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So..speaking of Imaging

J

jefflaurence

I was talking with a bunch of production folks last week..What do you guys think the future of radio imaging is? Most any market you go to..you hear the same stuff..voice person and purchased effects. Sameness is king. Listening to Sirius and XM it's all the same stuff too. Even the Jack stations are so predictable and stale. Do you feel there is there a corner somewhere that we're going to be turning as far as stationality goes? Any "cutting edge" ideas that we can all try in our individual market?

OR..is the future of imaging leaning towards ONE voice person being produced for an entire company's chain of stations regardless of format?

OR..is the concept of station imaging starting to go the way of cart machines and turntables..using none at all?

OR is it more likely to have the morning crew doing the imaging in the afternoon to recycle to thier show the next day and same with the afternoon jock in the morning? OR is it more likely to see corporate clusters use the promos slots and breaks to promote thier other stations more vigorously..thus eliminating the "outside" imaging voice? Damn I'm depressed now..

It would be cool to put some new ingredients into the stew here on the ol' Radio-Info board.

And as a fast approaching career landmark looks my way I want to stay crisp, and solid..so I can keep paying my bills..and keep you "youngsters" on your toes..with all due respect and sincere envy!

Now..My God where IS that blasted NURSE? I want my warm milk! And this heating pad is all snarled up in my pajamas.
 
Jeff, first let me say you're smart to try to look ahead and pose the question. Of course, the simple answer is---potentially, ALL of the possible directions you suggest.
One voice for all of a company's stations (or similar format of stations) already makes some sense for some companies...and I wouldn't be surprised if it's an idea that could grow as companies look to economize further.
The idea of the stations' own air talent being used to voice much of the imaging is a neat idea; by using voices of their own talent, I hear WGN in Chicago do more and more of this...I think it sounds great. But you still need the role of the "announcer" in that mix.
But I don't think you can forget the role of the LISTENER'S VOICE in imaging---they are, after all, if done correctly, the most credible voice of all.
The smart PD will have a digital recorder everywhere he/she goes to capture the moments when the listeners just...talk about their station! And I mean THAT STATION, not some generic listener comments. It's hard work and you can't get it from a service, but I really believe it's an idea that will continue to improve imaging for the years ahead.
 
Good question. Now let me throw another wrinkle into the mix. TEXT TO SPEECH technology. It's getting better. With it you have every voice imagined. I foresee a day where a PD will type his liner into a computer- choose male or female, set the 'read intensity" and hit enter. As a veteran voice guy myself, I am thoroughly depresed as well.

One voice guy for a huge company? I don't see it. Aftr all, with HD radio, each station can multicast into 3 or 4 more digital channels. That would increase the amount of terestrial stations to something like 30,000. That guy would have to be good! (not to mention QUITE proficient with ProTools-lol)

At least Jeff will probably be OK. With a voice like his, there will probably be a "Jeff Laurence" plugin in which he will be paid thousands of dollars in royalties.

Where IS that nurse??

Dave Solomon
Digital Audio Tracks [DAT]
www.DigitalAudioTracks.com


> Jeff, first let me say you're smart to try to look ahead and
> pose the question. Of course, the simple answer
> is---potentially, ALL of the possible directions you
> suggest.
> One voice for all of a company's stations (or similar format
> of stations) already makes some sense for some
> companies...and I wouldn't be surprised if it's an idea that
> could grow as companies look to economize further.
> The idea of the stations' own air talent being used to voice
> much of the imaging is a neat idea; by using voices of their
> own talent, I hear WGN in Chicago do more and more of
> this...I think it sounds great. But you still need the role
> of the "announcer" in that mix.
> But I don't think you can forget the role of the LISTENER'S
> VOICE in imaging---they are, after all, if done correctly,
> the most credible voice of all.
> The smart PD will have a digital recorder everywhere he/she
> goes to capture the moments when the listeners just...talk
> about their station! And I mean THAT STATION, not some
> generic listener comments. It's hard work and you can't get
> it from a service, but I really believe it's an idea that
> will continue to improve imaging for the years ahead.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
Positive Hit Radio is the latest radio station in the SRP Radio Network stable. 24 hours a day of Christian AC music intensive programming at www.PositiveHitRadio.com
</P>
 
Is the day of "9" and "99" here or coming soon to a station near you? Will a computer generate a voice saying and doing exactly what a PD wants it to do? Geez, I hope not. Radio has taken way to much personality out of itself to do that!

I've always been of the opinion that a stations voice should be one of their own jocks, even in that jocks own shift. I would use an outside voice for special promotions, and that's it.

