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Question for drt - DXing at Hutchinson Island

gar hi

gar hi

In an older thread about AM saltwater propagation, you mentioned being at Hutchinson Island and not being able to hear any of the New York stations.

I've more recently crossed the state to Stuart (about 34 miles north of Palm Beach) and on the beach there (Hutchinson Island) I was not able to pick up any of the NYC clear channels or anything north of
Charleston for that matter. At the time (just before the 880 in Miami came on the air); all I got on 880 was Cuba, the same for 770; and nothing on 660 except for a very weak signal on the 660 out of Orlando. 710 was a strong WAQI (50,000 watts) out of Miami.
Click to expand...



What I'm wondering is exactly what kind of receiver did you use at the time?

I'm asking because I'm considering another trip to the east coast of Florida for AM daytime DXing and I wanted to pick a location more south of Daytona Beach but not too close to Miami.

A straight line from High Island in Queens (where WFAN and WCBS transmit from) crosses virtually no land except for right along the Jersey shore and the tip of eastern North Carolina, which is mostly saltwater inlets, so that means almost a complete saltwater path.

After hearing the audio of how strong they are in Bermuda daytime (almost 800 miles), I'm wondering if there would still be something left after another 200 miles with a good receiver. I'm sure WZAB 880 has a fairly decent signal there but I could still listen in the background.

I also don't know how much splash if any I would get from the station on 670 in Miami on 660. WABC would probably be impossible because they are located inland and cross more land but it would be worth a try.

My Sangean PR-D5 along with the Terk loop has given me daytime catches that were not thought possible such as KTRH at the Gulf and what could have been traces of WFAN and WCBS in Daytona Beach, so I was wondering if it's worth a try on Hutchinson Island.
 
Hi GarFla, this was several years ago, before I had my Grundig Satelite 750 and the Sangean PR-D5.........I was using a GE SuperRadio III, which has good sensitivity but isn't the easiest radio to tune, so to assist me in figuring out what frequency I had tuned when I wasn't sure I would briefly get in the car and compare. (at the time I had one of the worst car radios I've ever had the displeasure of owning).....also a friend of mine has just got off the air of a Ft. Pierce/Stuart FM and he was on the phone with me as I was going through the dial and telling me what I should be hearing and what to listen for.

I was impressed to get WTMA 1250 out of Charleston and the 630 out of Savannah, I never dreamed that under the right conditions, that I might get NYC. Also this was done in June, not the best time of year to DX on the AM band and my time was limited as I had to be somewhere at noon; I was only able to dx from about 1030 - 1130 that morning.

I would like to try again, knowing what I know now, but I would be doing it sometime between Veterans' Day and mid February, where there is also the possibility of daytime skywave. Of course this time, I would have both the Grundig and Sangean in tow. WCBS 880, even in the best of conditions would be more of a challenge now due to the new 880 in Sweetwater/Miami,but I suspect if anyone could do it, it would be you; with your perserverance and determination!

Also 810 out of Freeport booms inlike a local on the beach and even a few miles inland.

btw- the person I know in the Fort Pierce Stuart area that suggested Hutchinson for that part of the state, regularly goes to Myrtle Beach, SC for what he considers the best dx'ing on the Atlantic coast.

btw2- If you end up getting gasoline toward the east coast and take S.R. 70 to cross the state, Okeechobee's gas prices are much cheaper, as a rule than Stuart, PSL or the Palm Beaches.

drt
 
Thanks for that nice reply!

The reason I had picked Daytona Beach as the spot on the east coast to do my daytime DXing for NYC was because it seemed to be the best place with the least co channel interference from Florida stations (which I still got anyway) and there were many hotels to choose from.

The only drawback was that it meant more land for the NYC stations to cross. The Ft. Pierce beaches seemed like a better spot because of much less land path but there were few hotels on the beach and they weren't cheap. Now, I found a cheap one which is on the mainland right near the intercoastal waterway, so it's a short drive over to Hutchinson Island where I can set up my equipment during the day and I can even spend two nights there so I won't be rushed and be able to have plenty of time midday to scan the AM band and maybe get an entire log of stations, not just any possible New York reception.

I don't want there to be any skywave involved, of course, so I'm not sure if I should do this sooner or later. I would think that by late February, at least most of the AM band should be free of midday skywave here. March would not be a good time to be there because of all the spring breakers. I could wait till April but the chance of bad weather seems greater by then and by May and onward, there's often a lot of lightning static around even if in the distance, not to mention the local storms that pop up.

My Sangean PR-D5 along with the loop can actually pick up some stations that are absent on my car radio which isn't a bad car radio either.

