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Smooth Jazz 105 flips

A

AnotherCat

I hit the button on the way home from work and they were playing the Jordin Sparks/Chris Brown song Calling themselves Coast 105.5 and used "Rhythm" in their liner..sounds like some type of Rhythmic A/C that is hipper and skews younger and more current than Urban A/C, doesn't play the pop-rock songs that CHR does and isn't as gold-driven as Movin'. Now that's what I call an obscure little niche....
Guess no True Oldies this time around...
 
Well Tama just failed to go for a format that would make them money and get listeners.....why another Rhythmic Station......something that will fail......TAMA...PLEASE EXPLAIN....WHY COULDN'T YOU DO THE OLDIES???? Anyways...I have been building a playlist of songs based off several oldies stations around the country including WCBS and I like how iTunes is shuffling it for me....so I think the format will live on my iPod, but as for everyone we know an oldies station has been a want and once again we failed to see it happen...we are now like the only market in Florida that has no form of an oldies station....Pensacola has WYCL...Tallahassee has WUTL..Tampa has WRBQ....Orlando has WOCL....Miami has WMXJ...Jacksonville....well we have nothing...enough of my ranting for right now.....later.
 
Let's say they DID flip to an oldies format of your (and many other posters) liking ... the signal is feeble at best and would never have done service to the format and prospective advertisers. This 98 pound weakling would never generate the sort of revenue needed to do the format justice.
No matter how much you may WANT the oldies format to return to Jacksonville, don't curse it with an 'also-ran' signal, or an owner who has no emotional attachment to it.
I wish Oldies fans luck.
 
You are so correct, Brother Bear. And thanks for wishing us luck, if anything - it's appreciated!

Per AnotherCat, if they are caling themselves Coast, then we would have to forget Cox flipping the Point to their AC version of Coast. I always so that move in the cards but apparently that is not to be.

And Broncos, I can understand the frustration. We have so many of the same type stations with little subtle differences in the format. The pie keeps getting smaller and smaller and I just don't get how anyone can do business like this in the long run.

I've never given up hoping. What eventually happens at 92.7 remains to be seen when new owners take over. Could Renda Broadcasting do it again? It's not impossible but certainly, they would not flip WEJZ or WGNE. But their other two properties could be in play. Who knows. I'm wrong more than right trying to figure this market out. ???
 
How about this for a hypothetical ... Seven Bridges is a sleeper with a real up and coming property in 1010XL. If they one day want to think big and swipe the Jaguars from Cox, they will need an FM to carry the games as well. What if Seven Bridges bought 92.7 (not a GREAT signal, but good enough to carry the Jags and provide a decent service area), programmed Oldies AND carried the Jaguars ala the old Cool-FM days?
Seven Bridges gets a needed bargaining chip in the football arena, plus Jacksonville gets a format conducive to a demographic that has the $$$ the Jaguars are looking for ... and needing.
Just an ol' Bear's brain at work.
 
TAMA is an absolutely dreadful company. If y'all think Renda botched oldies think of what TAMA could do. I've heard more horror stories about them and the few contacts I have had with them have been downright scary...they seem to have accumulated these stations because the head guys thought it was cool to own radio statons, show up at events and be VIPs and get media coverage as minority owners. Only thing is they were clueless about running radio stations and were downright nasty to both local media and listeners, and the media coverage dried up when they failed to become successful minority owners. I read that the stations were now being operated by appointees of the group that providied the original funding but I don't know what the status of that situation is now.
 
;D Tell ya what..Me and a couple of the guys will be down Tuesday to see if we can't "flip" APE to Oldies! I hear Pat Garrett is out at WTHZ in NC..Maybe we can bring him back! ::)
 
mhsbroncos2005 said:
Well Tama just failed to go for a format that would make them money and get listeners.....why another Rhythmic Station......something that will fail......TAMA...PLEASE EXPLAIN....WHY COULDN'T YOU DO THE OLDIES???? Anyways...I have been building a playlist of songs based off several oldies stations around the country including WCBS and I like how iTunes is shuffling it for me....so I think the format will live on my iPod, but as for everyone we know an oldies station has been a want and once again we failed to see it happen...we are now like the only market in Florida that has no form of an oldies station....Pensacola has WYCL...Tallahassee has WUTL..Tampa has WRBQ....Orlando has WOCL....Miami has WMXJ...Jacksonville....well we have nothing...enough of my ranting for right now.....later.
Click to expand...
I'll tell ya...WOCL is nothing to write home about.However,between CBS's WOCL (105.9) & CBS's WOMX (105.1)-with enough Button Pushing you can get a few decent songs here & there.
 
