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So I Was Thinking...

K

Kelly

Guest
Beyond all the HD/IBOC bashing, personal attacks, smartass comments, etc. on this board, I was wondering what the honest opinion was of those of you that regularly post about the future of the AM broadcast band, say ten years from now?

AND, if you were responsible for turning the loss of listeners or interest in the band around, what would you do? That is, from a programming and technical aspect assuming the modern hurdles of terrestrial/impulse noise, areas of the U.S. with poor ground conductivity, bad receivers in modern cars, and lack of content that interest people younger than 40.
 
Here's my take on AM radio and what needs to happen to keep it alive. First, we MUST demand that the FCC make DRM (Digital Radio Mondale) compatable radios the standard along with IBUZ. IBUZ for AM has issues and from what I hear those issues of interference will NOT go away in the purely digital mode. So, lets take a proactive stance and say that from this time foward all digital media recievers for AM will also be capable of recieving DRM. That way, in about 8-12 years from now, stations can go all-digital if they wish. Time will move a LOT faster than we think, and if DRM was a real option for stations and there were a fair amount of radios out there, I actually think you'd see people switching off the analog in many cases. Has anyone else messed with DRM? A DRM signal that is quite noisy will still work great. So far, I haven't seen any AM IBUZ signal that was less than pristine work in IBUZ mode. What good is it then?

I understand that some might think I'm being a Kaun here, but, in reality it wouldn't cost much more at all to crack open a door to AM's future at the receiver-end. In the year 2006, why not?

;D
 
Kelly said:
Beyond all the HD/IBOC bashing, personal attacks, smartass comments, etc. on this board, I was wondering what the honest opinion was of those of you that regularly post about the future of the AM broadcast band, say ten years from now?

AND, if you were responsible for turning the loss of listeners or interest in the band around, what would you do? That is, from a programming and technical aspect assuming the modern hurdles of terrestrial/impulse noise, areas of the U.S. with poor ground conductivity, bad receivers in modern cars, and lack of content that interest people younger than 40.

Well, if you have noticed, the personal attacks have ceased, since most of the pro-IBOC'ers have left. As far as the AM band, I am perfectly happy with DXing and listening to talk shows/news. AS far as my car and portable radios, I have no problems listening to out-of-state AM stations, up to 1000 miles. If there was a problem with the broadcast bands, it is too many commercials and repetitive music - I don't think too much can be done, since Satellite Radio, and I suspect some Internet Radio, are not regulated and enjoy that freedom, which terrestrial radio will never enjoy. Also, there are too many other interesting technologies and delivery platforms (Wireless Internet, Internet Radio, Satellite Radio, Wi-Fi, Wi-Max, G3) for HD Radio to have a chance, and for terrestrial radio to gain ground - as a matter of fact, one of my boys is getting the Samsung BlackJack PDA-type cell phone today from Cingular Wireless, which has Wireless Internet and Internet Radio for only $20/month. I just don't see, how any form of digital radio is going to "save" terrestrial radio - just more channels of the same. Get my drift ? :D

BTW, the BlackJack is $250 with a $100 mail-in rebate - now, which do you honestly think 99% of people are going to want, an ugly, clunky HD Radio that requires a loop antenna and mounting a dipole antenna, and only gets lousy local stations, and if you are lucky some HD channels, or having a nice looking portable PDA/cell phone that gets hundreds of stations and gets Internet access ? :D
 
Agreed... The real problem with radio IS the programming, not the technology. It's actually funny the consolidators think they can buy themselves out of the self-inflicted slump with HD. Without some programming, it won't matter.

;D
 
Those are good questions.

I think the radio industry is making a huge mistake by ignoring people older than 40, because this is the fastest-growing age group in the USA thanks to the Baby Boomers. (I'm not a Baby Boomer myself, being 40.) Perhaps it's a social myopia driven by the average age of radio station managers?

Most people in the over-40 age group have more disposable income than their younger counterparts, and although they are already "branded" (loyal to certain brands of products and services), those same brands can sell more of their wares to this age group through radio advertising. In addition, new companies selling new kinds of products and services are appearing all the time, and the Baby Boomers are a generation that is willing to try new things.

AM radio can attract and hold over-40 age group listeners if it offers news-talk and even music (the latter preferably in C-QUAM AM Stereo, which is making a minor comeback) program content that appeals to them and addresses their interests, concerns, and needs.

