Not sure where this topic would go, but let's try it here. In today's market, many stations are programmed with something like a giant ipod that let's PD's select which songs they want to play and how the rotation of the music is to run. This can all be preprogrammed in the computer. In the dark ages when real records were played, the PD, or someone had to decide which songs were played and when. There wasn't a computer to do that for them. My question is this: Is the role of the Program Director at a radio station today easier or harder than what it was then. And why? Thanks folks!
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Role of the Radio Program Director Now versus Then
- Thread starter FRR
- Start date
Based on that job description, I have to think it is easier. So much of radio now - particularly at smaller stations - involves automation and using satellite feeds that are aired. It's almost as if the P.D. is working with machines instead of people. Unfortunately, this has led to many stations sounding alike. Just tune across the AM dial some afternoon and see how many times you pick up Rush Limbaugh's show.
Program directors and music directors in this day and age are data entry clerks. Sorry to say that, but if I'm off, it's not by much.
There was a thread regarding Q102 back in the day and their local hits, that would not happen today. A regional or corporate VP of Programming would forbid any excuse to deviate from the plan.
Corporate radio existed back then, but on a local level you were allowed to interpret the concept and the focus was on the results. Today, in many situations, there is micromanaging of the entire process so you have to follow the instructions as written.
Corporate radio existed back then, but on a local level you were allowed to interpret the concept and the focus was on the results. Today, in many situations, there is micromanaging of the entire process so you have to follow the instructions as written.
D
DangerousLoner
Guest
Data entry clerks?
Hardly.
Today's PD is generally (depending on the company) responsible for FAR more than the PD 10 years ago. PDs today are often Brand Managers for their station's brand, which now extends to the streaming product and website. There's more interfacing with Sales, and promotions are generally a bit more complicated, given the web elements, etc.
Even with talent on the air live, the on-air systems require programming that used to be just having someone punch a cart here. Now, a lot of that stuff is pre-programmed.
I can personally attest to the fact that a PDs job in 1989 (when I got my first one) is incredibly simpler than the PDs job in 2008 (which, yes, I do - in a big market). Data entry clerk? Maybe on a completely automated syndicated station, but not on real, successful, viable players. It's a much more varied and complex job.
Hardly.
Today's PD is generally (depending on the company) responsible for FAR more than the PD 10 years ago. PDs today are often Brand Managers for their station's brand, which now extends to the streaming product and website. There's more interfacing with Sales, and promotions are generally a bit more complicated, given the web elements, etc.
Even with talent on the air live, the on-air systems require programming that used to be just having someone punch a cart here. Now, a lot of that stuff is pre-programmed.
I can personally attest to the fact that a PDs job in 1989 (when I got my first one) is incredibly simpler than the PDs job in 2008 (which, yes, I do - in a big market). Data entry clerk? Maybe on a completely automated syndicated station, but not on real, successful, viable players. It's a much more varied and complex job.
In he real days of radio, the DJ's picked the music, took requests, played the requests, maybe put together a string of songs that segued together nicely to form a thought in the listeners mind.
Ya there may have been someone who made a list of what songs could be played off a certain album, or in some cases what songs couldn't be played, but the DJ's used to control the songs.
The DJ would fill out a list of songs as he/she spun them, so the next DJ could lok over the list and avoid duplication. On the front of the album cover, there might have been a sticker where the staff could write little notes.. good song, bad song, don't play song, trivia for when you read off what songs you played.... And that was Linda Rondstat.... Andrew Gold was the guitarist on that song.... he passed away recently....
Back in the day, before consolidation, when you needed a license to be a DJ (to make transmitter adjustments and take readings), when radio was local, when things were good. When Engineers were Gods!
Ya there may have been someone who made a list of what songs could be played off a certain album, or in some cases what songs couldn't be played, but the DJ's used to control the songs.
The DJ would fill out a list of songs as he/she spun them, so the next DJ could lok over the list and avoid duplication. On the front of the album cover, there might have been a sticker where the staff could write little notes.. good song, bad song, don't play song, trivia for when you read off what songs you played.... And that was Linda Rondstat.... Andrew Gold was the guitarist on that song.... he passed away recently....
Back in the day, before consolidation, when you needed a license to be a DJ (to make transmitter adjustments and take readings), when radio was local, when things were good. When Engineers were Gods!
This is such an interesting post, I feel required to respond specifically.
From about 1970 on, only one format may have done this. Free form/album rock. I started in Top 40 in small and medium markets in 1972, and the only place where I picked the music was COLLEGE RADIO.
