Still editing songs in 2024?

[OldYeller]

It's been stated in other discussions on RD that this is a limiting factor that keeps radio stations from adopting hip-hop formats that could appear to younger listeners. Bleeps will take you only so far.


Which are....?

I believe the real issues come back to revenue, as traditional media is climbing a steep hill just to survive. National advertising has seen a significant drop-off in most markets, with the shiny new outlet being digital. While national doesn't typically make up the majority of the revenue pie...it has started and is creeping into the local revenue. We've all watched this unfold for the past decade...but most haven't adjusted the radio model.
Hats-off to iHeart, as they seem to have the best grasp on the digital component. Townsquare has done well, too. But....most of radio is simply following the herd and hoping for a different outcome. The ad-based model with ridiculous stopsets aren't helping to solve the issue. Is it time for a new model for terrestrial radio?
I'm not smart enough to know the answer and I'm not convinced that radio won't just fade away at some point. Sad to say, as a radio "lifer".
As crazy as Lee Abrams' ideas seemed a few years ago....he's pretty damn smart.
Sorry for the rant!
Cheers

 

[Kelly A]

I believe the real issues come back to revenue, as traditional media is climbing a steep hill just to survive. National advertising has seen a significant drop-off in most markets, with the shiny new outlet being digital. While national doesn't typically make up the majority of the revenue pie...it has started and is creeping into the local revenue.

Actually for larger groups, national is becoming most of the pie. Local direct is expensive (overhead) and harder to sell. Sure, Ma and Pa stations only have local direct clients because they have no shot at national. But for the same reason as large markets, local direct is on a downward slide.

We've all watched this unfold for the past decade...but most haven't adjusted the radio model.

Really? How so?

 

[bobdavcav]

Actually for larger groups, national is becoming most of the pie. Local direct is expensive (overhead) and harder to sell. Sure, Ma and Pa stations only have local direct clients because they have no shot at national. But for the same reason as large markets, local direct is on a downward slide.

Really? How so?

I thought it was you Kelly who said radio never recovered from 2008. Looking at this from the outside, it's clear to me that the industry is not healthy and hasn't been since at least 2020, and it has really been on display this year. Until December 2020, the number of licensed stations continued to grow, though AM itself has been declining since at least 1995. The only area that's still growing seems to be NCE. Translators, commercial FM, and LP are all shrinking. To add to that, this year seems to be the year of the cuts, with Alpha, Cox, and Beasley all having made major cuts within the last couple months, Audacy in bankruptcy, Bonneville making cuts earlier this year, and Salem selling assets.

 

[EricStein]

A few things:

1. Alt 103.7 in Dallas-Fort Worth has been playing both Panic! At The Disco - I Write Sins Not Tragedies and Harvey Danger - Flagpole Sitta unedited for quite some time now.

2. I heard Ginuwine - Pony recently and the word “horny” was edited. That was the first I’ve heard that song with that word edited out and it seemed kinda weird.

This version was played on WGCI Chicago when it was a current in 1996. I didn't know there were more stations that would play that version.

3. Does anybody remember when rock stations played Alice In Chains - Heaven Beside You unedited? They sing “f-cked up” 3 times in that song.

KUPD in Phoenix would play that version in their pre-Hubbard days. Same with the album version of Candlebox's "You."

 

[TheBigA]

Alpha, Cox, and Beasley all having made major cuts within the last couple months,

FYI so has Amazon, Apple, Sirius, Paramount, and we just got notice yesterday about Discovery. This is not a radio-only thing.

Warner Bros. Discovery to lay off nearly 1,000 staffers amid calls from analyst to ‘explore stategic options’

Warner Bros. Discovery reportedly is slashing 1,000 jobs as the struggling media giant faces calls to sell off assets that include ratings-challenged CNN. The layoffs, which began earlier this mont…

nypost.com

 

[EricStein]

FYI so has Amazon, Apple, Sirius, Paramount, and we just got notice yesterday about Discovery. This is not a radio-only thing.

Warner Bros. Discovery to lay off nearly 1,000 staffers amid calls from analyst to ‘explore stategic options’

Warner Bros. Discovery reportedly is slashing 1,000 jobs as the struggling media giant faces calls to sell off assets that include ratings-challenged CNN. The layoffs, which began earlier this mont…

nypost.com

Of course, a Murdoch outlet would take a jab at CNN whenever they can.

 

[Kelly A]

I thought it was you Kelly who said radio never recovered from 2008.

It didn't. Station valuations fell through the bottom after the recession.
The difference is advertising, most of which prioritizes digital or social media rather than traditional media. That wasn't the case in 2008/2009.

Looking at this from the outside, it's clear to me that the industry is not healthy and hasn't been since at least 2020, and it has really been on display this year. Until December 2020, the number of licensed stations continued to grow, though AM itself has been declining since at least 1995. The only area that's still growing seems to be NCE. Translators, commercial FM, and LP are all shrinking. To add to that, this year seems to be the year of the cuts, with Alpha, Cox, and Beasley all having made major cuts within the last couple months, Audacy in bankruptcy, Bonneville making cuts earlier this year, and Salem selling assets.

I hope I'm wrong, but it's looking more that because larger groups are counting on political advertising to keep their collective boats afloat in Q4. If not, chances are good there will be even deeper and wider cuts across the board.
In other words, it's likely going to be a tough holiday season.

