Reception question

[radiojay1]

I know many of the Toronto AMs and FMs can be heard well in Buffalo and much of Northwest New York close to Lake Ontario, but can the Buffalo AMs and FMs be heard well in Toronto? How about any of the Rochester AMs and FMs?

 

[fybush]

I know many of the Toronto AMs and FMs can be heard well in Buffalo and much of Northwest New York close to Lake Ontario, but can the Buffalo AMs and FMs be heard well in Toronto? How about any of the Rochester AMs and FMs?

I answered this on the New York State board (which is very lightly trafficked, so perhaps you didn't see it there):

The Rochester stations don't make it into Toronto very well at all. Take a look at a map and you'll see that Toronto is a good long haul west of Rochester - it's a good 90-mile straight-line run across the lake from Rochester to Toronto, which is pushing it for line-of-sight FM reception. Add to that all the co-channel and adjacent-channel signals that have popped up on both sides of the lake (88.5, 92.5, 94.1, 94.9/95.1, 96.3/96.5, 97.9/98.1, 98.9/99.1, 100.5/100.7, 101.3, 102.1, 103.9, 106.5/106.7) and there's not much that breaks through from Rochester.

Even the Buffalo/Toronto dial is becoming so crowded on each side of the border that it's becoming harder to hear cross-border signals. Canada has put a lot of new FMs on the air that block out clean reception of Buffalo-market FM signals. Most of the big AMs (550, 930, 970, 1520) still get into Toronto, but the level of electrical noise seems to be higher every time I'm up there, making Buffalo signals harder to hear than they used to be.

 

[cyberdad]

I've been going to Toronto on business a few times each year for nearly 20 years. Scott pretty much said it all, but I'll add a couple of my own observations.

On the FM dial, most of the full-powered Buffalo stations are audible on a good car radio, but difficult to listen to. Either due to the pure dynamics of a weaker signal in an urban environment and/or because of the adjacent channel spacing situation that Scott mentioned.

As for AM. 550 has the best signal....930 is almost as good. If you're away from a noise source, these two are definitely listenable on a good radio. 970 and 1520 are weaker, but still reasonably listenable on a good car radio. WHAM on 1180 is usually the only reliable signal from Rochester. Strength is "fair" at best.

 

[radiojay1]

Scott, yes I did read your reply in the New York board, but I did not realize there was also a Toronto board until recently, and I wanted to see what responses I would also get here. Thanks also Cyberdad and anyone else who replies. I did look at a map and realized why the Toronto stations could be heard well in northwest New York especially near Lake Ontario. It's almost all water between the northwest New York shoreline of Lake Ontario and the Toronto radio towers. That's why I was thinking possibly Rochester might be carried further, albeit weak, across Lake Ontario. I can see why Toronto would have a hard time getting Rochester, but looking to Ontario directly north, for example the town of Brighton, may be able to hear Rochester radio. And looking at northwest New York, Lockport and the area north and west of it, can get Toronto, Niagara Falls, and Buffalo radio.

 

[fybush]

There's definitely cross-lake reception between the Rochester area and the Belleville/Peterborough/Brighton area directly north of us. The last remaining AM up there, Belleville's CJBQ 800, is a local in Rochester by day and listenable at night, and they hear many of our AM signals up there as well.

FM used to be easier across the lake, but there's been a tremendous crowding of the dial on both sides of the border that's made it more challenging. For instance, Rochester's WVOR (now WDVI) 100.5 had a clear shot to the northern lakeshore...but then CKRU 980 Peterborough was moved to 100.5, blocking it out on the Canadian side. Here in Rochester, the cleanest Canadian FM signal is CFMX 103.1 from Cobourg, which is nearly a local (and even had a sales office here in the 80s for a few years). A few others - CJOJ 95.5, CIGL 97.1 and the newer CHCQ 100.1 - get across the lake as well, but the terrain on the US side (the glacial ridge that runs just south of the lakeshore) tends to block those signals south of Route 104.

One more note: nobody here calls this area "northwest New York." We're "western New York" if you're anywhere from Rochester to the Pennsylvania line, "central New York" from Rochester to Syracuse and Utica. "North", in a New York context, is generally reserved for the area north of Syracuse/Utica/Albany.

 

[Obtuse1]

IIRC Batavia at one time was a sweet spot that could recieve Buffalo, Rochester, and many Toronto signals. A few TO FM signals reach into Rochester...I remember DXing CFNY wasn't too difficult, for example, but that was before the 102.1 signal in Albion launched.

As for Buffalo FM signals in Toronto, IIRC WKSE (with it's Grand Island transmitter) and WTSS (WNY's FM blowtorch) reach the metro pretty well.

 

[radiojay1]

One more note: nobody here calls this area "northwest New York." We're "western New York" if you're anywhere from Rochester to the Pennsylvania line, "central New York" from Rochester to Syracuse and Utica. "North", in a New York context, is generally reserved for the area north of Syracuse/Utica/Albany.

Thanks Scott. I was not sure what the name for the region was, but I said "northwest" to make it easier to describe the exact location I was talking about, for those not familiar with the area.

 

[Mid West Clubber]

i remember listening to Z-1035 in Toronto and in Downtown I was getting interference and bleed over from 103.3 the Edge in buffalo,, but also ive had Z-103.5 coming in clear in Niagra Falls with local 103.3 just beside it, makes no sense.

 

[radiojay1]

i remember listening to Z-1035 in Toronto and in Downtown I was getting interference and bleed over from 103.3 the Edge in buffalo,, but also ive had Z-103.5 coming in clear in Niagra Falls with local 103.3 just beside it, makes no sense.

103.5 CIDC transmits at 30,700 watts from Orangeville, Ontario, 37 miles northwest of Toronto. 103.3 WEDG transmits at 49,000 watts from Buffalo, 60 miles straight line distance from Toronto, but also the distance is about half over land and half over Lake Ontario. It may have been tropo in both cases, especially in Niagara Falls, which is 77 miles straight line distance from Orangeville.