The same is true for the under-40 age group listeners--give them what they want and they'll listen. The loss of younger listeners from AM radio stems from a belief that turned into a self-fulfilling prophecy: "Only older people listen to AM, so we'll program to them." It's no surprise, then, that the younger listeners went elsewhere.

I am an audiophile, and I prefer the warm, rich sound of AM to the dry, sterile, "over-crisp" sound of FM (I prefer LP records and reel-to-reel tapes over CDs for the same reason). I can only stand FM sound for a few minutes at a time, but I can listen to AM all day long without suffering "ear fatigue." I've heard C-QUAM AM Stereo, and it makes FM Stereo sound like a tin-horn cylinder phonograph by comparison. I haven't heard AM HD radio yet, but if it really makes AM sound like FM as iBiquity claims, then I would not consider that an improvement in AM audio quality.

I've listened to AM radio on ordinary (not top-of-the-line) car radios and/or table radios and/or portable radios in Miami, Miami Beach, Fort Lauderdale, Orlando, Jacksonville, Naples (Florida), Orange City (Florida), Deland (Florida), Titusville (Florida), Valdosta (Georgia), Atlanta, Cleveland (Georgia), Hiawassee (Georgia), Young Harris (Georgia), Blairsville (Georgia), Hayesville (North Carolina), Franklin (North Carolina), Murphy (North Carolina), Ducktown (Tennessee), New York City, Los Angeles, Anchorage (Alaska), and Fairbanks (Alaska), and I was never unable to get good, clear AM reception in any of these places. Some out-of-market AM stations (such as KIAM 630 in Nenana [Alaska] heard here in Fairbanks) are/were a bit weak (which is not unexpected), but by no means unlistenable.

AM radio has a problem with its program content, not its technology.



-- Black Shire
 
Kelly said:
Beyond all the HD/IBOC bashing, personal attacks, smartass comments, etc. on this board, I was wondering what the honest opinion was of those of you that regularly post about the future of the AM broadcast band, say ten years from now?

The future of AM rests in killing AM-IBOC. Now. A system that intentionally sprays its carriers well into the first adjacent channel is going to hasten AM's demise as a usable service.

Kelly said:
AND, if you were responsible for turning the loss of listeners or interest in the band around, what would you do? That is, from a programming and technical aspect assuming the modern hurdles of terrestrial/impulse noise, areas of the U.S. with poor ground conductivity, bad receivers in modern cars, and lack of content that interest people younger than 40.

We're already well into the second generation of young people who understand that they have choices other than radio for their audio entertainment, and under those circumstances AM radio, the oldest broadcast service and the one generally aimed at the oldest audience, will be the first to suffer. The AM band does need a digital solution to put it on par with those other choices, but a solution that doesn't interfere with neighboring stations. Programming-wise, the march toward entire radio stations consisting of syndicated programs has to stop. Radio works best when it's live and local. The down-side of that is that sort of programming costs money, which to a large extent isn't there anymore. The downward spiral won't be easily stopped.
 
OKCRadioGuy said:
Agreed... The real problem with radio IS the programming, not the technology. It's actually funny the consolidators think they can buy themselves out of the self-inflicted slump with HD. Without some programming, it won't matter.

;D

Only partially correct. The tech becomes a problem if it's a negative, and AM-HD is definitely a negative. A system whose specs call for digital carriers in the first adjacent channel is a recipe for disaster. AM-HD should be abandoned immediately. How would you feel if a station you owned was being interfered with by a nearby "big gun" running HD, and you were powerless to do anything about it while you watched your business slowly go under due to lack of listeners? That's what's happening...now. There are plenty of well-documented cases on the record of HD signal interference extending hundreds of miles from the offending transmitter (and remember, HD is only authorized during daytime hours). To borrow a term from the 1960s, AM-HD is MAD (mutually assured destruction).
 

