I was at Acadia National Park in Maine this week with my Sangean PR D5 and I picked up WFAN and WCBS quite well at 1PM. I didn't think the NYC stations went that far up the Maine coast. The other 50,000 watters, WOR and WABC were barley audible. Of course, the park is right on the coast but it is quite a distance from New York. Can you get them even further up the coast or in New Brunswick or Nova Scotia during the day?
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receiving NYC stations in Maine
- Thread starter benale
- Start date
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
spunker88 said:
Daytona Beach Shores, too!
Wonder how far you could get those stations on an ocean liner headed for Europe?
The distances below are based on the FCC groundwave propagation chart for the conditions shown. This 195-degree radiator is assumed to be adjacent to the ocean shore (an all sea water path).
The fields received in/on an ocean liner probably would be less.
Data:
Frequency = 540 kHz
Power = 50.00 kW
Radiation at 1 mile = 1767.8 mV/m
Conductivity = 5000.0 mS/m
Results:
Contour level Distance to contour
0.500 mV/m 513 miles
0.400 mV/m 547 miles
0.300 mV/m 588 miles
0.200 mV/m 646 miles
0.100 mV/m 757 miles
The distances below are based on the FCC groundwave propagation chart for the conditions shown. This 195-degree radiator is assumed to be adjacent to the ocean shore (an all sea water path).
The fields received in/on an ocean liner probably would be less.
Data:
Frequency = 540 kHz
Power = 50.00 kW
Radiation at 1 mile = 1767.8 mV/m
Conductivity = 5000.0 mS/m
Results:
Contour level Distance to contour
0.500 mV/m 513 miles
0.400 mV/m 547 miles
0.300 mV/m 588 miles
0.200 mV/m 646 miles
0.100 mV/m 757 miles
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
R. Fry said:
You don't get any reception IN the cruise ship, however on deck the reception is incredible. If you think about the conductivity, the saltwater path ends at the steel hull of the cruise ship, which is about as good a connection as you could ask for with seawater. However, the interior of the ship is like a Faraday cage.
When you look at the Northeast Coast, the WFAN and WCBS signals have to travel over some land to get to Arcadia National Park. Parts of Connecticut, Massachusettes and Rhode Island are in the way. So it's not a direct over-the-water line.
It's too bad many Maritime Canadian AM stations are now off the air because you probably would have heard those as well. I know there had been an Oldies/Classic Hits station, 720 CHTN Charlottetown PEI, that was quite easy to pick up in Portland ME in the daytime. But nearly all Canadian AM stations east of Montreal have moved to FM.
It's too bad many Maritime Canadian AM stations are now off the air because you probably would have heard those as well. I know there had been an Oldies/Classic Hits station, 720 CHTN Charlottetown PEI, that was quite easy to pick up in Portland ME in the daytime. But nearly all Canadian AM stations east of Montreal have moved to FM.
rbrucecarter5 said:
True -- but then the surface wave fields existing just above the surface of the ocean (or terrain for that matter) arrive via a path through space, not through the ocean or the earth.
The high conductivity of sea water reduces propagation losses for surface wave fields because the part of the traveling wavefront that penetrates the surface of the earth generates less current in the earth. That earth current is supplied by the fields in that traveling wavefront. So the relatively high conductivity of sea water reduces the earth losses incurred by the surface wave..
Here is a link with more detail:
http://books.google.com/books?id=1n...wBg#v=onepage&q=wave tilt ground wave&f=false
That's a 623 mile daytime groundwave catch!
And also, a lot of the path is on land as well so it goes to show the effect of saltwater.
Let's give credit to the Sangean PR-D5 too. I've had mine for more than three years and it's amazing for AM.
And your catches of WFAN and WCBS makes me even more confident that the unidentified signal I was getting on 880 midday at Daytona Beach had to be WCBS.
Even though it's more of a distance, the signal has a lot less land interaction than it does to get to where you are.
But your catches are amazing considering how much land path there is.
One thing I've noticed here in Florida is that being out on a barrier island surrounded by saltwater, I can get much better signals from inland stations than if the receiver was also inland.
For example, WVLG from The Villages (1 kw ND) north of Orlando can't be heard with even a trace here in Tampa daytime but out on Honeymoon Island at the Gulf about 18 miles west of here, I can easily hear it.
WYGM Orlando is barely audible daytime here in Tampa but out there, it has a good signal.
WQAM Miami can barely be heard daytime in Tampa behind the splatter of WTBN but out there at the Gulf, it has a good signal and all three stations mentioned have a more distant signal path to that spot on the Gulf than to Tampa.
