Rochester Spring Ratings '12

[Bob1370]

And the 12+ winner in Rochester in the Spring 2012 book is...WDKX!

That's right, the Urban Contemporary FM is now the top station in the Rochester market, consolidating its hold on both urban and suburban listenership 12-35 and turning it into the overall 12+ lead by almost a share point and a half over country WBEE. This despite arguably the weakest FM signal in the market. In many ways, from youth dominance to large total audience despite a comparatively poorer signal, WDKX is duplicating the feat that WBBF-AM accomplished 45 years ago in riding dominance of young listenership into overall market leadership against bigger-signal competition.

WHAM is still third but its audience is shrinking and aging at a faster rate. Those have to be the worst relative share numbers they've had since they first became a full-market-coverage station after they boosted their original 100-watt signal up to 5,000 watts back in 1927, and then 50,000 in 1934.

Warm 101 and 98PXY are holding their own. The Buzz seems to be shrinking, CMF cruising at its current lower level, and WFXF, under its new name "The Brew", got left out of the listings, probably because Clear Channel didn't buy its numbers while they finish the re-branding process. It's also anyone's guess how Legends is doing since they don't subscribe to the Arbitron book and their numbers therefore don't get published either.

The one other salient point is a puzzle--why two AM signals persist in sports talk although the format as a whole, without a major league or major college play by play franchise, can't crack a 1.5 combined share. WGR can do it in Buffalo with a mostly-local sports talk menu because they also carry both the Bills and the Sabres...they have in-house coverage to themselves of two major league teams that are regional obsessions 12 months of the year. No Rochester station can ever enjoy that kind of advantage.

 

[SirRoxalot]

Bob, I think that the question is "What do you do with an also-ran AM these days?" Especially one with a crappy signal. Nobody's going to challenge WHAM and talk on the AM band (although they seem to be beating themselves). So, what are your alternatives for cheap, syndicated programming? Sports, and ??? You're looking at either the God squad, or Disney, and neither one seems to be buying. Maybe Entercom could donate WROC to WXXI just to fill in any coverage gaps, and annoy WHAM a bit more. The write off may be more valuable than spending money on electricity to keep it running.

 

[Bob1370]

WROC wouldn't help us. Our current 5 kW signal on 1370 is better--second-best AM coverage in the market, good enough to get us consistently solid numbers trailing only WHAM among AM signals.

 

[bmcglynn]

And the 12+ winner in Rochester in the Spring 2012 book is...WDKX!

That's right, the Urban Contemporary FM is now the top station in the Rochester market, consolidating its hold on both urban and suburban listenership 12-35 and turning it into the overall 12+ lead by almost a share point and a half over country WBEE. This despite arguably the weakest FM signal in the market. In many ways, from youth dominance to large total audience despite a comparatively poorer signal, WDKX is duplicating the feat that WBBF-AM accomplished 45 years ago in riding dominance of young listenership into overall market leadership against bigger-signal competition.

This goes to show that power level is only a delivery vehicle. Compare WDKX to WBLK in Buffalo - a full class B. As long as you get a good 70dBu signal into the urban core, and a 60dBu into the suburbs of your target market, you're in. Programming and brand recognition do the rest.

WHAM is still third but its audience is shrinking and aging at a faster rate. Those have to be the worst relative share numbers they've had since they first became a full-market-coverage station after they boosted their original 100-watt signal up to 5,000 watts back in 1927, and then 50,000 in 1934.

I wonder how much of WHAM's leakage is to WYSL. Since Savage lined up some first rate programming, there has to be a measurable impact on WHAM.

 

[Mark Giardina]

According to the book WBEE took a major hit in the 12+ catagory; down almost 3 points.
While the station is still doing well in the ratings, I wonder what happened?

As for WYSL taking listeners away from WHAM; according to the book nobody listens to WYSL, which is some what ironic considering that major advertisers continue to buy time on a station (WYSL) that, according to the book, nobody listens too.

 

[Mark Giardina]

It's also anyone's guess how Legends is doing since they don't subscribe to the Arbitron book and their numbers therefore don't get published either.

