PRO TOOLS Free For All

[MattontheRadio]

I use Adobe Audition. My big awesome voice guy loves his Pro Tools and I'm diggin' on some of the stuff he's tellin' me about. What's the deal? Worth the money? Anyone? Anyone? This would be for straight-up imaging production for a Hot AC station, imaged with a twinge of CHR. Okay, open season, whaddya got?

 

[Emmett1057]

I think you'll find a lot of differing opinions...Anymore, there isn't a whole lot that any decent DAW can't do. Personally, I can't stand working with Pro Tools...Sometimes I don't have a choice, but I much prefer Audition. It's all about comfort, and the results are much more dependant on the producer than the software package.

I've been using Pro Tools for about eight years, Audition (Cool Edit Pro) for about six or seven. I have yet to find anything that Pro Tools does dramatically better, except the time stretch function...And I personally really prefer the Audition interface and workflow.

I'm assuming you're talking about Pro Tools LE or M-Powered, not a full-blown HD system. If you're talking about Pro Tools | HD, you're comparing apples to oranges, especially with the price.

 

[uppendowndadial]

Yeah, I agree. There are so many powerful DAWs out there right now. ProTools is so proprietary. You want effects? Buy each one of them individually!. No Active X or VST plug-ins allowed. AA is a strong program, as is Steinberg. Save your money.

 

[MyCatKnight]

I really like my Cool Edit Pro 2.0, but never tried ProTools. For those of you who know both, does ProTools crash as frequently as CE? I'm constantly saving stuff as I record, having gotten burned too many times by freeze-ups [I get a "not responding" message, then I have to "X" out & restart CE... tends to be when I highlight part of a wave in order to amplify or silence it]. I suppose I might simply have too much junk filling up my hard drive [Dell Pentium 4 w/ Windows XP home edition].

 

[another_guy]

I really like my Cool Edit Pro 2.0, but never tried ProTools. For those of you who know both, does ProTools crash as frequently as CE? I'm constantly saving stuff as I record, having gotten burned too many times by freeze-ups [I get a "not responding" message, then I have to "X" out & restart CE... tends to be when I highlight part of a wave in order to amplify or silence it]. I suppose I might simply have too much junk filling up my hard drive [Dell Pentium 4 w/ Windows XP home edition].

Pro tools is as stable as the system its running on is. It is pretty picky about how you set up your system and what hardware you using, i run pro tools at home and have no problems with it at all crashing.

My take on the using protools thing over audition. I have used both for many years. I went to school and got a 4 year degree in sound recording technology so my training was in studio recording, IE multi-track recording, with bands. And I have to say I love pro tools for that, the interface is great, it sounds great, and has so many mixing features its awesome. However, for radio I think audition is so much better. Pro Tools wasn't made for radio production it was made for hardcore multitrack production, and a lot of those features get in the way. Audition in my opinion is designed more for radio production, so the interface is a lot easier and things don't get in your way.

Just my .02

 

[voicetrack]

Has anyone used Adobe 2.0 yet? I understand its a completely new program bearing little resemblance to to previous versions.

 

[Emmett1057]

I really like my Cool Edit Pro 2.0, but never tried ProTools. For those of you who know both, does ProTools crash as frequently as CE? I'm constantly saving stuff as I record, having gotten burned too many times by freeze-ups [I get a "not responding" message, then I have to "X" out & restart CE... tends to be when I highlight part of a wave in order to amplify or silence it]. I suppose I might simply have too much junk filling up my hard drive [Dell Pentium 4 w/ Windows XP home edition].

CEP 2.0 was a very unstable program and was quickly replaced by 2.1, which was a free upgrade at the time, but I doubt you'll be able to find it now. All versions since have been much more stable.

As another_radio_dude says, Pro Tools is extremely solid for music production. Many of its features are geared toward music production, and for that, it has few faults...But it just isn't good for a quick edit...Even when I need to use Pro Tools for multitracking, I'll often use Sound Forge for quick edits and then dump it in to Pro Tools (that studio isn't equipped with Audition).

Yes, Audition 2.0 is very different. It takes some getting used to, but most users are reporting that they like the changes, after they have some time to work with the program. It still works about the same way as previous versions, but little differences add up...Still, much easier to move to, than a completely different program.

 

[voiceguy]

Well, let me be the only defender of Pro Tools here...

I like it alot. I don't love it...I don't hate it...I like it.

AND...I'm comfy with it. It resides on both my studio machine, and my laptop, it has eaten vast holes in my bank accounts over the years, and it has helped me make some things that sounded really freakin' cool...

But then again, so did the Orban Audicy...

and, back in the day, so did the KORG Soundlink...hell, I even used this glorified Sampler called the Akai DD1000 for a little while in Houston.

It's all about what you're comfortable with...what sounds good...and what will do the job you need it to do.

The name of Pro Tools does belie it's original intent...it's "Pro" gear. It was designed with multi-million dollar studios and post-production houses in its earliest incarnation...

But, it has since gone the way of the "pro-sumer" in an effort to keep up with other manufacturers who started out targeting that highly regarded market.

Yes, the plugins can be expensive, but LOTS of people have written great plugins that either are very inexpensive, or sometimes free ( you can find 'em out there, trust me... )

And the plugins from IZOTOPE are the bomb...solid build, solid sound, and nice price.

And, if you buy the Pro Tools Producer bundle, you get tons of plugs right out of the box...with very little extra up-front cost.

And, with the new VST WRAPPER plugin, you can use VST plugins inside the ProTools environment, which opens ProTools up to...well...virtually all the same things you can use in Audition.