I'm pretty sure WUTL in Tallahassee just flipped to rock, so their only oldies would come from WMGR-AM. about 50 miles north of town (in Georgia). WYCL in Pensacola isn't a true oldies station, it's more of a 70's-80's station. There is an oldies station in Pensacola, WPFL, but it is also 50 miles north of town (in Alabama) and is difficult to pick up in the city limits.
To me it looks like Florida doesn't have any Oldies stations north of the Tampa - Orlando area.

mhsbroncos2005 said:
Well Tama just failed to go for a format that would make them money and get listeners.....why another Rhythmic Station......something that will fail......TAMA...PLEASE EXPLAIN....WHY COULDN'T YOU DO THE OLDIES???? Anyways...I have been building a playlist of songs based off several oldies stations around the country including WCBS and I like how iTunes is shuffling it for me....so I think the format will live on my iPod, but as for everyone we know an oldies station has been a want and once again we failed to see it happen...we are now like the only market in Florida that has no form of an oldies station....Pensacola has WYCL...Tallahassee has WUTL..Tampa has WRBQ....Orlando has WOCL....Miami has WMXJ...Jacksonville....well we have nothing...enough of my ranting for right now.....later.
Click to expand...
 
Oldies doesn't appear to the advertizers I guess. It's sad. WYCL is more of a extreme variety (meaning we play only 200 or so songs)

XM has oldies.

-Rob
 
Rob, thanks for travelling a little further East to post. We appreciate it. ;)

The old rules regarding advertisers appear to be changing. It seems not a week goes by that we hear of another market, big, small or in between doing a flip to oldies. While the format isn't what it once was - and it shouldn't be - it is being built to attract a wider spectrum of listener age. With competition being what it is, most station expectation is to make a decent showing in certain key demos. And oldies is targeting 35+. As in any format, those who know what they are doing will have better odds on their side to succeed. Those who are not really radio folks and who do not understand the format, will flounder. Just my take.

And you have to ask yourselves, if the format is dead in ad land, why are the flips to it continuing? When we see major players such as CBS Radio going, once again, with the format, they are not doing it for sentimental reasons. They are doing it because it represents tapping into an underserved and attracting a financially sound listener. In other words, they wouldn't touch it if there wasn't a chance to make money. Bottom line.

What Brother Bear said a few posts up is brilliant from a business sense. His 92.7 scenario makes perfect sense to me. But as we all see, time and time again, what makes sense doesn't often become reality. We'll need to see but I love the hypothesis.

I've mentioned this before but I believe it's timely to mention it again. If you watch American Idol, count how many times songs from the 60s and 70s are featured. Their audience skews very young, yet the songs featured are often the hits decades before the singers were even born. Why? These are timeless classics and they are familiar to generations. Not a bad recipe for a radio station to incorporate.

Oldies represent something different on the dial. The music has a special place to many - especially the underserved. It remains a viable format in my book.

And fianally Big Ape, enjoy Jacksonville. I recommend a visit to the St. John's Town Center. I believe you will be impressed in what is occuring there - very "big city" to say the least. Radio in Jax is still "small town." Introducing oldies will shake things up and reflect a little more sophistication which is today's Jacksonville.
 
...and yet take a look at WCBS 101.1 that's probably doing very well, though different area, similar concept.
(though, when I heard it, they play 60s to the 80s)

Let's travel north and look in my old stomping grounds, syracuse, ny
92.1 there (WSEN) is still going strong.

and Naples has an elevator music station which comes here on foggy (tropo) days I think that's in the top 5 down there!

(I love it when the radio fights for George Noory (panama city beach - forgot the call signs) and some sleepy song is playing with awesome stereo separation to boot!)

-Rob
 
The last two music stations I have listened to with regularity are now gone...Kool 96.9/100.7 and Smooth Jazz. Both have gone the way of some sort of hip hop type format, like we need more of those here.

When I moved here in 1991, Jax had a very good spread of stations which covered most people's interests. Now, it is sorely lacking and very bland.

I have no idea if there will be another station that will switch its format to jazz or there will be another Kool like station, but now, I am finding myself listening to a new station out of just north of Orlando (I live in St. Augustine) at 105.9, which is mostly 70s with some 60s thrown in. I don't get it in Jax very well, but my business is in Eagle Harbor and I drive south to go home, so it works for me.

Otherwise it is talk radio.
 
The last response appears to have come from an average listener who found this board and was motivated enough to vent. Another case where a segment of the market becomes a member of the underserved club. This person's comments on the state of things is money. You are so right. Thank you.

