I've always wondered how radio stations went about format changes, especially in the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s (the days before computers and cd's). Did stations who changed from one form of music to another (i.e., WFIL in 1966 from MOR to top-40, or WCAU top-40 to oldies in 1987)have those records in their library? Did they have to purchase them? What happened to the records from the old format? Also, how did stations train the new DJ's? Where was it done? Did the outgoing staff see them? Finally, how long in advance were format changes planned? It seems like now, a new format is merely loaded into a computer hard drive and a station flips effortlessly. Thanks for your help.
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Question about format changes
- Thread starter rich610
- Start date
I think I can answer a couple of these; the old libraries were either retained by the station, or in some cases, stations traded their inventory. WAAT in Trenton had a lot of leftover C&W records from their format change back to Top 40, and around that time, WRCP was converting to Country. WAAT dumped a lot of Country LPs onto WRCP, and when WAAT morphed into a mostly standards format, WRCP returned the favor.
As far as format changes, they happened a lot less frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station, and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format change was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to All News, was the first real adjustment to any major Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top personality radio station in Philadelphia.
As far as format changes, they happened a lot less frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station, and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format change was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to All News, was the first real adjustment to any major Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top personality radio station in Philadelphia.
E
Ethel
Guest
> I've always wondered how radio stations went about format
> changes, especially in the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s (the days
> before computers and cd's). Did stations who changed from
> one form of music to another (i.e., WFIL in 1966 from MOR to
> top-40, or WCAU top-40 to oldies in 1987)have those records
> in their library? Did they have to purchase them? What
> happened to the records from the old format? Also, how did
> stations train the new DJ's? Where was it done? Did the
> outgoing staff see them? Finally, how long in advance were
> format changes planned? It seems like now, a new format is
> merely loaded into a computer hard drive and a station flips
> effortlessly. Thanks for your help.
>
I know in the 80's a format change happened a couple times with me.
First time no staff changes..as the company was cheap..
Went from top 40 to Album rock with Burkhardt Abrams consulting.
That was about 1980. Burkhard Abrams rep Jon Sinton(of Air america)
came in and put paper card index files together for the music. Dubbed it from vinyl on to cart. We played some from vinyl too. He was real anxious to
get us on the air with the format as the ratings were beginning soon in Oct '80.
I liked working with him. He helped me alot with my airchecks.
I thought I sucked and he said I was good. He told me back then their
was a woman on WYSP in Philly. I don't remember who that was. Maybe you guys would.
A station I know in '80 went from FM Beautiful music to top 40FM overnight.
Rumors were going around before the switch for a few months..as to who would be on the air. They took a jock or two from a competing AMTop 40 station so those two knew what was going on. They did it on new years eve '79 and called it the station of the '80s.
That was pretty shocking to the beautiful music listeners next day. But it paid off for the owner..
In 86 at a top 40/Urban in FL..I was basically laid off so to speak when the new company took over. Their GM had told me I would be kept in some capicity.. an air shift..but wasn't. The PD had no plans for me.
The new guys were staying in hotels nearby I think. The format change happened on a weekend..sat morning. Most of the music was in house.. They didn't change too much just less Urban.
In NYC...
Stern took over after Jay Thomas at WXRK( which changed to rock I think from what ever Jay was playing..top40 I guess)
(Stern was on in the afternoon I think first and then mornings..)
I think Jay was taken in the day before or that morning and fired..
Stern called Jay at home after he was fired.( I have an aircheck of that.) and the bit was really funny. Stern was playing Jay's old corny drops he had left in the studio.
Jay told him not to play them as they were "copywrited"..
The drops sounded cartoonish to me. No wonder he got fired.
Jay has had his moments..but he is an actor at heart..
I think format change plans were and are still made in advance most of the time and hushed up ..
Stations for sale used to be a tip off .....and most jocks looked for jobs when they found out. AS for the music, I guess they just got record service from the record companies for whatever format they wanted..or bought it at stores if they were keeping it a secret. Cheap stations got music from the jock's collections also and just dubbed it off.
Those are the ones I can remember.. Guys who worked in the 60's and 70's may have another story to tell.
