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Programmers being Cost Effective at the expense of the audience

F

fccfight

Guest
Mauzzi Stafford?? (spelling?) - there were two women announcers on this weekend mid-day, I think one was WZLX the other WODS who just couldn't cut it. It sounded like college radio.

Then the dude who subbed for Carter Alan today - he sounded like college radio.
Not that Carter is any great shakes, but at least he can string a coherent sentence together. This dude was rambling on about John Lennon's "How Do You Sleep" - a great song ZLX should play more. Shut the fill-ins up and play good music.

Asked a colleague why these major corporations are doing this. He said it is the almighty dollar. What are they paying these individuals? Minimum wage?

With all the advertising one would think they could either hire quality talent or have some legendary jock with an ISDN line from his home (didn't Dale Dorman do this before the WODS gig?) fill in.

You know - we listeners would be happy if they'd give the time, say the title of the record with no histrionics, and stop overdoing it. They are trying too hard - and their talking over the intros of good records makes one scan the dial
 
> Mauzzi Stafford?? (spelling?) - there were two women
> announcers on this weekend mid-day, I think one was WZLX the
> other WODS who just couldn't cut it. It sounded like
> college radio.
>
> Then the dude who subbed for Carter Alan today - he sounded
> like college radio.
> Not that Carter is any great shakes, but at least he can
> string a coherent sentence together. This dude was rambling
> on about John Lennon's "How Do You Sleep" - a great song ZLX
> should play more. Shut the fill-ins up and play good music.
>
>
> Asked a colleague why these major corporations are doing
> this. He said it is the almighty dollar. What are they
> paying these individuals? Minimum wage?
>
> With all the advertising one would think they could either
> hire quality talent or have some legendary jock with an ISDN
> line from his home (didn't Dale Dorman do this before the
> WODS gig?) fill in.
>
> You know - we listeners would be happy if they'd give the
> time, say the title of the record with no histrionics, and
> stop overdoing it. They are trying too hard - and their
> talking over the intros of good records makes one scan the
> dial
>
Mauzy has been around for years, she worked at 98.5 when it was WROR and has always been a top notch announcer maybe you caught her on an off day, it does happen.
 
> Mauzy has been around for years, she worked at 98.5 when it
> was WROR and has always been a top notch announcer maybe you
> caught her on an off day, it does happen.

I hear Mauzy weekends on WODS & she sounds fine. I don't know who subbed on WZLX but have never heard anyone on that station who didn't sound good. Who exactly is available to fill in weekdays other than weekenders anyway & most Boston weekenders are full-time quality. As far as getting someone legendary to fill in, who exactly is available & why go with someone who will fill in one week then never be heard from again? It makes more sense to use familiar voices.

Or would you rather have David Lee Roth? Count your blessings.
 
> I hear Mauzy weekends on WODS & she sounds fine. I don't
> know who subbed on WZLX but have never heard anyone on that
> station who didn't sound good. Who exactly is available to
> fill in weekdays other than weekenders anyway & most Boston
> weekenders are full-time quality. As far as getting someone
> legendary to fill in, who exactly is available & why go with
> someone who will fill in one week then never be heard from
> again? It makes more sense to use familiar voices.
>

Agree, Mauzy does a very fine job there. Also heard Steve York on 103.3
over the weekend. He used to be a night guy on the old bald Eagle 93.7,
IIRC.
 
> Mauzzi Stafford?? (spelling?) - there were two women
> announcers on this weekend mid-day, I think one was WZLX the
> other WODS who just couldn't cut it. It sounded like
> college radio.

Mauzy is a Boston area pro who usually sounds fine. As a poster below said, perhaps you caught her at a bad moment or an off day, or perhaps you have an issue with her style rather than her actual ability.

I think it's amazing how much Mauzy juggles on regular weekday mornings, doing traffic reports for a number of stations while also simultaneously being one of the "sidekicks" on Dale Dorman's "Breakfast Club" on WODS, and she does it all without screwing up. Even with some voicetracking, etc... there must be a lot of multitasking involved with doing all that.