I guess all the nice weather we've been having lately has me motivated to take another DXing adventure.
 
I myself have wanted to attempt DXn from Cape Canaveral, but on the maps, I see no access to their coastline. Any idea how I can get to the shoreline at the cape? or is the place top secret?

cd
 
I was dx'ing on South Hutchinson Island, the part in Martin county, there's a state park/beach there with plenty of parking just yards away from the Atlantic, as far as spring breakers, they really don't congregate in the Stuart area, so that's not a problem.

I didn't have a loop and that would have certainly helped, but this was a last minute idea to dx, I had to be in Stuart and had some time to kill, just lucky I had the GE Super Radio III with me; as a rule I generally do have one dx'ing radio with me. The only time I really encounter daytime dx'ing is from around Veteran's Day to maybe mid Feburary at the latest, I know it's a different story at more northern latitudes. About the only winter time skywave I receive even during that period is to receive WCBS about 60 - 90 minutes before sunset, then after sunset, as you well know the Cuban 880 usually takes over.

The only other daytime skywave I have encountered on a regular basis is the 1470 out of Pompano Beach overriding the 1470 out of Dunedin; have had that happen as early in the afternoon as 2:45 in December.

Daytime skywave is pretty well over for the winter for latitude 28 degrees north, southward. (at least in my experiences
-----------------------
Now, If I could turn the tables for a minute, from where you are in n.w. Hillsborough county, how is the reception for 89.1 WSMR? (at least so far as it still seems to be a work in progress; at least when I left St. Pete last week).

drt
 
I'm not familiar with 98.1 since I seldom listen to the bottom of the FM band but since you asked, I got out my radio (the Sangean PR-D5) and what I'm hearing is light piano music when I put the radio in one position and then some news discussion about the situation in the middle east on another station when I move the radio to another position.

Neither station is very strong but the music station comes in with weak stereo on and off. Interesting.
 
gar fla said:
I'm not familiar with 98.1 since I seldom listen to the bottom of the FM band but since you asked, I got out my radio (the Sangean PR-D5) and what I'm hearing is light piano music when I put the radio in one position and then some news discussion about the situation in the middle east on another station when I move the radio to another position.

Neither station is very strong but the music station comes in with weak stereo on and off. Interesting.
Click to expand...
Thanks Gar, an interesting FM co-channel experience in your area, WUSF's WSMR (the Classical music you heard) vs. WUFT 89.1 Gainesville

When I'm in St. Pete, on the Sangean, WSMR has been strong enough to light up the stereo pilot light as well as the RDS and also slightly bleed over on to the 88.9 from the Tarpon Springs area.

btw- have you used the Sangean time set feature (CT feature button)? I have used WCTQ 106.5 to set the time, but several times, just experimenting I used Q-105 to set the time and with the CBS stations (Play 98.7 as well), the time was several minutes slower than the correct time, whereas WCTQ always agreed with my atomic clocks.

drt
 
I've never used the time set feature on mine.

In fact, I've never even set the clock.


I think we're having a little tropo tonight.

On the tropo thread, I mentioned that I can hear 94.5 "The Arrow" from Ft. Myers here. Weak but still in stereo most of the time.

Never heard them before.
 
Two things: not to ignore CD, but as far as the Cape, are there public access places in nearby Merritt Island?

Also at least on South Hutchinson Island, IIRC, there was some bleed over on 770 kc from ESPN radio 760 out of Tequesta. (with their directional tower array just east of I-95 near the Martin/Palm Beach county line).

drt
 
I've never been to Merritt Island or anywhere in that area. Sorry I can't help you.

Although I've been down in Florida for 26 years, I haven't gotten around that much.


Thanks for letting me know about the possible splash over from 760.

Hopefully the part of Hutchinson Island near Ft. Pierce will be far enough away.
 
You will experience good DXing there. I'm just S of Charleston, and I experience the opposite DXing that you have down in your part of FL.

It might be a little too far S for skywave, but you'll get groundwave. In our area, AM usually stays good until DST in March, sometimes ending a little before. Daytime I can get Miami easily, plus your 760, 640 sometimes, and 820 from Tampa comes in through some skywave enhancement.

WBT also comes in here a lot during the winter. Most of the big Eastern clears can be heard a good hour at least before sunset during the winter months, sometimes coming in before 3pm.

I even get skywave from the west. 1670 from Warner Robins sometimes comes in earlier than 3. WTOP, WCBS and WWVA are the best. WHAM even sneaks in during the late afternoon, when it doesn't come in here otherwise.
 
