Listening to Scott and Toad this week I cannot help but notice the show almost seems like it is being phoned in. A phone scam mentioned a diners club credit card. Another one mentioned a former neighbor who he said moved away years ago. Coopers job must be to just laugh because her quote breaking entertainment news is usually something I already heard on 103.5 the day before. As Much as I love the great Scott Shannon he even seems like he's a recording of his former self. The only 2 people worth listening to are bill Evans and his accurate weather and Jeff McKay traffic which is more accurate then his predecessor. Scott and Toad were great once but they sound too old for a younger sounding WPLJ. It also seems as if some of what they do is prerecorded. Cubby and Cindy would be much better for their target demos than the overpaid former stars. Time for a change.
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Scott and Todd getting old!
- Thread starter RadioRayWedeman
- Start date
Scott was born in 1947. Todd was born somewhere around 1967. (His bio doesn't give his birthdate but says he's been married since 1987 and I know he married quite young.) Contrast that with someone who's 35 today, born in 1978.
So Todd isn't too far out of the demo, although Scott certainly is. The question is, how do they score in the ratings? If Cumulus is happy, they're safe. They've got two decades of name recognition and reliability. But they also have big paychecks. I'd assume Scott is somewhere around $1 million a year, considering he used to be WPLJ's Program Director as well as morning star. He doesn't do that anymore but did he take a paycut when he stopped being in management? And Todd has been his partner for a couple of decades so I'm sure he's making many hundreds of thousands himself.
As for phoning it in, most morning shows in July and August aren't as revved up as other times of the year. Perhaps Scott or Todd are dividing their worktime with having their families at a summer home. Maybe some staffers are off. Their audience is also partially on vacation, the kids are not in school, etc. Listen in September and let us know if it still sounds "phoned in."
I really find the show aimed very low. The artificial laughter, the prank phone calls, it's not for me. I know he's been doing morning radio for 40 years, first Tampa, then NYC. But for the life of me, I can't figure out how anyone finds Scott funny or friendly or happy. He always sounds like someone in a bad mood forcing himself to be entertaining. However, I'm not a 35 year old working mom either. Obviously they like his act.
Up until last year, WPLJ was sort of a hybrid station, a mix of Hot AC and Rock Hits of the 80s and 90s. Rhythmic artists were limited to two spins an hour. You could actually count it out. That changed when Cumulus got more involved in programming the station with a standard Hot AC format. Out went most music recorded before 2000. In came more Rhythmic and youthful artists.
Overall WPLJ's ratings went up. They're now often tied with CBS's AC station Fresh 102.7. Yet they kept Scott & Todd in place. So I guess that means Cumulus is OK with their salaries, ages and the ratings of their show.
So Todd isn't too far out of the demo, although Scott certainly is. The question is, how do they score in the ratings? If Cumulus is happy, they're safe. They've got two decades of name recognition and reliability. But they also have big paychecks. I'd assume Scott is somewhere around $1 million a year, considering he used to be WPLJ's Program Director as well as morning star. He doesn't do that anymore but did he take a paycut when he stopped being in management? And Todd has been his partner for a couple of decades so I'm sure he's making many hundreds of thousands himself.
As for phoning it in, most morning shows in July and August aren't as revved up as other times of the year. Perhaps Scott or Todd are dividing their worktime with having their families at a summer home. Maybe some staffers are off. Their audience is also partially on vacation, the kids are not in school, etc. Listen in September and let us know if it still sounds "phoned in."
I really find the show aimed very low. The artificial laughter, the prank phone calls, it's not for me. I know he's been doing morning radio for 40 years, first Tampa, then NYC. But for the life of me, I can't figure out how anyone finds Scott funny or friendly or happy. He always sounds like someone in a bad mood forcing himself to be entertaining. However, I'm not a 35 year old working mom either. Obviously they like his act.
