Programmers say Dixie Chicks still not welcome on their airwaves

[firepoint525]

Ya think?

http://www.radio-info.com/programmi...ie-chicks-still-not-welcome-on-their-airwaves

 

[flashback]

its a shame that some fans of music , movies or whatever form of entertanment it is are incapable of enjoying an entertaner because of a political belief or statement .that they can`t seperate it from whether the artist is good at their work or not.

if the dixie chicks are to be judged by country music fans it should be for their music.

interestingly conservatives believe in freedoms being important yet so many got so up in arms when a recording artist exercised her freedom of speech.i know the first amendment does not include radio playlists but the hate for the statement that set the firestorm off is not intellectualy honest if supporters of free speech react the way many did.

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

Interesting read. Thanks for sharing the link.

I had wondered if stations and listeners had gotten to the point of "Let bygones be bygones." Evidently not.

 

[firepoint525]

Disclaimer: I never liked the Chicks even before "the controversy," so my opinion of them wasn't changed by anything that any of them ever said or did. I always sort of figured that they appealed to teenage and pre-teenage girls, sort of the country equivalent of the Spice Girls.

interestingly conservatives believe in freedoms being important yet so many got so up in arms when a recording artist exercised her freedom of speech.i know the first amendment does not include radio playlists but the hate for the statement that set the firestorm off is not intellectualy honest if supporters of free speech react the way many did.

I had wondered if stations and listeners had gotten to the point of "Let bygones be bygones." Evidently not.

Did either of you read the article? Given that the Chicks insulted their own (former) fans, how would you expect them to react? The Chicks forgot that fans also have freedom of speech. That was reflected in their slumping sales. They seemed to have it in for country artists from Oklahoma, which might explain their feuds with Vince Gill, Reba McEntire, and most notably, Toby Keith. (I kinda wish that they had also spoken out against Garth Brooks, because he is such an egomaniac, but since he was "retired" at the time, that might have come off as a cheap shot.) Evidently, their beef with President Bush was that he was from Texas. Had he been from Oklahoma, that might have fit right in with their other ongoing feuds.

My only complaint about the article was that it omitted any mention of the Courtyard Hounds. Since Martie and Emily had the Dixie Chick name before Natalie ever joined them, they could certainly have used the Dixie Chick name on the Courtyard Hounds project. I don't blame country radio for not playing Courtyard Hounds because it is not country, but it briefly got some airplay on the AAA station here. "Not Ready to Make Nice" had briefly also been on their playlist, but I don't recall ever hearing it played there.

 

[nocomradio]

In todays flash-in-the-pan world of music, I'd say the Dixie Chicks were about to run their professional course by the time all that controversy flared up. Two of the member had just gotten married and one was having a kid, the other planning to, and generally one the family starts the professional career begins to decline some.

That said, I was never a big fan, but did listen to country quite a bit in that time period, and never understood the flap entirely. They were entitled to their opinions, although I think the timing was the biggest issue. On the other hand, the fans and public are entitled to their opinions too, and if they don't like what they heard they have the right to not buy the records or listen to the artists.

Funny though, much worse stuff never got some other artists blacklisted like that: Think Jane Fonda.

 

[TheBigA]

This feels like a non-story to me. Sorry Phyllis, but they shot themselves, and then dug the hole even deeper.

I went to a press conference they gave long before the uproar, and they said they were looking forward to expanding beyond country radio. It's the reason they gave for recording "Landslide" and firing their original producer. Keep in mind that this third album was the first on their own label, released after the lawsuit against Sony. That lawsuit led to a lot of people getting fired, including the very people who made them stars. After the lawsuit, all the control for their radio promotion and publicity shifted to New York. The day the Natalie story broke, the people in Nashville tried to help, but New York said no. The folks in NYC had no idea how much Natalie's comments would offend people in the red states, particularly those with military bases. That included Texas! If you ever see the movie, "Shut Up and Sing," you'll see their manager turning down early opportunities for the girls to address the comments, before things got out of hand. By the time they returned to the US two months later, things were already out of hand, and it was too late to "make nice." Then they release their fourth album, and they make it seem like they were the ones who were wronged. Sorry, folks. We know the real story.

 

[firepoint525]

In todays flash-in-the-pan world of music, I'd say the Dixie Chicks were about to run their professional course by the time all that controversy flared up. Two of the member had just gotten married and one was having a kid, the other planning to, and generally one the family starts the professional career begins to decline some.

