Processing Question

[sawtooth_mcmull]

I am a mobile DJ and I have a question concerning two processors.

I have an Alesis NanoCompressor and a Samson S Com Plus Compressor both in my studio chain. I'm trying to set them where they work WITH each other and not AGAINST each other. I want to achieve the loudest sound possible, but I know it ain't an Orban. ;o) I'm having problems with peaks sometimes jumping out untamed. I've given both the fastest attack times possible and the fastest release times possible, but still some peaks get through. What do I need to do to get these two to work together? Are there any suggestions? Here's a pic of the two if needed:

- http://www.samsontech.com/products/relatedDocs/S-complus.jpg
- http://alesis.com/products/nanocompressor/

P.S. Sad I can't EVEN adjust these two, but I can adjust an Orban 8100 and make it scream... ) Maybe I need an Orban!

 

[SamBuca]

A couple things...

DO NOT (as in...do not) use broadcast audio processing on live sound elements (mobile gear, club gear, etc). Those drivers are not meant to be held at a constant level. This is my club setup:

Top to bottom: satellite speaker compressor, real-time spectrum analyzer, house EQ, house compressor, one of the amps.

The crossover splits the signal into low/high and each is compressed separately with different settings. The result is nice punchy bass, loud and even highs....without overheating the drivers.

DO NOT (even though you're tempted) put an EQ into the positive.

DO NOT put 2 compressors in the same audio chain unless you reeeeeeeeeeeeeeally know what you're doing...for instance, at the station we have an AGC unit before the STL and then the optimod at the transmitter site. The AGC on the optimod is defeated.

If you're doing it for studio work...compress your elements separately...and just enough to even it out. Once it's in the tracking software you can get the bass drum punchy, vocals with a large presence and solid, etc leaving the option to change the sound later on. For a master, use software like Sound Solution (discussed to death here) to even it out....if you want an FM sound, search for my sound solution setting posted here.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>

 

[DFWRadioJock]

I’m in a different school of thought than you are, Sam. I believe multiband compression should be used for this application. Notice I didn’t say “multiband compression with clipping”. There are several decent multiband processors that could work well for club DJ applications. Right off hand I’d look at such processors designed for Internet streaming. The crossover approach you’re using doesn’t appear to me as if it allows you time delay the various bands of audio being processed. That’s key in my book for creating a signature sound. I do agree, don’t use an Optimod designed for FM broadcasting.

 

[gtomas]

> P.S. Sad I can't EVEN adjust these two, but I can adjust an
> Orban 8100 and make it scream... ) Maybe I need an
> Orban!

Yep, I would say you need something like Orban 424... Can be found on eBay, for about $300. Will blow your cheap Samson and your cheap Alesis away in terms of consistency and compression quality. Not every compressor is good compressor... In fact, there are quite few of them ;-)

If you want multi-band processor, others already mentioned broadcast processors for flat media and these are great! But perhaps bit expensive for you... There's also a matter of latency.

If you like 8100 and got one lying around, with a little under the hood soldering you could use the summed output of two-band compressor. This would give you 8100's two-band levelling/compression and limiting without pre-emphasis, HF limiting and clipping. There would be some overshoots, but these are in the order of less than 1ms so I don't belive it would be noticeable. In any case, you could limit it (or clip it) afterwards if you really want to. Beware that 8100 produces quite consistent bass with lots of harmonics, which (as Sam mentioned) may be too much for your sound system to handle at high volumes for prolonged time...


Regards
Goran Tomas

 

[sawtooth_mcmull]

> I’m in a different school of thought than you are, Sam. I
> believe multiband compression should be used for this
> application. Notice I didn’t say “multiband compression
> with clipping”. There are several decent multiband
> processors that could work well for club DJ applications.
> Right off hand I’d look at such processors designed for
> Internet streaming. The crossover approach you’re using
> doesn’t appear to me as if it allows you time delay the
> various bands of audio being processed. That’s key in my
> book for creating a signature sound. I do agree, don’t use
> an Optimod designed for FM broadcasting.

Thank you all for your input! I'm not looking for maximum compression, so it may still be ok to use and Orban or something to that affect. The "FM compression" sound would be nice, but not if it isn't a good idea.

Again, keep in mind that this equipment is not at extremely high volumes. Most often, this equipment is setup for studio use only. Very seldomly do I take it "out on the road." I have a different setup for that, but if I do have to take it out, I usually don't bring the processors.

I'm just looking for consistent sound with peak control. I do recordings, samplings, etc. with this equipment.

On a side note, I used to work for a radio station that had an Orban Optimod 8100. I will say that it was a nice piece of equipment! For analog equipment, it sure does sound smoother and more inviting than most of the new-fangled digital processors out there.

Sawtooth

 

[SamBuca]

> I’m in a different school of thought than you are, Sam. I
> believe multiband compression should be used for this
> application.

Um...I just described and showed you my multiband compression.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>

 

[DFWRadioJock]

Sam,

I should have said a “single unit” multiband processor. The way you described your setup, it sounds to me like you have to drag around excess gear to make it work. So you have two crossovers, one for left and one for right? Then you’ve got a bunch of single band compressors, say three per channel? That’s what I envisioned after reading your post.

 

[SamBuca]

There's a picture there of what I have in the post.

A crossover unit puts lowpass and highpass filters on a source and then has multiple outputs. 1 crossover unit has 3 outputs: low, med, high.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>

 

[Jimprewitt1954]

> I am a mobile DJ and I have a question concerning two
> processors.
>
> I have an Alesis NanoCompressor and a Samson S Com Plus
> Compressor both in my studio chain. I'm trying to set them
> where they work WITH each other and not AGAINST each other.
> I want to achieve the loudest sound possible, but I know it
> ain't an Orban. ;o) I'm having problems with peaks
> sometimes jumping out untamed. I've given both the fastest
> attack times possible and the fastest release times
> possible, but still some peaks get through. What do I need
> to do to get these two to work together? Are there any
> suggestions? Here's a pic of the two if needed:
>
> -
> http://www.samsontech.com/products/relatedDocs/S-complus.jpg
>
> - http://alesis.com/products/nanocompressor/
>
> P.S. Sad I can't EVEN adjust these two, but I can adjust an
> Orban 8100 and make it scream... ) Maybe I need an
> Orban!

Hi,

I have a Vintage DBX 166a with peak stop and over easy compression. It is GREAT for limiting. Solid brick wall. You can find them on ebay. I agree the Orban 424 is good. Excellent limiter and transparent compression.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
Good Night and Good Luck.</P>