• Get involved.
    We want your input!
    Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.

    After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
    If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.

    After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
    https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/

    Thanks in advance and have fun!
    RadioDiscussions Administrators

Spring Arbitron Discussion Thread

D

DiamondJoe

Guest
As you may know, today is the release date of the Spring Arbitron book. I thought I'd start it by reminding everyone once again not to post ratings in your comments. If you wish to point out that one station went up or down, even to the extent of being as vague as saying "dropped a point" without specifics, it's okay. Everyone who wants the ratings information knows where it can get it.

They will be officially released this afternoon.<P ID="signature">______________


New York City Radio and TV</P>
 
> As you may know, today is the release date of the Spring
> Arbitron book. I thought I'd start it by reminding everyone
> once again not to post ratings in your comments. If you
> wish to point out that one station went up or down, even to
> the extent of being as vague as saying "dropped a point"
> without specifics, it's okay. Everyone who wants the ratings
> information knows where it can get it.
>
> They will be officially released this afternoon.
>

Winners
WBLS
Q-104
K-Rock
WCBS-AM
WFAN
WNEW
WMTR - Oldies - Showed up in NY book for 1st time in the last year....Coincidence?

Losers
Hot 97
Power 105
WABC
WCBS-FM
WPAT
WLIB
 
It was a good book for Infinity as their cluster went up while Clear Channel and Emmis as a whole both went down.
All the Spanish stations went down.<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by EvanJ1 on 07/18/05 09:33 PM.</FONT></P>
 
First off.. IT IS WAY TOO EARLY to look at the impact of the flips at 101.1 and 105.9 in this book. Only a couple weeks of the new formats are featured here.

That said...

The biggest winners in this book are WBLS, WAXQ, WNEW and WCBS.

The Urban wars are heating up again. The older focus on WBLS and the birth ok La Kalle could spur Power 105 to overtake Hot 97 for the first time in the coming months. Meanwhile WBLS has a nice rise as they position themselves head to head against Kiss.

It wasn't too long ago that Q104.3 was hanging around with WPLJ in the 2.0 to 2.5 range. Bob Buchmann and company has done a tremendous job building the station into a powerhouse. The refocusing at K-Rock hasn't hurt Q at all yet, and we've yet to see how much of an impact the changes at 101.1 will have. There hasn't been this much of an emphasis on Rock in the market since a decade ago when the ever shifting WNEW, Q104.3, and Z100 were battling for alternative listeners.

It's amazing what a little consistancy will do. WNEW has found a focus and has stuck with it. It's found it's niche against WKTU, and will be one of the primary locales for former CBS-FM listeners. I personally would love to see how much audience overlap WNEW has with WPAT as well seeing as Amor's drop has coincided with the rise at Mix.

880 hasn't had numbers this high in years either. The Yankees early season struggles put a higher emphasis on early season games than in past years, as has the sudden defection of listeners from WABC.

Which brings us to our biggest loser: WABC.

No other station has had as much of a drop recently as WABC. It's lost 1/4 of its audience since the Fall book. Granted the political climate has shifted much since then; no election, war in Iraq slowing, etc.. The station, much like many other talkers which has focused on a conservative political sound for so long has gotten stale. Talk radio has constantly reinvented itself, however that has not happened in quite awhile on the AM side.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>
 
Spring Arbitron/Oldies

Won't it be interesting to track CBS-FM over the next year? Their first month was awful but I don't think that should be a shock to any of us.

I note with surprise that WBZO on Long Island did not have a big jump in the Nassau-Suffolk book with Oldies going away on CBS-FM. Again, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too early to tell.

Yello, Infinity- bring Oldies back, put it on 102.7 FM and you might just improve on that #22 ranking you now have with WNEW-FM (and THAT was after going up a half-point!).
 
Re: Spring Arbitron/Oldies

> Won't it be interesting to track CBS-FM over the next year?
> Their first month was awful but I don't think that should be
> a shock to any of us.
>
> I note with surprise that WBZO on Long Island did not have a
> big jump in the Nassau-Suffolk book with Oldies going away
> on CBS-FM. Again, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too early to tell.
>
> Yello, Infinity- bring Oldies back, put it on 102.7 FM and
> you might just improve on that #22 ranking you now have with
> WNEW-FM (and THAT was after going up a half-point!).
>
It's still too early to tell whether or not WCBS-FM benefitted from flipping to Jack. The flip was in early June, and the Arbitron period ended around the 20th. We should definitely be looking toward the coming books to see what will happen to Jack and the others.

Also, K-Rock seems to be up, despite the grief that a lot of posters on the board had. K-Rock is sticking to playing the bigger hits, but most AORs these days are keeping their playlists tight, only playing the big Zeppelin, AC/DC and Aerosmith songs in with the high-charting currents. K-Rock could emphasize on the 90s and early 2000s in my opinion and get a younger audience.