> changes, especially in the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s (the days
> before computers and cd's). Did stations who changed from
> one form of music to another (i.e., WFIL in 1966 from MOR to
> top-40, or WCAU top-40 to oldies in 1987)have those records
> in their library? Did they have to purchase them? What
> happened to the records from the old format? Also, how did
> stations train the new DJ's? Where was it done? Did the
> outgoing staff see them? Finally, how long in advance were
> format changes planned? It seems like now, a new format is
> merely loaded into a computer hard drive and a station flips
> effortlessly. Thanks for your help.
>
I know in the 80's a format change happened a couple times with me.
First time no staff changes..as the company was cheap..
Went from top 40 to Album rock with Burkhardt Abrams consulting.
That was about 1980. Burkhard Abrams rep Jon Sinton(of Air america)
came in and put paper card index files together for the music. Dubbed it from vinyl on to cart. We played some from vinyl too. He was real anxious to
get us on the air with the format as the ratings were beginning soon in Oct '80.
I liked working with him. He helped me alot with my airchecks.
I thought I sucked and he said I was good. He told me back then their
was a woman on WYSP in Philly. I don't remember who that was. Maybe you guys would.
A station I know in '80 went from FM Beautiful music to top 40FM overnight.
Rumors were going around before the switch for a few months..as to who would be on the air. They took a jock or two from a competing AMTop 40 station so those two knew what was going on. They did it on new years eve '79 and called it the station of the '80s.
That was pretty shocking to the beautiful music listeners next day. But it paid off for the owner..
In 86 at a top 40/Urban in FL..I was basically laid off so to speak when the new company took over. Their GM had told me I would be kept in some capicity.. an air shift..but wasn't. The PD had no plans for me.
The new guys were staying in hotels nearby I think. The format change happened on a weekend..sat morning. Most of the music was in house.. They didn't change too much just less Urban.
In NYC...
Stern took over after Jay Thomas at WXRK( which changed to rock I think from what ever Jay was playing..top40 I guess)
(Stern was on in the afternoon I think first and then mornings..)
I think Jay was taken in the day before or that morning and fired..
Stern called Jay at home after he was fired.( I have an aircheck of that.) and the bit was really funny. Stern was playing Jay's old corny drops he had left in the studio.
Jay told him not to play them as they were "copywrited"..
The drops sounded cartoonish to me. No wonder he got fired.
Jay has had his moments..but he is an actor at heart..
I think format change plans were and are still made in advance most of the time and hushed up ..
Stations for sale used to be a tip off .....and most jocks looked for jobs when they found out. AS for the music, I guess they just got record service from the record companies for whatever format they wanted..or bought it at stores if they were keeping it a secret. Cheap stations got music from the jock's collections also and just dubbed it off.
Those are the ones I can remember.. Guys who worked in the 60's and 70's may have another story to tell.
B
BobAltimari
Guest
I would have to say the modern day format flip is usually a stunt until the engineering staff can come in, install the new computer system (with the new format, ie: music, drops, etc., already loaded) and do a dry run to work out the bugs before the official launch. <P ID="signature">______________
I've done it all...HOO HOO...tell 'em, Fred!
FOX News Alert: YOU SUCK!!! Ya like apples?</P>
I've done it all...HOO HOO...tell 'em, Fred!
FOX News Alert: YOU SUCK!!! Ya like apples?</P>
A friend of mine was one of three engineers at WZZD-Wizzard 100 when they changed to Christian.
The three engineers divided the WZZD/WIBG record collection that has been used since the fifties.
My friend got all the 45 RPM singles and the other two divided up the LP's.
> I think I can answer a couple of these; the old libraries
> were either retained by the station, or in some cases,
> stations traded their inventory. WAAT in Trenton had a lot
> of leftover C&W records from their format change back to Top
> 40, and around that time, WRCP was converting to Country.
> WAAT dumped a lot of Country LPs onto WRCP, and when WAAT
> morphed into a mostly standards format, WRCP returned the
> favor.
>
> As far as format changes, they happened a lot less
> frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station,
> and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format change
> was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to
> All News, was the first real adjustment to any major
> Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was
> when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and
> retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that
> was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top personality
> radio station in Philadelphia.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
The three engineers divided the WZZD/WIBG record collection that has been used since the fifties.