If you are saying that they would have eventually "jumped the shark" anyway, then yeah, I would agree with that. It's just that very few performers do so in such an awkward, clumsy, and very public way. All three of them are approaching 40 now, so the shark fins were obviously in sight.

 

[firepoint525]

It's the reason they gave for recording "Landslide" and firing their original producer.

I remember hearing an announcer at the local AC station referring to the Fleetwood Mac version as the "definitive" version of "Landslide." Important to note because they were one of the few formats that played both versions. I kinda knew that the Chicks were toast after that comment.

Then they release their fourth album, and they make it seem like they were the ones who were wronged. Sorry, folks. We know the real story.

I believe that they expected Hollywood to embrace them. And that never really happened.

 

[TheBigA]

I believe that they expected Hollywood to embrace them. And that never really happened.

They actually did. That album dominated the Grammy awards that year, and they felt vindicated. But it was the end of the line. The album didn;t sell well, and their touring days were over.

Look, did they sign a lousy record deal? Probably. Lots of people do. Should they have renegotiated? Sure. But their manager was pulling all the strings. He was the same one who signed them to the bad deal, then tried to get them out of it. He was the problem. Instead, all their label people were fired. So when this incident occurred, so one was there to save them.

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

I had wondered if stations and listeners had gotten to the point of "Let bygones be bygones." Evidently not.

Did either of you read the article? Given that the Chicks insulted their own (former) fans, how would you expect them to react? The Chicks forgot that fans also have freedom of speech. That was reflected in their slumping sales. They seemed to have it in for country artists from Oklahoma, which might explain their feuds with Vince Gill, Reba McEntire, and most notably, Toby Keith. (I kinda wish that they had also spoken out against Garth Brooks, because he is such an egomaniac, but since he was "retired" at the time, that might have come off as a cheap shot.) Evidently, their beef with President Bush was that he was from Texas. Had he been from Oklahoma, that might have fit right in with their other ongoing feuds.

Yes, I read the article in it's entirety before writing my post.

I purposely did NOT make my response any kind of political response either way.

No, their beef with President Bush was NOT that he was from Texas. Their beef with Mr. Bush was that he started a war and started it in a way they didn't agree with. That is THEIR freedom of speech.

Freedom of speech often is NOT FREE. You are free to say it, the the results of saying it can be very, very costly! You can lose friends because you speak up. You can lose your job because you exercise your (citizen's) freedom to speak out in a way that your employer has indicated is not compatible with your employment. In the case of the Dixie Chicks it cost them their career. As BigA has pointed out, their career may have been on the road to death anyway for all the reasons he listed.

Now, in this post, I will get a bit political:

[SET POLITICAL TO: ON]
I quit listening to country music radio about the same time as the fiasco of the Dixie Chix. I got tired of listening to Toby Keith and other cheerleaders for a war that I also disagreed with. I got tired of listening to dj's who were pandering to an audience that was hungry for raw meat and butt-kicking attitudes about how we handle our foreign relations pattern. Starting the wrong war is a big part of why we are in financial crisis in this country today.

[SET POLITICAL TO: OFF]

What was it about my first response that made you think that maybe I hadn't read the article in it's entirety? Yes, I read that part about the DJ who had worked in three different markets. In Madison, WI he could play the records by the girls. That should have been a hint that the Dixie Chix picked their musical friends and their non-friends for some other reason than what state they were from.

 

[landtuna]

Funny though, much worse stuff never got some other artists blacklisted like that: Think Jane Fonda.

I don't know if Fonda's career would have been different had she not consorted with NVA but she was not "blacklisted". She has had continuous work since then and apparently been shunned by a minor segment of Vietnam vets.

I'm a Vietnam vet but always liked her as an actress. Like so many other performers her personal life is her own. The biggest criminals in the Vietnam fiasco were not in Hollywood.

 

[buttonpusher812]

its a shame that some fans of music , movies or whatever form of entertanment it is are incapable of enjoying an entertaner because of a political belief or statement .that they can`t seperate it from whether the artist is good at their work or not.

if the dixie chicks are to be judged by country music fans it should be for their music.

interestingly conservatives believe in freedoms being important yet so many got so up in arms when a recording artist exercised her freedom of speech.i know the first amendment does not include radio playlists but the hate for the statement that set the firestorm off is not intellectualy honest if supporters of free speech react the way many did.

