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Something I just don't understand..

A

adz

Guest
Happened to be listening to the ''Station in Alliance'' over the weekend..heard one of their promos..well done from a voice and music standpoint..but one thing nearly knocked me to the ground..

They're giving away I-Pods as one of their feature prizes this summer..

Why?

Why are you cutting your own throat? Does anybody understand that once you give somebody an I-Pod, and they start downloading and ripping music off a varitey of sites, that you can pretty much kiss that prize winner goodbye?

A major group president told FMQB this summer that you can pretty much kiss the 17-25 demo goodbye as potential radio listeners, as the digitial revolution in terms of downloading music continue to evolve..

Why are you giving your primary demo a reason to leave?

I just do not get it..
 
I agree it isn't the brightest move to give an IPOD away...but other stations are doing it too...WHOT in Youngstown did it as well.
 
I agree. You'd think that they would have learned from the televison and movie industries, which were devastated by the VCR.
 
> They're giving away I-Pods as one of their feature prizes
> this summer..
>
> Why?

Way to go you bozos at WZKL. Do any of you down there actually think about stuff BEFORE doing it?

> Why are you cutting your own throat? Does anybody
> understand that once you give somebody an I-Pod, and they
> start downloading and ripping music off a varitey of sites,
> that you can pretty much kiss that prize winner goodbye?
>
> A major group president told FMQB this summer that you can
> pretty much kiss the 17-25 demo goodbye as potential radio
> listeners, as the digitial revolution in terms of
> downloading music continue to evolve..

In their case, it IS cutting their own throat. It's the 12-17 demo that is solely keeping that station alive -- and that's a fact! You take that demo away from them and you'll have numbers similar (if not less) than their Hot Ac days. Real smart there guys. Give the only demo that's keeping your station afloat a reason to never go back again.

That's about as sensible as WHBC giving away yearly or lifetime subscriptions to Sirius or XM (and throwing in the hardware, too).
 
Actually...

> I agree it isn't the brightest move to give an IPOD
> away...but other stations are doing it too...WHOT in
> Youngstown did it as well.


In a rare defense of both WZKL and WHOT:

IF utilized correctly, IPod contests can actually be beneficial to a radio station.

What? You think I'm insane? Nope... give it some thought, my friends, and you'll see why I say that.<P ID="signature">______________
Aaron Tyler
Afternoons / MD
WVZA / Marion - Carbondale, IL
www.kissfm927.com

Weekends / Swing
KSLZ / St. Louis
WAKZ / Youngstown, OH
</P>
 
I'll go farther than that in my defense..

> > I agree it isn't the brightest move to give an IPOD
> > away...but other stations are doing it too...WHOT in
> > Youngstown did it as well.

> In a rare defense of both WZKL and WHOT:
> IF utilized correctly, IPod contests can actually be
> beneficial to a radio station.

> What? You think I'm insane? Nope... give it some thought,
> my friends, and you'll see why I say that.

I've wondered whether or not stations give iPods away and now I know it must be a rarity. I don't think it's stupid to do so. The iPod train has left the station and it ain't coming back regardless of whether or not radio stations give them away. At least stations giving them away can strive for some of the iPod hip factor to rub off. Pretending they don't exist won't work.

Everyone in my family has an iPod but we still listen to radio, although the TSL for music stations is down. I believe in radio's long-term future. I'm just not too sure that the advertising model will be around forever and I think that's a good thing.

It isn't just radio you know. Millions of peoplel(mostly college students with Internet2 access)are downloading and viewing current TVs shows automatically stripped of their commercial content. The mistake people make is that they dismiss young audiences because they have little money. What they forget is that youthful behavior doesn't change much as we age. Ten years from now, today's 19 year old downloading his media content will be a 29 year old downloading his media content.



<P ID="signature">______________
Jerry

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts" - late Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan</P>
 
Re: I'll go farther than that in my defense..

I am one of those people who don't think giving iPods away is stupid. But, I agree, IF it's done properly. That is so very important! I have an iPod and sattelite radio, but I still listen to local radio for local content (weather, traffic, etc). I am certainly not one of those who are on the "iPods and sattelite are the death to terrestrial radio" bandwagon.

But, when the younger demo IS the only demo keeping your afloat, then a valid argument can be made if you're seriously shooting yourself in the foot, per se, by giving away a device that could drive away segments of the demo you need.

It's HOW you execute the promotion that is important. What are you doing with that promotion to make them come back? And that's all I'll say because I'll be damned if I am gonna give anymore details away for free! LOL
 
Re: I'll go farther than that in my defense..

"I am one of those people who don't think giving iPods away is stupid. But, I agree, IF it's done properly.

What is the proper way? What is the improper way?

"I am certainly not one of those who are on the "iPods and sattelite are the death to terrestrial radio" bandwagon."