My friend got all the 45 RPM singles and the other two divided up the LP's.
> I think I can answer a couple of these; the old libraries
> were either retained by the station, or in some cases,
> stations traded their inventory. WAAT in Trenton had a lot
> of leftover C&W records from their format change back to Top
> 40, and around that time, WRCP was converting to Country.
> WAAT dumped a lot of Country LPs onto WRCP, and when WAAT
> morphed into a mostly standards format, WRCP returned the
> favor.
>
> As far as format changes, they happened a lot less
> frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station,
> and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format change
> was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to
> All News, was the first real adjustment to any major
> Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was
> when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and
> retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that
> was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top personality
> radio station in Philadelphia.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
> I would have to say the modern day format flip is usually a
> stunt until the engineering staff can come in, install the
> new computer system (with the new format, ie: music, drops,
> etc., already loaded) and do a dry run to work out the bugs
> before the official launch.
>
EHHH I dunno about that one. Of course the drops and stuff may take awhile but the production team would be working on that once they know the flip is gonna hit. The music is really not hard to be loaded into the system especially if A. It's a big cluster (borrow from a lot of sister stations if you could.) B. Big Corporate Companies can borrow songs and playlists from other stations on their network.
Honestly I think a higher up could say lets flip and the could do it over one day and one over night period.
> stunt until the engineering staff can come in, install the
> new computer system (with the new format, ie: music, drops,
> etc., already loaded) and do a dry run to work out the bugs
> before the official launch.
>
EHHH I dunno about that one. Of course the drops and stuff may take awhile but the production team would be working on that once they know the flip is gonna hit. The music is really not hard to be loaded into the system especially if A. It's a big cluster (borrow from a lot of sister stations if you could.) B. Big Corporate Companies can borrow songs and playlists from other stations on their network.
Honestly I think a higher up could say lets flip and the could do it over one day and one over night period.
M
mwebster
Guest
Reportedly, the WFLN classical music collection could have gone anywhere - but it went to Temple (WRTI).
WIP's change was more evolutionary than revolutionary. They backed off on hard rock singles (keeping the MOR cross-over stuff - and top 40 stations played a substantial portion of MOR in the late 50's and early 60's, at least during the day), and started adding standards to the mix. Even so, Metromedia never came close with WIP to what they had with WNEW, New York. The music was similar, WIP's DJ's were not in the same league with WNEW's personalities.
> I think I can answer a couple of these; the old libraries
> were either retained by the station, or in some cases,
> stations traded their inventory. WAAT in Trenton had a lot
> of leftover C&W records from their format change back to Top
> 40, and around that time, WRCP was converting to Country.
> WAAT dumped a lot of Country LPs onto WRCP, and when WAAT
> morphed into a mostly standards format, WRCP returned the
> favor.
>
> As far as format changes, they happened a lot less
> frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station,
> and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format change
> was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to
> All News, was the first real adjustment to any major
> Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was
> when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and
> retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that
> was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top personality
> radio station in Philadelphia.
>
WIP's change was more evolutionary than revolutionary. They backed off on hard rock singles (keeping the MOR cross-over stuff - and top 40 stations played a substantial portion of MOR in the late 50's and early 60's, at least during the day), and started adding standards to the mix. Even so, Metromedia never came close with WIP to what they had with WNEW, New York. The music was similar, WIP's DJ's were not in the same league with WNEW's personalities.
> I think I can answer a couple of these; the old libraries
> were either retained by the station, or in some cases,
> stations traded their inventory. WAAT in Trenton had a lot
> of leftover C&W records from their format change back to Top
> 40, and around that time, WRCP was converting to Country.
> WAAT dumped a lot of Country LPs onto WRCP, and when WAAT
> morphed into a mostly standards format, WRCP returned the
> favor.
>
> As far as format changes, they happened a lot less
> frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station,
> and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format change
> was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to
> All News, was the first real adjustment to any major
> Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was
> when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and
> retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that
> was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top personality
> radio station in Philadelphia.
