Re-broadcasting WWV or WWVH on HD2 or HD3 channels?

[JasonW]

From the thread "Here is a link to the backround leading to HD Radio," autopaint-1 wrote:

<The non commercial aspect of current HD broadcasts will disappear when it become economically viable to sell the HD 2 and 3 channels. At this point it is still very much experimental. In NY they've given a 2 year block of time before commercials appear on HD 2's>

If it is legal to re-broadcast the WWV and WWVH atomic clock time voice radio stations http://tf.nist.gov/stations/wwv.html on commercial radio stations, WWV and WWVH would be useful services to put on the HD2 or HD3 channels of IBOC stations that don't yet have programming for these supplemental channels.

In the future, some large stations making plenty off their main signals and HD2 channels might elect to keep WWV or WWVH on their HD3 channels as a convenience feature for their listeners. As long as no commercials are aired with WWV or WWVH, it should be legal. -- Jason

 

[autopaint-1]

"If it is legal to re-broadcast the WWV and WWVH atomic clock time voice radio stations"

No reason to. With HD stations could include the time in their data stream. Listening to WWV (or it's sister) wouldn't be much of a service because due to IBOC's structure the time you hear on any of the time & frequency stations would be delayed by as much as 10 seconds.

 

[JasonW]

"If it is legal to re-broadcast the WWV and WWVH atomic clock time voice radio stations"

No reason to. With HD stations could include the time in their data stream. Listening to WWV (or it's sister) wouldn't be much of a service because due to IBOC's structure the time you hear on any of the time & frequency stations would be delayed by as much as 10 seconds.

I know the main HD signal is delayed due to buffering, but I don't know about the HD2 or HD3 streams. Also, the WWV and WWVH signals are only 5 kHz wide to begin with. They're on Short Wave, and Short Wave stations have 5 kHz channel spacing rather than the 10 kHz spacing of AM Medium Wave stations (in North America--Europe uses 9 kHz spacing on Medium Wave). -- Jason

 

[autopaint-1]

HD 2& 3 channels are also buffered. There's really no reason that I could think of to pass WWV audio and it's other information to the general public who couldn't care less about solar conditions and the like. Actually I set my Receptor clock when I first got the radio and have even had it unplugged for an hor or more at a time and still the time is fairly accurate. There's no battery backup, they use capacitors to store the voltage for the clock.

 

[Chuck]

There's really no reason that I could think of to pass WWV audio and it's other information to the general public who couldn't care less about solar conditions and the like.

Besides, you can buy an "Atomic Clock" for less than $20.00 these days. They actually work.

 

[sbe1]

When was the last time you called the time number from the phone company? I thought so. Just look at your cell phone if you want absolutely accurate time. Cell phones are tied to GPS satellites and that time is dead nuts accurate. Just as accurate as WWV. Plus on HD, it would be several seconds off.

 

[JasonW]

When was the last time you called the time number from the phone company? I thought so. Just look at your cell phone if you want absolutely accurate time. Cell phones are tied to GPS satellites and that time is dead nuts accurate. Just as accurate as WWV. Plus on HD, it would be several seconds off.

I don't have a cell phone, and the WWVB radio-controlled clocks don't work here in Alaska (we're too far away from WWVB). Our local time & temperature number is pathetically off when it gives the time. I just call the WWV telephone number when I need to re-set all of the clocks around the house after a power failure or when switching from Daylight Saving Time to Standard Time and vice versa. -- Jason

 

[Ai4i]

And then there is always good old WWVA.

 

[autopaint-1]

Here's a site you can use if you have an internet connection. While there may be some lag, it's not all that bad for most people. I use this site as my computer clock reference. Once a week it sends a packet to the site and that in turn updates the computers clock. It works pretty well if you don't have access to a SMPTE clock.


http://www.time.gov/

 

[autopaint-1]

By the way, I just checked the time link for accuracy. The site says the clock is accurate within .1 seconds and I checked it against our SMPTE clock and you can't see any difference.

 

[rbrucecarter5]

Well now, WWV on HD2 is really gonna motivate me to plunk down $300 for a receptor radio.

 

[JasonW]

Well now, WWV on HD2 is really gonna motivate me to plunk down $300 for a receptor radio.

Maybe we could get WWV to do some of their announcements with celebrity voices. Imagine Gilbert Gottfried saying, "At the tone, four hours, thirty-two minutes, co-ordinated universal time...BEEP!" -- Jason

 

[boiseengineer]

There are very specific rules regarding the rebroadcast of WWV, etc..

Just a part of it:

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2004/octqtr/47cfr73.1207.htm

Sec. 73.1207(d)(2) Rebroadcasts

(d) The rebroadcasting of time signals originated by the Naval
Observatory and the National Bureau of Standards and messages from the
National Weather Service stations is permitted without specific
authorization under the following procedures:

(2) National Bureau of Standards Time Signals. (i) Time signals for
rebroadcast must be obtained by direct radio reception from a National Bureau of
Standards (NBS) station.
(ii) Use of receiving and rebroadcasting equipment must not delay
the signals by more than 0.05 second.

Not sure if that'll be legal to rebroadcast with the IBOC delay.