Bob,

Even if Legends does not subscribe to Arbitron, previous books showed the station did, at one time, have a substantial audience. That's not the case today.

However I am one of many who don't believe in Arbitron any way.

 

[JustPastBuffalo]

According to the book WBEE took a major hit in the 12+ catagory; down almost 3 points. While the station is still doing well in the ratings, I wonder what happened? As for WYSL taking listeners away from WHAM; according to the book nobody listens to WYSL, which is some what ironic considering that major advertisers continue to buy time on a station (WYSL) that, according to the book, nobody listens too.

It's not that WYSL has no listeners. It's Arbitron's revised policy. Stations that don't subscribe are not listed in publicly released ratings.

 

[SirRoxalot]

I guess that Country has run it's course as a format, and WBEE is in decline. Or, it could just be diary placement. Or promotions. Or voodoo. Or all those people that abandoned WBEE went to WDKX.

 

[therealjm12]

From looking over the 12 + I think I can make an educated guess and say it is placement this time. Strange: listed is WUUF -AM. Is that the old WACK? WUUF -FM is at the bottom. WROO-FM ? It's listed as Jacksonville. People listening on line? What is WCRR listed as country & owned by Clear Channel?

 

[heydaybegone]

Just chiming in to note the number of posters "sliding" away from the "Arbit$% Gods" ???
Having always proclaimed my disbelief of the system (all faults included-some reiterated here), I'm feeling better that the club is growing. ;D
As time goes on, many more will learn more about the statistical downfalls of the "ratings" system that has been faulting the industry for years!! (Rox, too funny....kinda hitting the nail on the head with a Sennheiser)

Just my 5 1/2 cents (2 cents don't get diddly anymore)

That's all

HDBG

 

[Bob1370]

Here's a question I'm posing without having a clue how to answer (but maybe someone else here might)...if Rochester and Buffalo were PPM markets, rather than just about the largest of the remaining diary markets, would our numbers be more reliable?

 

[SirRoxalot]

Considering that they can't get 34 of the 48 PPM rated markets certified by the Media Ratings Council, I'd say that "reliable" isn't one of the words I'd use to describe PPM. "Different", perhaps, and considering that PPM sample sizes are even smaller than diary samples, I might also go with "anemic". And, PPM samples "hearing", not "listening". Of course, if you listen on headphones or earbuds, you need to plug in an adapter to get the PPM to work. I'm sure that nobody ever "forgot" the extra cord needed to make that work.

OK, cue "TheBigA" and "David Eduardo", who'll extoll the virtues of Arbitron methodology in general, and PPM in particular. You might want to explore this link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lies,_damned_lies,_and_statistics

 

[bmcglynn]

Here's a question I'm posing without having a clue how to answer (but maybe someone else here might)...if Rochester and Buffalo were PPM markets, rather than just about the largest of the remaining diary markets, would our numbers be more reliable?

PPM has awakened a lot of operators about true listening of their stations. Some formats were over-reported, some under-reported, and some just vanished. The advantage of PPM is that listeners are less likely to be biased based on memory for a station's name.

In Canada where PPM is pretty much ubiquitous, the biggest issue there is sample size. As for Arbitron - that is the case even with Diaries. In Dansville, we are not part of any market. We appear in the Rochester market (as well as Corning and Olean) because our coverage kisses the furthest throes of those markets. The problem for us is that the numbers that do appear are unreliable in that they are based on too small of a sample size.

The same is true for Niche formats within the market. If I am not mistaken, Cumulus has abandoned Arbitron all together.

Brian

 

[JustPastBuffalo]

[In Canada where PPM is pretty much ubiquitous, the biggest issue there is sample size. As for Arbitron - that is the case even with Diaries. In Dansville, we are not part of any market. We appear in the Rochester market (as well as Corning and Olean) because our coverage kisses the furthest throes of those markets. The problem for us is that the numbers that do appear are unreliable in that they are based on too small of a sample size.

The same is true for Niche formats within the market. If I am not mistaken, Cumulus has abandoned Arbitron all together.

Brian

Years ago, Arbitron intended to initiate PPM in Buffalo. The Citadel cluster had the PPM coders in place for on air and streaming, as well as backups for all stations, but they were removed and returned to Arbitron and PPM plans were shelved.

