I have a question concerning the Arsenio Hall show which aired from 1989-1994. Has any NBC affiliate pre-empted The Tonight Show or A Late Night with David Letterman for the Arsenio Hall show?
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Question about Arsenio Hall
- Thread starter edward1978
- Start date
I don't think they were many NBC affiliates, if any at all, that carried the original Arsenio Hall Show...if so, it was probably in the smallest markets; his affiliate base was mostly limited to CBS stations (for example, in Chicago, Baltimore, Atlanta, Cleveland), Fox (in San Diego, Philadelphia, Milwaukee, Kansas City), or independents (New York City, Los Angeles). I know there were also a smattering of ABC affiliates that carried Arsenio (for example, in Santa Barbara, Cal. and in my hometown of Rockford, Ill.).
The Tonight Show (under Carson or Leno) wasn't pre-empted by any NBC station, except in Nashville and Milwaukee (both during different periods during the 1980s), although independent stations in both cities picked it up instead. Minneapolis-St. Paul and Birmingham both delayed the Carson Tonight Show by a half-hour for years before finally airing the show in-pattern with the rest of the network.
Letterman, however, may be a different story...someone may been able to answer that question.
The Tonight Show (under Carson or Leno) wasn't pre-empted by any NBC station, except in Nashville and Milwaukee (both during different periods during the 1980s), although independent stations in both cities picked it up instead. Minneapolis-St. Paul and Birmingham both delayed the Carson Tonight Show by a half-hour for years before finally airing the show in-pattern with the rest of the network.
Letterman, however, may be a different story...someone may been able to answer that question.
B
Bob1370
Guest
First a word about Arsenio's impending return. You probably won't see anyone pre-empt late night network talkers for the show that's launching this coming fall--but then again, there are so many more outlets now (a lot of independents, Fox stations, CW and MyNetwork affiliates out there that didn't exist in 1989) that Arsenio can get national carriage in almost all the top 150 markets without getting a substantial number of defections from the big three).
Back in the day, all the NBC affiliates stayed with Carson because he was the leader and clearly no one was going to displace him (and no one ever did). Letterman wasn't even an issue at the 11 or 11:30 ET time period when Arsenio was usually carried most of his original run, because he was following Carson on NBC at 12:30 when Arsenio started (and wasn't head to head with him until the last nine months of Arsenio's original series).When Letterman DID start on CBS at the end of August 1993, literally every affiliate of CBS carried him from day one except KMEG in Sioux City, Iowa (which became a running joke on the show for six months until they picked him up too in the spring of 1994).
A significant number of CBS, ABC and Fox affiliates DID try Arsenio and many got good results with him from 1989 through the summer of 1993. Letterman's arrival at CBS was what really clobbered Arsenio's first show. Dave grabbed a lot of the late night audience from the get go, especially in younger demos, at a time when Jay Leno was struggling to find his footing as Carson's successor.
Arsenio is coming back to a very different environment in 2013 than the one he entered in 1989. The late night audience is both much bigger than it was in '89, and a lot more fragmented. All three of the biggest broadcast networks are competing now at 11:30 with formatically similar talk and variery shows (it's Letterman on CBS vs. Leno on NBC vs. Jimmy Kimmel on ABC, who is 17 to 20 years younger than his network competitors and 11 years younger than Arsenio). There's also Jon Stewart, Steven Colbert and Chelsea Handler drawing substantial audiences on channels that didn't even exist when Arsenio first hit the air. And Jimmy Fallon isn't far behind...he's probably going to be running the Tonight Show before long.
How well will he do this time? He is a smart, talented guy, though he's also only a little younger than the rest of the baby boomers who have dominated late night TV on the networks since Carson's retirement 20 years ago. The typical late night viewer today is a 30-something who's more a contemporary of Jimmy Fallon or Chelsea Handler.
Back in the day, all the NBC affiliates stayed with Carson because he was the leader and clearly no one was going to displace him (and no one ever did). Letterman wasn't even an issue at the 11 or 11:30 ET time period when Arsenio was usually carried most of his original run, because he was following Carson on NBC at 12:30 when Arsenio started (and wasn't head to head with him until the last nine months of Arsenio's original series).When Letterman DID start on CBS at the end of August 1993, literally every affiliate of CBS carried him from day one except KMEG in Sioux City, Iowa (which became a running joke on the show for six months until they picked him up too in the spring of 1994).
A significant number of CBS, ABC and Fox affiliates DID try Arsenio and many got good results with him from 1989 through the summer of 1993. Letterman's arrival at CBS was what really clobbered Arsenio's first show. Dave grabbed a lot of the late night audience from the get go, especially in younger demos, at a time when Jay Leno was struggling to find his footing as Carson's successor.
Arsenio is coming back to a very different environment in 2013 than the one he entered in 1989. The late night audience is both much bigger than it was in '89, and a lot more fragmented. All three of the biggest broadcast networks are competing now at 11:30 with formatically similar talk and variery shows (it's Letterman on CBS vs. Leno on NBC vs. Jimmy Kimmel on ABC, who is 17 to 20 years younger than his network competitors and 11 years younger than Arsenio). There's also Jon Stewart, Steven Colbert and Chelsea Handler drawing substantial audiences on channels that didn't even exist when Arsenio first hit the air. And Jimmy Fallon isn't far behind...he's probably going to be running the Tonight Show before long.
