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PHILADELPHIA ARBITRON PPM RATINGS RELEASED: JULY 2010
- Thread starter pjc1961
- Start date
DToTheJ said:Here's something interesting: Both WIP and WPEN-FM have seen their ratings and cume drop dramatically over the last two months. Meanwhile, WPEN-AM's rating and cume have increased over the same period. Time to bring back "Now 97.5"?
No, the Fanatic being on the FM band is a smart place to be. It depends how someone is identifying the station in their Arbitron diary. I'd bet some of that crediting should probably had been on the FM.
WIP will end up on FM eventually, or KYW. One of those stations will eventually be on 94.1.
I would love to see KYW on 41.1 HD-1
Seltzer said:
No it doesn't. Hasn't since 2007.
However, the dramatic drop you see from WPEN-FM is because the ratings listed for May are a typo from radio-info. You'll notice that the ratings for WPEN-FM and WBEN are exactly the same. Check the May thread on this board for the real WPEN ratings for that month. They were posted there but never corrected on the chart. The real May ratings are more in line with what you see in June and July.
The ratings on WPEN-FM and AM combined are at the same 1.8 they've been since the FM launch. That's a full point lower than the combo of Now 97.5 and WPEN-AM were pulling before.
Seltzer said:
As we've discussed before, there is no reason whatsoever to blow up a successful AM station to put it on FM.
I
imhomerjay
Guest
How much more 'crushed' could the Fanatic be at the moment?
That said, though, how often did we hear WIP enjoyed success by being the only, er, game in town, the short lived "GMP" 1210 notwithstanding? So here they have a competitor taking a more sports-centric approach and available on both AM & FM. Looks like people continue to choose WIP. Like 'em or hate 'em, they're doing something mostly right. The Fanatic has a bright spot in the afternoon where they seem to be a genuine, um, player, but that's about it so far.
That said, though, how often did we hear WIP enjoyed success by being the only, er, game in town, the short lived "GMP" 1210 notwithstanding? So here they have a competitor taking a more sports-centric approach and available on both AM & FM. Looks like people continue to choose WIP. Like 'em or hate 'em, they're doing something mostly right. The Fanatic has a bright spot in the afternoon where they seem to be a genuine, um, player, but that's about it so far.
As I've said before, the way for WIP to improve its reach is not to move it to FM. It's to move it to 1210 and improve that station's signal to its full FCC-licensed potential. It could be a powerhouse like WFAN and WCBS. Then put the syndicated talk, that people in the outer reaches of the area can hear on other stations, on 610.
We've said it before and we'll say it again, each time the atrocious PPM's are released in the Phila market, until Greater Media stops being cheap and actually decides to spend some money, they will NEVER have any success against the long established sports-talk station in the market. Doing something half ass gets you half ass results. In a market in which people do not like change (and that's another story), of course the format station that's been around since 1987 is not going to be challenged by a cheap imitation. You need a mix of major professional sports teams rights, and COMPELLING personalities throughout the day to even have a chance to try an compete. Greater Media is simply not spending the money to adequately compete in this space. Some may argue the PPM is better than diaries, but it's drive-by measurement that's having a negative effect on listener numbers on talk formats around the country.
It's not like Greater Media isn't spending money - they are, in markets such as Detroit, where both of their live-and-local, round-the-clock rock stations are both in the Top 5. It makes me question their commitment to "The Fanatic" long-term - then again, I believe they have to carry some ESPN Radio programming, so their hands may be a little tied in that regard.
DtotheJ, It's a relative term as to what is defined as "spending money" in other markets, but they are not doing it for The Fanatic in Philly, and in general, GM does not have a solid reputation for spending money, in pockets yes, but not generally. In fact, they still trail CBS in Detroit despite "spending money," granted two of the stations are doing well. Last I looked GM was also still seeking a market manager in Detroit with John Fullam doubling up from Philly, that's saving a market manager's salary. They choose to carry ESPN in morning drive on the FM station instead of only the AM station, and they will never amount to anything without a local morning drive program to compete with the longtime format station. Not that GM would pay the same kind of money to on-air talent as the longtime station, but with the same morning drive ESPN programming available on multiple other platforms, it simply doesn't make sense if you hope to make a dent.
