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When I lived in Tulsa in the 70's, I remember WHB 710 and WDAF 610 being listenable all day, especially in the wintertime. WIBW 580 in Topeka was also there. I have a vague recollection of hearing KFAB during the day as well.

In the other direction, WBAP 820 and KRLD could also be heard during the day, with the Dallas 570 sometimes there.
 
DXBob said:
Yes! WSCR is a regular cold day, winter daytime skywave regular here in Overland Park as is WBBM. Distance is actually 406 miles...

Bob
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That is not necessarily skywave. The main difference between Summer and Winter for the AM band is the high vs. low noise levels. The signal is the same, but in Summer the noise masks it.

My rule was "if you can hear it day after day in deep winter, it's groundwave". Skywave tends to vary from day to day, week to week.
 
There are also Summer Winter Differences in FI, which I demonstrated with an actual field strength meter that was loaned to me, in several locations in Michigan. They can be dramatic, like a ratio of 3-4 times in Winter over Summer. It seems more cold related than snow or rain related. I think it was Mr. Richard Arsenault in New Jersey, possibly someone else, who had an article about it. There was a huge difference in WMTR 1250 and WABC 770 at the RL in the course of a day when it warmed up dramatically.
 
Good DX on the remote receivers in the Arctic and Hawaii tonight. The Alaskans have been strong on both. On the Arctic big signals from 660 Calgary, and 1130 Vancouver fighting it out with Minneapolis. The Alaskans are strong in Hawaii as KNOM and KKOH fighting it out on 780. WGN was in on the Hawaiian. KSL usually a regular with a decent signal into Hawaii tonight.
 
Schroedingers Cat said:
There are also Summer Winter Differences in FI, which I demonstrated with an actual field strength meter that was loaned to me, in several locations in Michigan. They can be dramatic, like a ratio of 3-4 times in Winter over Summer. It seems more cold related than snow or rain related. I think it was Mr. Richard Arsenault in New Jersey, possibly someone else, who had an article about it. There was a huge difference in WMTR 1250 and WABC 770 at the RL in the course of a day when it warmed up dramatically.
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Having never done engineering at a station where there was a "winter" season, I did not know that.

But why do you suppose, then, that stations and the FCC don't recognize this? If I was building a station, I'd do ground conductivity studies to supplement the FCC tables in July and August and petition for higher power!
 
DavidEduardo said:


That is not necessarily skywave. The main difference between Summer and Winter for the AM band is the high vs. low noise levels. The signal is the same, but in Summer the noise masks it.

My rule was "if you can hear it day after day in deep winter, it's groundwave". Skywave tends to vary from day to day, week to week.
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Thank you for your comment David! Reception of both WSCR and WBBM is at best sporadic here in winter and appears to be confined to the coldest days often after we have received a fresh snow cover. We had 6.5" of snow here on Sunday and sure enough, WSCR was logged earlier this week. We also enjoy warmer weather here in winter with highs in the 60s and I have never logged WSCR or WBBM on those days at midday. I have tried.

Bob
 
The difference in FI between summer and winter probably has something to do with tropoducting. According to wikipedia, tropoducting exists at all frequencies to some extent.
My favorite daytime DX in the winter is WFLI (1070) Chattanooga, about 100 miles from here. They're an oldies station, which we don't have here in Atlanta.
They seem to be doing well selling spots. But who knows, they might be going for a dollar-a-holler.
 
I guess that engineers knew this for years and did indeed use it to their advantage. It seems like I talked to Richard Arsenault about it on the phone once.

The FCC tried to deny it years ago but numerous studies forced them to quietly agree. They had fined stations for not keeping their Monitor Points in limits, and had to try to defend it against all evidence.

I wish I could find that article. Maybe David could direct us as to where we might look on his site.

There have been numerous attempts to explain it. One was that the leaves were off the trees, which DOES definitely affect VHF and UHF propagation increasingly with frequency.
 
DXBob said:
Thank you for your comment David! Reception of both WSCR and WBBM is at best sporadic here in winter and appears to be confined to the coldest days often after we have received a fresh snow cover. We had 6.5" of snow here on Sunday and sure enough, WSCR was logged earlier this week. We also enjoy warmer weather here in winter with highs in the 60s and I have never logged WSCR or WBBM on those days at midday. I have tried.

Bob
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Schroedinger's Cat makes a valid point as well.

When I DXed from NE Ohio, the paths which were chilly or downright cold seemed to perform the best in winter. From that location, they were generally east-west paths, and winter reception of things like 600 KSJB in Jamestown or 1270 KTFI or 1370 in Montana or even 1410 in Wyoming were easy and common. In summer, between the noise and the warmer weather, those were improbable.

And the best months for N/S reception, like Venezuela, Ecuador, Colombia, Peru, Chile, Uruguay and Argentina were those times between late fall and early winter and late winter and early spring.

Oddly, when I was in Puerto Rico from the 70's to the 90's, paths to the west were never particularly good, but far north (New England, Ontario, Québec) and deep south (Paraguay, Uruguay, Arbentina, Brazil) were often enhanced in Spring and Fall (their Fall and Spring, at least in the deeper reaches of the Southern Cone).

I'm surprised that there are not more papers about this.
 
David, there was a mystery I noticed involving daytime AM DXing in Florida that maybe you can explain.

When I would go over to the Gulf to hear signals from other parts of the Gulf coast over the salt water path, I noticed that some Florida stations whose signals were on a land path were always a lot stronger on the barrier island than they were back in Tampa.

