satellite vs HD-radio no comparison

[gunsmoke]

Not with variety, with sound quality, I have Sirius in my new car (they refused to put HD in the Taurus), the stereo separation, sounds crappy and the overall sound is not as good as the main FM signals I pick up on the T-Dial. I just plugged my new JVC, HD tuner into my radio, put the antenna on the dash, tried the B and OGL for a test. You cannot compare the sound of HD to satellite, the HD sound was fantastic, crystal clear, crisp and the stereo separation was the best. HD sounds so much better than Satellite, which always claims, CD sound, great quality, but it cannot match HD. I noticed in the city limits I had no drops and the HD's were solid, same with the AM-HD's, I was surprised to hear WUBA 1480 in HD..also, why the heck doesn't OGL put KLUV on their 2, 3 or 4, it would cost nothing to operate, its already a CBS owned and operated station, so why not put it on. I wrote Anne G many times but she is kinda ignorant, never received a response or acknowledgement. I always receive responses from RFF, the B, XTU and others, she should not be in her position if she is so above the listener.

 

[Bill_W]

Not with variety, with sound quality, I have Sirius in my new car (they refused to put HD in the Taurus), the stereo separation, sounds crappy and the overall sound is not as good as the main FM signals I pick up on the T-Dial. I just plugged my new JVC, HD tuner into my radio, put the antenna on the dash, tried the B and OGL for a test. You cannot compare the sound of HD to satellite, the HD sound was fantastic, crystal clear, crisp and the stereo separation was the best. HD sounds so much better than Satellite, which always claims, CD sound, great quality, but it cannot match HD. I noticed in the city limits I had no drops and the HD's were solid, same with the AM-HD's, I was surprised to hear WUBA 1480 in HD..also, why the heck doesn't OGL put KLUV on their 2, 3 or 4, it would cost nothing to operate, its already a CBS owned and operated station, so why not put it on. I wrote Anne G many times but she is kinda ignorant, never received a response or acknowledgement. I always receive responses from RFF, the B, XTU and others, she should not be in her position if she is so above the listener.

Sirius-XM used to sound great coming out of my DirecTv box with a digital cable into mt stereo at home.

 

[JimmyJames]

That's because the DirecTV feed was taken direct from Sirius and ran at a higher rate than the Sirius broadcast to their receivers.

 

[MattParker]

People get into AA and next think you know, they try to get everybody into AA. People find Jesus and they start trying to save everyone they meet. Gunsmoke, you bought an HD receiver and now you want to sell HD to everybody. I can't help wondering if you are really preaching the Gospel of HD or trying to allay your own doubts about a recent purchase. Check back with us in five years and let us know if that HD receiver is up in the attic, along with the AM stereo receiver, 8-track tape player or Laser Disk player. In fairness, I suspect the XM/Sirius receivers will be in the attic, too.

Meantime, I was listening to KLUV-HD2 in my car yesterday, thanks to the media player in my smart phone. I like it but Elvis every hour is a little much. I actually prefer Clear Channel's Real Oldies. Plus several Live365 Oldies channels.

It's curious. WOGL is playing what another station a few years ago called "Jammin' Oldies." And you want them to put their old format on HD2 (which is what some stations have done).

And the sound quality of anything in a car is not a big deal. Not the best speakers or equipment. Not the best listening environment. FM sound quality is fine for cars.

 

[DaveWilliams]

Even Internet radio sounds better than Sirus does right now! A $67 internet radio from Walmart sounded so much brighter in a recent test I did. Guess Sirus had to do something when they're paying Stern $2,009 a minute!

 

[qtpieislit]

I just bought a refurbished 8 Track player complete with HD radio.

 

[DG02816]

One can only hope HD goes the way of the 8-track and quadraphonic sound.
As I said in an earlier post, HD is the electronic version of the road to hell being paved with good intentions.

