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philly oldies stations force fed us for years

R

RunWithScissors

Guest
I usually tune in XM 60's now and then to get a kick out of the top 6 of the day and how you never heard those gems on the Philly oldies dial. Today in 1964 it was 6-Beach Boys, 5-4 Seasons, 4-Beatles, 3-Beatles, 2-Beatles and number one today in 1964, you guessed it the Beatles. When you heard the oldies on WPGR, WFIL, WPEN, WIOQ and the dead horse WOGL its like this music never existed. These so called oldies stations constantly fed the listener the same diet of Motown, Soul, R&B and Doo Wop, which was not as popular as the BI and Surf sounds, but these one-sided PD's and soul jocks would never make you think it. That is one reason most oldies stations flopped big time in the Philly market. One bright spot was WCAU-FM which did play all the good songs, not just one brand, thanks to the greatest PD in the universe, Jim Nettleton.
 
Gee, another White music versus Black music post recounting the Great Philadelphia Radio Conspiracy to keep White music off the airwaves.

Philadelphia is one of the few major and large markets that still have an Oldies station.

"Dead horse" WOGL is "bright spot" WCAU-FM. Go figure.

Oldies did not die on WPEN and WFIL. Music on AM radio died.

You've got XM. Why do you care anyway, except as another excuse for a racially motivated rant? (I can understand how Rizzo appeals to you.)
 
Huh? ???

I travel far too often and can attest that WOGL is one of the very best surviving "big market" oldies stations. There aren't many left in the top 20 markets. Quit whining - it's without merit.

Or, better yet, move to Boston where you can hear James Taylor 23 times a day on WODS, WROR and others. In fact, as long as you avoid 94.5, you don't have to listen to anything *blacker* than Jimi Hendrix. If that's what you like, great! Frankly, I find radio in that market to be mind-numbingly dull and living there helped me to discover talk radio.

There are many things that I don't like here in Philly, but I'd have to say that the choices available on the radio (am and fm) are better than in most places. You just don't appreciate what you have here.
 
Due to the fact my defense responses are always deleted by the operator and FF's and others always stay put, will allow me to be brief. Philly radio is far from the best, no Active, Alternative, Hard Metal, Standards, etc., which caters to a certain audiance, which is severely underserved. If you embrace urban you are in luck but otherwise not so, the Philly dial caters to one audiance, just like you may complain about Boston catering to one special listener. nuff said!!!
 
wogl is okay , but was much better when they were "allowed" to play late 50's and early 60's ...except for certain specialty shows , mostly '62 and back is gone .....

boy o boy , when 98.1 let hy lit and subsequently later on jim nettleton do earlier years on "the top 20 countdown" , it was awesome ... not knocking bob charger , but his hands are tied , with what years he can do , whether he is liked or not
 
Today in 1964 it was 6-Beach Boys, 5-4 Seasons, 4-Beatles, 3-Beatles, 2-Beatles and number one today in 1964, you guessed it the Beatles.

That's because 1964 was the year for The Beatles. Chuck Berry, Fats Domino, Little Richard, Frankie Lymon, etc. were fast becoming a thing of the past. So were Frankie Avalon, Bobby Rydell, and Chubby Checker. Ricky Nelson's last top ten hit of the 60's peaked during the same month that The Beatles debuted in the states. Roy Orbison scored a number one tune with Pretty Woman that same year, but his career as a hit maker except for a hand full of minor hits in '65 and '66 was over until '88 with The Traveling Wilburys.

Mainstream Motown popularity was in its infancy in 1964, and The Phil Spectre Wall Of Sound (Ronettes, Darlene Love, Crystals, Bobb B. Soxx & The Blue Jeans, etc.) stopped cranking out major players toward the end of '63 immediately preceding the beginning of The Beatles in '64. The Shirelles and had a couple of left over hits from 1963, and Steve Caldwell of The Orlons believes that their tune "Knock Knock" would have been their next hit in early '64 if Ed Sullivan hadn't shown the Lads of Liverpool on his show on that infamous night.

The major American acts that were able to sustain their popularity in the states at that time were The Four Seasons and The Beach Boys. That's why both of those acts were in the top ten during this week. Of course there were many other American musicians who charted in 1964 and in the next couple of years, but people were looking for a new sound, and The Beatles were it. This is why it should come as no surprise that The Beatles had that many hits in the top five 43 years ago.