Guys like Jeff, Jim (who did some great work for me!), Spyder Harrison (who also did some stuff for me, in fact his voice welcomes you to my site), Brian James, Sean Caldwell, Zeus...their names and voices are known and heard far and wide. Jeff is very encouraging of newbies and geeks, even though he is a bit slow with the mail. (looking at Jeff...did you mail the package yet???) Or did the milk put you to sleep? :)

I truly believe that a station should let the jocks talk more, and use a station voice less. Hearing the same liners and sweepers day after day can get pretty boring. One of our local Long Island stations just switched voice guys, and I always poked fun at that with the APD...I said it sounds like the " blank Show" all the time, not yours!" Well, the new voice is not nearly as annoying as the old, but still is heard to much. What's wrong with going back in time, and using more jingles and less voice? (sorry guys)

Just my five cents...


<P ID="signature">______________

Co/Moderator: New York,Miami,Airchecks,Classic Radio and Where Are They Now?</P>
 
> Jeff is very encouraging of newbies and geeks, even
> though he is a bit slow with the mail. (looking at
> Jeff...did you mail the package yet???) Or did the milk put
> you to sleep? :)

;) Yes, Jeff, I've been meaning to send you an e-mail to see if you've still got that Red Rover ;)
>
> I truly believe that a station should let the jocks talk
> more, and use a station voice less. Hearing the same liners
> and sweepers day after day can get pretty boring. One of our
> local Long Island stations just switched voice guys, and I
> always poked fun at that with the APD...I said it sounds
> like the " blank Show" all the time, not yours!" Well, the
> new voice is not nearly as annoying as the old, but still is
> heard to much. What's wrong with going back in time, and
> using more jingles and less voice? (sorry guys)
>
> Just my five cents...

IMO, having a "signature" station voice is still a very important part of branding. Aside from the recognition, it adds comfort and an "at home" feeling. That being said, I think we'll see less and less of the "big" voice guy, like Zeus, for example. We'll start hearing more unknown voice people that match each station's target demo...People that sound like they could easily be a listener, rather than a "larger than life" voice.

As far as production style, it will constantly be changing. I think the next step is simplicity. Let the jocks handle the personality...Less comedy, TV & movie drops, characters, etc in imaging. Just a basic slug that matches the flow of the music. The days of 18-second sweepers that are meant to entertain, are limited. I think it will skew to 4-second sweepers, 20-second promos.

Emmett
 
> > > As far as production style, it will constantly be changing.
> I think the next step is simplicity. Let the jocks handle
> the personality...Less comedy, TV & movie drops, characters,
> etc in imaging. Just a basic slug that matches the flow of
> the music. The days of 18-second sweepers that are meant to
> entertain, are limited. I think it will skew to 4-second
> sweepers, 20-second promos.
>
> Emmett
>
I agree. Does the listener even appreciate the packed sweepers?
I've heard more than a few that were really not understandable,
especially with all the effects, filters etc.
More often than not, the overproduced sweepers are appealing to impressing other radio types..then the listener. Not really conveying any real message.
A well written quick liner voiced by a "local" in a simple manner would be a welcome change. How refreshing would it be to hear a dry liner over the
intro of a song. Just my opinion.
 
I can only relate what we are doing, which is mainly in reaction to the highly polished and technically pristine stuff a lot of the chains are doing. Nothing against the big chains, because they have very talented people turning out great work that simply doesn't really spark any fires.

1. Unusual and more "real" sounding voices. The previous suggestion about using listeners is great. But it is a huge amount of work. Sometimes for expediency, you need a professional that has the experience to nail it, but not sound like an "announcer." In that regard, I look (listen) for voices with presence and something distinctive... like a younger sounding voice with some gravel and gravitas, a younger perky voice, or a Sally Kellerman-type female. There is still room for a big voice, we just chop it up and use it sparingly in connection with other voices.

2. Multiple voices. We use one primary voice, but almost always in conjunction with several other voices to mix things up. It implies that the station is an "everyone" station, but also has enough consistency that it is readily apparent what station you are listening to.

3. SFX that draw attention to the calls. 'Nuff said. I don't have the time to create our own, but AVDELI/CremeMachine works for us. Besides, who cannot LOVE Joe Kelly?

4. Stereo EFX. Sure echo and reverb went out at the end of the 80's but its back again, IMHO. We've got two channels (Left and Right) might as well use them in a mono-compatible way to make things interesting. That also means using stereo expansion in the mastering process, but checking to make sure that your mix is still good in mono.

5. Jingles. It seems for years that everyone went to a stripped-down almost non-melodic jingle package. Melody, IMHO, is back. People remember melodies and will track it back to the station. Use that melody logo to your best advantage. N2Effect, ReelWorld, and IQBeats have some really great packages that have contemporary vocals yet hew to the principal that it is the logo melody that is important. And yes, we mess around with the workparts and effects on these.

