Why isn't there a Rock Station like 98 Rock/KRXQ in the Bay Area??
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Rock Station
- Thread starter MarioMania
- Start date
I've kinda noticed The Bone leaning Active Rock lately
I have to take a listen ...
I've kinda noticed The Bone leaning Active Rock lately
You either were tuned in during a specialty show or have a poor understanding of the Active Rock format.
The Bone is a conservative Heritage Rock station.
KSJO during the late 90's and early 00's could be considered Active Rock (even though I believe they continued reporting to the Rock panel during that time; might be wrong on that). KSJO during its last year or two on the air regressed to a Mainstream Rock sound.
Personally, I think Live 105 should've ditched its current branding and Modern Rock format several years ago in favor of Active Rock. KSJO for a few years was very competitive with Live 105 (ratings wise) in the overall San Francisco consolidated market. KSJO started to go downhill after they lost Lamont & Tonelli, and then plummeted when they went "el cheapo" with Bob & Tom and added loads of dinosaur rock to the playlist.
I believe a station similar to KRXQ or San Diego's Rock 105-3 might outperform what Live 105 is presently doing.
Entercom should consider it for 95.7 or 98.5. Seriously, does the Bay Area need 3 (!!!) Classic / Heritage Rock stations and a classic rock-friendly AAA station, too? ???
I listen late at night, I think its a speciality show
K
kenrayc
Guest
I don't see why there can't be a Active Rock (current) station in the Bay Area that includes a hard/ heavy metal classic format, in the past there have been many stations like KOME, KSJO, KRQR, KSAN and the original KMEL, they were successful, Live 105 doesn't have a clue, why have 3 classic rock stations and this so called Alternative live 105, Alice can handle Modern music, either 98.5 KUFX with Entercom buying it, even if it's a simulcast of KRXQ 98.5, or Live 105 switching to it.
kenrayc said:I don't see why there can't be a Active Rock (current) station in the Bay Area that includes a hard/ heavy metal classic format, in the past there have been many stations like KOME, KSJO, KRQR, KSAN and the original KMEL, [....]
Uh, because rock is dead? Do you realize that hip hop has lasted longer than rock? Scary, no?
DavidKaye said:kenrayc said:I don't see why there can't be a Active Rock (current) station in the Bay Area that includes a hard/ heavy metal classic format, in the past there have been many stations like KOME, KSJO, KRQR, KSAN and the original KMEL, [....]
Uh, because rock is dead? Do you realize that hip hop has lasted longer than rock? Scary, no?
David,
I'll probably regret challenging you here, because you seem to have a well rounded grasp of modern music history...certainly better than mine, but...
How do you figure that a genre of music (Hip Hop) that is said to have originated in the late 60s or mid 70s (depending on your source) - has lasted longer than music that originated in the late 1940s?
Yes, you can probably trace the "roots" of Hip Hop back much farther, but that certainly applies to Rock and Roll as well.
D
Dick Skinner
Guest
Don't regret it, Keller. It was an absurd assertion.
The message here is an interesting one that can be addressed by looking at the current music and radio landscape.
Market indicators of the Bay Area show the audience isn't a large enough to make money with a radio station doing Active Rock. How do we know this? a) record sales- there isn't nor hasn't been an influx of rock sales since the late 90s during the rap/rock heyday. b) concert ticket sales- a majority of active rock bands currently either play small venues like Konacti, or need to join a festival tour like Metal Mayhem, which only sold approximately 10,000 tickets at the 20,000 capacity Shoreline Amphitheatre as recently as last year. Of all the Active Rock bands that has become more of a pop-rock act, Linkin Park remains successful, albeit having already peaked. Again, this is based on local album and ticket sales. Acts such as Disturbed, Korn, etc. have done poorly in recent years and current acts of the genre haven't made an impression locally. Today's YouTube-reliant era shows that radio isn't always necessary to expose an act, so the argument of "well if there was a station playing this music, people would listen", is null and void. Justin Bieber has been tremendously successful and started on YouTube first. Radio just rode the wave after the fact.
Today's radio landscape is more corporate than ever. A PPM world has created radio stations left with very few "personalities" and more talking heads. The fact is radio conglomerates aren't going to take a chance on giving freedoms to a jock who needs time to grow. Why would they take a chance on what's become a niche format? Active rock sales worldwide are nowhere near hip-hop and pop acts. Check out this article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2011/jan/11/is-rock-finally-dead Referring to old stations like KSJO KRQR, KMEL and others is a moot point because there were A LOT more artists and mainstream support for a radio station to succeed. They flipped formats for a reason.
It's the sad reality and with an endless amount of choices on internet radio and even Sirius, Bay Area listeners can get their fix of Breaking Benjamin and Stone Sour. If there was such a demand, don't you think someone would already be doing the format?
