Pandora is incapable of doing (at least for now).

An old editor-in-chief of a successful magazine once said to me, "My magazine succeeds because I know my readers and I give them what they want." It's obvious advice but still good and can be applied to any media. To me if a PD or station owner knows his/her listener and can 'give them what they want' I think it is entirely possible to compete with the Pandoras of our industry, even with a music format.

c5

 

[adma]

Why does talk radio flourish? Because it's the last bastion of talented humans relating to listeners on the radio.

Which, given the nature of such "talented humans" and listeners, is like saying: "Why did grindhouses and XXX cinemas flourish in the 1970s? Because it was the last bastion of talented film programmers relating to the neighbourhood movie house marketplace."

 

[SirRoxalot]

Why does talk radio flourish? Because it's the last bastion of talented humans relating to listeners on the radio.

Which, given the nature of such "talented humans" and listeners, is like saying: "Why did grindhouses and XXX cinemas flourish in the 1970s? Because it was the last bastion of talented film programmers relating to the neighbourhood movie house marketplace."

Yet, strangely, movies invested in talent and technology, and produced quality programming that's bigger than every. See anybody in radio doing that these days?

 

[adma]

Yet, strangely, movies invested in talent and technology, and produced quality programming that's bigger than every. See anybody in radio doing that these days?

Though keep in mind the "talent" base being worked from. You don't expect the equivalent of Scorsese or Spielberg emerging from the realm of Rush and Hannity. From NPR, maybe...

 

[Fieldtech1]

Pandora does have the groundwork layed to be huge. Its on PCs, its now available on most Smartphones, and now its becoming a mainstream feature on many LCD TVs and Bluray Players. One of my fellow co-workers uses it in his vehicle as an alternative to XM, or FM, for tht matter.

 

[bossbill]

I'm flashing back on the last major storm in our area. Power was out for days, cell providers were down, no Comcast internet, etc. But terrestrial radio stations were on the air providing information to those who were in their cars, had battery radios or power.

Pandora and the gazillions of internet stations not only weren't providing any help, they were also not available to most people.

Do we want to lose that?