 

[Starbucks]

Here's the Problem .....HD vs. XM

One can only hope HD goes the way of the 8-track and quadraphonic sound.
As I said in an earlier post, HD is the electronic version of the road to hell being paved with good intentions.

Yes....I've listened to an HD receiver desktop myself, and yes it sounds very good. Better then satellite.
But the problem.....

1. I don't care to listen to the Pride channels everywhere market I go. ( I never knew there was such a thing called straight music)
2. When I'm traveling more then 20 or so miles, I don't want to keep changing stations when I do find something worth listening to.
3. So, HD at it's finest is made for home use listening only.
4. As long as the sound is clear digital....no static..most people won't care to spend more money and installation for a gadget they don't need. Music is accessible everywhere. But it does sound good.

 

[musichead1029]

Re: Here's the Problem .....HD vs. XM

I've listened to an HD receiver desktop myself, and yes it sounds very good. Better than satellite.

Depends on the satellite and the HD station. I have HD and XM, which I hear sounds better than Sirius these days. HD talk stations certainly sound better than XM. XM has reduced the bandwidth of their talk and weather/traffic stations down to being barely listenable. Sounds like a bad 32kbps mp3. But the XM music stations sound about the same as HD. WRDW-HD2's music sounds distorted. In this case, XM clearly sounds better. The digital artifacts are more noticeable on XM's Classical stations than on WPEN-FM HD2. Neither sounds great through headphones. An analog FM signal receivable without serious multipath still sounds the best of the three.

2. When I'm traveling more then 20 or so miles, I don't want to keep changing stations when I do find something worth listening to.
3. So, HD at it's finest is made for home use listening only.

Yep. Add to that satellite's 100+ channels vs maybe 10-15 HD channels tops and satellite wins hands down on variety and receivability. Unless you're near Washington DC, it's unlikely that HD is going to offer a Bluegrass channel to rival XM's. And I can listen to satellite everywhere - even where there's no cell service.

So the sound of all the digital sources is comparable to a poorly encoded mp3 file. It's not ever going to be audiophile quality, but the public has already made it clear that they don't really care much about sound quality as long as it's fairly listenable and convenient. They want quantity over quality, which is why you see some HD stations going with 3 and 4 channels, making each channel sound a little worse, but not adding much to the variety of available formats.

 

[Jimmy128]

I have both. I like both. I can't understand the haters of HD. BTW, I'm from Boston and I enjoy your WDAS HD2 Slow Jams. Great station wish we had it in Boston. I wrote to Clear Channel.

 

[musichead1029]

The haters (ed: replace with adult term) critics of HD radio are usually responding to

• the over-the-top hype and childish anti-satellite radio rhetoric that surrounded the launch of the technology,
• that the FCC anointed Ibiquity's compromise system over other options in an effort to jump start the adoption of the technology,
• that the technology was adopted in response to political prerogatives rather than to address an actual consumer need,
• the fact that AM HD causes broadcasters to degrade analog audio quality
• that AM HD ruins adjacent and second-adjacent DXing with little or no benefit as AM HD is very difficult if not impossible to receive in even moderately noisy environments,
• and that the technology has been decisively rejected by the marketplace due to the aforementioned and yet some still continue to flog the dead horse due to financial and political prerogatives that are of little to no interest to the average radio consumer.

And I personally like FM HD radio, though it's pretty much limited to home listening with a good antenna. But AM HD really has further degraded AM in pursuit of elusive benefits. A bad idea that is fortunately being recognized as such and abandoned.

I'm sure others can add to the list.

 

[Jimmy128]

I understand what you are saying. I have Sirius XM in my car which is fine. I have no complaints. However, I think that HD does sound superior although it is only practical at home attached to your stereo with a good antenna or at work with a good antenna. I don't know how it would work out in a car or whether the HD2 stations would cut out from movement. Still, I don't think it going to die any time soon seeing that all the big broadcasters have put so much into it.
I don't listen to AM that much so I don't know about that.

 

[musichead1029]

I don't think it going to die any time soon seeing that all the big broadcasters have put so much into it.