Well, if you have noticed, the personal attacks have ceased, since most of the pro-IBOC'ers have left. As far as the AM band, I am perfectly happy with DXing and listening to talk shows/news. AS far as my car and portable radios, I have no problems listening to out-of-state AM stations, up to 1000 miles. If there was a problem with the broadcast bands, it is too many commercials and repetitive music - I don't think too much can be done, since Satellite Radio, and I suspect some Internet Radio, are not regulated and enjoy that freedom, which terrestrial radio will never enjoy. Also, there are too many other interesting technologies and delivery platforms (Wireless Internet, Internet Radio, Satellite Radio, Wi-Fi, Wi-Max, G3) for HD Radio to have a chance, and for terrestrial radio to gain ground - as a matter of fact, one of my boys is getting the Samsung BlackJack PDA-type cell phone today from Cingular Wireless, which has Wireless Internet and Internet Radio for only $20/month. I just don't see, how any form of digital radio is going to "save" terrestrial radio - just more channels of the same. Get my drift ? :D

BTW, the BlackJack is $250 with a $100 mail-in rebate - now, which do you honestly think 99% of people are going to want, an ugly, clunky HD Radio that requires a loop antenna and mounting a dipole antenna, and only gets lousy local stations, and if you are lucky some HD channels, or having a nice looking portable PDA/cell phone that gets hundreds of stations and gets Internet access ? :D
[/quote]

I think we're all pretty clear on where you stand on HD/IBOC 700, and your hobby interest in DX'ing. That being said, you are in the minority of radio listeners. I for one won't be "shouted down with your diatribe or emoticons.

Other than being smug, you really didn't answer the questions. However, if I read between lines of answering my informal survey with more questions, are you trying to say the AM band is doomed, and that there is no future for the band? Then, why bother getting so worked up about a new modulation scheme? You are quick to be critical of the current programming in radio, but offer nothing as an alternative.
 
Kelly questioned:

are you trying to say the AM band is doomed, and that there is no future for the band? Then, why bother getting so worked up about a new modulation scheme?

Because it the new modulation "scheme" that is the cause of the aggravated assault on AM radio, as illustrated by this truthful quote from dumber than a box of hair:

The tech becomes a problem if it's a negative, and AM-HD is definitely a negative. A system whose specs call for digital carriers in the first adjacent channel is a recipe for disaster. AM-HD should be abandoned immediately. How would you feel if a station you owned was being interfered with by a nearby "big gun" running HD, and you were powerless to do anything about it while you watched your business slowly go under due to lack of listeners? That's what's happening...now. There are plenty of well-documented cases on the record of HD signal interference extending hundreds of miles from the offending transmitter (and remember, HD is only authorized during daytime hours). To borrow a term from the 1960s, AM-HD is MAD (mutually assured destruction).

Yes, this is EXACTLY what is happening now. These small market AM stations are being mercilessly assaulted by the big guns that are running HD (within "tolerance" or so they say I might add) and the small market AMs appear to be powerless to do anything about it. Those of us here who CARE hope that the FCC will come to its senses and instruct the industry to abandon AM IBOC. It remains to be seen however, whether or not the FCC will get out of bed with HD radio cartel and make an honest engineering decision about this.

This is the nice way of describing what is going on. If you were a small market AM owner you would be using different verbeage.
 
Kelly wrote: "I think we're all pretty clear on where you stand on HD/IBOC 700, and your hobby interest in DX'ing. That being said, you are in the minority of radio listeners. I for one won't be "shouted down with your diatribe or emoticons. Other than being smug, you really didn't answer the questions. However, if I read between lines of answering my informal survey with more questions, are you trying to say the AM band is doomed, and that there is no future for the band? Then, why bother getting so worked up about a new modulation scheme? You are quick to be critical of the current programming in radio, but offer nothing as an alternative." :D

I wonder, how many fringe listeners there are - there seems to be many, when listening to nighttime AM talk shows. I just turn on my radio and tune across the AM band, so that puts me into a minority - I don't think so ! BTW, I'll answer your questions, any way I please ! Now, don't get too worked up ! :D
 
There are a good many users of radio which are not accounted for by the commercially used metrics.
Customizing the markets via interference to the advantage of the local markets disenfranchises the all the other users of the service.

I think the AM dial will still have many users in 10 to 20 years, but more and more of these will be the listeners which fall outside the traditionally measured groups.

My own use would be classified by many as dx, but the last time I sent away for a QSL was in 1973, so I don't consider myself a dxer.

I think radio, like newspapers, feels it must compete with newer products, despite apples/oranges considerations.

The online newspapers have FAR fewer stories and detail than the printed version, which does a far better job in depth and variety.
News on -line is a different thing, but not a replacement for newpapers.
Similarly, radio feels it must adapt, and while changing, cannot fully do all of its old jobs as well.