This is a very accurate description of my college radio station. It may also be the way that some non-comm stations on the West Coast act. But I'm personally only aware of one station in 35 years that worked somewhat like this.. CD101 in Columbus Ohio under Tom Tuber. In every other case, DJ's did NOT pick the songs. Consolidation is at fault for a lot of things, but taking music choice away from DJ's is not because of consolidation.
What's a PD's job today? Music programming - it is much more of a "computer programming" rather than "art of radio programming" issue, for sure. But with two music tests and balancing out hours for voice tracking, it does take time and precision. Personnel issues - hiring, firing and reviews. Imaging/production - the stuff between the songs. Promotion/marketing - in most cases, the PD has to be the brand manager and is responsible for a lot of the outside and internal marketing and promotional issues.
In he real days of radio, the DJ's picked the music, took requests, played the requests, maybe put together a string of songs that segued together nicely to form a thought in the listeners mind.
From about 1970 on, only one format may have done this. Free form/album rock. I started in Top 40 in small and medium markets in 1972, and the only place where I picked the music was COLLEGE RADIO.
The DJ would fill out a list of songs as he/she spun them, so the next DJ could lok over the list and avoid duplication. On the front of the album cover, there might have been a sticker where the staff could write little notes.. good song, bad song, don't play song, trivia for when you read off what songs you played.... And that was Linda Rondstat.... Andrew Gold was the guitarist on that song.... he passed away recently....
This is a very accurate description of my college radio station. It may also be the way that some non-comm stations on the West Coast act. But I'm personally only aware of one station in 35 years that worked somewhat like this.. CD101 in Columbus Ohio under Tom Tuber. In every other case, DJ's did NOT pick the songs. Consolidation is at fault for a lot of things, but taking music choice away from DJ's is not because of consolidation.
What's a PD's job today? Music programming - it is much more of a "computer programming" rather than "art of radio programming" issue, for sure. But with two music tests and balancing out hours for voice tracking, it does take time and precision. Personnel issues - hiring, firing and reviews. Imaging/production - the stuff between the songs. Promotion/marketing - in most cases, the PD has to be the brand manager and is responsible for a lot of the outside and internal marketing and promotional issues.
FRR said:My question is this: Is the role of the Program Director at a radio station today easier or harder than what it was then. And why? Thanks folks!
It's hard to say whether it's easier or harder, but it sure is different. Today, with staffs shrinking, a lot of PD's are resposnsible for so many different facets of the operation of the station. And, in the past several years, we've seen PD's cut out of the picture at a sister station, while another PD in place then takes on the departing PD's station as well. I think there's probably a lot more time spent these days on administrative type things, and yes, data entry, and not nearly the time spent on things like listening to new music and dealing with a staff of air "personalities."
Were there ever any stations that actually PLAYED records instead of records recorded onto carts? ??? I know that Dr. Dave, when he was at Z-93, said that all the music was carted up off of records...He was Music Director at Z from 85-89, when Randy Ross took the MD stripes. Not sure when they started just playing just CDs at Z-93(Maybe Jason Roberts could fill us in...He was at 717 E. David Rd. back in the late 80s and early 90s)...I DO remember that most stations in the late 80s were saying, "That was insert artist name here with insert song title here straight from Compact Disc." Funny thing...I think until Radio One bought Z, that they still were playing CDs and carts...I remember someone that worked there telling me that awhile back. I know WING-FM also was playing CDs and carts until they flipped to HOT when Radio One came in and plugged in a pre-programmed computer.
Yes, there were stations that played records, WTUE when they first switched to AOR was one. I worked at several smaller stations that played 45s. I visiitd a station in Angola, IN in the early 80s that was top 40 but played most of their music off LPs or 12-inch singles. Carts of course eliminated cue burns and having to constantly get new copies of the music you were playing. On a 45 you could go through 6 copies during the chart life of a song.
alans613 said:Were there ever any stations that actually PLAYED records instead of records recorded onto carts?
I'm sure WCLU played most (if not all) of its music straight off records. Just as a listener, I could figure this out just from the records skipping so much.
ZRXOA 5248 said:In he real days of radio, the DJ's picked the music, took requests, played the requests, maybe put together a string of songs that segued together nicely to form a thought in the listeners mind.
Ya there may have been someone who made a list of what songs could be played off a certain album, or in some cases what songs couldn't be played, but the DJ's used to control the songs.
The DJ would fill out a list of songs as he/she spun them, so the next DJ could lok over the list and avoid duplication. On the front of the album cover, there might have been a sticker where the staff could write little notes.. good song, bad song, don't play song, trivia for when you read off what songs you played.... And that was Linda Rondstat.... Andrew Gold was the guitarist on that song.... he passed away recently....
Back in the day, before consolidation, when you needed a license to be a DJ (to make transmitter adjustments and take readings), when radio was local, when things were good. When Engineers were Gods!