Although it appears that Cumulus does not subscribe to Buffalo trends, it does subscribe the quarterly reports. If the Persons 12+ for Spring is any indication, they must be pleased with their investment. Cumulus clusters in Syracuse and Binghamton are not reported in R-I's Spring '12 survey, and it appears Cumulus does not subscribe to Arbitron in those (and other smaller) markets.

 

[Mark Giardina]

Has anyone taken into consideration that perhaps fewer people are listening to the radio?

In the car people might instead be listening to CD's on their way to and from work, or in some cases iPads.

 

[bmcglynn]

Has anyone taken into consideration that perhaps fewer people are listening to the radio?

In the car people might instead be listening to CD's on their way to and from work, or in some cases iPads.

Arbitron should take those factors into account. The share is based on a percentage of all the hours in which people report being tuned in for a given period of time in a daypart - "Quarter Hour". Reach, or "Cume" deals with all the total listeners in a given daypart.

Where I assume WHAM has been showing leakage of the audience is in the quarter hour. Now, it is possible that a percentage of their listeners went to other mediums whereas their competitors did not see that loss. All said, a good analysis of their P1's would show where people are going.

Brian

 

[Mike Sheridan]

What's 1280's signal like? Good coverage or not? I auditioned for a job there many years ago. It was WROC at the time, and not doing well. It became WPXN so I dodged a bullet!

 

[qman]

1280s signal is marginal at best during the day and non-existent at night.

 

[Bob1370]

Mike Sheridan asks, "What's 1280's signal like? Good coverage or not? I auditioned for a job there many years ago. It was WROC at the time, and not doing well. It became WPXN so I dodged a bullet!"

Just curious, what format was it running? Was it still full service personality MOR (as it was back in the 60s and much of the 70s), or was it already on the way to format-of-the year, heading from all-news to big band/standards to business news to hot talk to syndicated sports talk to sports from Fox with a local show or two fronted by staff borrowed from sister station WHAM?

Some past owner tried at one point to sell it to RAETA (predecessor of the current WXXI Public Broadcasting Council) but the 1370 signal came available at around the same time, in the early 1980s, and offered a much better nighttime and pre-sunrise pattern than 1280 could offer. So needless to say, 1370 became WXXI-AM. All the better, since while both 1280 and 1370 have decent non-directional daytime patterns that cover essentially the whole metro, 1280 has to send nearly all its power through the city and into Lake Ontario after dark to protect stations in southern Ontario and New York City. 1370, on the other hand, can run a somewhat less restrictive north-south night pattern, cover more of the metro core, and be heard well in growth areas like Canandaigua and Victor after dark, when no other Rochester-licensed AM (aside from WHAM) can rise above the noise.

 

[BTB117]

hHi there. I used to work in hockey as a broadcaster, mr/pr director and co-hosted a couple of sports talk shows. Since I moved home a few years ago I have changed careers but I still follow the business and its great to have a forum dedicated to the radio trends in our area.

I want to talk specifically about the 2 sports stations in the area. 950 is just too weak of a signal for someone to compete. It needs the owner or a potential new owner to try and strengthen that signal if they ever want to try and make money off of it so it can rest in syndication of any format and right now its sports. ESPN just likes that they have a station for all of their programming.

Now 1280 while not the strongest signal is strong enough and while DiTullio is ok there is not enough local talk on that station. Someone mentioned not having a major team to carry them well that is not true. They are the home to Syracuse sports and although going way past the region the cluster does carry all 162 Yankee games. This is also a HUGE BILLS and Sabres market. You add that with the occasional minor league, RIT and high school sports you have the ingriedients for some great local sports talk. I think if you have a morning drive show that stays LOCAL then you have DP and Rome in the middle with DiTullio at 3 and I just do not understand why they don't simulcast Matthew's show at 6. Now you are at 7-8 hours of local sports talk per day that is all different. Matthews will talk anything and everything. DiTullio does local with a lot (too much) national stuff mixed in and then you have a local show in the beginning and then you may start to see better numbers for 1280.


Just my thoughts. Thanks!