When you heard the oldies on WPGR, WFIL, WPEN, WIOQ and the dead horse WOGL its like this music never existed.

It's interesting that you've listed all of these stations without clarifying the distinct differences and time periods.

WPGR: 1540 did play The Beatles during their short-lived "Beatles and Motown" experiment, but admitedly it was in 1983 when that station was still WRCP. I wouldn't put WPGR and "league" in the same sentence because the station rarely if ever even showed up in the ratings. But that station was unlike any other in Philly. They covered a lot of years with their music, but you're right, they focused on what has become known as "real oldies," and contrasted that sound by skipping over The Beatles and The Beach Boys by playing lots of Motown, Northern Soul, and exclusive Philly hits of the late 60's and early 70's. While they didn't play The Beach Boys (that I remember) for some reason they found it appropriate to subject us to The Four Seasons about once an hour. I never understood that.

WFIL: Before or after the comeback? Hopefully you aren't suggesting that WFIL never played The Beatles. Long John Wade played the Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club album cut by cut and commented on each track one by one back in the 60's. I'm no expert on WFIL, but I do know that they played the big hits of the 60's and 70's (including The Beatles) when the music was new and also during the 80's when they returned. They also played the long version of "Light My Fire," which I don't think WOGL has ever done during its entire time on the air.

WPEN: Again. Before or after? 1970's or 2004 and 2005? Both time periods were distinct for 950, and while I don't know too much about their playlist in the 70's, during their recent "real oldies" days, they premiered Beatles-free but actually did end up playing the Fab Four during their last few months. So I fail to see why you say that WPEN never played The Beatles. One could argue that by playing The Beatles they were grasping for air during their last few weeks, but WOGL played that group in crisp and clear FM Stereo. So what was the point?

WIOQ: Who? What? You mean Solid Gold 102? I think my last bowel movement lasted longer than that station. Maybe you're talking about WIOQ in the 70's. That station was far from an oldies station back then. It was a progressive album rock station. But it just so happens that "Breakfast with The Beatles" premiered on WIOQ in 1976. So again I fail to see why you say that WIOQ never played The Beatles.

Last but not least...the dead horse. Like them or not (and I don't) come on, they play The Beatles, Beach Boys, and Four Seasons. Of course the latter two aren't featured as they were ten years ago, but that's because WOGL has turned into a steady diet of horribly loud classic hits and disco. But if you stumble onto the station by accident once in a while you will hear The Beatles.

What's interesting about this discussion is that lately on this forum, oldies radio has centered around WIBG. Reading about that station is interesting and informative, but it's intriguing that we've forgotten the late 80's and early 90's. Those were Philly's best radio years IMHO. There was plenty of rock on MMR and YSP, a steady dose of easy listening on Kiss and EZ, and who could forget the short span of months during which Philly had 5 oldies stations!

Oldies 98
Oldies 1210
WFIL
Solid Gold 102
WPGR

And at the time, even 98.1 was decent. They actually played "At The Hop" and the original version of that song, called "Do The Bop" back to back in the middle of the day during the week. What's funny though, is that back then, everyone complained about WOGL as they do today. Maybe it's because we had all those other stations to listen to. Anyone remember 50's Friday with Tommy McCarthy on Oldies 1210? Good luck finding anyone who listens to Woggle because they actually like the station, but how many of us would like to have its playlist of the late 80's and early 90's on the air today?
 
Oldies 1210 never co-existed with WFIL or Solid Gold 102, chronologically...

I'll try to add more thoughts when I get home tonight...
 
oldies 1210 WOGL was the best am oldies station in philly.and oldies 98.1 WOGL was the best on the fm.NOW oldies 1210 WOGL is off the air.and oldies ? 98.1 WOGL is not anything worth my time anymore.I now listen to Sirius gold.and I get all the 50's you could ever ask for!!!.
 
Oldies 1210 never co-existed with WFIL or Solid Gold 102, chronologically...

