Reaction to HD Radio

[nextline]

My gut feeling is HD is gonna be slow comin, mainly because analog FM isn't really broken. I can only speak for me, and I personally don't care whether my car radio is outputting 15 khz, or 20 khz. Just not enough difference to warrant replacing every radio I own and spending megabux for response I can't hear anyway. I can see us telling the typical teenager they suddenly have to buy a $300 HD radio to hear the exact same stuff their favorite FM pumps out every day- on radios they already own! And let's not forget- as you drive away from the city grade coverage contour of your favorite analog signal, guess what your HD radio starts blending to...analog! We probably will never get to turn analog off, as a lot of stations would lose huge chunks of their service area, and still more (short-spaced look-ins in particular) would not be able to cover their entire market.

I know there will be the argument- well what about all those "extra" channels HD brings? That in itself is quite another subject- Are these to be considered separate stations, and operated as such? What if they are?- can a given market sustain a doubling, or even tripling of available signals? If everyone is siphoning off everyone else's audience with multiple channels, can any one group remain viable? Maybe I'm a tad skeptical...

 

[longjohnmaroon]

My gut feeling is HD is gonna be slow comin, mainly because analog FM isn't really broken. I can only speak for me, and I personally don't care whether my car radio is outputting 15 khz, or 20 khz. Just not enough difference to warrant replacing every radio I own and spending megabux for response I can't hear anyway. I can see us telling the typical teenager they suddenly have to buy a $300 HD radio to hear the exact same stuff their favorite FM pumps out every day- on radios they already own! And let's not forget- as you drive away from the city grade coverage contour of your favorite analog signal, guess what your HD radio starts blending to...analog! We probably will never get to turn analog off, as a lot of stations would lose huge chunks of their service area, and still more (short-spaced look-ins in particular) would not be able to cover their entire market.

I know there will be the argument- well what about all those "extra" channels HD brings? That in itself is quite another subject- Are these to be considered separate stations, and operated as such? What if they are?- can a given market sustain a doubling, or even tripling of available signals? If everyone is siphoning off everyone else's audience with multiple channels, can any one group remain viable? Maybe I'm a tad skeptical...

It will take awhile, but it will eventually happen. Auto manufacturers will begin to offer HD Radios standard on some models, more and more HD radio's will be available in stores, and the prices will start to come down. Eventually, radio set makers will quit making non-HD capable radios completely.

Yes, those extra HD channels will be considered separate stations. The major broadcast groups in the HD Radio Alliance have agreed to not offer competing formats for those second and third HD channels. That means in markets where they compete, you will not see Entercom and Clear Channel or Cumulus and CBS for example both offer a Classic Country HD-2 Channel. They have also agreed to not sell any advertising on the HD-2 or HD-3 channels for the first two years. They are a little over 6 months into that 2 year agreement. After the two years are up, if they decide to not extend the agreement, then you will see those stations with extra HD Channels begin to offer advertising for those formats. It will probably start off with inexpensive advertising packages such as you see the stations who offer streaming are selling now. But like streaming advertising is doing now, if you can make $10,000 or $20,000 a month to begin with on those HD-2 channels, they will start to become a good source of income for the stations.

 

[jcolletta275]

Sooner than that, though, car manufacturers will offer WiMax receivers in their vehicles (the high-end models are planning on rolling them out this year, last I heard). That will effectively kill HD Radio.

 

[RoundMound]

I recently purchased the JVC car deck from Crutchfield. It's not bad but the problem is finding a vehicle that's receiver isn't integrated into the dash in a way that you can replace it. I ended up putting it into an old fixer upper I've got. HD reception is OK but very spotty. I can drive down 40 in GSO and it will flicker in and out of HD.

I don't think the 40+'s will care that much or invest in it and right now it's a little too cost prohibitive for the "impressionable and hip" younger demo's.