I'm not knockin' that program...because there's PLENTY of folks out there, obviously, that love it...and saying that one workstation is better than another is like callin' somebody's baby ugly...

So, I celebrate what Pro Tools has to offer...its differences, its foibles, its amazing features...

And remember too, that your DAW is only as good as the quality of the converters...

So, if you use Audition, just make sure you spring for the extra-nice sound card...

These days, with M-Audio being bought by digi, you can now get a Pro Tools compatible interface for around less than $200...and then get the M-Powered Pro Tools software for under $300...

Then, as time wears on, you can always upgrade your interface...

Just a thought.

Ok, thanks for lettin' me babble...good luck with whatever you decide to purchase!

Rock on,

Mike Bratton
Voice Guy

www.mikebrattonvoice.com

 

[PTBoardOp94]

The voice guy we use produces his liners/promos/whatever in something called Samplitude V8.

Bascially the same thing, right? They all do pretty much the same thing? Or does anyone think Samplitude is miles ahead of other softwares (he seems to think so).

 

[Emmett1057]

I tried samplitude once and couldn't get ANYWHERE with it. An Audition user can step right into the basics of Pro Tools, and vice versa...Not so with Samplitude, it's very different....That's all I can tell you about it.

Emmett

 

[robgrayson]

I love pro tools for recording and mixing music, in an atmosphere where you have lots of time to listen and tweak. It would be a pain in a finite-time quick turn-around production situation. The biggest drawback to me is that when you want to save your mix as a file (bounce to disk), it has to be in real time. In Vegas, for example, when you get the mix where you want it, you can render a file instantly, without having to listen back to the whole thing from the top.
RG

 

[fresnel]

The voice guy we use produces his liners/promos/whatever in something called Samplitude V8.

Bascially the same thing, right? They all do pretty much the same thing?

um.... yeah... in the same way that a rolls royce and a yugo do the same thing......


the big questions that need to be asked when looking at all the different DAW packages out there is this...

how easy is it to use?
how are the features?
expandable?
last.. but frankly most important...

how does it SOUND?

this is where your voice over guy gets it. Samplitude (and its cousin sequoia) have an absolutely fabulous sound. the mix bus is right, the effects are right, and it is SIMPLE to edit on. Sequouia is my native DAW of choice.... (I use it on my laptop in my home studio) now, I realize in this day and age, most radio stations are too cheap to put out $2000 for a peice of software (even though less than 10 years ago, they would have spent $30,000 on an Orban Audacy... or a Sadie rig)...

so.. since this thread is about protools....for the price... and the fact that you get a control surface, really nice editing, and a mix bus that is suspect... but ussually good enough for radio (I hate that term... but I use it here) I like the Protools DIGI002 rigs. . .

but, for the same cash, you can set up a tascam 1082 (firewire control surphace/audio interface... yes, it has flying faders), Sony Vegas, Sound Forge, and a buttload of great plugins... this is the route I go at work.... trying to keep the budets happy, and get some powerful sofware.......



the point is this... get to know as many of these peices of software as possible. look into how they handle audio (not all digital is identicle... those 1's and 0's mix differently with different software) use your own judgement.... then... use what you feel fits your situation best....

unfortunately... too many people in our business have tin ears... and cant tell....so, you end up with what is fast becoming our industry standard..... adobe audition.... BLAH!



cheers.
Scott h(a.K.a.- fresnel)

 

[Emmett1057]

The problem with the Pro Tools mix bus is that it doesn't automatically sum. While I see this as a glaring flaw, there are millions of workarounds, such as plug-ins or summing externally. Pro Tools also still uses integer file formats, which will also affect the sound, somewhat. But virtually all digital audio programs sound identical when working with the same bitdepth, sample rate and dither settings. Straight recording will be exactly the same, regardless of the program. Effects may vary from one program (and plug-in) to the next, but many use the same algorithms. Audition's hard limiter produces identical results when compared to Sony's Wave Hammer or Waves' L1 or L2, when identical settings are used. The graphical compressors from Audition, Waves and Sony also sound the same (this has all been tested by phase inversion).

Aside from the things listed above, DAW sound quality is strictly hardware dependant. Anyone who has told you different is wrong.

But you should absolutely try out every piece of software you can find. Use what works for you...Even if it's the free Audacity with some good VSTs.

Emmett

 

[fresnel]

The problem with the Pro Tools mix bus is that it doesn't automatically sum. While I see this as a glaring flaw, there are millions of workarounds, such as plug-ins or summing externally

this has always been my issue with protools...

and the protools defenders will always bring up... "well, that is why you also go with XXXX summing mixer" or" thats why we always mixdown externally"

that is kinda like buying an extremely expensive sportscar.... only to change out the engine so that you can get the promised performance. .... I dont get that....

But virtually all digital audio programs sound identical when working with the same bitdepth, sample rate and dither settings. Straight recording will be exactly the same, regardless of the program.

absolutely not true...


take a 8 track raw mix with NO fx....

place the tracks into several different DAW systems... unity gain on every track, and the master.


then bounce the mix to a stereo file .

take those files and place them on top of one another, reverse the phase of one of them.

if you hear ANY artifact... that is proof that they not mixing the same.

now... after you determine that they are different... figure out which sounds better (much, much more difficult)



actually.. the better DAW's will make this even more apparent the more tracks you have on them.

this is the reason I purchased an Ensoniq Paris rig instead on a Protools 24 setup back in 1997... it just sounded better... still sounds better than 99% of whats on the market....

the same test that lead me to purchase Sequioa for my laptop...