I don't remember the exact dates during which all of those stations existed. I don't doubt you're correct about Oldies 1210's time period. What I meant by that "span of months" was the entire time period of the very late 80's and early 90's during which all of those stations existed, even if they weren't all on the air at the same time.

If I remember correctly, Oldies 1210 didn't debut until about 1990 or '91, while WFIL was already gone by '89 or early '90. (I think)

I'll try to add more thoughts when I get home tonight...

I posted some of what I could remember about all of those stations in a short period of time this evening, but it would be great to hear from others about their thoughts and perspectives, and about the history of these four of five stations during this period in Philly radio.
 
Holy Smoke...don't forget Ron Diamond on wifi 92. The Geat on 1340, 1310 1370 or where ever he could buy time. This is an intelligent thread. But I think the music was also forcefed by the record companies themselves. Those trips, cars, appliances, "Christmas Wish" goodies and even the 'Name It And Claim It" prizes had a price. Every PD "steers" the ship his way.
 
Holy Smoke...don't forget Ron Diamond on wifi 92.

Well that was definitely before the time period that I mentioned of the late 80's and early 90's, but Ron Diamond played some great music. I have a tape of an interview he did with the late Mike Venditti on WNJC about 10 years ago. Was an interesting and informative interview.

Diamond used to play Mary Wells' "What's Easy For Two Is So Hard (To Be Done By One)." That record barely made the top 30 in 1964. Wells was the first person to have a Number 1 record (My Guy) on Motown.

She beat John, Paul, George, and Ringo in April of that year for the Number 1 spot. They had to settle for the Number 2 spot with "Do You Want To Know A Secret." The following month, they placed "Love Me Do" at Number 1 and aside from a couple of minor hits with Marvin Gaye, Mary Wells was never seen again on the charts.

Just another act to fall by the wayside after the debut of The Beatles.
 
Pilly oldies stations, HD to the rescue

Obviously somebodys not a fan of soul, R&B, or doo wop. For whatever reason, it really doesn't matter. To each his own. I hope the the color of the performer is not steering this post. The fact is, in the 1960's the radio station owners, like the rest of the country made decisions based on their personal feelings and persuasions, and therefore attempted to censure the radio content. Black music was heavily scrutenized for "radical undertones". If you only had any idea of what was not played in the name of what was best for, "in the public's interest".

WOGL has a fair share of the market in Philadelphia. Are you surprised to know that its fan base is mostly white? WOGL has shifted into the seventies oldies now. This should not be a surprise since Philadelphia produced some of the biggest hits of the seventies, ever hear of Gamble and Huff, Thom Bell, Philly International, Teddy Pendergrass, The Intruders, McFadden and Whitehead. The list goes on and on. Radio stations make money by selling airtime to advertisers. The price they charge is based on their ratings. Hence the stations try to please a large number of fans they hope will tune in to them every day. If you play the wrong songs people get their dial working and find something else to listen to. I am not trying to insult anyones intelligence, but we are talking Philly here aren't we. Do you realize the significance of Philadelphia music. Were talking LARGE!

2006, HD comes to the rescue. There are stations playing album oriented rock, alternative rock, heavy metal, and all types of alternative music on their HD2 and HD3 streams. I am not saying that the Beetles have been lowered to the alternative music genre, they do belong on mainstream channels. They like a lot of music previously mentioned have made a significant impact on the sound of "American" music.

I tune in from Lancaster, and desire the selections you have in Philadephia. You see central Pennsylvania is not as open minded as some of those stations you talked about in the 1960s, get my drift? I really enjoy the selections offered by more liberal urban stations. HD with its multi-channel, multi-format system has given life to many of the forgotten formats of the 70s. I dread to think of the day when rap will be an oldies format. But to each his own.
 
From somewhere up higher in this chain is the name Mary Wells. You Beat Me To The Punch, My Guy, Two Lovers, The One Who Really Loves You. Great stuff.