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
gar fla said:
That was the situation I was in, I was living on the barrier island in Daytona Beach Shores, my house backed up to the intercoastal waterway. The island was only two blocks wide at that point. Reception of most NYC clears was constant no matter what time of the day or month of the year, and many other 50 kW clears came in like WLW. I moved a couple of miles inland a year later, and ALL the fantastic reception was gone. Not a trace.
I live on the mainland just west of Mount Desert Island (Acadia National Park) and during the warmer weather daylight hours can pick up WEZE, WRKO, WCRN (Worcester), WEEI, WROL, WBZ, WQQM, WRCA, and WUFC all day long on my car radio and my GE Superadio. The quality of the signals varies, of course; WBZ has by far the strongest, coming in as though Hull were ten miles away(!). I can also get WFAN and WCBS, about as well as the weaker Boston signals. Ditto what Benale said: WOR and WABC barely come in.
WPRO in Providence is also audible, as is WHJJ, albeit less well.
Quite a few more stations can be picked up in the daytime during the winter.
Having traveled New Brunswick a great deal over the years, I can tell you that WBZ does come in during the day along the Fundy coast, though not as well as here. Nighttime's a different story.
WPRO in Providence is also audible, as is WHJJ, albeit less well.
Quite a few more stations can be picked up in the daytime during the winter.
Having traveled New Brunswick a great deal over the years, I can tell you that WBZ does come in during the day along the Fundy coast, though not as well as here. Nighttime's a different story.
The NYC clears being heard daytime can be explained by ground wave due to the ocean path but WLW has a path over all that distance of land, not to mention land that is not very conductive.
Even considering the ability of being surrounded by saltwater to somehow improve reception of inland stations, there would be no signal at that distance to be able to improve upon.
I'd say that daytime reception of WLW can only be due to sky wave.
benale said:
I'd have to dig out my Halifax listings, but I recall that in our house it was quite bad for AM/MW listening in general. Being right on Halifax Harbour, there was an awful lot of interference on the AM band (though the scanner was interesting!). Having said that, I do have a daytime band scan, listed while parked right on the waterfront in Point Pleasant Park in Halifax. Being further up the harbour from the (interference causing) military facilities, that scan wasn't to bad if I recall.
On the FM side of things, the one American station I'd pick up in Halifax, on a fairly regular basis was WMED (Maine Public Radio) on 89.7 out of Calais ME.
And finally, during the winter in particular, quite a few east coast stations (Boston, NYC, Philly, etc.) can be heard through a good portion of the day, here in eastern Ontario...being quite a ways from the coast.
Gregg said:
I miss those stations, too. It used to be, that I would flip on the radio at home and could listen in on CBC radio, in 3 different time zones (Maritmes, Eastern, Central).
~BG
It's like getting the Cuban 570 around Charleston during the daytime. About the same length, maybe a little more, on a lower frequency.
I've tried for NY numerous times on all the clear frequencies here, but it usually takes a cold, cloudy day in the winter for reception to occur, or you have to be on a boat in the ocean. I have gotten WSM though in downtown Charleston at about 4 or 4:30 in the afternoon recently (in April).
I've tried for NY numerous times on all the clear frequencies here, but it usually takes a cold, cloudy day in the winter for reception to occur, or you have to be on a boat in the ocean. I have gotten WSM though in downtown Charleston at about 4 or 4:30 in the afternoon recently (in April).
During the late fall or winter months we receive a lot of the east coast US stations sometimes 24 hours a day here in Newfoundland as well as Trans-Atlantic signals from England etc. around the clock.
The east coasters as well as many Florida stations are audible year round during darker hours.
The east coasters as well as many Florida stations are audible year round during darker hours.
Maybe someone with more knowledge of AM propagation can correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think temperature or cloud cover affect AM reception.
Unfortunately, there's no chance of getting a ground wave AM signal from NYC where you are because there's too much land in between.
You'd have a better shot at something from eastern Massachusetts or Rhode Island daytime like 630 WPRO but I suspect WBMQ would have too strong a signal where you are. WBZ is too high a frequency and has a directional signal, so they are probably out of the question.
Have you tried for WBZ daytime?
Cloud cover doesn't affect AM reception but temperature really does seem to. When the temperature is below -10 celsius, I notice daytime of the Montreal AM stations increases by about 4 to 6 dbu's above what it is when the temperature is at freezing. At least according to the meter on my G8. On my cc plus the signal meter does show signals going from 2 bars to 3, and it takes a LOT of signal increase for that to happen. Even the local stations increase by about 3 dbu's. Stations appear at -10 or below that do not appear at 0. With an easily listenable signal to0. I noticed on the coldest day we had last winter every signal had a massive signal increase at no0n that would never be there othe wise.
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