The two women jocks on WZLX were weekenders Annie Ashe and Anngelle Wood. I like Ashe's style. A little boisterous, but her comments are fun. She sounds like she's really having a good time, not putting it on. I think she previously did afternoon drive on Clear Channel's Philadelphia "Smooth Jazz" station WJJZ.

Wood recently moved over from WFNX, which I don't listen to, so I don't have an opinion on her air sound. I know that she's active in the local rock music scene.

> Then the dude who subbed for Carter Alan today - he sounded
> like college radio.
> Not that Carter is any great shakes, but at least he can
> string a coherent sentence together. This dude was rambling
> on about John Lennon's "How Do You Sleep" - a great song ZLX
> should play more. Shut the fill-ins up and play good music.

I didn't hear the sub today, but some people like a little information about the music and artists. That's one of the things Carter normally does that helps make his show more interesting than your run of the mill liner card Classic Rock format.

> You know - we listeners would be happy if they'd give the
> time, say the title of the record with no histrionics, and
> stop overdoing it. They are trying too hard - and their
> talking over the intros of good records makes one scan the
> dial

Though I also don't usually like when jocks go too overboard with jive and try too hard (though there are some that are/were good at it, such as Little Walter DeVenne, Arnie "Woo Woo" Ginsburg, Charles Laquidara and a few other legends, even Dale Dorman still to a point...), I like when DJ's include some originality, personality and information. I find liner card radio very boring.

Oldies DJ's talk over instrumental song intros because all Top 40 jocks in the 60's and 70's did. It was the style of Top 40 radio then (and still is). Oldies stations are playing the same music as Top 40 stations did then, so they also emulate the format.
 
>
> You know - we listeners would be happy if they'd give the
> time, say the title of the record with no histrionics, and
> stop overdoing it. They are trying too hard - and their
> talking over the intros of good records makes one scan the
> dial
>

Never understood how talking over an intro "ruins" the song. To my ears it makes the station flow better. Granted, there are jocks who over-do it...try to hit the post on Black Magic Woman, etc. but for the most part I think it sounds better than the AAA approach where it's never done.
 
> Agree, Mauzy does a very fine job there. Also heard Steve
> York on 103.3
> over the weekend. He used to be a night guy on the old bald
> Eagle 93.7,

Steve has been around for a number of years. I think (could be wrong time has killed the brain) he was on WBOS in the mid to late 80's. Every time I have heard him he has been all pro.
 
> > Agree, Mauzy does a very fine job there. Also heard Steve
> > York on 103.3
> > over the weekend. He used to be a night guy on the old
> bald
> > Eagle 93.7,
>
> Steve has been around for a number of years. I think (could
> be wrong time has killed the brain) he was on WBOS in the
> mid to late 80's. Every time I have heard him he has been
> all pro.


With all due respect to the jocks mentioned in this thread, it is about the benjamins and coupled with the shrinking talent pool, thanks to voice tracking and syndication eliminating the jobs where jocks could smooth out the rough edges, the quality of "air talent" in recent years in the Boston market has declined.

Some of the newer (read that younger) folks won't remember Boston radio in its heyday and really don't have anything to compare the next generation of Boston jocks against, but the older listeners can remember folks like Jess Cain, Dave Supple, Bruce Bradley, Dick Summer, et al.

No one on the air in Boston today is qualified to even carry their bags!

Thank you synidcation, PDs who only allow jocks to read liner cards, and voice tracking!
 
> Never understood how talking over an intro "ruins" the song.
> To my ears it makes the station flow better. Granted,
> there are jocks who over-do it...try to hit the post on
> Black Magic Woman, etc. but for the most part I think it
> sounds better than the AAA approach where it's never done.

I think whether or not talkovers work depends on the format.

Top 40 and Oldies is high energy, fast paced radio, and talkups seem appropriate for the sound of the format.