How well will he do this time? He is a smart, talented guy, though he's also only a little younger than the rest of the baby boomers who have dominated late night TV on the networks since Carson's retirement 20 years ago. The typical late night viewer today is a 30-something who's more a contemporary of Jimmy Fallon or Chelsea Handler.
This was talked about in another Arsenio thread a week or two ago. His former audience is now about 20 years older. He may get some of them back (and undoubtedly could have huge numbers right off the bat) but will he come back with something new or will his old shtick work 20 years later.
There's also a whole demographic who have never seen him host a talk show and only do what he's done the last few years (hosting Star Search, winning Celebrity Apprentice, guesting on various talk shows).
So can he win again with Burton Richardson and ARSENIOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HALLLLLLLLLLLLL; Michael Wolf and The Posse; the dogpound; Kick It Sandy; the John B Williams Poetry Moment; and, hopefully, Star Parodi on drums? Or does he have to come up with something else?
There's also a whole demographic who have never seen him host a talk show and only do what he's done the last few years (hosting Star Search, winning Celebrity Apprentice, guesting on various talk shows).
So can he win again with Burton Richardson and ARSENIOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HALLLLLLLLLLLLL; Michael Wolf and The Posse; the dogpound; Kick It Sandy; the John B Williams Poetry Moment; and, hopefully, Star Parodi on drums? Or does he have to come up with something else?
PHL17 here in Philadelphia is alreadly blitzing the airwaves with promos 8 months out from the show's debut. I hope the show lasts longer than the hype.
...I have a feeling it won't. It'll be no different than the last times Jack Paar and Dick Cavett were brought back onto late-night commercial network TV. Tom Snyder lasted longer largely because (a) his CBS show was simply the same as the NBC show he had success with until Roger Ailes turned it fubar, and (b) it was notably different from the rest of the offerings at the time (it was an old-school broadcaster calmly conversing with guests instead of a comedian trying to wring laughs out of every minute on the show). Arsenio won't make it past 13 weeks without radical changes in his show's structure since the last time he was on late night...OldNumber7 said:
If I remember correctly Arsenio Hall was the replacement for Joan Rivers, who sealed her fate when she betrayed Carson by launching her own talker competing with Carson. She is currently the host of Fashion Police on E! What really boosted Hall was the aftermath of the L.A. Riots. He became the spokesman for the Young Black community. :
visaman said:If I remember correctly Arsenio Hall was the replacement for Joan Rivers, who sealed her fate when she betrayed Carson by launching her own talker competing with Carson. She is currently the host of Fashion Police on E! What really boosted Hall was the aftermath of the L.A. Riots. He became the spokesman for the Young Black community. :
Yes, Hall was made host of THE LATE SHOW but for only 13 weeks in 1987 - he had already commited to doing "Comming to America" with Eddie Murphy, and FOX had lined up what became a bigger disaster, "The Wilton North Report" - which when that falled, they were unable to get Hall back as he had commited to his own show syndicated by Paramount Television.
If FOX could have gotten Hall back - the landscape of Late Night television might look different today. National Clearance at 11pm, and a strong network - not a syndicator - behind him - might have better weathed Dave Letterman's 11:30pm move to CBS. (Which cost Hall affilates,time-slots and Viewers)
The thing is, Hall is going into what is a 5 player field - Dave,Jay,Jimmy K on Broadcast,and Conan and John Stewart on Cable. Not to mention WHY the CBS' syndication arm is putting up a show that will compete with Dave on their own network! (I don't subscribe to the theory they are trying him out as a possible replacement for Dave with a jump to the network when the time comes.)
...the L.A. Riots were in April of 1992, over three years after Hall started in syndication. What actually boosted Hall was the failure of The Pat Sajak Show in 1990, which led quite a few of Sajak's CBS affiliates to pick up Hall as a replacement (provided an indie or Fox affiliate hadn't already grabbed him)...visaman said:If I remember correctly...What really boosted Hall was the aftermath of the L.A. Riots. He became the spokesman for the Young Black community. :
ShawnHill1 said:
There was a station that ran Arsenio between Carson and Letterman. The ABC station in Columbia MO (KMIZ) carried Arsenio, delaying Nightline
visaman said:If I remember correctly Arsenio Hall was the replacement for Joan Rivers, who sealed her fate when she betrayed Carson by launching her own talker competing with Carson. She is currently the host of Fashion Police on E! What really boosted Hall was the aftermath of the L.A. Riots. He became the spokesman for the Young Black community. :
Arsenio took away younger viewers from Carson, he had guests Carson would never have on. Arsenio won't last if he still thinks it's 1990
I seem to remember WMGM-TV in South Jersey running Arsenio in the early '90s -- at 2:00 AM, after Later with Bob Costas. They may have been the only NBC affiliate east of Mississippi to run the program
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