Unless I'm missing something, the beef against WOGL is S O U N D. When I used to turn it on it didn't sound like 60's radio that I heard in the 60's. You know, I mean if you were alive in the 60's you've gotta remember clearly songs like Lies (The Knickerbockers), Liar Liar (Castaways), Doubleshot Of My Baby's Love (Swinging Medallions), The Rain, The Park and Other Things (Cowsills. Misknown by many as I Love The Flower Girl), Wipeout (Safaris), Sugar Shack (Johnny Horton & The Fireballs), Heart Full Of Soul (Yardbirds), Don't Sleep In The Subway (Petula Clark), Kind Of A Drag (Buckinghams), Ain't Got Nothin Yet (Blues Magoos). Beau Brummels, Jan & Dean, Chad & Jeremy, Freddie and the Dreamers, Dusty Springfield, Clarence Carter and literally hundreds of other songs and artists. They just spew out of my memory with no effort.

Songs that peaked inside the Top 10 got there for a reason. People like them. Heck, the songs I mentioned by title, I bet just about all of them peaked inside the top 10. WOGL- Best of the 60s & 70s? Not a chance and not a clue.
 
2006, HD comes to the rescue. There are stations playing album oriented rock, alternative rock, heavy metal, and all types of alternative music on their HD2 and HD3 streams.

LOL LOL LOL (and I don't use the overused "LOL" very frequently)... "HD to the rescue!" I can see it now... A "superhero" in goofy Superman-like tights with the "HD" logo on his chest, flying around trying to sell literally the unsalable...

HD with its multi-channel, multi-format system has given life to many of the forgotten formats of the 70s.

Sorry, but the "day late, dollar short" analogy would be quite the understatement... XM and Sirius did it years before, and better... Before that, MusicChoice, DMX, etc. likewise took care of this-- and had millions more takers... Exactly what kind of "life" can be found on these channels? Is there even one live voice on a Philadelphia "HD"-only stream?

Songs that peaked inside the Top 10 got there for a reason. People like them.

Sorry, but radio and record companies were in bed with each other just as much back then, if not more... The Internet today has empowered millions to actually speak out for and against music (and everything else)... I have always believed most "hits" were hits because the masses were pretty much told what to like... To say hits were hits because "people liked them" is, to me, quite naive...

"Funny Face" peaked at number five early in '73, following almost four months on the charts... Would you want to hear that on WOGL today?

You listed some great records and artists there, some of which used to be on WOGL but aren't anymore of course... While I know I would enjoy a "real" playlist on that station, I fully understand why it does what it does... The masses are musically stupid; they're not like you and I... Sure, from time to time you'll encounter someone who really knows and appreciates a wide variety of stuff, but for the most part the average 47-year-old woman will hear "Brown Eyed Girl" for the 1500th time and love all three minutes of it...

Fifty years ago, Todd Storz said, "People don't know what they like-- they like what they know." It was true then, and it's just as valid today.

As predictably boring and unlistenable as I personally find WOGL, it's hard for us music and radio geeks to argue with its success. As the great Jim Nettleton said on the Racket a few months back, there certainly would have been a way for that station to have maintained its large cume while not driving away folks like us (who grew weary of the artificially high dose of Motown, etc.) but there's really no incentive for the station to do any of this... I know I'm not alone in questioning CBS Radio's committment to the station and format in the first place... Fortunately I carry 31,000 songs with me every night, have broadband throughout my home and office, and have access to both XM Satellite Radio and Sirius. What's WOGL? I don't think I've listened for more than ten minutes straight since Hy Lit did his last program there. And even then, Hyski was one of the few shows I'd go out of my way to catch on that frequency.
 
Sam Lit said:
Speaking of ……..I think we actually play ‘Donna Fargo’ now and then. Yup, I’m sure of it.

Sam:

You play something I hate....that AM version of 'Hair' by the Cowsills, that has the intro all chopped up. Can't you play the whole song? It's the only thing you do wrong, IMHO.
 
Sam Lit said:
Ok. Just added the full version, as per request. Sorry ‘bout those edits. Next play, 6:00 pm EDT. today.

Thanks, Sam!! Now I have to get the PC fixed! It crapped out last week, and I can't listen to your stream on my iMac for some unknown reason.

I get a great deal of listening enjoyment from hylitradio.com. I hope your dad's health is holding up.
 
Sam Lit said:
Thanks Don. As soon as he get back from his morning swim, I’ll ask him.

Says it all! :) I didn't grow up with Hyski, but got turned on to him (and, you!) on WKXW in the eighties! How the technology has changed, yet the music lives.
 
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