When "FM underground" album rock radio came around in the late 60's as an alternative to Top 40, there were no talkups. The programming was "laid back", and the material was supposed to sound like listening to your album collection. This formatting remained with AOR, then later AAA radio. It sounds more appropriate for the material and presentation.

Classic Rock and Classic Hits stations seem like they may go either way, but for the most part they don't talk over intros as much as Top 40 or Oldies stations.
 
> >
> > You know - we listeners would be happy if they'd give the
> > time, say the title of the record with no histrionics, and
>
> > stop overdoing it. They are trying too hard - and their
> > talking over the intros of good records makes one scan the
>
> > dial
> >
>
> Never understood how talking over an intro "ruins" the song.
> To my ears it makes the station flow better. Granted,
> there are jocks who over-do it...try to hit the post on
> Black Magic Woman, etc. but for the most part I think it
> sounds better than the AAA approach where it's never done.
>
Exactly right. The moment someone starts talking about their distaste for jocks talking over the intros I know that their problems reach far beyond just being bothered by jocks talking over intros, they have a fundamental frustration with radio which if so they should stop listening. It's like complaining that a painter uses a certain type of brush it's just pointless and dumb.
 
Though I'm not fond of the tonal quality of Carter Alan's voice, he does a good job of talking about the music. The fill-in yesterday just didn't have "the knack" for chatting about John Lennon. Like the weekend people, they fumble and stumble and if they can't be entertaining (they don't have to be as good as
Laquidara or Dale Dorman), they should keep in mind that sometimes less is more.

I would trade the chatter for more songs like "How Do You Sleep" which belong on Classic Rock radio - more so than Pink Floyd's "Money", Lynyrd's "Freebird",
and the everpresent Black Magic Woman. Play Santana's "She's Not There" for God's sake, and know about Colin Blunstone and Rod Argent when ya play it.




> >
> > > You know - we listeners would be happy if they'd give
> the
> > > time, say the title of the record with no histrionics,
> and
> >
> > > stop overdoing it. They are trying too hard - and their
>
> > > talking over the intros of good records makes one scan
> the
> >
> > > dial
> > >
> >
> > Never understood how talking over an intro "ruins" the
> song.
> > To my ears it makes the station flow better. Granted,
> > there are jocks who over-do it...try to hit the post on
> > Black Magic Woman, etc. but for the most part I think it
> > sounds better than the AAA approach where it's never done.
>
> >
> Exactly right. The moment someone starts talking about
> their distaste for jocks talking over the intros I know that
> their problems reach far beyond just being bothered by jocks
> talking over intros, they have a fundamental frustration
> with radio which if so they should stop listening. It's like
> complaining that a painter uses a certain type of brush it's
> just pointless and dumb.
>
 
Thank you, exactly my point.

>
> With all due respect to the jocks mentioned in this thread,
> it is about the benjamins and coupled with the shrinking
> talent pool, thanks to voice tracking and syndication
> eliminating the jobs where jocks could smooth out the rough
> edges, the quality of "air talent" in recent years in the
> Boston market has declined.
>
> Some of the newer (read that younger) folks won't remember
> Boston radio in its heyday and really don't have anything to
> compare the next generation of Boston jocks against, but the
> older listeners can remember folks like Jess Cain, Dave
> Supple, Bruce Bradley, Dick Summer, et al.
>
> No one on the air in Boston today is qualified to even carry
> their bags!
>
> Thank you synidcation, PDs who only allow jocks to read
> liner cards, and voice tracking!
>
 
Re: Pardon Me, But Wrong

> With all due respect to the jocks mentioned in this thread,
> it is about the benjamins and coupled with the shrinking
> talent pool, thanks to voice tracking and syndication
> eliminating the jobs where jocks could smooth out the rough
> edges, the quality of "air talent" in recent years in the
> Boston market has declined.