Market indicators of the Bay Area show the audience isn't a large enough to make money with a radio station doing Active Rock. How do we know this? a) record sales- there isn't nor hasn't been an influx of rock sales since the late 90s during the rap/rock heyday. b) concert ticket sales- a majority of active rock bands currently either play small venues like Konacti, or need to join a festival tour like Metal Mayhem, which only sold approximately 10,000 tickets at the 20,000 capacity Shoreline Amphitheatre as recently as last year. Of all the Active Rock bands that has become more of a pop-rock act, Linkin Park remains successful, albeit having already peaked. Again, this is based on local album and ticket sales. Acts such as Disturbed, Korn, etc. have done poorly in recent years and current acts of the genre haven't made an impression locally. Today's YouTube-reliant era shows that radio isn't always necessary to expose an act, so the argument of "well if there was a station playing this music, people would listen", is null and void. Justin Bieber has been tremendously successful and started on YouTube first. Radio just rode the wave after the fact.
Today's radio landscape is more corporate than ever. A PPM world has created radio stations left with very few "personalities" and more talking heads. The fact is radio conglomerates aren't going to take a chance on giving freedoms to a jock who needs time to grow. Why would they take a chance on what's become a niche format? Active rock sales worldwide are nowhere near hip-hop and pop acts. Check out this article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2011/jan/11/is-rock-finally-dead Referring to old stations like KSJO KRQR, KMEL and others is a moot point because there were A LOT more artists and mainstream support for a radio station to succeed. They flipped formats for a reason.
It's the sad reality and with an endless amount of choices on internet radio and even Sirius, Bay Area listeners can get their fix of Breaking Benjamin and Stone Sour. If there was such a demand, don't you think someone would already be doing the format?
DavidKaye said:kenrayc said:I don't see why there can't be a Active Rock (current) station in the Bay Area that includes a hard/ heavy metal classic format, in the past there have been many stations like KOME, KSJO, KRQR, KSAN and the original KMEL, [....]
Uh, because rock is dead? Do you realize that hip hop has lasted longer than rock? Scary, no?
Lkeller said:How do you figure that a genre of music (Hip Hop) that is said to have originated in the late 60s or mid 70s (depending on your source) - has lasted longer than music that originated in the late 1940s?
Rock as we know it is a guitar and drum-driven 4/4 time music featuring what are called "rock chord progressions", usually known as "3-chord wonders" such as major chords I-IV-V. In the pre-Beatles era there were also some 4-chord progressions such as my favorite, I-vi-V-IV (heard in such songs as Ricky Nelson's "Poor Little Fool" and the Swinging Medallions' "Double-Shot of My Baby's Love. This was a carry-over from the doo-wop era, though doo-wop was mainly street vocals with little to no instruments and a slower tempo than rock.
Rock is distinct from blues progressions, which are generally I-IV-I-V-I. Also, blues lyrics tend to repeat on the I chords. This is distinctly different from rock. Rock is also different from rockabilly, which tended to feature sax, pedal steel, etc, and can be traced more to the Western swing era.
So, rock as we know it basically went from about 1961 to 1985 or so. Sure, there are bands putting out rock music, but they don't get played much. Rock purists will say that rock ended about 1973 with the advent of disco, synth pop, etc.
Hip-hop, however, has been largely unchanged since its inception in 1979. It's basically beat-boxing and/or sampling, rapping, and scratching. So, hip-hop is 32 years old (generally speaking) and rock lasted about 24 years (or about 15 years to purists).
sfpd1 said:The message here is an interesting one that can be addressed by looking at the current music and radio landscape.
(remainder deleted for brevity)
All very good points. Yet the same is pretty much true in Sacramento. So why does 98-rock do so well up there?
Dave B.
Entercom is up to something....tick toc, 95.7
K
kenrayc
Guest
A simulcast of KRXQ 98.5 for starters, but not necessary 95.7 but some Entercom station, with KRXQs morning show then eventually will go on their own with an AOR format.
Most of the info on the station swaps/moves re: KUFX & KUSF is in this thread: http://boards.radio-info.com/smf/index.php?topic=183467.0
As noted in other threads, Larry Sharp has left KISM in Bellingham, WA to return to the Bay Area - presumably to KUFX 98.5 & its new simulcast partner @ 102.1 in San Francisco.
As noted in other threads, Larry Sharp has left KISM in Bellingham, WA to return to the Bay Area - presumably to KUFX 98.5 & its new simulcast partner @ 102.1 in San Francisco.
Personally I think The Band will be the eventual loser, in my opinion. The Bone will survive, and with Larry Sharp's leadership, so will "K-Fox"!
Agreed. The only way The Bone stands a big chance of crashing & burning is if they lose their morning show to a competitor. The Bone's testosterone-laden stationality, strong morning show, and music position help differentiate it from the other two stations. It is also nicely complemented by KNBR. I would have to believe that is a formidable duo from a sales standpoint.
If The Bone's ratings start to erode substantially, Cumulus can always back off on the 70's rock and begin playing more 90's and even 00's rock (similar to the station that shares their name in Tampa).
I am not really sure what 103-7 The Band's biggest strength is -- other than low overhead. That can only carry the station so far. If operating cash flow isn't up to snuff, then the opportunity cost becomes too great and the station will head in a different direction. If the Classic Rock format eventually fails, I think a gold-leaning Adult Contemporary format may be viable.
What about FM Talk for 103.7? Fox Sports doesn't have an affilate here right?
@MarkW- Agree. The Band will give up first. CC would rather switch than fight. They did the same with "Soft Rock Hits" on K101, switching to Star...even after beating KOIT for a couple books. They will never want to spend money on programming expertise, talent, or promotion to compete.
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