I love the "idea" of it but have come to view it much like my one-year Sirius experiment. You may hear different music on HD but nothing really earth shaddering (or original) enough to invest in that kind of equipment. You still have to sit thru numerous songs to get to the one you love. Having said that, you show me an "on-demand" radio, punch up your fav artist or album and it beams it to your car. Watch out, we're all doomed. I'll be first in line for that.

 

[XTalker]

Does anyone know if the FCC has a mandated date (like they did for HDTV)?

 

[eckwood]

Does anyone know if the FCC has a mandated date (like they did for HDTV)?

At this point in time there isn't a mandated date to do away with analog broadcasting. It will be up to the individual stations to determine when they will end analog and just do digital. When the first digital stations came on the air, the conventional wisdom was that it would take about 12 years for enough people to own a digital radio that you could do away with your analog signal. Some stations with younger skewing formats may be able to do it in less than 12 years. It might be 20 or 30 years for some formats. Nobody knows. Three years ago, XM and Sirus thought a lot more people would own a satellite radio. But they have seen their subscriptions slow down a lot in the past year. I saw a story recently which said that only a small percentage of people who bought a car with satellite radio in it were renewing their subscriptions after the one that came with the car expired. At least HD won't have that problem since there is no subscription required.

 

[vchimpanzee]

Does anyone know if the FCC has a mandated date (like they did for HDTV)?

I hope never, because than some of us won't pick up anything.

How are they paying for HD radio, anyway, if there's no advertising?

 

[XTalker]

The same way TV paid for HDTV! It is an investment. Strange to me that the FCC makes technological updates mandantory for television (and forces the receiver industry to come along) but doesn't do the same for radio.

Remember when they made TV makers include all the channels? If there is no mandated conversion to HD, it will go the way of AM Stereo!

 

[haltenfour]

I think it has to do with the fact that radio hd is in band on channel. The govt wants to auction off the analog tv frequencys. Radio will not vacate their current space so the govt has no interest in dictating a date for radio.

 

[XTalker]

I understand that .. still think without some mandate, it is less likely to be a successful venture! Again, recalling AM stereo - where lots of stations invested in the technology, some auto makers included AM stereo as standard equipment. Stations gave away thousands of portable radios - but it never caught on! Now most of the equipment is turned off and collecting dust!

 

[nextline]

HD radio could very likely suffer the same fate, as from a consumer point of view, there is no incentive. FM works BETTER than, and sounds the same as- HD in mobile listening environments, where most radio listening occurs. Change just for the sake of change (mandated or not) isn't a valid argument, nor does it make business sense.

DTV has not worked for the very same reason- for the average consumer, modern state of the art analog TV looks and works fine. Note that twice already, firm shutoff dates for analog TV channels have been postponed due to lack of consumer acceptance of the new and expensive technology. Satellite and cable providers aren't helping by tacking on "premium service" access charges for DTV.

I'm not saying that a better technology would never be embraced by the public, but I AM saying people need a better reason to switch than the mere fact that "it's digital!" In the public's mind the question remains: is this really better?

 

[xpd]

This is my 2cw on the subject. I think HD is going to be accepted for the following reasons.

There is only one standard. With AM Stereo, you had two competing and incompatible technologies. Adoption by broadcasters was very low because everyone was waiting to see which one was going to prevail before they spent the money on equipment to go AM Stereo. As a result, it just died. There are already more HD stations than there ever were AM Stereo stations.

Media Consolidation. Believe it or not, this is one time that media consolidation serves a good purpose. With CC, CBS, Entercom, Cumulus, ABC and the other big media companies that form the HD Alliance behind it, you have a huge chunk of the nations radio stations committed to spending the money to convert to HD. All of the smaller broadcast outlets will find themselves having to follow along eventually.

Advertising. Those same media conglomerates are spending huge bucks on converting their stations to HD and they have pooled their money and committed huge advertising budgets to promote HD.

Manufacturers are behind it. There are already more companies producing HD Radios than there were companies making AM Stereo radios. They will keep producing them and will eventually stop producing analog only radios. Remember when you used to be able to buy an AM only radio? There won't be a reason to produce an analog only radio anymore. The new HD Radios can pick up both.