What are you talking about? Boston is not a market in which to "smooth out the rough edges." That's done in the 'burbs and smaller markets, where believe it or not, there are actual live people still on the actual air. Golly gee, we get to talk on the radio and everything! If we get good enough, some of us get to go to Boston and talk on the actual radio there. Same as it ever was.

>
> Some of the newer (read that younger) folks won't remember
> Boston radio in its heyday and really don't have anything to
> compare the next generation of Boston jocks against, but the
> older listeners can remember folks like Jess Cain, Dave
> Supple, Bruce Bradley, Dick Summer, et al.
>
> No one on the air in Boston today is qualified to even carry
> their bags!

Then go listen to reelradio.com and play your "Crusin' 1962" album all over again and listen to the raps about swingin' hep cats and submarine races. "Bing Bong, chime time is 7:56 in the big city!"

Today's Boston radio has plenty of good jocks. I'm a rocker, so my list is a little biased toward that end of the spectrum, but Carter Alan, Julie Deveraux, Kristin Lessard, Albert O., Bill Abbatte and Chuck Nowlin immediately come to mind as great jocks that have been around a long time because they connect with their listeners and weave the music together in a real, conversational and decidedly non liner-card way.

The current crop of BCN and AAF'ers might not be your cup of tea because they A) are playing music WAY out of your personal demo and B) are talking to younger listeners in their own language, but the target audience for those kind of stations doesn't want to hear some big-voiced "schunny and scheventy-scheven" boss jock doing radio YOUR "right" way.

And the Top-40 stations... they're talking to KIDS, not you! I'm smart enough to know that if I ever attempted to pull a shift on a station like Jam'n, I would come off like a complete and utter moron. While they're not connecting with this 30-something old rocker, they must be very good at what they do to consistently pull down those kind of numbers.

> Thank you synidcation, PDs who only allow jocks to read
> liner cards, and voice tracking!

Name one major syndicated talent in Boston ON A MUSIC STATION besides Howard Stern. As for "liner cards," go back to the precious good old days on any of the old-fart aircheck sites, and time those breaks on WRKO. They didn't have much time to do their raps either. The current crop of jocks on Kiss 108 are just as cool to today's kids as the heroes of yesteryear were to you. No one got to a market the size of Boston by just reading liner cards. And sure, a little VT'ing goes on, but sheesh, if anyone was going to VT my station it might as well be Ed McMann!
 
Re: Pardon Me, But Wrong

> What are you talking about? Boston is not a market in which
> to "smooth out the rough edges." That's done in the 'burbs
> and smaller markets, where believe it or not, there are
> actual live people still on the actual air. Golly gee, we
> get to talk on the radio and everything! If we get good
> enough, some of us get to go to Boston and talk on the
> actual radio there. Same as it ever was.

If you read my post, you will find that I did not say Boston was a market to be used to "smooth out the edges", that should be done in small and medium markets.
However I did say the opportunities for today's up and comers are diminishing resulting in a shrinking talent pool.


> Then go listen to reelradio.com and play your "Crusin' 1962"
> album all over again and listen to the raps about swingin'
> hep cats and submarine races. "Bing Bong, chime time is
> 7:56 in the big city!"

>snip rant<

I am not talking about the formats, kinds or music, etc. I am talking about the quaility of the talent available. Because the current crop has "made it" doesn't mean that there isn't a serious problem with the farm team to use a baseball analogy.

And the Top-40 stations... they're talking to KIDS, not you!
> I'm smart enough to know that if I ever attempted to pull a
> shift on a station like Jam'n, I would come off like a
> complete and utter moron. While they're not connecting with
> this 30-something old rocker, they must be very good at what
> they do to consistently pull down those kind of numbers.

Maybe so, but even in the days of WRKO and the Drake format those jocks did not read liner cards, they were heavily formatted, and were still head and shoulders above what's on the air today.

If you want to compare WBCN and WAAF with top 40 and do wop have a good time, I'd recommend comparing them against....let me think, how about WBCN and WCOZ?
Charles, et al.


