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Radio & "Variety"

davideduardo

Moderator/Administrator
Staff member
(I still like KCKC FM - I heard a 1975 DIsco song on the station today)

KMXV FM played a "mellow" Janet Jackson song from 1994 today, the DJ jokingly mentioned he'd probably get "called in to the office" to explain why he (sort of) broke the format.

My understanding of a large playlist means that songs that appeal to people outside the desired demographics (for advertisers) are played, one question I have for advertisers is that there must be a list somewhere of products and services that nearly everyone buys, maybe play some older songs that appeal to people >49 but place ads for (near) universal appeal products and services near the time these songs are played.


Kirk Bayne
 
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(I still like KCKC FM - I heard a 1975 DIsco song on the station today)

KMXV FM played a "mellow" Janet Jackson song from 1994 today, the DJ jokingly mentioned he'd probably get "called in to the office" to explain why he (sort of) broke the format.
Sounds like the jock just playing with listeners to emphasize "variety" and just to sound human.
My understanding of a large playlist means that songs that appeal to people outside the desired demographics (for advertisers) are played, one question I have for advertisers is that there must be a list somewhere of products and services that nearly everyone buys, maybe play some older songs that appeal to people >49 but place ads for (near) universal appeal products and services near the time these songs are played.
I'm not sure I understand what you are describing and asking, but ads and music are not even scheduled by the same department and maybe not even in the same office location!

Yes, national brand advertisers have extreme knowledge of the customers, but they don 't have correlations with individual songs because every song has its own group of fanatics... and dislikers. Stations play songs that a group of people in their target demographic (age, gender, ethnicity) all like a lot. They don't play songs that the target does not like.
 
(I still like KCKC FM - I heard a 1975 DIsco song on the station today)

KMXV FM played a "mellow" Janet Jackson song from 1994 today, the DJ jokingly mentioned he'd probably get "called in to the office" to explain why he (sort of) broke the format.

My understanding of a large playlist means that songs that appeal to people outside the desired demographics (for advertisers) are played, one question I have for advertisers is that there must be a list somewhere of products and services that nearly everyone buys, maybe play some older songs that appeal to people >49 but place ads for (near) universal appeal products and services near the time these songs are played.


Kirk Bayne
Why do you think older listeners are even seeking out a station that only plays occasional songs they can even tolerate? How would they even know that a "good song" was on KMXV at that moment in the first place? As for the advertisers, I can't imagine that any ad buy comes with the proviso of "Run only before mellow songs at least 30 years old."
 
(I still like KCKC FM - I heard a 1975 DIsco song on the station today)

KMXV FM played a "mellow" Janet Jackson song from 1994 today, the DJ jokingly mentioned he'd probably get "called in to the office" to explain why he (sort of) broke the format.

My understanding of a large playlist means that songs that appeal to people outside the desired demographics (for advertisers) are played, one question I have for advertisers is that there must be a list somewhere of products and services that nearly everyone buys, maybe play some older songs that appeal to people >49 but place ads for (near) universal appeal products and services near the time these songs are played.


Kirk Bayne
They do that everyday with an old song from the 90s-00s. It's a segment called "Oh No You Didn't Play That!" They are playing a Janet Jackson song everyday because she's coming to town. The songs are usually newer than that, say 1998 or older for that segment.
 
I was mainly thinking about KCKC FM, not KMXV FM, I just happened to switch to KMXV FM and heard the DJ make the above comment.

Maybe coordinating the placement of ads for (near) universal products/services to play near or in sets of a few older songs would be of interest to advertisers (has such a concept been tried [I'm sure that present day tech could make this happen - if it helps sell, I see no problem with it]).

I'm not really understanding the song dislike issue - I've heard all of the songs I hear on KCKC FM before, meaning they have been through the song evaluation and classification process and been played on other radio stations many, many times in the past.


Kirk Bayne
 
I was mainly thinking about KCKC FM, not KMXV FM, I just happened to switch to KMXV FM and heard the DJ make the above comment.

Maybe coordinating the placement of ads for (near) universal products/services to play near or in sets of a few older songs would be of interest to advertisers (has such a concept been tried [I'm sure that present day tech could make this happen - if it helps sell, I see no problem with it]).

I'm not really understanding the song dislike issue - I've heard all of the songs I hear on KCKC FM before, meaning they have been through the song evaluation and classification process and been played on other radio stations many, many times in the past.


Kirk Bayne
I think most listeners listen to a station always and know the kind of demos they get. The songs get tested today to see if they oike them currently. I think 102.1 is figuring it out though as their playlist has shifted somewhat and ratings have gone up in the past few months.
 
Maybe coordinating the placement of ads for (near) universal products/services to play near or in sets of a few older songs would be of interest to advertisers (has such a concept been tried [I'm sure that present day tech could make this happen - if it helps sell, I see no problem with it]).
There is no way to do this as ads and music are programmed separately and independently. And, were advertisers to have any interest in this, a solution would be found.
I'm not really understanding the song dislike issue - I've heard all of the songs I hear on KCKC FM before, meaning they have been through the song evaluation and classification process and been played on other radio stations many, many times in the past.
Music is tested among a sample group of today's listeners to each specific station and format. That is done, generally, a couple of times a year. Along with other data, that determines what is played on each station, independently.

Songs that were hits in the past are not necessarily hits today. And some secondary songs back in the day are bigger now than back then.