WQAM, WIOD, WYGM, for example, were barely audible in Tampa but much stronger and easily listenable out at Honeymoon Island.

I know the high conductivity of the sea water helps signals travel better across that path but how does only a couple miles of salt water of an inlet or part of the bay cause a much better signal that's coming from what's completely a land path until it reaches that small path of water?

It seems to defy the laws of physics.

If a signal is weak to begin with, how can the water boost the signal strength?
 
KCJJ dominating 1630khz tonight.. im only 40 miles away from KRND "Fox Farm"... theyre on the air but in my professional opinion, just opinion.. they arent running full power and somethings funky with their tower.. they should be alot stronger for me in laramie day and night than they are
 
hawaiigar said:
David, there was a mystery I noticed involving daytime AM DXing in Florida that maybe you can explain.

When I would go over to the Gulf to hear signals from other parts of the Gulf coast over the salt water path, I noticed that some Florida stations whose signals were on a land path were always a lot stronger on the barrier island than they were back in Tampa.

WQAM, WIOD, WYGM, for example, were barely audible in Tampa but much stronger and easily listenable out at Honeymoon Island.

I know the high conductivity of the sea water helps signals travel better across that path but how does only a couple miles of salt water of an inlet or part of the bay cause a much better signal that's coming from what's completely a land path until it reaches that small path of water?

It seems to defy the laws of physics.

If a signal is weak to begin with, how can the water boost the signal strength?
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Gar, have you heard WBBM this season? I've been listening on the Hawaii SDR and I've heard WGN several times, but no WBBM. The reason I ask is that last year WBBM came in regularly to Hawaii. Maybe it's a coincidence, but now that they are on a different tower I have not heard them this season.
 
SomeRadioGuy said:
KCJJ dominating 1630khz tonight.. im only 40 miles away from KRND "Fox Farm"... theyre on the air but in my professional opinion, just opinion.. they arent running full power and somethings funky with their tower.. they should be alot stronger for me in laramie day and night than they are
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KCJJ does get out. I've heard them many times on the Arctic receiver and several European receivers.
 
Gar, have you heard WBBM this season? I've been listening on the Hawaii SDR and I've heard WGN several times, but no WBBM. The reason I ask is that last year WBBM came in regularly to Hawaii. Maybe it's a coincidence, but now that they are on a different tower I have not heard them this season.
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Yeah, last night for a short time on the Maui SDR WBBM was the dominant station.

Within less than 10 minutes, KKOH was back in control and strong too.
 
hawaiigar said:
Yeah, last night for a short time on the Maui SDR WBBM was the dominant station.

Within less than 10 minutes, KKOH was back in control and strong too.
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I guess it's just when I'm listening. I hear either KKOH or KNOM on the Oahu receiver. Last year KKOH was stronger, but WBBM would come up now and then. Now I hear KNOM a lot along with other Alaskan stations. Thanks
 
Orange County, TX-after trying for some time, this morning around 5:12 CST I was able to pull in CHHA from Toronto. The program was in English altho their website indicates they are a Spanish language station. Are they still Spanish? Reception was confirmed by the on air talent using their calls for a station promo.
 
WCJ said:
Orange County, TX-after trying for some time, this morning around 5:12 CST I was able to pull in CHHA from Toronto. The program was in English altho their website indicates they are a Spanish language station. Are they still Spanish? Reception was confirmed by the on air talent using their calls for a station promo.
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CHHA really gets out. I've heard it on the Arctic SDR once or twice. And, yes, CHHA is basically Spanish. But it's also brokered, so you could occasionally hear English or something else. Canada doesn't have as high a percentage of Hispanic population as we do, but Toronto is a very diverse city and the CRTC seems to make a concerted effort to accomodate everybody in the granting of broadcast licensees.
 
Yesterday, around Sunset, I was tuning around the AM dial while waiting in a parking lot (a surprisingly quiet location by today's standards). I heard Oldies in the background on 1180 under WHAM. I heard the call with a W, a long A sound that sounded like K, and two long E sounds. Checked 1180 AM on Wikipedia on my phone, and the only match was WKCE 1180 Knoxville, TN. Checked their website and the list of songs recently played matched. It's 10 kw-D and 2.6 kW-CH nondirectional.

Someone ought to add any translator frequencies to that list. WKCE doesn't have one. I think it's a BIG mistake for a powerful station to call a station with an FM translator by the translator frequency.
 
Schroedingers Cat said:
Yesterday, around Sunset, I was tuning around the AM dial while waiting in a parking lot (a surprisingly quiet location by today's standards). I heard Oldies in the background on 1180 under WHAM. I heard the call with a W, a long A sound that sounded like K, and two long E sounds. Checked 1180 AM on Wikipedia on my phone, and the only match was WKCE 1180 Knoxville, TN. Checked their website and the list of songs recently played matched. It's 10 kw-D and 2.6 kW-CH nondirectional.

Someone ought to add any translator frequencies to that list. WKCE doesn't have one. I think it's a BIG mistake for a powerful station to call a station with an FM translator by the translator frequency.
Click to expand...

www.topazdesigns.com/ambc will list translators but the info is user sourced so sometimes it might be out of date, but its gonna be mroe accurate then wikipedia i thin.

and as for calling an am by its translator frequency.. not a big deal to me.. theyre going where the majority of their listeners probably are or whgere they wanna direct them to
 


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