I agree, they may have an opinion and a political belief but, they were the ones who couldn't separate music from politics. They were the ones who made the statement a part of their show in another country. I for one don't think that I pay for a political class from the artist when I buy my ticket, I want to hear the hits. Had they made those comments in an interview with a news magazine where the music wasn't the focus or had they shown up at a political rally and carried a sign to show their point of view then I would be fine with that. They didn't.
They also should have known their audience and not bitten the hand that feeds them. An artist like Toby Keith can get away with a little more political talk because his beliefs tend to track very closely with the audience that makes up the vast majority of his fan base and that of country music as a whole.
At this point who needs them. As someone else commented, there have been allot of new artists and allot of new music in the past 8 1/2 years and quite frankly we don't have enough room in the play list now for songs that would seem to be better in the ears of the audience.
I would think that over half of the audience now would say "who?" if you asked about the Chicks and in another 5 years their place as a "footnote" in the history of country music will be secure.

 

[firepoint525]

Yes, I read the article in it's entirety before writing my post.
I purposely did NOT make my response any kind of political response either way.
No, their beef with President Bush was NOT that he was from Texas. Their beef with Mr. Bush was that he started a war and started it in a way they didn't agree with. That is THEIR freedom of speech.
Freedom of speech often is NOT FREE. You are free to say it, the the results of saying it can be very, very costly! You can lose friends because you speak up. You can lose your job because you exercise your (citizen's) freedom to speak out in a way that your employer has indicated is not compatible with your employment. In the case of the Dixie Chicks it cost them their career. As BigA has pointed out, their career may have been on the road to death anyway for all the reasons he listed.
Now, in this post, I will get a bit political:
[SET POLITICAL TO: ON]
I quit listening to country music radio about the same time as the fiasco of the Dixie Chix. I got tired of listening to Toby Keith and other cheerleaders for a war that I also disagreed with. I got tired of listening to dj's who were pandering to an audience that was hungry for raw meat and butt-kicking attitudes about how we handle our foreign relations pattern. Starting the wrong war is a big part of why we are in financial crisis in this country today.
[SET POLITICAL TO: OFF]
What was it about my first response that made you think that maybe I hadn't read the article in it's entirety? Yes, I read that part about the DJ who had worked in three different markets. In Madison, WI he could play the records by the girls. That should have been a hint that the Dixie Chix picked their musical friends and their non-friends for some other reason than what state they were from.

You obviously missed the part in which they insulted their own (former) fans. Remember, fans have the last word. (The irony in all this is that Toby Keith is supposedly a democrat, too.)

 

[firepoint525]

I believe that they expected Hollywood to embrace them. And that never really happened.

They actually did. That album dominated the Grammy awards that year, and they felt vindicated. But it was the end of the line. The album didn;t sell well, and their touring days were over.

Grammys mean nothing, partly because of head-scratching votes in the past (like Jethro Tull for best metal artist!?), partly because they are voted on by industry insiders, and partly because they are not based on sales, chart performance, or anything else of any substance. They had one good night from industry insiders, but no ongoing longstanding support since then. So Grammy night was basically just window-dressing for them. They received no real support from Hollyweird.

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

You obviously missed the part in which they insulted their own (former) fans. Remember, fans have the last word. (The irony in all this is that Toby Keith is supposedly a democrat, too.)

No, I didn't miss that part. But I apparently read it differently than you do.

“You forget to mention they publicly called country listeners stupid and backward,” he writes, recalling some blundering media statements the group made while attempting to mount a comeback in 2006.

You seem to be suggesting that their fans left them not only because the fans were unhappy that she would criticize The President, but that the fans left them because they insulted their fans... or "former fans" if you please. The fans were already lost long before the "stupid and backwards" insult was uttered about country music fans. (I don't know the timing of when they may have called Toby Keith "stupid and backwards".)

Toby Keith claimed he was a Democrat because his family was. Apparently where he lives/votes, you register to vote and state your party preference or declare yourself to be an independent. He changed his registration and no longer claims to be a Democrat as of maybe 2-1/2 years ago. He says he is now an Independent. (Just for grins, I just finished searching he Web for more information on Toby Keith and his political thinking, his political attachments and his participation in politically oriented events. He is like a lot of Americans. He is all-over-the-place. He considers himself "patriotic" and free to hang out with people from both sides of the political spectrum. May his tribe increase!)

You are really hung up on this topic, FirePoint. There is no room in your thinking for someone to have an opinion different than yours.

Some of us like the Dixie Chicks. Some of us hate the Dixie Chicks. Some of us have no opinion of the Dixie Chicks. You've made your point: You don't like them. You don't intend to forgive them. What else is there to say? Why would you keep telling me I don't know how to read if I suggest that I look at them differently than you do?