And so, Jacksonville now has 4 stations doing an urban format. Variations here and there but still urban.

As I was reading a lot of stories about Jackson Armstrong yesterday, I began thinking of the good 'ol AM hit music days where personality ruled and radio was in a word - exciting. In just about every market, even with the pie being as big as it was back then, there was usually a very dominant contemporary hit station followed by a very close competitor. And then there was a third and sometimes fourth station doing the same format and usually with a tight budget and book after book, they were not able to make a dent. It seemed everyone knew that it was only a matter of time that they would need to flip to something else. Yes, sometimes there were exceptions but as a general rule, the second tier stations had a tougher time getting ad $$, attracting great talent and growing an audience and surviving doing a format others were doing.

I believe the same applies today. From a business sense, I just don't understand how programming to a narrow spectrum of listeners is a strategy of success in the long run. Like it or not, CC dominates urban here and nothing anytime soon is going to change that. They will continue to do well earning a good share of the urban ad dollars. Period.

Sometimes, I think about approaching Folioweekly to do a story about radio in Jacksonville with emphasis on so many stations doing the same thing and not representative of a diverse community. And while I've never been one to shy away from a challenge, you just know that even if a reporter got an interview with a PD or GM, it would be the usual corporate scripted response. Our research says this or that, listeners are looking for this or that, advertisers don't like this or that. Nothing changes.

But meanwhile the unnecessary screw-ups with incompetence in the forefront that results in format demise and then going with the format du jour as it appears a safe bet never gets covered. Something is just terribly wrong with how the business of radio is done. Certainly, the listener is not in the center of the decision making. Public airwaves. Yeah, right.

Once in a while I do hear from those in the business who appreciate what I say. It makes me feel it's all worth it. All things considered, Smooth Jazz did pretty well in the ratings despite poor signal and no marketing. Kool 100.7 at the time it flipped appeared to be getting it together and they were trending up. Now if you enjoyed oldies or jazz, you are SOL.

Format flips is a reality of the business. But when unique formats go away and are replaced by a format others are doing as well and doing well I might add, it makes little sense to me. The Logans Run mentality of treating many in the market as if they don't exist is just not good business.
 
JohnJax, thank you for the kind comments. I appreciate it. Your comments are pretty much how I am thinking.

What I have done to compensate, if I really want oldies, is listen to KEarth101 out of LA online. My now wife was living in LA and when I would visit her when we were dating, that is what we would listen to. So at home (like tonight while cleaning), that is what I listened to. I still think that KOOL 96.9 had the best DJs in town when I listened to it, and they were every bit as good as the ones in LA.
 
Why, why, why?! Of all possible radio formats on planet earth...

Will Coast 105.3/105.5 REALLY make Tama any more money than Smooth Jazz did? I'd be concerned about having my thumbs broken by angry investors right about now.

But it could be worse for Jacksonville: Tama has/had an oldies station in Greenville, SC. Yeah...it's friggin' DARK.
 
With the jazz to coast format change and all the other things that have happened in the past few years it's a forgone conclusion that Jacksonville radio has taken a huge step backwards. As far as the gator Jacksonville's #1 for Country it's just another blowhard consultant smoke screen posiitoning statement that is just making the CC's powers to be just laughing. QIK is in the top 3 12+ and GNE is #10. Who's kidding who. Good positioning statement and a positive but CC has alot more money to promote QIK then Renda ever will to promote gator. Let's get real
 
They've already had their thumbs broken by inverstors. I read a while ago that the investors had taken control of the stations away from the original management team and put them in the hands of people hired by the inverstors to oversee them and 1. keep them alive till they turn around? (not happening) or 2. keep them from becoming even bigger cash drains till they can sell them? I choose 2.
 
Hey, vt ... I'm pretty sure "CC's powers that be" weren't laughing so hard when the '07 Fall book came down and The Little Gator That Could pasted QIK in Women 25-54 pretty much all across the board.
Anyone with even the least viscous knowledge of the business knows that Women 25-54 is a far more financially lucrative demo and is much more indicative of a radio station's overall listenership.
Get real? Gator has more street buzz now than QIK has had in many moons. The once mighty Hitkicker has become a worn out, tired sounding jukebox bereft of any sort of personality.
That smoke screen you talked about? It's coming from the ONLY hot radio station in Jax.
vt, we never DID find out why you hate Tony Renda and his stations so much.
Would you like to talk?
I'm listening ...
 
vtdude, obviously a lover of Cheap Channel................let's hear your beef with Renda big boy
 
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