> > Thank you synidcation, PDs who only allow jocks to read
> > liner cards, and voice tracking!
>
The current crop of
> jocks on Kiss 108 are just as cool to today's kids as the
> heroes of yesteryear were to you.

I'm not talking cool, I'm talking about the lack of opportunity for small/medium market jocks to improve their skills so they can be more than just "good enough"

No one got to a market
> the size of Boston by just reading liner cards. And sure, a
> little VT'ing goes on, but sheesh, if anyone was going to VT
> my station it might as well be Ed McMann!

Sure, there are still small stations that hire jocks, but the number of those stations is dwindling with VT and Syndication, so the opportunity for you and those like you to smooth out the rough edges is diminished, and with it the talent pool.

This was not an attack on jocks in small and medium markets, it's an assessment of the current and future trend of Boston radio (and probably other major markets) and the reason that the quality of the crop of jocks coming through Boston now is not up to the standards of the past. Nothing more, nothing less.
 
> Though I'm not fond of the tonal quality of Carter Alan's
> voice, he does a good job of talking about the music. The
> fill-in yesterday just didn't have "the knack" for chatting
> about John Lennon. Like the weekend people, they fumble and
> stumble and if they can't be entertaining (they don't have
> to be as good as
> Laquidara or Dale Dorman), they should keep in mind that
> sometimes less is more.
>
> I would trade the chatter for more songs like "How Do You
> Sleep" which belong on Classic Rock radio - more so than
> Pink Floyd's "Money", Lynyrd's "Freebird",
> and the everpresent Black Magic Woman. Play Santana's
> "She's Not There" for God's sake, and know about Colin
> Blunstone and Rod Argent when ya play it.

You are talking about two different things here, you think that your favorite "classic rock" songs are not being played because the dj's are talking rather than playing "How do you sleep"? wrong. Classic Rock is not an ipod they play what is familliar to the masses and that is the end of the story. You want to hear deep, deep. cuts get an ipod of your own. Even the Jack stations while they present themselves as "playing everything" what they really play are hits from different formats on one station and that is it.

You are hell bent on complaining it is not about SOMETHING its dj's one day and now it's song selection, the dj's are not picking the songs so your issue is with the program directors/music directors and the larger issue is the audience. In short there's no pleasing you so your opinion means little.
>
>
>
>
> > >
> > > > You know - we listeners would be happy if they'd give
> > the
> > > > time, say the title of the record with no histrionics,
>
> > and
> > >
> > > > stop overdoing it. They are trying too hard - and
> their
> >
> > > > talking over the intros of good records makes one scan
>
> > the
> > >
> > > > dial
> > > >
> > >
> > > Never understood how talking over an intro "ruins" the
> > song.
> > > To my ears it makes the station flow better. Granted,
> > > there are jocks who over-do it...try to hit the post on
> > > Black Magic Woman, etc. but for the most part I think it
>
> > > sounds better than the AAA approach where it's never
> done.
> >
> > >
> > Exactly right. The moment someone starts talking about
> > their distaste for jocks talking over the intros I know
> that
> > their problems reach far beyond just being bothered by
> jocks
> > talking over intros, they have a fundamental frustration
> > with radio which if so they should stop listening. It's
> like
> > complaining that a painter uses a certain type of brush
> it's
> > just pointless and dumb.
> >
>
 
Re: Pardon Me, But Wrong

>
> If you want to compare WBCN and WAAF with top 40 and do wop
> have a good time, I'd recommend comparing them
> against....let me think, how about WBCN and WCOZ?
> Charles, et al.

You can't decry "liners" and wax nostalgic about WCOZ in the same post. COZ was one of, if not THE original "Shut Up and Rock" stations. The jocks were allowed to say VERY little besides "Kick-Ass Rock & Roll." It's the same formula that's worked for John Sebastian over many years and multiple formats.

I will give you that WBCN had a nice long stretch through most of the 80's where they transcended radio and became a living, breathing thing. Charles, Ken, Mark, Oeddie et al. They also had the luxury of current music that WAS the mainstream. Almost universal in its appeal. The box isn't as big for current Rock right now.