As much as I agree with many of the peoples thought on the Mike and Mike show, I dont think there is a local morning show that will really make a difference. You're not going to bring in a show from another city that Philly fans are going to really relate to or give a chance, there isnt anyone currently in town that is worth putting on in mornings. That being said, Mike and Mike is really the best your going to do.
Now, if your not spending the money in morning drive, you should be able to find much better midday talent. I mean this is Philadelphia...
The question is...is there any talent locally at 610, 97.5, 97.3 that is not being used enough that should be in a FT role, because we all know that someone from another market won't work in Philly.
Now, if your not spending the money in morning drive, you should be able to find much better midday talent. I mean this is Philadelphia...
The question is...is there any talent locally at 610, 97.5, 97.3 that is not being used enough that should be in a FT role, because we all know that someone from another market won't work in Philly.
Interesting given the discussion of talk programming on FM in Philadelphia that Cox has decided to simulcast WSB Atlanta on an FM signal. The radio/TV columnist from the Atlanta Journal Constitution says the reason was demographics: not enough people under 40 were listening to WSB anymore because it was only on AM. And WSB is at 750 with 50,000 watts -- so it's not a matter of an overall poor AM signal.
WSB has been getting 5.5-6.0 6+, good enough for as high as third in the market. But, as is often mentioned on these boards, those numbers mean very little. It's 25-49/54 that matters.
And WSB's closest commercial talk competitor was only getting 1.2-1.6. The FM Cox blew up was getting 3.2-3.8, good for about 15th in the ratings.
It's been asked why CBS would put WIP, KYW or WPHT on 94.1's main channel. Two reasons: 1) AM getting more and more difficult to receive due to various interference factors and 2) More difficult to get listeners under age 40 on AM.
Does anyone know how KYW and WPHT do in the money demos of 25-54? It's been reported WIP does very well in men 25-54. And how about revenue? Has KYW's or WPHT's ad revenue been declining?
Something "fun" to think about: How would KYW change its decades-old jingle if it were to move to FM?
WSB has been getting 5.5-6.0 6+, good enough for as high as third in the market. But, as is often mentioned on these boards, those numbers mean very little. It's 25-49/54 that matters.
And WSB's closest commercial talk competitor was only getting 1.2-1.6. The FM Cox blew up was getting 3.2-3.8, good for about 15th in the ratings.
It's been asked why CBS would put WIP, KYW or WPHT on 94.1's main channel. Two reasons: 1) AM getting more and more difficult to receive due to various interference factors and 2) More difficult to get listeners under age 40 on AM.
Does anyone know how KYW and WPHT do in the money demos of 25-54? It's been reported WIP does very well in men 25-54. And how about revenue? Has KYW's or WPHT's ad revenue been declining?
Something "fun" to think about: How would KYW change its decades-old jingle if it were to move to FM?
radiophiler said:
Demographics are why the move to FM will happen eventually. CBS has three possibilities:
1. Move WPHT to 94.1. It may make more sense for the general interest talk format, which will draw more listeners than Sports Talk, to the FM dial. Smerconish, Beck, Rush, and Hannity on FM would be a huge hit. Continue to make 94.1 the home for Eagles Football.
2. Move WIP Sportstalk to 1210. Keep the Phillies here, along with Sixers and Flyers. It would give the station 50,000 watts on AM for out of town Philly sports fans to enjoy.
3. Leave KYW as it is
4. Turn WIP into the Liberal talk station and sports spillover conflict station. That way, you'd never have to use OGL as a place for sports. Carry Temple or Villanova hoops on this station.
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