I hate to tell you this...but, with the sole exception of college radio, you're talking about radio from the 1950's and early 1960's, except in the smallest of radio markets.
Licenses went away in the early 80's...not due to consolidation. And radio wasn't always good when it was "live and local". Salaries in smaller stations were really sub-standard. ($10,500 for morning show host wasn't unusual.)
Does that mean I'm a "corporate toadie"? No. There's lots that I can criticize about consolidation. But some of you guys are either living in your college radio days, or are rewriting history. Successful Top 40 AM stations controlled their music pretty strenuously by the late 1960's.
radioboymark said:This is such an interesting post, I feel required to respond specifically.
In he real days of radio, the DJ's picked the music, took requests, played the requests, maybe put together a string of songs that segued together nicely to form a thought in the listeners mind.
From about 1970 on, only one format may have done this. Free form/album rock. I started in Top 40 in small and medium markets in 1972, and the only place where I picked the music was COLLEGE RADIO.
The DJ would fill out a list of songs as he/she spun them, so the next DJ could lok over the list and avoid duplication. On the front of the album cover, there might have been a sticker where the staff could write little notes.. good song, bad song, don't play song, trivia for when you read off what songs you played.... And that was Linda Rondstat.... Andrew Gold was the guitarist on that song.... he passed away recently....
This is a very accurate description of my college radio station. It may also be the way that some non-comm stations on the West Coast act. But I'm personally only aware of one station in 35 years that worked somewhat like this.. CD101 in Columbus Ohio under Tom Tuber. In every other case, DJ's did NOT pick the songs. Consolidation is at fault for a lot of things, but taking music choice away from DJ's is not because of consolidation.
What's a PD's job today? Music programming - it is much more of a "computer programming" rather than "art of radio programming" issue, for sure. But with two music tests and balancing out hours for voice tracking, it does take time and precision. Personnel issues - hiring, firing and reviews. Imaging/production - the stuff between the songs. Promotion/marketing - in most cases, the PD has to be the brand manager and is responsible for a lot of the outside and internal marketing and promotional issues.
This man knows of what he speaks. Read...and learn. Thank you, Mark!
alans613 said:Were there ever any stations that actually PLAYED records instead of records recorded onto carts? ??? I know that Dr. Dave, when he was at Z-93, said that all the music was carted up off of records...He was Music Director at Z from 85-89, when Randy Ross took the MD stripes. Not sure when they started just playing just CDs at Z-93(Maybe Jason Roberts could fill us in...He was at 717 E. David Rd. back in the late 80s and early 90s)...I DO remember that most stations in the late 80s were saying, "That was insert artist name here with insert song title here straight from Compact Disc." Funny thing...I think until Radio One bought Z, that they still were playing CDs and carts...I remember someone that worked there telling me that awhile back. I know WING-FM also was playing CDs and carts until they flipped to HOT when Radio One came in and plugged in a pre-programmed computer.
Alans...most stations played 45's until the late 1960's - early 1970's at the very least. WING went to all cart only after it moved to 717 East David. WTUE played vinyl from it's Top 40 days until CD's started taking hold.(Most stations didn't have carts longer than about 7 1/2 minutes...and it would have been tough to cart up some LP cuts.) WONE was all cart by the mid-70's. WDAO was vinyl up till it's end on FM. (At the very least they were vinyl when I worked there in the late 70's) WHIO-AM was vinyl until it's music days ended when Lou Emm retired. (I should know...we just took the turntables out of the studio a year or two ago.) Z was all cart, but that was the norm by the 80's. We were all cart when I worked at WING, though we did redub some of the oldies from CD when that started coming in.
Were there ever any stations that actually PLAYED records instead of records recorded onto carts?
1972 - WIZE AM Springfield Ohio - all the music was on cart. Currents on individual carts, oldies on B and C size carts (the 20 - 30 minute kind) with a short "voice track" at the beginning to tell you what song was coming up. You listened to that in cue ("Osmonds, One Bad Apple, 3:10 with a 5 second intro") before playing the song on air. One of the weekenders had to cart up the oldies every week from the 45's and put the name announcements prior to each song. Someone was always in a hurry slammed in an oldies cart and that cut got played on the air. (Not me of course, I was always paying attention.) I forgot his name, but one of the guys who carted up the oldies used to make fun of them or use "inappropriate language" ("It's another f%$ing Beatles song..") All oldies went to individual carts when Steve Joos, GM/PD, got tired of hearing those names read on air or heard something he didn't like. If I remember correctly, the entire oldies library got carted up in about two days.