Stations go through high points. 'AAF has had it a couple of times, in the Bob and Zip days, at the height of the Hairbands and again with Opie & Anthony leading the charge in the mid-late 90's. HJY in Providence has seen the same thing a few times and it could be argued that they're as good now as they've ever been. Their ratings the last few years seem to hold that up.

> Sure, there are still small stations that hire jocks, but
> the number of those stations is dwindling with VT and
> Syndication, so the opportunity for you and those like you
> to smooth out the rough edges is diminished, and with it the
> talent pool.

Worcester, Manchester, Portsmouth, Portland, New Bedford, Cape Cod all have plenty of live shifts and good jocks. If you want to consider Providence a farm team, them too. All within driving distance of Boston and all more live than VT. Contrary to popular opinion, very few successful stations regardless of market size are empty buildings with unattended computers spitting out MP3s and imported voicetracks. All I'm sayin'.
 
Re: Pardon Me, But Wrong

> Worcester, Manchester, Portsmouth, Portland, New Bedford,
> Cape Cod all have plenty of live shifts and good jocks.>

You're just not getting my point, None of the markets you listed are Small markets, They are also not the places a new jock goes to cut his/her teeth. And many stations in those markets use VT or syndication.

One last time, my point is the number of places where the newbie can polish his/her act is dwindling, not increasing! Therefor it is the law of diminishing return.

Fewer places where the newbie can get "good" = fewer newbies that will get "good";

fewer newbies getting "good" = the talent pool getting shallow!
Nothing hard about this.

Subject closed. Good luck on your career.
 
Wizard, take two Advil and call me in the morning.

Oh my opinion means plenty. See the last post here - it is all about the fact that we have a watered down pool of talent. Internet radio is providing more entertainment. It will be nice when that format gets into car radios

Until that time, we get to vent on boards like this.

have a nice day!
>
> You are hell bent on complaining it is not about SOMETHING
> its dj's one day and now it's song selection, the dj's are
> not picking the songs so your issue is with the program
> directors/music directors and the larger issue is the
> audience. In short there's no pleasing you so your opinion
> means little.
> >
> >
 
Re: Pardon Me, But Wrong

> > If you want to compare WBCN and WAAF with top 40 and do wop
> > have a good time, I'd recommend comparing them
> > against....let me think, how about WBCN and WCOZ?
> > Charles, et al.
>
> You can't decry "liners" and wax nostalgic about WCOZ in the
> same post. COZ was one of, if not THE original "Shut Up and
> Rock" stations. The jocks were allowed to say VERY little
> besides "Kick-Ass Rock & Roll." It's the same formula
> that's worked for John Sebastian over many years and
> multiple formats.

You must've only listened to WCOZ's last couple of years as a rock station, not the first couple.

For a couple of years in the mid-70's before Sebastian took over and brought in the "Kick-Ass Rock & Roll" flash in the pan (perhaps the biggest ratings "spike" ever in Boston, and also one of the fastest to fall), WCOZ was previously an innovative album rocker which gave WBCN quality competition on it's then-"progressive" turf, and the jocks, while "laid back" in execution, tried to connect with the audience, gave information about the music, and were not simply relegated to liner cards. It was a very good AOR station for a little while.
 
Re: Pardon Me, But Wrong

Subject's closed when I say it's closed.

You think the talent currently on the air can't carry the bag of some of the older hosts. I disagree, and named several good personalities in the Rock arena alone.

You think VTing and syndicated shows have wiped out the talent pool. I disagree. Boston radio hasn't suffered because economic realities eliminated somebody's chance to cut their teeth doing overnights in Southbridge. The small(er) suburban towns can be fine feeder markets. Nothing hard about this.

Thanks for the nice wishes on my career. I do appreciate it.<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by ActualRadioEmployee on 09/09/05 01:39 AM.</FONT></P>
 
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