I need advice. I am trying to eliminate as much in our audio processing chain as I can. We have an Orban optimod 8100A, CRL SEG-800 compressor/limiter, Stereo Maxx and Apehx Compellor. I want to run just the Optimod and and the Aphex Compellor. Any suggestions?
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Processing 8100A
- Thread starter radioactiv911
- Start date
Remove it all except the 8100. 
FM Engineer has a point. I've always had the luxury of Texars in front of an 8100, but I've heard of good results using a Dominator instead of a compellor. I always hated the Stereo Maxx's...never had one myself...but on other stations heard it generate tons of extra multipath everytime.
I was thinking of just runiing the Optimod. So No stereo Maxx or compellor? The CRL SEG-800 I hated since the day it was found in the basement and installed. What are the best settings for the Optiod?
The best settings are going to be dependent upon what you want to do. Are you working on a music format? Need loudness? Want to have it as clean as possible? Give a few more details. It's been quite some time since I've looked at one of the 8100s but I think I can give you a few ideas. (I have to open the front door up on one of them and take a look at the knobs and their labels!)
Our format is AC but I want it to preserve the highs but also keep the bass.
By the way there is another thread 'down lower' on this same board about the same subject. Some good info in there.
Looking at the internal controls of the 8100 and working from memory:
1. Adjust the input attenuators so that you get 10 dB of gain reduction on the TOTAL meter while your console levels are nominal (i.e., 0 VU)
2. Use the L-R meter to adjust the channel to channel balance during speech or other pure mono source (null L-R out).
3. Bass coupling: completely CCW.
4. Release time: slow. Probably 3:00 or so.
5. Start off with the clipping control at noon.
6. Start off with the HF limiting control at noon as well.
One thing to watch is this: with the meter on "L filter" or "R filter" make sure the VU meter on the 8100 doesn't go much above -2. You start to get in to clipping seriously after that.
Looking at the internal controls of the 8100 and working from memory:
1. Adjust the input attenuators so that you get 10 dB of gain reduction on the TOTAL meter while your console levels are nominal (i.e., 0 VU)
2. Use the L-R meter to adjust the channel to channel balance during speech or other pure mono source (null L-R out).
3. Bass coupling: completely CCW.
4. Release time: slow. Probably 3:00 or so.
5. Start off with the clipping control at noon.
6. Start off with the HF limiting control at noon as well.
One thing to watch is this: with the meter on "L filter" or "R filter" make sure the VU meter on the 8100 doesn't go much above -2. You start to get in to clipping seriously after that.
wgliradio said:
I almost totally agree.
To add a bit to wgliradio' s comment... the 8100 can get kind of muddy when the bass coupling is completely uncoupled, but thin if completely coupled, so you need to adjust to taste.
Personally, I think the 'sweet spot' for total G/R is a little less than 10 dB, most definitely if using external AGC.
I also like to run the Gate up until the indicator flickers with open-sounding programming, still allowing release to otherwise fill in the gaps.
I like to work the Gate and Release controls together; they can complement each other. IOW, you can have a pretty fast release and not be obnoxious if you gate it enough.
My close-to-ideal, off-the-shelf analog processing system would be the Ariane/8100/Solid Electronics DCP-1A combo.
You can get a lot of mileage and still sound clean and relaxed.
Kind Regards,
David
stha said:
They have different purposes. The Ariane's job is to make consistent source-to-source 'ear' loudness from wide-ranging sources, and, IMOH (since it's not my product), the XT-2 works over a much narrower dynamic range to maximize peaks across the spectrum and add punch and body to the sound.
In my experience, they work well together.
One other thing: if you have Orban's "Card 0", any need for additional composite clipping is almost eliminated.
Kind Regards,
David
B
Bill Sacks
Guest
8100 recommendations
My old friend David has the trick down "I like to work the Gate and Release controls together; they can complement each other. IOW, you can have a pretty fast release and not be obnoxious if you gate it enough."
The bass control issue of "muddy Vs thin" that David cites goes away when the 8100 is properly recapped. This means going beyond just replacing aging electrolytic types with modern low ESR devices, but also replacement of all the tiny ceramic 0.1 uF local bypass caps with high quality 1.0 uf film caps. The effect on the tone of the bass of replacing the 4.7uF tantalum caps on cards 3 and 4 with the right film types is quite dramatic. The big new films are a tight physical fit, but well worth the effort. This is what we do everyday.
The 8100 is a sleeper. IMHO, the 8100 uniquely marks the pinnacle of analog FM processing, being the most competent analog FM audio processor ever made. The visionary genius of Bob Orban's design is even more audible once this wonderful machine is fortified with modern ultra low distortion opamps, new generation film dielectric power supply bypass caps, and high-fidelity coupling capacitors. The result of this work is a much smoother, very open, and transparent sound. One will get a tight sounding clean modern sound, yet preserve the original Orban character and polish if this this work done with proper care and you fully align the box afterward.