Up until last year, WPLJ was sort of a hybrid station, a mix of Hot AC and Rock Hits of the 80s and 90s. Rhythmic artists were limited to two spins an hour. You could actually count it out. That changed when Cumulus got more involved in programming the station with a standard Hot AC format. Out went most music recorded before 2000. In came more Rhythmic and youthful artists.
Overall WPLJ's ratings went up. They're now often tied with CBS's AC station Fresh 102.7. Yet they kept Scott & Todd in place. So I guess that means Cumulus is OK with their salaries, ages and the ratings of their show.
I'm sure that when the end finally comes, the prevailing view will be that Cumulus was looking to save money by replacing expensive veteran talent with cheaper younger hosts. Cheap corporate management. Someone might even bring up age discrimination. But not now.
About a year ago, Cumulus went through the loss of their highly rated morning duo Mark & Brian at KLOS in LA. They replaced them with established LA names, but it's not the same show. They're getting a 2 share now, beaten regularly by the local country station. Scott & Todd get a 3 in NYC. They're familiar names that have an established fan base. If they go, who do you replace them with?
Sure Scott is old. So is Imus. That's what Cumulus is looking at. Aging veteran talent that will be tough to replace. They don't want to blow up two stations at the same time. Who goes first? My bet is Imus.
About a year ago, Cumulus went through the loss of their highly rated morning duo Mark & Brian at KLOS in LA. They replaced them with established LA names, but it's not the same show. They're getting a 2 share now, beaten regularly by the local country station. Scott & Todd get a 3 in NYC. They're familiar names that have an established fan base. If they go, who do you replace them with?
Sure Scott is old. So is Imus. That's what Cumulus is looking at. Aging veteran talent that will be tough to replace. They don't want to blow up two stations at the same time. Who goes first? My bet is Imus.
They only actually work about 4 minutes per hour, another radio show actually did the math once. I'm sure Scott can keep that up for a few more years. Of course Todd and the lady co-host making fun of Scott constantly will eventually get through his head and he might just retire.
ProducerGuy said:
the rumor I heard is he wants to go to CBS FM, but take that with a grain of salt. I could see that as a better fit if Cumulus wants to go with a younger sound. The show DOES sound a bit faster paced when you have Todd host it. Less news stories, and more people interest stuff. He also talks to callers a bit more.
If I had to take a guess, they might make it to 25 and decide what to do then. By then even they might be ready to quit. Patty Steele left when Dish Nation came around. Guess she didn't want to be on TV. Brad Blanks left for family reasons, but also because I Think he gets bored if he sticks with one thing too long. JCooper left, but that might have been involuntary based on on air stories ;o)..
I know after discovering them in junior high when they started, I don't have the time, or attention span anymore to get acclimated to new hosts. I'll just go to big joe henry on the weekend.
RadioRayWedeman said:
you lost your credibility right there j/k ;o)..... I love Bill, But there was a REASON why the 50/50 Weather Jingle was around. I'm STILL waiting for these severe thunderstorms to show up ;o).
I've learned NOT to trust Jeff "I have no sense of sentence structure and I like to PUNcUate in weird places" McKay. Driving the roads when he first started, he not only didn't cover my area, but he didn't get my area right when he did. At least he's upgraded NJ to more than just the parkway and turnpike...but I tend to turn him off when I hear his ben stein like voice..
I also miss the shows glory days. I tend to compare it to Letterman and his slow decline into, well, standard safe fare. Letterman had the velcro suit, Larry Bud Melman, etc. PLJ had Brad Blanks, Classic live appearances in places where no one showed up..and other live events like Cruises, Diner tours... lots of audience interaction and remotes. Now, thanks to budget cuts, and probably because their tastes have changed, they rarely leave the studio and some days they sound like they truly sound like they wish they where somewhere else (Friday, Todd 'joked' about a life style change when the lottery got brought up).
All in all, I would have no problem if scott wanted to retire. I think the show could continue on quite well with just Todd and his two co hosts. Wether or not they need a fourth person would be up to them. But if they brought in a whole new crew? I'd probably drop PLJ altogether. The Music has been sounding a little more up beat and dancy lately, which is good. Less songs that sound like an office would have playing in the cubicles as background noise. But CBS FM and oldies is more my thing..