In addition, I noticed that PLJ got a little boost. Not much, but every little bit counts. It'll be interesting to see what happens between WPLJ, WNEW, WCBS-FM, WKTU and WLTW in the coming months. It seems that those stations are sharing about 60%, even more, of each other's playlists. I would like to see WPLJ go a little hotter AC, kind of like WBMX in Boston and try to lure listeners from Z100. It will be interesting to see if one of the many AC/hot AC/dance AC stations decides to jump ship.

It's kind of ironic how the market that has the most available FM frequencies seems to have the least amount of variety on the dial. No country, AAA or oldies stations anywhere. Hmmmm...

Jacko<P ID="signature">______________
I live for my dream,
And a pocket full of gold.
</P>
 
Re: Spring Arbitron/Oldies

> Won't it be interesting to track CBS-FM over the next year?
> Their first month was awful but I don't think that should be
> a shock to any of us.

In 25/54, it may not have been so awful. We get the real months tomorrow, and it will be interesting to see how it kicked off in sales demos. What they lost appears to be the over/55 folks.
 
Spring Arbitron/Oldies

lousy 25-54 month (June). Again, not surprising at this very early stage.
>
> In 25/54, it may not have been so awful. We get the real
> months tomorrow, and it will be interesting to see how it
> kicked off in sales demos. What they lost appears to be the
> over/55 folks.
>
 
Slightly off-topic...

> It's kind of ironic how the market that has the most
> available FM frequencies seems to have the least amount of
> variety on the dial. No country, AAA or oldies stations
> anywhere. Hmmmm...
>
> Jacko
>

Yeah, exactly. I'm not sure you can say that NYC has the most available frequencies from the standpoint of commercial radio however -- since 93.9 and 99.5 are taken by non-commercial stations. Wouldn't that mean that either Chicago or LA, for example would arguably have more frequencies available for commercial stations.

This may sound like nitpicking, but I don't mean it to sound that way. In fact, I think it holds the answer to why formats like country, oldies, or AAA are not represented here (or at least, are consigned to suburban rimshot signals) while "smaller" markets like LA, Chicago, or for that matter Detroit, has got 'em.

Having said that, I'm personally a big fan of public radio and don't bemoan the fact that these frequencies have non-commercial stations on them. I think actually this begs the question, what could be done with a more market-friendly format on WFME 94.7???
 
Re: Spring Arbitron/Oldies

> Won't it be interesting to track CBS-FM over the next year?
> Their first month was awful but I don't think that should be
> a shock to any of us.
>
> I note with surprise that WBZO on Long Island did not have a
> big jump in the Nassau-Suffolk book with Oldies going away
> on CBS-FM. Again, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too early to tell.
>
> Yello, Infinity- bring Oldies back, put it on 102.7 FM and
> you might just improve on that #22 ranking you now have with
> WNEW-FM (and THAT was after going up a half-point!).
>
The changeover for WCBS to JACK and B103 getting a clear playing field to itself on Long Island will not be reflected in this book. The final "month" runs only 19 days after the June 3rd flip of 'CBS...as Spring 2005 diaries were in on June 22nd.
 
> First off.. IT IS WAY TOO EARLY to look at the impact of the
> flips at 101.1 and 105.9 in this book. Only a couple weeks
> of the new formats are featured here.
>
> That said...
>
> The biggest winners in this book are WBLS, WAXQ, WNEW and
> WCBS.
>
> The Urban wars are heating up again. The older focus on WBLS
> and the birth ok La Kalle could spur Power 105 to overtake
> Hot 97 for the first time in the coming months. Meanwhile
> WBLS has a nice rise as they position themselves head to
> head against Kiss.
>
> It wasn't too long ago that Q104.3 was hanging around with
> WPLJ in the 2.0 to 2.5 range. Bob Buchmann and company has
> done a tremendous job building the station into a
> powerhouse. The refocusing at K-Rock hasn't hurt Q at all
> yet, and we've yet to see how much of an impact the changes
> at 101.1 will have. There hasn't been this much of an
> emphasis on Rock in the market since a decade ago when the
> ever shifting WNEW, Q104.3, and Z100 were battling for
> alternative listeners.
>
> It's amazing what a little consistancy will do. WNEW has
> found a focus and has stuck with it. It's found it's niche
> against WKTU, and will be one of the primary locales for
> former CBS-FM listeners. I personally would love to see how
> much audience overlap WNEW has with WPAT as well seeing as
> Amor's drop has coincided with the rise at Mix.
>
> 880 hasn't had numbers this high in years either. The
> Yankees early season struggles put a higher emphasis on
> early season games than in past years, as has the sudden
> defection of listeners from WABC.
>
> Which brings us to our biggest loser: WABC.
>
> No other station has had as much of a drop recently as WABC.
> It's lost 1/4 of its audience since the Fall book. Granted
> the political climate has shifted much since then; no
> election, war in Iraq slowing, etc.. The station, much like
> many other talkers which has focused on a conservative
> political sound for so long has gotten stale. Talk radio has
> constantly reinvented itself, however that has not happened
> in quite awhile on the AM side.
>



First of all it is nine years this month that q104.3 has been a classic rock station. Even through the sale from Viacom to Clear Channel and changes in personnel and so on, the station has maintained its overall purpose and is now obtaining good numbers.