I much prefer a refurbished XT2 for enhancing the density over the use of things like a Prism in front of it.
The Ariane is a the only modern box I would use as a leveler in front an 8100. Anything else, except a refurbished Orban Co-operator, is an insult to the tone of the Optimod and will detract from the intrinsic smoothness and fidelity of the 8100.
If you want very up front thick smooth bass, I suggest a refurbished and rechipped XT with our CLUB (Centered Uniform Low Bass) mod. Our CLUB bass modification was specifically approved by Bob Orban. This modification is embodied as a small PCB that makes each of the bass controls into a separate frequency and each control boosts ONLY in pure L+R. This method of L+R only boost prevents imbalances that result from setting the left and right controls on-the-fly without then carefuly renulling the LF L-R with tone after each adjustment. In addition, our CLUB mod gives the flexibility of two complimentary frequencies of 55 Hz and 110 Hz allowing you to have a broader, more shelf-like boost yet give you control of the shape of this virtual shelf. We may apply for a patent which teaches this unique method of bass EQ for stereo signals.
Here is an example of an XT with our CLUB mod: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TG27NAZgFs&feature=channel
Please feel free to contact me directly for a more detailed rant.
.
First a full disclosure. Kim and I offer a factory authorized commercial service of restoration and refurbishing legacy Orban analog gear and we sell new Orban products.David Reaves said:
My old friend David has the trick down "I like to work the Gate and Release controls together; they can complement each other. IOW, you can have a pretty fast release and not be obnoxious if you gate it enough."
The bass control issue of "muddy Vs thin" that David cites goes away when the 8100 is properly recapped. This means going beyond just replacing aging electrolytic types with modern low ESR devices, but also replacement of all the tiny ceramic 0.1 uF local bypass caps with high quality 1.0 uf film caps. The effect on the tone of the bass of replacing the 4.7uF tantalum caps on cards 3 and 4 with the right film types is quite dramatic. The big new films are a tight physical fit, but well worth the effort. This is what we do everyday.
The 8100 is a sleeper. IMHO, the 8100 uniquely marks the pinnacle of analog FM processing, being the most competent analog FM audio processor ever made. The visionary genius of Bob Orban's design is even more audible once this wonderful machine is fortified with modern ultra low distortion opamps, new generation film dielectric power supply bypass caps, and high-fidelity coupling capacitors. The result of this work is a much smoother, very open, and transparent sound. One will get a tight sounding clean modern sound, yet preserve the original Orban character and polish if this this work done with proper care and you fully align the box afterward.
I much prefer a refurbished XT2 for enhancing the density over the use of things like a Prism in front of it.
The Ariane is a the only modern box I would use as a leveler in front an 8100. Anything else, except a refurbished Orban Co-operator, is an insult to the tone of the Optimod and will detract from the intrinsic smoothness and fidelity of the 8100.
If you want very up front thick smooth bass, I suggest a refurbished and rechipped XT with our CLUB (Centered Uniform Low Bass) mod. Our CLUB bass modification was specifically approved by Bob Orban. This modification is embodied as a small PCB that makes each of the bass controls into a separate frequency and each control boosts ONLY in pure L+R. This method of L+R only boost prevents imbalances that result from setting the left and right controls on-the-fly without then carefuly renulling the LF L-R with tone after each adjustment. In addition, our CLUB mod gives the flexibility of two complimentary frequencies of 55 Hz and 110 Hz allowing you to have a broader, more shelf-like boost yet give you control of the shape of this virtual shelf. We may apply for a patent which teaches this unique method of bass EQ for stereo signals.
Here is an example of an XT with our CLUB mod: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TG27NAZgFs&feature=channel
Please feel free to contact me directly for a more detailed rant.
.
I have 2 8100A's with the same problem at the TOTAL Bass G/R meter. If the unit is powered up but with no audio during hours, that meter is not active when the audio is back. It only "wakes up" if I increase the input levels during one second, then all is back to normal. This is not the meter by itself. Any idea ? About a recapping, if I only replace "electrolytic types with modern low ESR devices, but also replacement of all the tiny ceramic 0.1 uF local bypass caps with high quality 1.0 uf film caps" can I use the unit with it's current calibration ?
B
Bill Sacks
Guest
Stha,stha said:
I think your units both have their gating thresholds just set too high. Try turning the gate control fully counter clockwise and see if the problem goes away. The gate lamp should flash on only during "gaps" in the program material duirng normal operation. My friend David just happens to have given great advice for setting the gate control optimally in his post above
Let me know if that fixes this issue.
Thanks
Sounds like a sticky meter.
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