As long as they stay around for another Jocktober(http://oapedia.com/oa/Jocktober) this year, I'm fine.
Lets face reality. WPLJ's morning show has not been the same since Patty Steele and Brad were there. Cooper isn't even a poor person's Patty Steele. Bill Evans is Bill Evans and his work speaks for itself. Interesting is how the ratings for WPLJ according to published Arbitron PPM have gone up from January to June, and in that time the only change was the management kicking my and Shredder's fave buddy Joseph P. Nolan to the perverbial curb. Joey hasn't impacted WCBS-FM's ratings at all since he's been there, so unless you have a beef with Arbitron that point's moot.
Shredd-o-rama brings up what you could conclude is an inside story that maybe Joe's best buddy Scott Shannon would love to reunite with him. Since it won't happen on WPLJ where what AFTRA rumors of non-compete issues might come into play, WCBS-FM could be a better destination since the audience is older anyway. The way I see it as a longtime DJ, the PLJ "soiree" is skewing younger due to the Cumulus-mandated changes to a "hotter" AC. Lets face reality and admit Scott and Todd just don't fit anymore. Coupled with their salaries which you have to think are probably some of the highest in the Cumulus food chain, maybe PLJ will consider changes when their contracts expire?
Lets face reality. They lost Dish Nation meaning they lost their potential youth demos. They lost Josephus Nolan, and despite on-air crying and you would have to think were demands to upper managers he wasn't coming back. Scott and Todd simply don't have the "Mojo" they once had. They were great once, but their time is done. Their Shtick plays old, they sound old, and you would have to think they just can't reach the younger demos like a Ralphie can. Maybe moving Ralphie to the morning would be the answer. Cumulus would be smart to clean the entire morning house and bring in a show more reflective to the demos they want, and better to their bottom line. At this point Imus could probably do WPLJ and get the same ratings since they reach some of the same age ranges IMHO.
If not Ralphie, Dial Global's Hot AC syndicated product would fit right in and be far less costly, and with weather and traffic from anyone would still be cost effect and ratings probably wouldn't suffer at all.
Shredd-o-rama brings up what you could conclude is an inside story that maybe Joe's best buddy Scott Shannon would love to reunite with him. Since it won't happen on WPLJ where what AFTRA rumors of non-compete issues might come into play, WCBS-FM could be a better destination since the audience is older anyway. The way I see it as a longtime DJ, the PLJ "soiree" is skewing younger due to the Cumulus-mandated changes to a "hotter" AC. Lets face reality and admit Scott and Todd just don't fit anymore. Coupled with their salaries which you have to think are probably some of the highest in the Cumulus food chain, maybe PLJ will consider changes when their contracts expire?
Lets face reality. They lost Dish Nation meaning they lost their potential youth demos. They lost Josephus Nolan, and despite on-air crying and you would have to think were demands to upper managers he wasn't coming back. Scott and Todd simply don't have the "Mojo" they once had. They were great once, but their time is done. Their Shtick plays old, they sound old, and you would have to think they just can't reach the younger demos like a Ralphie can. Maybe moving Ralphie to the morning would be the answer. Cumulus would be smart to clean the entire morning house and bring in a show more reflective to the demos they want, and better to their bottom line. At this point Imus could probably do WPLJ and get the same ratings since they reach some of the same age ranges IMHO.
If not Ralphie, Dial Global's Hot AC syndicated product would fit right in and be far less costly, and with weather and traffic from anyone would still be cost effect and ratings probably wouldn't suffer at all.
almaniac27 said:
I've got a tree on my house!
RadioRayWedeman said:
the problem with younger guys, is that they don't tend to have staying power. The last guy to last more than ten years, is Radio Voice of the Gods Race Taylor. Jeff Miles left when his kid was born..he barely made three, I believe. Not sure if John Foxx is still on the air, and Ralphie is the new kid. But since PLJ doesn't play my type of music, I tend to only listen to the morning show, so I don't know how he fares.