The question is how long they're going to support something they're getting nothing out of. Probably until the HD transmitter/exciter fails beyond an economical repair.... In the not-too-distant-future, look for stations saying that their HD signal is "on hiatus" until repairs can be made. Those repairs will be complete right after Joe Scarborough resumes his "on hiatus" syndicated radio show.

 

[Jimmy128]

I don't think it going to die any time soon seeing that all the big broadcasters have put so much into it.

The question is how long they're going to support something they're getting nothing out of. Probably until the HD transmitter/exciter fails beyond an economical repair.... In the not-too-distant-future, look for stations saying that their HD signal is "on hiatus" until repairs can be made. Those repairs will be complete right after Joe Scarborough resumes his "on hiatus" syndicated radio show.

I think the reason the big broadcasters are keeping HD radio is that they are in a new ball game. They are up against Siruus XM, Internet stations, Youtube, iPods, so I think they are trying to keep listeners this way.

 

[musichead1029]

Just as my original post stated, the sound in the car with HD is fantastic, better than my Sirius on the same car audio system.

Could be. Don't try listening to either of them in headphones. Terrible. If sound quality is important, go with a CD ripped from an LP from a decent turntable. Or analog FM. Or a FLAC file on a file player. Any will blow away HD or satellite radio.

I did not go more than 20 miles from any Xmtr, so I don't know just how far they will carry.

I haven't been closer to XM's transmitter than 22,000 miles*, and reception is near flawless. ;D

(* Likely reception of in-city terrestrial repeaters excepted. Your mileage may vary.)

Just wish there were more choices on the HD-sides.

Even if they fix the reception issues, there will never be 1/5 the choices on HD that there are on satellite. That is satellite's selling point, and that's why satellite has let the audio quality go to hell. They figure car listeners will take quantity over quality. If HD were to catch on, you'd see most stations with HD-3s and 4s, with lower sound quality on each channel.

 

[Savage]

Yes, and don't forget that far more than DXers trying to listen to distant second and third-adjacent AM stations are stymied by HD. Because the digital HD sidebands are flung hundreds of miles via skywave at night - remember they propagate just like the main channel does - HD-AM stations destroy LOCAL coverage of LOCAL stations within their protected contours.

WYSL 1040 in Rochester has our nighttime coverage obliterated by WBZ-HD, which radiates the equivalent of 4100 mV/m in our direction. At times the upper OFDM sideband wipes out our local signal exceeding 40 mV/m. "City grade" FCC AM coverage is 5.0 mV/m, and our nighttime protected "interference-free" is 13.687 mV/m. WBZ goes through that like butter. The FCC has ignored repeated complaints.

This is why Citadel shut of HD on WABC, WJR and WSB after two weeks of experimentation back in 2007. The stations were obliterating each other at night. Not even 50kw NDA can overcome HD skywave.

 

[Starbucks]

What do you expect with 10 khz of bandwidth. For HD-AM to work, they would need a rebanding of the AM band period.

 

[Savage]

When iBiquity's predecessor, "Project Acorn" was tasked with including AM broadcasting in the IBOC scheme, radio industry engineers basically reacted by saying: forget it. There is nowhere enough bandwidth, and mediumwave propagation characteristics mean that nighttime distant skywave will make the digital carriers worthless, to say nothing of the local interference to existing service.

But for political reasons AM "had" to be included in HD. The FCC (populated by lawyers and few engineers) said there's no way we're going to have digital radio for only one band. So the developers farmed out development of AM-HD to an aerospace firm which knew nothing about broadcasting in general, and still less about AM.

It was the classic "hear no evil" monkey with his fingers in his ears. "Don't tell me it won't work!
MAKE it work!!" Only politicians and lawyers could think they can revoke the laws of physics.
But it's our fault as an industry for going along with it.

 

[athegymtday]

What a waste HD is on AM radio. Turn the hash off! Actually, it will probably happen soon anyway! Let it die naturally.