6. Hope that everyone else doesn't do the above, so that we can stay ahead of the curve.
 
> How refreshing would it be
> to hear a dry liner over the
> intro of a song. Just my opinion.

That was my whole idea behind an imaging package I put together for a now-defunct rock show at my previous station. Imaging that accentuates the music, not standing out on it's own. I put together about 30 different dry liners for a show that only ran three hours a day, and we used them over both song intros and as segment closers over talkover beds. It sounded beautiful, and listeners reacted to it! Not only that, the jocks (myself included) had a whole new level of energy in their on-air presence due to the heightened pace of the show, so the entire presentation was rejuvenated.

Nothing else works like a dry liner!<P ID="signature">______________
radiodude.jpg

http://theradioblog.blogspot.com</P>
 
What a GREAT Thread!, I've read what everyone has voiced and I agree with most of it. What would we do (as imaging gurus) if suddenly everyone decided to go back to the 50's and creat great melodic jingles, I for one would be out of work, I think having on-air staff voice imaging is a bad idea,, well not a bad idea, but think about it, the listener has been (we hope) listening to Bob Jock for the last 5 hours doing the mid-day show and in-between all the records, it's Bob Jock, now Jane Jock is doing afternoons, and inbetween all of her records is Jane Jock,, sounds monotonous to me.

Having a station voice(s)between our sets of music is key ( I use Jon Carter/Buffy O'Neil Megahertz) in my AC imaging and Joe Kelly for my Classic Rock station), I also intersperse listeners whom I've painstakenly recorded by asking open ended questions or even derogatory statements,,ie: "That (jock) sucks doesn't he",, you cannot believe the positives that come from conversations like this. I try and use real listeners to my stations in as much imaging as I can, it's real. Just my rant. Oh,, and thanks for all the great ideas!..
Cheers
Larson/KUDL/KYYS-Kansas City
> > How refreshing would it be
> > to hear a dry liner over the
> > intro of a song. Just my opinion.
>
> That was my whole idea behind an imaging package I put
> together for a now-defunct rock show at my previous station.
> Imaging that accentuates the music, not standing out on
> it's own. I put together about 30 different dry liners for
> a show that only ran three hours a day, and we used them
> over both song intros and as segment closers over talkover
> beds. It sounded beautiful, and listeners reacted to it!
> Not only that, the jocks (myself included) had a whole new
> level of energy in their on-air presence due to the
> heightened pace of the show, so the entire presentation was
> rejuvenated.
>
> Nothing else works like a dry liner!
>
 
> These are ALL great ideas! What a great use for this type forum.
Not a negative idea in the bunch. I think it's to everyone's credit that
we've entered into a productive(no pun) discussion that might even provide
real results.
Good going!!
 
> These are ALL great ideas! What a great use for this type forum.
Not a negative idea in the bunch. I think it's to everyone's credit that
we've entered into a productive(no pun) discussion that might even provide
real results.
Good going!!
 
> I was talking with a bunch of production folks last
> week..What do you guys think the future of radio imaging is?
> Most any market you go to..you hear the same stuff..voice
> person and purchased effects. Sameness is king. Listening
> to Sirius and XM it's all the same stuff too. Even the Jack
> stations are so predictable and stale. Do you feel there is
> there a corner somewhere that we're going to be turning as
> far as stationality goes? Any "cutting edge" ideas that we
> can all try in our individual market?
>
> OR..is the future of imaging leaning towards ONE voice
> person being produced for an entire company's chain of
> stations regardless of format?
>
> OR..is the concept of station imaging starting to go the way
> of cart machines and turntables..using none at all?
>
> OR is it more likely to have the morning crew doing the
> imaging in the afternoon to recycle to thier show the next
> day and same with the afternoon jock in the morning? OR is
> it more likely to see corporate clusters use the promos
> slots and breaks to promote thier other stations more
> vigorously..thus eliminating the "outside" imaging voice?
> Damn I'm depressed now..
>
> It would be cool to put some new ingredients into the stew
> here on the ol' Radio-Info board.
>
> And as a fast approaching career landmark looks my way I
> want to stay crisp, and solid..so I can keep paying my
> bills..and keep you "youngsters" on your toes..with all due
> respect and sincere envy!
>
> Now..My God where IS that blasted NURSE? I want my warm
> milk! And this heating pad is all snarled up in my pajamas.
>


I think imaging is stale in many markets mostly b/c the importance of imaging is lost on some stations/companies/OM's/GMs. Focus has returned to SPOTS and left imaging with LIM. Everything is 10sec. I still believe good CREATIVE imaging, in 45sec or less is viable. IMO John Frost and Eric Chase already are doing the "future of imaging", especially Chase. I don't see companies going to one voice for all their stations, or like formats. How boring and dull is that? I think more stations need to have additional voices instead of one to keep it fresh, much like TV where there's a signature VO, but for certain projects there's additional talent. ABC, NBC, and especially the WB (CW) is good at it.