Radio risks losing the ability to do what it does best by being distracted by the newer technologies, which cannot do what it does.
The radio environment and future is far healthier than it imagines itself to be.
Existing metrics, however, show decline, which the business must address.
Pie-in-the-sky engineering is a natural straw to grasp at.
Inappropriate and ill-conceived engineering has hampered the progress of many technologies.
It is unusual for such a disruptive, problematic solution as IBOC to be introduced into a fully developed and working system.
Such ideas are supposed to be debunked by engineers. It is clear this step was ignored or over-ruled.

I do feel the harm being done by AM IBOC should be minimized by stopping the experiment as soon as possible.
I can't decide whether the self-noise or interference to others is worse, but either one is bad enough to disqualify this mode.
The FM version causes far less damage to the existing service, and naturally works better at the higher frequencies.
 
In Reply # 4 above, Black Shire wrote, “I am an audiophile, and I prefer the warm, rich sound of AM to the dry, sterile, ‘over-crisp’ sound of FM (I prefer LP records and reel-to-reel tapes over CDs for the same reason). I can only stand FM sound for a few minutes at a time, but I can listen to AM all day long without suffering ‘ear fatigue.’”

In my experience, AM (including short-wave international broadcasts) can sound rich and warm, but it usually doesn’t. When I was in elementary school, I couldn’t figure out why radio, which was sound only, didn’t sound as good as TV. In those days, console TV’s with 8-inch speakers were commonplace. As I soon learned, that was because (analog) TV sound is FM (though the picture is a modified form of AM called vestigial sideband modulation; see http://www.answers.com/topic/broadcast-television-system).

In the Philadelphia market, the difference was very clear even to anyone without an FM radio, because American Bandstand, which originated at WFIL-TV (ch. 6, now WPVI), was fed directly to the Ch. 6 transmitter (instead of going through the old-fashioned, 1920’s-vintage audio lines that paralleled AT&T’s coaxial cables until 1978, when they began sending analog FM audio at 5.8 Mc over the coax). The same records sounded much better on Bandstand than on an old five-tube AC/DC AM radio with a four-inch speaker, and even noticeably better than on a classic 1950's vaccuum-tube AM car radio (though the latter, except for a lack of real highs and a tendency to be a bit distorted on very loud peaks, was pretty good).

If you don’t like what you hear on FM, don’t blame the medium – or Major Armstrong. The fault lies in the processing. Most commercial stations not only compress the dynamic range of program material much more than they should; they also goose up the highs and the lows – especially the lows – in order to sound more impressive on mediocre sound systems and radios. The only stations I can stand to listen to on my main (vacuum-tube!) audio system these days are the public ones, and even they weren’t quite what they used to be even before I-BUZZ. That was probably because of digital studio-to-transmitter links!
 
So not having any audio above 10K really doesn't bother you golden-eared audiophiles? C-QUAM AM is subject to the same NRSC rolloff as non-stereo AM.

I think the most practical approach for the band would be an either-or situation. Allow stations to use their entire channel for HD IBOC or traditional analog - not both. There are a lot of AM signals that just aren't viable and haven't been for years - every rated market has a few. Their owners might be willing to use them to help further the cause.
 
On the contrary, I miss the upper octave when it’s not there, at least when I'm listening to my primary system (my speakers are nearly flat up to 19 kilocycles, making filtering of the stero pilot critical). But on the whole, I’d rather have the top octave missing than have it there but badly distorted.

You might remember that when the AM band was first extended from 1500 to 1600, at first stations were only assigned up there at 20-kilocycle spacings (1520, 1540, 1560, 1580 1nd 1600) in order to provide for “high fidelity.” But sometime in the 1930’s, one major company with an ax to grind did a study that purportedly “proved” that the public didn’t want high fidelity!

Then in the late 1940’s, there was a landmark study of the effects of phase shift within an essentially flat passband. Listeners participating in the test were asked to rank the quality of three versions of the same audio program. One had wideband response with very little phase shift. Another had essentially the same bandwidth, but with severe phase shift. The third was restricted in bandwidth.

The results: There was some division among ordinary listeners. Some preferred the wideband signal with good phase response, while nearly as many preferred the sample with markedly rolled-off highs, perhaps because they were accustomed to that kind of sound; but both groups were nearly unanimous in finding the wideband signal with gross phase shift the least appealing.

But among professional musicians, the negative reaction to the phase-distorted wideband sound was much more pronounced!

I wish I could give you the citation for this study, but I don’t have it at my fingertips. The best I can do is to refer you to “From Tin Foil to Stereo,” by Oliver Reade and Walter Welch (Sams, I think, 1959). They cited a paper on the effects of phase distortion presented at the Monmouth County Subsection of the IRE.
 