1973 - WTUE FM - Some of the currents were on cart and we played album tracks straight from the LP. (It was a riot to watch Bill Struck pick cuts from an album to play. He would only listen to the first 5 seconds.)
1974 - WKFI, Wilmington Ohio - (what are the calls of that station, is it still on the air? At the time, it was owned by Gannet when they bought the newspaper.) Everything was on cart with two three-stack decks. And everything was toned and Cart 1 started Cart 2. My first experience with a "sequencer". If you wanted to pause, you had to skip a deck.
1975 - WKRQ, Cincinnati - We had a frequency analyzer in the production room and when we carted up a song, we sped up the turntable 3-5% and we EQ'ed the song to match the frequency response of the one song Randy thought sounded great right off the 45 - "China Grove". We still had turntables in the control room, and every once and a while I would play something in middays on the first day it was out. I will never forget "Tusk" by Fleetwood Mac. The first time I heard it I was playing it on the air.
Jason, next time I'm in town can I do a shift on the air for you?
radioboymark said:Were there ever any stations that actually PLAYED records instead of records recorded onto carts?
1972 - WIZE AM Springfield Ohio - all the music was on cart. Currents on individual carts, oldies on B and C size carts (the 20 - 30 minute kind) with a short "voice track" at the beginning to tell you what song was coming up. You listened to that in cue ("Osmonds, One Bad Apple, 3:10 with a 5 second intro") before playing the song on air. One of the weekenders had to cart up the oldies every week from the 45's and put the name announcements prior to each song. Someone was always in a hurry slammed in an oldies cart and that cut got played on the air. (Not me of course, I was always paying attention.) I forgot his name, but one of the guys who carted up the oldies used to make fun of them or use "inappropriate language" ("It's another f%$ing Beatles song..") All oldies went to individual carts when Steve Joos, GM/PD, got tired of hearing those names read on air or heard something he didn't like. If I remember correctly, the entire oldies library got carted up in about two days.
1973 - WTUE FM - Some of the currents were on cart and we played album tracks straight from the LP. (It was a riot to watch Bill Struck pick cuts from an album to play. He would only listen to the first 5 seconds.)
1974 - WKFI, Wilmington Ohio - (what are the calls of that station, is it still on the air? At the time, it was owned by Gannet when they bought the newspaper.) Everything was on cart with two three-stack decks. And everything was toned and Cart 1 started Cart 2. My first experience with a "sequencer". If you wanted to pause, you had to skip a deck.
1975 - WKRQ, Cincinnati - We had a frequency analyzer in the production room and when we carted up a song, we sped up the turntable 3-5% and we EQ'ed the song to match the frequency response of the one song Randy thought sounded great right off the 45 - "China Grove". We still had turntables in the control room, and every once and a while I would play something in middays on the first day it was out. I will never forget "Tusk" by Fleetwood Mac. The first time I heard it I was playing it on the air.
Jason, next time I'm in town can I do a shift on the air for you?
Mark:
That's a hilarious story about WIZE and the oldies carts. I had never heard about that and it's a riot. I'll remember that one for the Hall Of Fame Media Page someday...
WKFI is still around and is part of the WBZI/WKFI/WEDI trimulcast. Classic country from Xenia on all 3 frequencies (WEDI is the AM in Eaton). Word is the Mullins family does OK with it. For a while, though, the second owner of what was WDHK-FM in Wilmington had bought WKFI and merged the two together. (Go figure, huh? Seeing how Gannett fought so long to keep the FM off the air!)
Yeah, I do kind of remembering Terry Dorsey telling me about WTUE carting the current playlist songs. I had forgotten about that. And, it's a good thing with how Bill Struck "previewed" LP cuts that the "Greatest Hits" album by James Taylor wasn't out yet for him to track the live version of "Steamroller Blues"! But, check the media page of the Dayton Broadcaster's Hall Of Fame website for, er uh...a "moment" you had with a stuck 45 during Record Recall early one morning. Your comeback line was a classic.
Sure, you can do a show anytime you'd like. Or, we could do it as a duo..."Jason & Jason"? Or...maybe not.
B
BobointheH20
Guest
radioboymark said:1975 - WKRQ, Cincinnati - We had a frequency analyzer in the production room and when we carted up a song, we sped up the turntable 3-5% and we EQ'ed the song to match the frequency response of the one song Randy thought sounded great right off the 45 - "China Grove". We still had turntables in the control room, and every once and a while I would play something in middays on the first day it was out. I will never forget "Tusk" by Fleetwood Mac. The first time I heard it I was playing it on the air.
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Mark, for answering the question that plagued me through my teen years-- am I crazy or is that song actually slighter faster on "the Q"?
The answer, I now know, is yes to both!
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