People will like all the new choices. Remember when we only had 3 TV stations to watch? (I know, I'm giving away my age. I still tell my kids about that just to watch the incredulous and unbelieving look on their face) The audience likes having all of those TV channels to choose from. They will like having all of these extra radio formats to choose from. And they're free!

That's my opinion anyway. And people who know me, know I like giving my opinion.

 

[vchimpanzee]

DTV has not worked for the very same reason- for the average consumer, modern state of the art analog TV looks and works fine. Note that twice already, firm shutoff dates for analog TV channels have been postponed due to lack of consumer acceptance of the new and expensive technology. Satellite and cable providers aren't helping by tacking on "premium service" access charges for DTV.

I hope they delay it again. I'm not interested in changing. I would have to get an outdoor antenna and even then there's no guarantee because I'm so far out in the country. Plus there's the converter box unless I buy an expensive new TV. And then there's recording shows ...

 

[XTalker]

I believe radio should do HD! No Doubt! It is just going to take time. Meanwhile, the product is going be pretty dull because of the cost. Just wait it out.

I could imagine a morning show doing an artist interview - only doing a brief portion on the main channel - then offering extended versions on HD - that kind of thing would attract people to HD.

It will just take time!

 

[700WLW]

I believe radio should do HD! No Doubt! It is just going to take time. Meanwhile, the product is going be pretty dull because of the cost. Just wait it out.

I could imagine a morning show doing an artist interview - only doing a brief portion on the main channel - then offering extended versions on HD - that kind of thing would attract people to HD.

It will just take time!

Looks, like your hopes, may be dashed:

http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,59422.0.html

 

[700WLW]

That's my opinion anyway. And people who know me, know I like giving my opinion.

So, do I:

http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,59422.0.html

 

[SUPERCASTER]

Does anyone know if the FCC has a mandated date (like they did for HDTV)?

I hope never, because than some of us won't pick up anything.

How are they paying for HD radio, anyway, if there's no advertising?

No analog "drop dead" date set. Hopefully an iBiquity digital "buzz off" date instead. Then we can all enjoy a digital system that already has FCC full approval and does not interfere, FMeXtra www.dreinc.com

Massive layoffs. Check the numbers.

iBiquity/HD supporters are the only ones with anything to fear, if they bought into the iBiquity hype.
Those who did not buy into HD or are waiting for a better, less destructive system, have nothing to loose, and only (once again) clear analog reception to gain. No "fear factor" here.

 

[tomservo]

Hmm. Since I started reading the HD Radio forum here I've been presented with compelling issues pro and con this new system. I'm still a skeptic at heart, though. With all the new competition from sat. radio, mp3 players, more TV channels than ever, DVD players and all the other in-home entertainment options, iBiquity's got an uphill battle.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: the biggest factor that will make HD radio sucessful is if it comes standard in cars first, then becomes available for cheap in walkman radios. MP3 players are already built in to more and more car stereos, OEM and aftermarket. The portables are smaller than ever. Heck, the same holds true for DVD players, even!

Sirius' brick-radios aside, satellite radios are getting super-portable. The Inno and Nexus from XM are sweet.

Where's my walkman sized HD radio? They haven't invented a powerful enough battery for it yet, lol!

When they can shoehorn in a decent HD radio into my cellphone, then maybe I'll upgrade. Right now, it's got a very good FM tuner with RDS that is plenty adequate for my portable needs. Not that I need it anymore.

And as for those mom-n-pops who'll be forced to upgrade - how will they afford it? I see a lot of little guys falling by the wayside if push ever comes to shove. Which hopefully, will never happen. Long live analog!

 

[700WLW]

Hmm. Since I started reading the HD Radio forum here I've been presented with compelling issues pro and con this new system. I'm still a skeptic at heart, though. With all the new competition from sat. radio, mp3 players, more TV channels than ever, DVD players and all the other in-home entertainment options, iBiquity's got an uphill battle.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: the biggest factor that will make HD radio sucessful is if it comes standard in cars first, then becomes available for cheap in walkman radios. MP3 players are already built in to more and more car stereos, OEM and aftermarket. The portables are smaller than ever. Heck, the same holds true for DVD players, even!