Nor I, but it is not any specific technology, it is an ongoing onslaught of new technology that is far from over. I realize this is heresy but I believe radio regulation is making it much tougher for radio to adapt. I know.. less regulation sounds like a "hair of the dog" cure but Apple, Internet radio, etc are not similarly handicapped.

"But, when the younger demo IS the only demo keeping your afloat, then a valid argument can be. made if you're seriously shooting yourself in the foot, per se, by giving away a device that could drive away segments of the demo you
need."

I'm scratching my head over this one.. are you saying thar iPods appeal to primarily teenagers? I have read this repeatedly on various radio-info.com boards and it causes me concern that this is so widely believed. It has become far more mainstream than that! And it happened in the blink of an eye.

"It's HOW you execute the promotion that is important. What are you doing with that promotion to make them come back? And that's all I'll say because I'll be damned if I am gonna give anymore details away for free! LOL"

There are good promotions and bad but I don't see how it makes any difference what the prize is. Your own post suggests that once they get a taste of iPod, they aren't coming back! I don't think that's true but opposition to giving them away reveals an insecurity that is very revealing.
<P ID="signature">______________
Jerry

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts" - late Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan</P>
 
Re: I'll go farther than that in my defense..

> I'm scratching my head over this one.. are you saying thar
> iPods appeal to primarily teenagers? I have read this
> repeatedly on various radio-info.com boards and it causes me
> concern that this is so widely believed. It has become far
> more mainstream than that! And it happened in the blink of
> an eye.

No, not at all. I think you're missing my point. I am sure you've seen the numbers that show which demographic uses radio the least and is more vulnerable to not use it, etc. A station giving away the iPod could use it to their advantage in so many ways (again, that's why stations hire promotions people...if they aren't thinking of this stuff, then I'll be damned if I'll give them ideas for free LOL).

> There are good promotions and bad but I don't see how it
> makes any difference what the prize is. Your own post
> suggests that once they get a taste of iPod, they aren't
> coming back! I don't think that's true but opposition to
> giving them away reveals an insecurity that is very
> revealing.

If a station wants to give them an iPod and "sent them on their way", that's their choice. Is it a bad promotion? Eh, depends on how one looks at it. It's not a smart move, IMO. A 'smart' promotion MAKES THEM want to come back -- with that iPod. Again, I don't doubt you know what I mean...as there are quite a few options out there that a station could use the iPod giveaway to their advantage.
 
iPod and Radio Stations - Get On There!

> If a station wants to give them an iPod and "sent them on
> their way", that's their choice. Is it a bad promotion?
> Eh, depends on how one looks at it. It's not a smart move,
> IMO. A 'smart' promotion MAKES THEM want to come back --
> with that iPod. Again, I don't doubt you know what I
> mean...as there are quite a few options out there that a
> station could use the iPod giveaway to their advantage.

I'm not so sure I'm in the "iPod giveway is a good idea" camp, but...

If a radio station is smart about this, they'll use iPod to their advantage. A good idea in my mind: to offer free podcasts of the best of your morning show or one or more of your talk shows. You can provide either whole segments, or just enough to entice people to turn on the radio to hear more. Or both. If you do whole segments, sell 'em to sponsors.

Since Apple introduced iTunes 4.9 with built-in podcast support, this has all changed dramatically. Podcasting right now is about to go through the roof (ask any podcaster what kind of traffic they've seen since 4.9 came out), and iPod users are going to tire pretty quick of the ones that sound like they were done in some guy's basement next to the washer/dryer. They'll WELCOME professional content, and your radio station can provide it.

On my iPod, I have segments downloaded from KOMO/Seattle and KSL/Salt Lake City. KOMO sends out some news and sports specials, and KSL sends out an entire hour of its morning news block! If your listeners are going to be spending time with iPod, why not put your station on their iPod?

-OA<P ID="signature">______________
Ohio Media Watch - <a target="_blank" href=http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com>http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com</a></P>
 
Re: iPod and Radio Stations - Get On There!

> > >
>
> A good idea in my mind: to offer free
> podcasts of the best of your morning show or one or more of
> your talk shows. You can provide either whole segments, or
> just enough to entice people to turn on the radio to hear
> more. Or both. If you do whole segments, sell 'em to
> sponsors.
>
> Great idea..but is the ''station in Alliance'' doing anything even remotely like that? Is anyone in Akron/Canton/Cleveland? If you're not, and you just hand someone the device thinking that they will stay with your station 'just because'', you're fooling yourself..
 
Re: iPod and Radio Stations - We Have A Winner!

> If a radio station is smart about this, they'll use iPod to
> their advantage. A good idea in my mind: to offer free
> podcasts of the best of your morning show or one or more of
> your talk shows. You can provide either whole segments, or
> just enough to entice people to turn on the radio to hear
> more. Or both. If you do whole segments, sell 'em to
> sponsors.