If anything, I'd like to see them give Race a shot at a LONGER show, not these 3 minute breaks most of today's youth claim are 'Too long'. Seriously, someone complained that a three minute show break was way too long. Personally, in days where you can get music ANYWHERE, I still think good DJ's make or break a station...
The problem with WPLJ is two-fold --- they are hanging their proverbial hat on two guys who sound like they are two generations older than their target demos, and despite having a caretaker PD, take their marching orders from corporate offices in another part of the country. Scott and Todd are big names, but they sound like they belong on a station targeting 55-75 year olds and not 25-45 year olds as WPLJ is doing. Yes suburban housewives are their demo, but their 1990's morning show material is generations old, much like the "replayed" phone scams and recorded bits. Established names like Bill Evans weather and Jeff McKay traffic both with trusted and well-known products can play well to anyone. But handcuffing talent like Race Taylor and playing and replaying songs and not talking about them makes the station sound more like an iPod that you will eventually turn off and replace with music by yourself. That is one reason the station's numbers may have plateaued. They may want to consider moving top-notch talent Ralphie (the next Elvis Duran) into mornings before another station grabs him and makes him the star he already is and jettison the high-paid and seemingly phoning-it-in Scott and Todd. Let Race be Race and allow him to create a solid daypart. Ralphie and Race should be the cornerstones of this radio station. They are the tandem Cumulus can build on in New York City, and mark my words if the Cumulus suits follow the Radio Ray plan, it will be a ratings bonanza that will set the station up for years to come!
1069_KIFR said:
I always wondered why they started to play less and less of the guys who headline the show. MAybe even Dish Nation thought they sounded too old.
Then again, Rickey Smiley from DAy one seemed to Dominate the show show..perhaps he's just trying to get rid of all the main headliners one by one
No, I don't agree with firing anyone over 50. I DO agree with putting that talent where it belongs, to reach the proper audience.
How can Scott Shannon relate to a 30 year old woman with a kid? It's like her father on the radio. The people who grew up with Shannon would welcome him to CBS-FM, he would be a perfect fit for that radio station. He is no longer a perfect fit for WPLJ, just as Imus isn't a perfect fit (though better than Shannon on WPLJ) on WABC. The combined age of Cumulus' morning hosts is 139. That's a demo problem.
When the host is older and still sounds fresh, it can work just fine. There are plenty of examples on the radio right now. But Imus sounds like he's dying on the air every day, and Shannon sounds like a throwback to radio 25 years ago.
How can Scott Shannon relate to a 30 year old woman with a kid? It's like her father on the radio. The people who grew up with Shannon would welcome him to CBS-FM, he would be a perfect fit for that radio station. He is no longer a perfect fit for WPLJ, just as Imus isn't a perfect fit (though better than Shannon on WPLJ) on WABC. The combined age of Cumulus' morning hosts is 139. That's a demo problem.
When the host is older and still sounds fresh, it can work just fine. There are plenty of examples on the radio right now. But Imus sounds like he's dying on the air every day, and Shannon sounds like a throwback to radio 25 years ago.
I think Radio Ray and WNTI bring up some very important points. Agreed when you have someone 30 or 40 years older than you talking to you that you cannot reach that audience. Nothing against a longtime radio legend like Scott Shannon but he's double the age of the station's target demo and they're obviously through their music trying to get younger. A old timer like Todd Petengill sometimes sounds older than Shannon does. Can Cumulus and WPLJ believe that having two senior citizens on the air targeting 20 and 30 somethings will work? Despite the laugh tracks they use I don't find the show funny at all anymore, and the news they do has been done by others, usually the morning before. I think Scott and Todd have had a great career, but they obviously and without any doubts cannot reach the desired demographics like younger stars such as Elvis Duran and Cubby Bryant can. When you depend on the music station for traffic and weather reports (which they really do well) and less for the old-time stars of the program, I would think it's time for them to make a change, and for the better IMHO.
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