I agree with your observations especially when it comes to WABC. This morning, I tuned into the drive time show and the station sounds old to me. I can't put my finger on it but it sounds like it needs some energy in its overall air sound.

Every year during rewound, Phil Boyce says he wants to have the station sound the same as it did when it was a top 40 rocker. In other words at least on the air, he wants to make the audience feel that what they are doing now has the same feel as the 21+ years when they had the All Americans and they rocked.

Does he really feel that way or is this just a image thing that he wants to project?

WABC never was negative when it was musicradio77 and it never insulted the listeners. Unfortunately talk radio tends to do that now in my opinion.
 
What do Cousin Brucie and Sean Hannity have in common?

> Every year during rewound, Phil Boyce says he wants to have
> the station sound the same as it did when it was a top 40
> rocker. In other words at least on the air, he wants to
> make the audience feel that what they are doing now has the
> same feel as the 21+ years when they had the All Americans
> and they rocked.
>
> Does he really feel that way or is this just a image thing
> that he wants to project?
>
> WABC never was negative when it was musicradio77 and it
> never insulted the listeners. Unfortunately talk radio
> tends to do that now in my opinion.
>
That's a laugh. What do nasty right wing talk show hosts and Top 40 radio from the 70s have in common? Nothing. That's just about as absurd as Hot 97 saying it wants to remind its listeners of NPR. Get real. Try programming something other than negativity and animosity 24/7.
 
Re: What do Cousin Brucie and Sean Hannity have in common?

No comparison between the way radio then and now is, this is comparing apples and monkeys, NOTHING in common!

Until HD becomes the standard (which won't be for a while), music will remain on FM.

> > Every year during rewound, Phil Boyce says he wants to
> have
> > the station sound the same as it did when it was a top 40
> > rocker. In other words at least on the air, he wants to
> > make the audience feel that what they are doing now has
> the
> > same feel as the 21+ years when they had the All Americans
>
> > and they rocked.
> >
> > Does he really feel that way or is this just a image thing
>
> > that he wants to project?
> >
> > WABC never was negative when it was musicradio77 and it
> > never insulted the listeners. Unfortunately talk radio
> > tends to do that now in my opinion.
> >
> That's a laugh. What do nasty right wing talk show hosts
> and Top 40 radio from the 70s have in common? Nothing.
> That's just about as absurd as Hot 97 saying it wants to
> remind its listeners of NPR. Get real. Try programming
> something other than negativity and animosity 24/7.
>
 
Re: What do Cousin Brucie and Sean Hannity have in common?

> That's a laugh. What do nasty right wing talk show hosts
> and Top 40 radio from the 70s have in common? Nothing.
> That's just about as absurd as Hot 97 saying it wants to
> remind its listeners of NPR. Get real. Try programming
> something other than negativity and animosity 24/7.

The whole point is building passion from your audience. The most successful stations all have that. WABC had it in the MusicRadio era and is now trying to find it again.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>
 
Re: Spring Arbitron/Oldies

> > Won't it be interesting to track CBS-FM over the next
> year?
> > Their first month was awful but I don't think that should
> be
> > a shock to any of us.
> >
> > I note with surprise that WBZO on Long Island did not have
> a
> > big jump in the Nassau-Suffolk book with Oldies going away
>
> > on CBS-FM. Again, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too early to tell.
> >
> > Yello, Infinity- bring Oldies back, put it on 102.7 FM and
>
> > you might just improve on that #22 ranking you now have
> with
> > WNEW-FM (and THAT was after going up a half-point!).
> >
> The changeover for WCBS to JACK and B103 getting a clear
> playing field to itself on Long Island will not be reflected
> in this book. The final "month" runs only 19 days after
> the June 3rd flip of 'CBS...as Spring 2005 diaries were in
> on June 22nd.
>


While the discussion on Jack continues, here's one that may amuse you guys. In All Access there's a help wanted ad from Infinity broadcasting seeking "street people" to take out the Jack van (and whatever else they have) and represent the station at remotes and other functions. This involves interaction with listeners, etc.

I'm sorry, but knowing the passion that still runs high for CBS-FM I think I'd rather take my chances on the streets of Iraq! 7 bucks an hour to go out and get pelted with garbage?? I don't think so!

Rock on!
 
Status
This thread has been closed due to inactivity. You can create a new thread to discuss this topic.


Back
Top Bottom