Ding ding ding!!! (insert 'winner' sfx and fire off the confetti cannons LOL).

That is EXACTLY what I was hinting at!!!!!
- Podcasting.
- other "i-clusive" content (and NO, no one has my permission to use that).

Ain't rocket science -- or even remotely close, ya know! ;)
 
Re: iPod and Radio Stations - We Have A Winner!

> Ding ding ding!!! (insert 'winner' sfx and fire off the
> confetti cannons LOL).
>
> That is EXACTLY what I was hinting at!!!!!
> - Podcasting.
> - other "i-clusive" content (and NO, no one has my
> permission to use that).
>
> Ain't rocket science -- or even remotely close, ya know! ;)


Taking that a step further, if you are a music station, load that I-Pod with music that is core on your station... As a CHR MD these days, I would be putting Mariah, Ciara, 50 Cent, 3 Doors Down, and the like on there, plus I would try to get a deal with a few of the labels to offer new releases available for download off of my station's website a few days before the full CD comes out. It also wouldn't hurt to put your brand all over that I-Pod... Z107.7 in St. Louis, where I do weekends, has ordered stickers that will fit on an I-Pod and keep the logo in the front of the listener's mind. You could also pre-load some of your station's imaging pieces in there so that when it's being used in shuffle mode, your imaging will pop up every so often, just to remind the person where they got their favorite new toy from.

Just my two cents worth..
<P ID="signature">______________
Aaron Tyler
Afternoons / MD
WVZA / Marion - Carbondale, IL
www.kissfm927.com

Weekends / Swing
KSLZ / St. Louis
WAKZ / Youngstown, OH
</P>
 
Re: iPod and Radio Stations - We Have A Winner!

> You could also pre-load some of your station's
> imaging pieces in there so that when it's being used in
> shuffle mode, your imaging will pop up every so often, just
> to remind the person where they got their favorite new toy
> from.
>
> Just my two cents worth..

If there's any way to give away an item that could lure your listeners away from you, it's this way. :D

But really, we all have to think outside that proverbial box, or whatever they call that overused phrase these days. A radio station that only tries to reach its listeners via the AM or FM frequency the FCC granted it is a radio station that will slowly die off.

Your listeners are on their computers, so you have to be, too. Why do you think Infinity is going head first into streaming audio after years of eschewing it? If your listener is sitting at a computer at work and can't pick up your AM station (or FM, even), would you rather he or she listen to you online, or listen to your competition?

And if your listener has an iPod...extend the brand. Brand it, produce it, even sell it to advertisers. (Yes, you can skip a "commercial" in a podcast, but you can front load audio with a sponsor hit, etc.) If I'm a Salt Lake City listener, it shouldn't matter to me if I get KSL's news/talk content via a small portable AM radio, a car or an iPod. It's still KSL, and their podcast even has commercials.

One note: CNN puts its hourly newscast (the first two minutes) up as a podcast, and updates that podcast each hour. It's an incredibly easy way to keep up to date with national news, as I'll get the last newscast they did before I disconnected the iPod from my computer. Why isn't every news or news/talk radio station in America offering this for their own local news? Heck, if the newscasts are timed, it can't take that much for an IT guy or gal to automate the process of doing it.

I'm surprised radio "gurus" aren't shouting this philosophy from the rooftops. Go where your listeners are looking for your content.

-OA<P ID="signature">______________
Ohio Media Watch - <a target="_blank" href=http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com>http://ohiomedia.blogspot.com</a></P>
 
Re: I'll go farther than that in my defense..

Id have to agree with Jerry's comments....but ill add more to support here. Although on paper iPods may seem cannabalistic....i was surprised how many more cd's people i know (including myself) bought after acquiring an iPod....just my opinion but I think in some way it stirs more interest in music...i just hope it benefits all

The other important thing which I have done some limited research in in the political world but not in music is podcasting....this seems to be a huge development for music lovers of all ages.....podcasting allows commentary on music or similar topics, allows one to try
/test new music and discuss it at the same time.....look at it as custom playlists that are portable......if i was giving away an iPod, I would have included some custom playlists with some marketing comments from my station on a business card cd or regular cd.....a couplen of progressive stations i have worked with in recent times are doing this for their content...in the music world, this could be a winner.....or Not....unfortunately my teams and co-workers in marketing research have not been able to gauge really good stats at this time...but we do feel with Itunes and other apps adding the feature of podcasting..that the idea is growing.

I find sometimes that youth have more $$$ for disposable income...they are and will be a cash cow for many marketeers in the future.