Oh, and I nearly forgot. I'm no fan of C-Quam. Kahn's independent sideband system was much better.

Aside from the pre-emophasis and sharp cut-off (which make today's AM sound a little harsh on the few surviving hif-fi AM tuners from the late 1950's), C-Quam also uses a stereo pilot. But it's at 25 c.p.s., not 19 kc. Motorola may consider that an infrasonic frequency, but I consider it a pedal tone. In a A=440 c.p.s. scale, the fundamental of a low G on the 32-foot stop of a pipe organ -- a whole tone below the low A the standard piano keyboard -- is 24.5 c.p.s.! And the 11-foot Bösendorfer Imperial Grand goes down to the same low C (32.7 c.p.s.) as the 32-foot stop on the organ.
 
FM does have a fundamentally different sound than AM, and I noticed it as soon as I was old enough to appreciate radio at 6 - 7 years of age in the early 1970s.

When an FM Disc Jockey would crumple a piece of paper within range of the microphone, it sounded like a crackling flame from a wooden match--that's an example of the "over-crisp" FM sound that I find grating. The same sound on an AM station sounded...well, normal, like a piece of paper being crumpled and nothing more or different.

CDs have that same "over-crisp" sound. Neil Young said the same thing (in so many words) when he first heard one of their old LP albums that had been re-released on CD. He said that the sound "washed over me like a wave of ice cubes."


-- Black Shire
 
ElCheapo said:
So not having any audio above 10K really doesn't bother you golden-eared audiophiles? C-QUAM AM is subject to the same NRSC rolloff as non-stereo AM.

I think the most practical approach for the band would be an either-or situation. Allow stations to use their entire channel for HD IBOC or traditional analog - not both. There are a lot of AM signals that just aren't viable and haven't been for years - every rated market has a few. Their owners might be willing to use them to help further the cause.
HD Radio/iBiquity supporters always claim that the problems with AM or FM reception and fidelity can always be solved by adding much more interference in the form of wider bandwidth, loud, digital, buzz and hash to both bands.
Does anyone actually find these proposals rational?
The increasing iBuzz is completely trashing both bands, and getting worse as more buzzing interference is added.
I am not a DXer, but it is plain to see that the only objectionable DXers are the HD Radio supporters, who fiddle with external antennas added to their radios to try to pick up a couple of highly destructive HD digital signals. Analog DXers do not interfere with other peoples radios, but iBiquity/HD Radio supporters promote digitally destroying the broadcast bands.
Broadcasters, and listeners, wake up!
Digital radio signals interfere with each other as much as, or more then analog AM and much more then FM signals do. Remember FM has a very beneficial "capture ratio", AM and direct digital signals do not.
If all broadcast stations dropped the lower power hybrid analog/digital HD hybrid mode, and went on the air at their full licensed power with fully digital iBiquity HD radio tomorrow, both AM and FM bands would become a massive glop of interference.
 
SUPERCASTER said:
ElCheapo said:
So not having any audio above 10K really doesn't bother you golden-eared audiophiles? C-QUAM AM is subject to the same NRSC rolloff as non-stereo AM.

I think the most practical approach for the band would be an either-or situation. Allow stations to use their entire channel for HD IBOC or traditional analog - not both. There are a lot of AM signals that just aren't viable and haven't been for years - every rated market has a few. Their owners might be willing to use them to help further the cause.
HD Radio/iBiquity supporters always claim that the problems with AM or FM reception and fidelity can always be solved by adding much more interference in the form of wider bandwidth, loud, digital, buzz and hash to both bands.
Does anyone actually find these proposals rational?
The increasing iBuzz is completely trashing both bands, and getting worse as more buzzing interference is added.
I am not a DXer, but it is plain to see that the only objectionable DXers are the HD Radio supporters, who fiddle with external antennas added to their radios to try to pick up a couple of highly destructive HD digital signals. Analog DXers do not interfere with other peoples radios, but iBiquity/HD Radio supporters promote digitally destroying the broadcast bands.
Broadcasters, and listeners, wake up!
Digital radio signals interfere with each other as much as, or more then analog AM and much more then FM signals do. Remember FM has a very beneficial "capture ratio", AM and direct digital signals do not.
If all broadcast stations dropped the lower power hybrid analog/digital HD hybrid mode, and went on the air at their full licensed power with fully digital iBiquity HD radio tomorrow, both AM and FM bands would become a massive glop of interference.