Although it is mostly done online now, here is a pictorial of how a music test is done:


These are not random people. They are P1's of the station that would play the songs if they pass, and the songs are selected based on wanting to know whether to keep playing them, to add them or to drop them.

Such a test cost in the $30,000 range back when they were done in person.
 
I think most listeners listen to a station always and know the kind of demos they get.
Stations share listeners with around 4 to 6 other stations. Favorite stations change often, based on usage each month.
The songs get tested today to see if they oike them currently. I think 102.1 is figuring it out though as their playlist has shifted somewhat and ratings have gone up in the past few months.
Every time a station test, there are many, many changes: adds, drops and increases or decreases in rotation.
 
Stations share listeners with around 4 to 6 other stations. Favorite stations change often, based on usage each month.

Every time a station test, there are many, many changes: adds, drops and increases or decreases in rotation.
I think poor programming decisions can be made though even if a song tests well. If shown "Who Let the Dogs Out?" I would probably say I like it, but would be foolish for any station to play all the time, I would think.
 
I think poor programming decisions can be made though even if a song tests well. If shown "Who Let the Dogs Out?" I would probably say I like it, but would be foolish for any station to play all the time, I would think.
And, surprise surprise, programmers know how to deal with "sore thumb" songs that stand out and seem to be played more than they really are unless severely limited. Generally, novelty songs never test again after they fade off as currents.
 
And, surprise surprise, programmers know how to deal with "sore thumb" songs that stand out and seem to be played more than they really are unless severely limited. Generally, novelty songs never test again after they fade off as currents.
That makes sense, though I heard Sexy and I Know for several years after it came out. As for the original topic, I think a newer or "upstart" station might benefit from having more variety at first and narrow down as time goes on.
 
re: radio ad placement near (probably after) an older song - seems like adding some metadata to the song info (year and month song peaked on a national chart) and some metadata to the ad info (age range ad is designed to appeal to), an automated ad placement system could select and play an ad for a near universal appeal product/service right after an older song (if the song was likely to have been heard by people in the desired age range).

Such a system could be developed and the option offered to radio advertisers (IMHO, there seems to be some of this type of demographic ad placement on the digital TV subchannels I watch [MeTV et al. - ads for aches and pains shown in the middle of the night when people possibly suffering from this would be awake because of it]).


Kirk Bayne
 
re: radio ad placement near (probably after) an older song - seems like adding some metadata to the song info (year and month song peaked on a national chart) and some metadata to the ad info (age range ad is designed to appeal to), an automated ad placement system could select and play an ad for a near universal appeal product/service right after an older song (if the song was likely to have been heard by people in the desired age range).

Such a system could be developed and the option offered to radio advertisers (IMHO, there seems to be some of this type of demographic ad placement on the digital TV subchannels I watch [MeTV et al. - ads for aches and pains shown in the middle of the night when people possibly suffering from this would be awake because of it]).


Kirk Bayne
I don't think listeners are usually aware of an older song being played, unless its a block then maybe (90s hour, for instance.) There might be demo differences certain times of the day, though.
 
I was mainly thinking about running an ad for a near universally purchased product/service that someone who heard the song when it was originally broadcast might be interesting in buying in the present day, the older song might attract their attention and they might be more receptive to an ad near (probably following) the song.


Kirk Bayne
 
I don't think listeners are usually aware of an older song being played, unless its a block then maybe (90s hour, for instance.) There might be demo differences certain times of the day, though.
Music listeners don't 'appointment-listen'. If you catch some at a certain time that happens to be when a station plays a feature artist or title, then it's mostly happenstance. The risk is; playing what's considered 'a-stiff', causing the loss of audience for likely the rest of that day. Sure, there may be delivery drivers who are on the road listening at that precise time each day, but that's not representative of the broader audience.
 
Philly's "Ben FM", whose playlist is normally very 1980s and 1990s-heavy, plays "Brown Eyed Girl" and "Sweet Caroline". So they actually play older music than Philly's Classic Hits station, WOGL.
 
I was mainly thinking about running an ad for a near universally purchased product/service that someone who heard the song when it was originally broadcast might be interesting in buying in the present day, the older song might attract their attention and they might be more receptive to an ad near (probably following) the song.


Kirk Bayne
I mean…it’s not “drop AM radios from a balloon,” but there’s still no sense to this.

If the product is near universally purchased, it doesn’t matter which song it follows, if it happens to even be first in the stop set.

If it’s universally used, it doesn’t matter if, let’s say for a classic hits station, the song preceding the break was by Abba or ZZ Top. Some segment of that audience was likely hearing the song when it was on CHR, and the product is, um, universal.

If it’s a stand-alone/special feature song on a current-based outlet, again, the product is “near universal.” And either the advertiser is on the station or they aren’t. Not “if you happen to flash back to Janet Jackson, we’ll be there on the off chance some old-head happens to be tuned in.”

This all makes no sense.
 
Philly's "Ben FM", whose playlist is normally very 1980s and 1990s-heavy, plays "Brown Eyed Girl" and "Sweet Caroline". So they actually play older music than Philly's Classic Hits station, WOGL.

I spent over twenty years in Top 40, and "Brown Eyed Girl" tested positively at every single station at which I worked. This is where interpretation comes into play. Obviously that song doesn't belong on CHR, except as some sort of unique, showcased flavor.

Someone once pointed out that "The Star-Spangled Banner" will show up in the Top 10 in any music test for any format. That doesn't mean it should be played, let alone rotated with any frequency,

C.
 
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