> I've wondered whether or not stations give iPods away and
> now I know it must be a rarity. I don't think it's stupid to
> do so. The iPod train has left the station and it ain't
> coming back regardless of whether or not radio stations give
> them away. At least stations giving them away can strive for
> some of the iPod hip factor to rub off. Pretending they
> don't exist won't work.
>
> Everyone in my family has an iPod but we still listen to
> radio, although the TSL for music stations is down. I
> believe in radio's long-term future. I'm just not too sure
> that the advertising model will be around forever and I
> think that's a good thing.
>
> It isn't just radio you know. Millions of peoplel(mostly
> college students with Internet2 access)are downloading and
> viewing current TVs shows automatically stripped of their
> commercial content. The mistake people make is that they
> dismiss young audiences because they have little money. What
> they forget is that youthful behavior doesn't change much as
> we age. Ten years from now, today's 19 year old downloading
> his media content will be a 29 year old downloading his
> media content.
>
 
Re: iPod and Radio Stations - Get On There!

> If a radio station is smart about this, they'll use iPod to
> their advantage. A good idea in my mind: to offer free
> podcasts of the best of your morning show or one or more of
> your talk shows. You can provide either whole segments, or
> just enough to entice people to turn on the radio to hear
> more. Or both. If you do whole segments, sell 'em to
> sponsors.
>
> Since Apple introduced iTunes 4.9 with built-in podcast
> support, this has all changed dramatically. Podcasting
> right now is about to go through the roof (ask any podcaster
> what kind of traffic they've seen since 4.9 came out), and
> iPod users are going to tire pretty quick of the ones that
> sound like they were done in some guy's basement next to the
> washer/dryer. They'll WELCOME professional content, and
> your radio station can provide it.
>
> On my iPod, I have segments downloaded from KOMO/Seattle and
> KSL/Salt Lake City. KOMO sends out some news and sports
> specials, and KSL sends out an entire hour of its morning
> news block! If your listeners are going to be spending time
> with iPod, why not put your station on their iPod?
>
> -OA

Ok thats it, im submitting myself as member #1 of the OA fan club....LOL
I wish i had seen your comment earlier.....further up in the thread I was just comparing / adding some comments about the future of podcasting as a potential interest for radio stations....we have been testing podcasting for the political /progressive stations i work with...but hadn't done a lot of research on the music side...but i strongly agree with your input here....i think its a winner to embrace rather than "poo-poo" technology.....

Tongue-in-cheek - my friend was joking about how porn/malware/spyware has been on the cutting edge for technology....i was laughing at how these industries will innovate then make mainstream their ideas...wonder what they are doing with iPods and podcasting...or should i say...porncasting...LOL...but seriously these guys have to be watched for innovation...despite our disgust with their content..
 
Re: iPod and Radio Stations - We Have A Winner!

> Taking that a step further, if you are a music station, load
> that I-Pod with music that is core on your station... As a
> CHR MD these days, I would be putting Mariah, Ciara, 50
> Cent, 3 Doors Down, and the like on there, plus I would try
> to get a deal with a few of the labels to offer new releases
> available for download off of my station's website a few
> days before the full CD comes out. It also wouldn't hurt to
> put your brand all over that I-Pod... Z107.7 in St. Louis,
> where I do weekends, has ordered stickers that will fit on
> an I-Pod and keep the logo in the front of the listener's
> mind. You could also pre-load some of your station's
> imaging pieces in there so that when it's being used in
> shuffle mode, your imaging will pop up every so often, just
> to remind the person where they got their favorite new toy
> from.
>
> Just my two cents worth..
>

Its a good two cents...HP as part of their licensing the ipod has provided free software to make "skins" that can be customized and removed as needed (short attention spans...LOL..maybe) but it would work to adjust to trends if radio stations put out an occasional skin that could be downloaded and printed by the users...
 
Re: iPod and Radio Stations - Get On There!

"I'm not so sure I'm in the "iPod giveway is a good idea" camp, but...
If a radio station is smart about this, they'll use iPod to their advantage. A good idea in my mind: to offer free podcasts of the best of your morning show or one or more of your talk shows."

Whoa! We went from giving away iPods to giving away content. This is exactly
what I'm afraid radio stations are going to start doing: Giving away their product as did newspapers online to their regret. It's very hard to start charging for that which people become accustomed to receiving for free. I suggest it's okay to give away iPods, but not necessarily beneficial. It's okay because they are so ubiquitous that ignoring them makes one look clueless.

Start giving content away and I'll have software to strip the spots out automatically faster than you can say Sirius. (Premiere is charging for their podcasts and very smart to do so.) Technology is not endangering radio in my opinion, it's threatening the advertising model. Since I like gadgets, computers and software, I make a sport out of avoiding advertising just to see how much I can avoid. It's getting easier and easier. It is my hope that media moves away from the so-called "free" model (whereby I am "charged" hideous amounts of my time to save miniscule amounts of money) in favor of subscription-based media.<P ID="signature">______________
Jerry

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts" - late Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan</P>
 
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