So the pro-IBOC crowd have become DX'ers by necessity not choice. :)

db
 
Let me reiterate, Black Shire, that what you call that “over-crisp sound” is not an innate characteristic of FM but an artifact of bad analog processing. And yes, an analog of this form is distortion (if you’ll pardon the pun) is also an artifact of most digital processing.

The following comment really surprised me: “When an FM Disc Jockey would crumple a piece of paper within range of the microphone, it sounded like a crackling flame from a wooden match--that's an example of the "over-crisp" FM sound that I find grating. The same sound on an AM station sounded...well, normal, like a piece of paper being crumpled and nothing more or different.”

In fact, with ungimmicked FM, the opposite is true. As Lawrence Lessing put it in his biography of Maj. Armstrong, the inventor’s first public demonstration of FM in Nov. 1935 made the difference very clear. One of Armstrong’s colleagues, broadcasting in ungimmicked mono FM to the lecture hall over his amateur station, didn’t stop with demonstrating the superiority of FM for both music and voice. He also demonstrated that two sound effects widely used in network radio drama – crinkling cellophane to simulate the sound of a raging fire, and pouring a glass of water close to a mike to created the sound of a waterfall, were far from convincing over FM.

So why did you hear what you heard in the early Seventies, and why do you still hear something wrong with FM today?

By 1970, most FM stations had both converted to stereo and converted to solid state technology, at least in the studio. What’s more many records were being mastered with solid state electronics by that time. Let’s consider the later factor first.

In Sept. 1972, Russell Hamm delivered his landmark paper, “Tubes vs Transistors: Is There an Audible Difference?” at the Audio Engineering Society convention in New York. He found two chief differences: (1) the spectral distribution of harmonics, and (2) innately less linear transistor amplifiers (and even more non-linear IC op-amps) used excessively large amount of inverse feedback. The latter yielded good results on steady-sate test signals, but allowed the amplifiers to produce gross amounts of short-term “transient intermodulation distortion,” or TIM, making the reproduction harsh and grating to the early on real-world musical sounds, especially those with lots of transient energy. (Hamm’s paper appeared the the Journal of the AES, Vol. XXI, No. 4, May 1973.)

Solid state sound began to improve markedly in the 1980’s. But I surmise that your early exposure to the poor quality of an early solid state amplifier handling high frequency content made a lasting impression.
As for the continuing problem of harsh FM sound, that’s a result of most stations’ unenlightened approach to audio processing.

Some observers were noting this back in the Seventies. I’ll just quote below from a source I think you’d have trouble finding: a guest editorial in “The Audio Amateur” (VIII: 4; Dec. 1977) by Roy H. Trumbull, under the title, “The Decline and Fall of FM.”

A chief engineer at an FM station, Trumbull notes that the problem began when stereo both made FM stations suddenly look financially viable, and forced the stations to cut back slightly on the modulation levels to accommodate the stereo subcarrier. This gave rise to all sorts of non-linear limiters, and even exciters with compromised frequency response curves that barely met the existing lax FCC audio standards.
He concluded his essay with this paragraph:

“One morning at 4 a.m. I was driving along on a trip to get some parts so I could get my 10kW stereo transmitter back on the air before 6 a.m. As I rolled along I was listening to our old unlimited auxiliary transmitter with its exceptional low end response. The music sounded so good and so much like the sound I’d grown up with that I began to wonder: ‘Is this trip really necessary?’”

NOTE TO SUPERCASTER: Nobody is more opposed to iNiquity’s trash technology that I am, let’s be fair about one thing: The capture effect that you cited allows almost any FM receiver to reject a desired station’s own I-BUZZ signals, since these are more than 20 dB below the level of the analog FM signal (and even a terrible FM receiver has a capture ratio of 6 dB or less). The problem comes when you’re trying to get a distant, weak signal on a receiver with very good selectivity, and can’t because the I-BUZZ from a nearby first-adjacent is actually jamming the station you want.

I’ve never heard of I-BUZZ interfering with mono reception of the host analog signal, though it can ruin stereo reception on certain solid-state tuners with very wide IF’s and keyed oscillators that produce a replacement 38-kc carrier with lots of harmonic content (see “HD Radio Self-Noise,” http://users.tns.net/~bb/hdrsn.htm).
 
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