I will vouch for Myrtle Beach. Been there, 2006. 760 Tequesta, despite 3000 watts, is not a hard catch in the day. As far as 640, that's amazing....I can't get it clear here in South FL (the Cuban on 640 messes with it in pockets----there are a couple of "sweet spots" on my drive to work where WMEN yields to the Cuban).

But Cape Hatteras NC & Port Fourchon LA are da bombs for DXn!

Of course, for daytime DXn, Bermuda beats 'em all!

cd
 
Well, provided I get enough sleep tonight, I plan to make a day trip to Ft. Pierce to do some daytime AM DXing on the beach there.

If not tomorrow, there are still a few chances between now and when the weather gets rainy and unpredictable in May.

I've made a long list of potential stations to look for, most of which are probably out of reach, but I'll look anyway. I've just been so anxious to do this that I don't want to wait. I plan to do my DXing midday from about 11 to 1 pm if I go. Ft. Pierce is a much better location than my former spot (Daytona Beach) for possibly hearing WFAN or WCBS because there's virtually no significant land for the signals to cross.

I also wont have to contend with the strong signal on 660 from WORL like up at Daytona Beach but I know WZAB will be stronger on 880, though. I'll be 100 miles from Miami, so I'll be looking for any sign of WCBS that might be behind WZAB.

My Sangean PR-D5 along with the loop has already accomplished the once thought impossible task of officially receiving the Texas coast daytime (KTRH) from the west coast of Florida, so I hope it makes the difference this time too.

Although it's probably out of reach, I was wondering what the power is of that station on 555 from St. Kitts that radioman said he heard well midday from San Juan.

I hope I'm up to making the drive each way tomorrow because I don't want to spend all that money for a hotel. Gas is expensive enough as it is and that's another reason I don't want to put this off anymore.
 
gar fla said:
Well, provided I get enough sleep tonight, I plan to make a day trip to Ft. Pierce to do some daytime AM DXing on the beach there.

If not tomorrow, there are still a few chances between now and when the weather gets rainy and unpredictable in May.

I've made a long list of potential stations to look for, most of which are probably out of reach, but I'll look anyway. I've just been so anxious to do this that I don't want to wait. I plan to do my DXing midday from about 11 to 1 pm if I go. Ft. Pierce is a much better location than my former spot (Daytona Beach) for possibly hearing WFAN or WCBS because there's virtually no significant land for the signals to cross.

I also wont have to contend with the strong signal on 660 from WORL like up at Daytona Beach but I know WZAB will be stronger on 880, though. I'll be 100 miles from Miami, so I'll be looking for any sign of WCBS that might be behind WZAB.

My Sangean PR-D5 along with the loop has already accomplished the once thought impossible task of officially receiving the Texas coast daytime (KTRH) from the west coast of Florida, so I hope it makes the difference this time too.

Although it's probably out of reach, I was wondering what the power is of that station on 555 from St. Kitts that radioman said he heard well midday from San Juan.

I hope I'm up to making the drive each way tomorrow because I don't want to spend all that money for a hotel. Gas is expensive enough as it is and that's another reason I don't want to put this off anymore.
Click to expand...

Give us the buzz when you can, gar. Last I heard, ZIZ runs 20 kW. I myself have never heard it here in southeast FL, day OR night. WQAM is a factor, but ZIZ might have a N/S pattern.

cd
 
20 kw? I've since done some Googling and found 10 kw mentioned but I don't know how old the sources were either.

20 kw and low dial position make for a good combination.

Since radioman heard them from the WNW, I don't know how much of a N/S pattern they could have or why they would need one.

Where I plan to go, hopefully WQAM won't have much splatter. They will be pretty much in the null anyway.
 
ZIZ is strong into San Juan all day. I'm surprised you guys in Florida don't get it as it's been heard up north although not by me.
Of course you've got WQAM to deal with.
 
FWIW, you can check any parallels of ZIZ audio via www.zizonline.com

I have never understood why I have never caught it here....even at 10 kW it shoulda made it, especially back in the 70s when I started the hobby in earnest. My radios were no slouches either.

cd
 
ZIZ is "notified" with 20kW non-directional on 555kHz. That's the way it appears on the FCC database, but that's old news, maybe decades old. The part about it being one tower seems believable, though. A number of sources seem to agree that ZIZ is probably running 10kW; their website has some contact numbers so it might be possible to confirm that.
 
Check out the 3 Bahamians: ZNS on 1540, ZNS3 on 810 (strongest) &
even ZNS2 (1240)....first two should be easy there.
Ron (used to live in Fort Lauderdale area) now in N Idaho ;) ;)
 
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