 

[kevtronics]

It didn't. Station valuations fell through the bottom after the recession.

Also the introduction of PPM brought inflated ratings down to reality.

 

[bobdavcav]

It didn't. Station valuations fell through the bottom after the recession.
The difference is advertising, most of which prioritizes digital or social media rather than traditional media. That wasn't the case in 2008/2009.

I hope I'm wrong, but it's looking more that because larger groups are counting on political advertising to keep their collective boats afloat in Q4. If not, chances are good there will be even deeper and wider cuts across the board.
In other words, it's likely going to be a tough holiday season.

Is political advertising much bigger in swing states? Now living on the border between two states with two very different election cycles, I get a lot more political advertising than I used to. Still, for the past several election cycles, it seems TV has been the dominant media candidates use. Case in point, I heard one add for a legislative district east of me on the radio this morning, having listened for about an hour and a half. In the same time period on TV, I'm probably going to get half a dozen or more political adds. Come October, almost every TV add is going to be political, but you can still listen to radio for a fairly long period and either not hear a political add or count on one hand the number of political adds you hear.

 

[Kelly A]

Is political advertising much bigger in swing states?

It is, but recent history has shown radio gets nowhere near what local TV gets in buys from the campaigns and PAC's.

Come October, almost every TV add is going to be political, but you can still listen to radio for a fairly long period and either not hear a political add or count on one hand the number of political adds you hear.

And it's not like radio won't see anything, but as I mentioned it seems like radio has bet large on making up for declining ad revenue this past two years with some form of political ad blitz. I'm just not confident that's anywhere near a safe bet.

 

[CCBInMI]

In the mid-'90s, Canadian singer-songwriter Jann Arden released a song called "Good Mother" which included the lyric in verse two: "All the rusted, tangled, dented, God-damned miseries." Most Canadian radio stations - even AC stations - I had the opportunity to hear played the song uncut, but there was one in southwestern Ontario - if memory serves, CKSY-FM in Chatham - which chopped out not only that line, but the entirety of verse two.
Overall, though, it's been my experience that Canadian radio stations are more permissive when it comes to language. I can remember 89X in Windsor/Detroit playing Alanis Morissette's "Hand in My Pocket" with the word "chicken sh*t" uncensored.

 

[CentralFL]

Wasn't "Bitch" by Meredith Brooks a #1 hit in the 1990s. I think I remember Casey Kasem announcing it.

In Orlando, the audacy stations play more questionable words than I Heart Radio.

 

[E-Cam]

Lest we forget the mother (or father) of all unedited versions that some, if not all, rock stations at the time were spinning circa 2000-2001 and that is Down With The Sickness by Disturbed. I don't know how it passed through FCC rules, but David Draiman was dropping s-bombs and f-bombs here and there, even had the "no mommy, don't do it again. I'll be a good boy" segment still airing but cuts off the "f-off and die" portion.

Since then, more rock stations are airing a radio edited version by censoring the s and f words, and cutting the "no mommy" section completely (although I think some iHeart rock stations are still airing part of the "no mommy" section).

 

[fordranger797]

Lest we forget the mother (or father) of all unedited versions that some, if not all, rock stations at the time were spinning circa 2000-2001 and that is Down With The Sickness by Disturbed. I don't know how it passed through FCC rules, but David Draiman was dropping s-bombs and f-bombs here and there, even had the "no mommy, don't do it again. I'll be a good boy" segment still airing but cuts off the "f-off and die" portion.

Since then, more rock stations are airing a radio edited version by censoring the s and f words, and cutting the "no mommy" section completely (although I think some iHeart rock stations are still airing part of the "no mommy" section).

Ironically, I’m sure a lot of people couldn’t actually tell what the lyrics of that song actually are!

 

[Kelly A]

Ironically, I’m sure a lot of people couldn’t actually tell what the lyrics of that song actually are!

They do, but to some editing out words or phrases makes the radio versions inferior. Especially so when, unlike the old days, you can hear the unedited version via streaming.

 

[boombox4]

Lest we forget the mother (or father) of all unedited versions that some, if not all, rock stations at the time were spinning circa 2000-2001 and that is Down With The Sickness by Disturbed. I don't know how it passed through FCC rules, but David Draiman was dropping s-bombs and f-bombs here and there, even had the "no mommy, don't do it again. I'll be a good boy" segment still airing but cuts off the "f-off and die" portion.

Since then, more rock stations are airing a radio edited version by censoring the s and f words, and cutting the "no mommy" section completely (although I think some iHeart rock stations are still airing part of the "no mommy" section).

But with Disturbed the music was so kick@ss that editing out the s & f bombs didn't really detract from the song all that much.

Most people who liked the song (and band) went out and bought the CD album and could hear the unedited version as much as they wanted. And by 2001, MP3's were also a thing. 2001 was when the IPod and ITunes hit the scene.

 

[fordranger797]

But with Disturbed the music was so kick@ss that editing out the s & f bombs didn't really detract from the song all that much.

Most people who liked the song (and band) went out and bought the CD album and could hear the unedited version as much as they wanted. And by 2001, MP3's were also a thing. 2001 was when the IPod and ITunes hit the scene.

You’re darn right. If I recall, KISW plays the radio edit of that song (obviously). It never stops me from listening to it. It’s a badass song either way.