 

[flashback]

its a shame that some fans of music , movies or whatever form of entertanment it is are incapable of enjoying an entertaner because of a political belief or statement .that they can`t seperate it from whether the artist is good at their work or not.

if the dixie chicks are to be judged by country music fans it should be for their music.

interestingly conservatives believe in freedoms being important yet so many got so up in arms when a recording artist exercised her freedom of speech.i know the first amendment does not include radio playlists but the hate for the statement that set the firestorm off is not intellectualy honest if supporters of free speech react the way many did.

I agree, they may have an opinion and a political belief but, they were the ones who couldn't separate music from politics. They were the ones who made the statement a part of their show in another country. I for one don't think that I pay for a political class from the artist when I buy my ticket, I want to hear the hits. Had they made those comments in an interview with a news magazine where the music wasn't the focus or had they shown up at a political rally and carried a sign to show their point of view then I would be fine with that. They didn't.
They also should have known their audience and not bitten the hand that feeds them. An artist like Toby Keith can get away with a little more political talk because his beliefs tend to track very closely with the audience that makes up the vast majority of his fan base and that of country music as a whole.
At this point who needs them. As someone else commented, there have been allot of new artists and allot of new music in the past 8 1/2 years and quite frankly we don't have enough room in the play list now for songs that would seem to be better in the ears of the audience.
I would think that over half of the audience now would say "who?" if you asked about the Chicks and in another 5 years their place as a "footnote" in the history of country music will be secure.

so toby keith can give his views in a concert because the views fit the audiance.the dixie chicks shouldn`t because they are too diffrent.

i think the playing field should be leviled.if one can all can and if one can`t none can.

as i said earlier the artist should be judged by their art. a rational person should seperate what the performer believes and says from the art and purely judge from the work.

as performers i dont miss the dixie chicks.it has nothing to do with theiir comment.

 

[TheBigA]

so toby keith can give his views in a concert because the views fit the audiance.the dixie chicks shouldn`t because they are too diffrent.

Not exactly. First of all, the Chicks made their comments while on tour in England. Not in the US. Second, I think both artists have paid a price for being outspoken. For all of Toby's success on the radio, he's never won a Grammy, and he hasn't won many of the country music awards. There's clearly some tension between him and the music industry, and he pays for that in less public ways. As has been said, there are always consequences to free speech. However, Toby's opinions resonated more with his fans. Meanwhile, the Chicks had already been working towards leaving country music and thought this could win them new fans. I believe Natalie's comments weren't an accident. Certainly the FUTK t-shirt wasn't an accident. This was all done for a reason, and I think it backfired in the long run.

 

[TheBigA]

as i said earlier the artist should be judged by their art. a rational person should seperate what the performer believes and says from the art and purely judge from the work.

One question that might be asked: What happens when what an artist believes becomes part of their art? When they become one and the same. Toby continues to sing patriotic songs, and the Chicks recorded "Not Ready To Make Nice." Most journalists will say: When you sing about it, that makes it fair game.

 

[firepoint525]

You are really hung up on this topic, FirePoint. There is no room in your thinking for someone to have an opinion different than yours.
Some of us like the Dixie Chicks. Some of us hate the Dixie Chicks. Some of us have no opinion of the Dixie Chicks. You've made your point: You don't like them. You don't intend to forgive them. What else is there to say? Why would you keep telling me I don't know how to read if I suggest that I look at them differently than you do?

Wrong, you seemed to ignore parts of the story that didn't fit with your preconceived notions. You said that they would take support anywhere that they could get it. You obviously missed the part about them dissing the country station in some given market (that had previously supported them) in favor of going after the CHR in the same market, only to have that CHR diss them! The problem for them is that the opposition to them was (and is) strong, while support for them (where it existed) was lukewarm. (And in CHR, it was non-existant!) Even the PDs who still play them in markets like Portland and Austin, etc., said that they only "sprinkle" in the occasional Chicks song in evening and weekend dayparts.

 

[landtuna]

I have been a John Denver fan since his first public appearance. He remains the only artist that drew me to every concert he played in my town. But at the last concert he quit singing midway through and began to lecture the audience on saving the whales.

I suspect every single person that night knew full well Denver was a proponent for ecology but I also suspect he lost a bit of respect for his art by going off-topic and subjecting his fans to his own personal beliefs. We were there, after all, to see him sing.

Had he come back to Phoenix sometime later I am not sure I would have attended. I love whales too but that's not what I paid good money to hear.