XM's imaging blows. Sirius has them beat all the way.<P ID="signature">______________
www.OhioRadio.net

</P>
 
> The idea of the stations' own air talent being used to voice
> much of the imaging is a neat idea; by using voices of their
> own talent, I hear WGN in Chicago do more and more of
> this...I think it sounds great. But you still need the role
> of the "announcer" in that mix.

Agreed, a signature VO is needed. Having station talent do "personality" promos, etc is fine. But to have your midday female on full blown daily "imaging" waters down the product. Not to mention not all (not even most) "on air talent" are good "vo talent".



> But I don't think you can forget the role of the LISTENER'S
> VOICE in imaging---they are, after all, if done correctly,
> the most credible voice of all.
> The smart PD will have a digital recorder everywhere he/she
> goes to capture the moments when the listeners just...talk
> about their station! And I mean THAT STATION, not some
> generic listener comments. It's hard work and you can't get
> it from a service, but I really believe it's an idea that
> will continue to improve imaging for the years ahead.
>
<P ID="signature">______________
www.OhioRadio.net

</P>
 
> I truly believe that a station should let the jocks talk
> more, and use a station voice less. Hearing the same liners
> and sweepers day after day can get pretty boring. One of our
> local Long Island stations just switched voice guys, and I
> always poked fun at that with the APD...I said it sounds
> like the " blank Show" all the time, not yours!" Well, the
> new voice is not nearly as annoying as the old, but still is
> heard to much. What's wrong with going back in time, and
> using more jingles and less voice? (sorry guys)
>
> Just my five cents...
>


Or just schedule fewer produced ID's/jingles and more talk breaks. Simple.

Produced imaging will always be needed. The written/produced word will always be more succinct than the spoken. Not to mention with producing you can really make it stand out.

Less imaging on the clocks is the way to go, not necessarily shorter imaging pieces. "Theater of the mind" is being lost with LIM.<P ID="signature">______________
www.OhioRadio.net

</P>
 
> As far as production style, it will constantly be changing.
> I think the next step is simplicity. Let the jocks handle
> the personality...Less comedy, TV & movie drops, characters,
> etc in imaging. Just a basic slug that matches the flow of
> the music. The days of 18-second sweepers that are meant to
> entertain, are limited. I think it will skew to 4-second
> sweepers, 20-second promos.
>

tv/movie drops have been played out for years. So boring, not to mention it burns FAST!

If it's entertaining, length is not an issue. You counter some of the longer stuff with shotguns and rollovers.

TSL...

T - Type
S - Style
L - Length

You have these 3 categories for imaging and plot them on your clocks. Minimum One per quarter hour.<P ID="signature">______________
www.OhioRadio.net

</P>
 
> I use Jon Carter/Buffy O'Neil Megahertz

They are awesome, aren't they?! I'm not sure if they still do WKZL's imaging, but Carter had just started emerging as the station voice when I left Greensboro, NC (where Megahertz is based) in 2003. Of course, he was doing middays back then as well... everyone I recall from the station, other than Jack and Josie, has moved on. I don't know if Jon's voice work was just a part of his job at KZL or if they used and/or continue to use Megahertz. But I digress. Back to my original point: Megahertz is really at the cutting edge, in my opinion. They put out original top-of-the-line work that astonishes me every time I hear it!

(And no, for those who are thinking it, J.C. does not stand for Jon Carter.)<P ID="signature">______________
radiodude.jpg

http://theradioblog.blogspot.com</P>
 
Its odd that I came across this topic as I was thinking about it the other day....in much the same way one other poster mentioned: computerized voices etal. I never say never but I'm doubtful (maybe selfishly so).The one that made me laugh was the budget comment. As if a VO's fees are REALLY going to make or break a bottom line. As cheap as the stations can be (not all but some) I don't think its going to be a problem.I think there will be another sound or style evolution and I think its the everyman style....but music will dictate that more than anything any of us could do.The one that has me a little uneasy is the celebrity image voice...I've heard a couple of those (talk about pricey) but I think we'll be coming across a few more of those in the not too distant future.- Peterwww.audioconnell.comThe Perfect Choice for an Awesome Voice
 
The future of imaging?More of the same.I predict quick, direct, interesting if possible, but mostly quick and direct messages.NOT creative, witty, or out of left field - although there will be exceptions.Listeners just don't have the time or patience to take in our brilliance. The only way messages will reach their brains is to be direct and quick - "here's something you might want" "want it?" "great!" "no?" "sorry to bother you." next message.
 
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