Sirius' brick-radios aside, satellite radios are getting super-portable. The Inno and Nexus from XM are sweet.

Where's my walkman sized HD radio? They haven't invented a powerful enough battery for it yet, lol!

When they can shoehorn in a decent HD radio into my cellphone, then maybe I'll upgrade. Right now, it's got a very good FM tuner with RDS that is plenty adequate for my portable needs. Not that I need it anymore.

And as for those mom-n-pops who'll be forced to upgrade - how will they afford it? I see a lot of little guys falling by the wayside if push ever comes to shove. Which hopefully, will never happen. Long live analog!

First-of-all, due to power consumption requirements, portable HD radios are not in the forseeable future (also, what are people going to do - walk around with portable dipole antennas ). As far as, expensive in-dash HD Radio, that is not going to happen, with in-dash Satellite Radio, and the new Sync-type mobile Internet units from Microsoft - these units are being installed in Ford vehicles next year, and also Avis rental cars - once this technology takes off, say goodbye to in-dash HD Radio ! Portable Internet Radio will also help kill HD Radio, as new devices are hitting the marketplace - my boys' new BlackJack Cingular phones, have access to football games, radio, etc through the Web.

"At Ford, Windows is Job One"

"What is YOUR group doing to be in front of this trend? What is YOUR group doing to be in every car in every way in 2007 and beyond? What content do you have that every Ford will want to stream? And where does this leave satellite radio and especially HD radio ?"

http://www.hear2.com/2006/12/at_ford_windows.html#comments

"Meet your new competition"

"And demand for all Internet services - not simply audio - will drive product development, marketing, and sales. In other words, the platform will not have to be sold. It will just have to be bought... And that's a key distinction differentiating these services from satellite and HD radio - both of which need both selling and buying."

http://www.hear2.com/2006/12/meet_your_new_c.html#comment-26335791

"WiFi radio stations to join battle for air supremacy"

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20061214.TWINGRAM14/TPStory/TPBusiness/

 

[Mike Walker]

I don't mind using AM Stereo as an example. NO, it wasn't a roaring success. But it never went away. It's still there. New car manufacturers are still installing it. There are still radios. In fact NEW ones are coming on the market (HD Radios which also receive AM STereo). The Accurian is something that was desperately needed two decades ago, but never materialized...a tabletop AM Stereo radio.

My point? Even if HD isn't hugely successful, that sure as hell doesn't mean it's going away. I don't think ANY FM station now in HD will EVER "pull the plug". They're down for the duration, which already makes HD a bigger success than AM Stereo ever was (in terms of geographical area served). Radios are just now becoming available, and the public still doesn't know what HD is (or AM Stereo for that matter. A few stations marketed it well in the 80s, but most sat on the sidelines. Consumers who were aware of it, did exactly what they're doing now with HD-DVD and Blu-Ray...they're saying "NEITHER...not until you agree on a damn standard!") The FCC finally chose C-Quam as the standard...WAY too late for it to make any difference. Limbaugh and O'Reilly don't really call out for stereo!

With HD, there's ONE standard. The advantage of consolidation in radio (the ONLY advantage I can think of!) is that when the big corporations like Clear Channel and CBS/Infinity decide to market a new standard like HD, it's already most of the way there, because they can almost instantly put it on thousands of stations in markets coast-to-coast. With that kind of backing behind an AM Stereo system, that situation would have been completely different.

"Reaction to HD"? Ask 20 people at random what HD Radio is. If more than 2 of them are even aware that it exists, I'll eat my hat (I don't own one. I suppose I'll have to buy one). There is no demand for what people don't know exists yet. Even then, technology must be SOLD! Remember salesmanship? Americans used to be able to sell each other things. Come on radio people, you remember how to sell, don't you?