>
> I've always wondered how radio stations went about format
> changes, especially in the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s (the days
> before computers and cd's). Did stations who changed from
> one form of music to another (i.e., WFIL in 1966 from MOR to
> top-40, or WCAU top-40 to oldies in 1987)have those records
> in their library? Did they have to purchase them? What
> happened to the records from the old format? Also, how did
> stations train the new DJ's? Where was it done? Did the
> outgoing staff see them? Finally, how long in advance were
> format changes planned? It seems like now, a new format is
> merely loaded into a computer hard drive and a station flips
> effortlessly. Thanks for your help.
I've heard that when WKTU in New York flipped to disco in the '70s they started by sending a station employee out with a credit card to buy hundreds of dollars' worth of vinyl.
When WINS in New York went all news supposedly Fordham University was given the record library.
> changes, especially in the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s (the days
> before computers and cd's). Did stations who changed from
> one form of music to another (i.e., WFIL in 1966 from MOR to
> top-40, or WCAU top-40 to oldies in 1987)have those records
> in their library? Did they have to purchase them? What
> happened to the records from the old format? Also, how did
> stations train the new DJ's? Where was it done? Did the
> outgoing staff see them? Finally, how long in advance were
> format changes planned? It seems like now, a new format is
> merely loaded into a computer hard drive and a station flips
> effortlessly. Thanks for your help.
I've heard that when WKTU in New York flipped to disco in the '70s they started by sending a station employee out with a credit card to buy hundreds of dollars' worth of vinyl.
When WINS in New York went all news supposedly Fordham University was given the record library.
I heard that Temple University (WRTI) received the classical music collection of WFLN with over fifty years of accumulated recordings.
> When WINS in New York went all news supposedly Fordham
> University was given the record library.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
> When WINS in New York went all news supposedly Fordham
> University was given the record library.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
Nor were their jingles.
> WIP's change was more evolutionary than revolutionary. They
> backed off on hard rock singles (keeping the MOR cross-over
> stuff - and top 40 stations played a substantial portion of
> MOR in the late 50's and early 60's, at least during the
> day), and started adding standards to the mix. Even so,
> Metromedia never came close with WIP to what they had with
> WNEW, New York. The music was similar, WIP's DJ's were not
> in the same league with WNEW's personalities.
>
> > I think I can answer a couple of these; the old libraries
> > were either retained by the station, or in some cases,
> > stations traded their inventory. WAAT in Trenton had a lot
>
> > of leftover C&W records from their format change back to
> Top
> > 40, and around that time, WRCP was converting to Country.
> > WAAT dumped a lot of Country LPs onto WRCP, and when WAAT
> > morphed into a mostly standards format, WRCP returned the
> > favor.
> >
> > As far as format changes, they happened a lot less
> > frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station,
>
> > and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format
> change
> > was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to
>
> > All News, was the first real adjustment to any major
> > Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was
> > when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and
>
> > retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that
>
> > was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top
> personality
> > radio station in Philadelphia.
> >
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
> WIP's change was more evolutionary than revolutionary. They
> backed off on hard rock singles (keeping the MOR cross-over
> stuff - and top 40 stations played a substantial portion of
> MOR in the late 50's and early 60's, at least during the
> day), and started adding standards to the mix. Even so,
> Metromedia never came close with WIP to what they had with
> WNEW, New York. The music was similar, WIP's DJ's were not
> in the same league with WNEW's personalities.
>
> > I think I can answer a couple of these; the old libraries
> > were either retained by the station, or in some cases,
> > stations traded their inventory. WAAT in Trenton had a lot
>
> > of leftover C&W records from their format change back to
> Top
> > 40, and around that time, WRCP was converting to Country.
> > WAAT dumped a lot of Country LPs onto WRCP, and when WAAT
> > morphed into a mostly standards format, WRCP returned the
> > favor.
> >
> > As far as format changes, they happened a lot less
> > frequently, were done as wholesale changes to the station,
>
> > and were planned out far in advance. The WFIL format
> change
> > was in the works almost a year...and after the KYW flip to
>
> > All News, was the first real adjustment to any major
> > Philadelphia radio station in almost six years. That was
> > when WIP flirted with going head to head against WIBG, and
>
> > retreated into their personality MOR format. The crew that
>
> > was hired for Top 40 went on to make WIP the top
> personality
> > radio station in Philadelphia.
> >
>
<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected]</P>
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