What a waste to put any Talk or sports on FM. It's not that hard to switch to AM on the radio. I'm sure the younger generation isn't stupid. They can figure it out that there's a switch and can read that it says AM. I don't get it. In Philly, they turned of WYSP and simulcasted it with their AM Sports? Why? I don't understand. Change the format to some music format. It's killing FM radio and people yes can get music from anywhere. However, I don't want to have to pay to hear music. I don't believe that this is fair. I don't want to purchase an HD Radio. I want what I have now, free music on my radio. It doesn't make any sense to me.
-
Get involved.
We want your input!
Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.
After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.
After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/
Thanks in advance and have fun!
RadioDiscussions Administrators
Talk on FM. It's a waste
- Thread starter XCountry285
- Start date
XCountry285 said:
Two generations of Americans have grown up on FM; they won't listen to AM unless forced to... such as sports. So, most AMs are very 55+ heavy, and since agencies don't buy geezer demos, they are being hurt badly as the AM audience ages.
When a successful AM news talker moves to FM or adds FM, it has been seen to improve the 35-54 numbers immensely in some cases, and just greatly in others.
This move gives FM the full variety of formats and options for those who will not listen to AM at all.
What will be interesting is to see what happens to AM in the future.
Jeff Deck makes a very good AM radio. Unfortunetly a lot of AM's are HD, talk, or foren language programming. There's also radio Disney too.
Of corse this could just be my area of Philly.
When in The Villages, i can get WRZN (which I like sometimes), and WVLG which plays Oldies with a live local presents.
Jeff Deck makes a very good AM radio. Unfortunetly a lot of AM's are HD, talk, or foren language programming. There's also radio Disney too.
Of corse this could just be my area of Philly.
When in The Villages, i can get WRZN (which I like sometimes), and WVLG which plays Oldies with a live local presents.
Unfortunately, AM radio is a technology whose time is slowly coming to an end, just like the telegraph, 45-rpm-singles and 33-1/3-rpm LP records, typewriters, phone booths and the horse and buggy.
All the new devices in our lives and the new high voltage electric lines along major roads create electrical noise that makes AM listening uncomfortable. The younger generations, especially women, have no reason to listen to AM and nobody is going to force them to. The free market is making the decision that AM should do a slow fade.
In the New York radio market, the three 50-kw non-directional AMs on clear channels, along with 50-kw directionals WINS and WOR have respectable ratings numbers, the rest are basement dwellers or don't show at all.
It's not just a problem in the US. In Canada they have been shutting down AM stations for years, and some of the 50-kw stations left, like Toronto's Zoomer Radio 740, are aimed at the retirement age demo.
In Europe, Australia, New Zealand, Malaysia, and India they are switching the AM Medium Wave band to full power digital broadcasting, that provides the fidelity of FM on the old AM frequencies. Ultimately, that is likely the way things will go in this country, but we will have to wait for many of the AM stations to die first. Let's hope the US follows the international standard.
The switch of AM talk formats to FM, or simulcasts is coming on rapidly because of competitive forces. Earlier this summer, Chicago got two FM all news stations, Philly got its second sports talk FM station, and last week Boston got its second FM sports talk station, and this week a Classic Rocker was dropped in D.C. and its FM channel is simulcasting a Washington talk station.
It looks like the change will happen faster than many people would have guessed since one competitor switching an AM format to FM gives it an advantage and the other competitors are being forced to follow suit. So, that means two, or more, stations switch instead of just one. Pretty soon you run out of FM music stations to bump. The Classic Hits FM dumped recently in Boston had respectable ratings, despite the fact that there were no DJs, and was profitable but its owner is more interested in being the sports leader in that market and its AM sports station no longer is because of a two year old FM rival.
Everything must change, nothing stays the same, the young become the old, and technologies become obsolete. AM had its glory days, but they are over and progress marches on. That said, I still think it will be years before the NYC 50-kw non directional AMs become obsolete for electrical noise and technical reasons, but their current formats may have to be moved to FM long before that happens just to get the younger audience.
Of course, FM itself is under threat from internet radio, WiFi and other new technologies, but that is for another thread and another time.
All the new devices in our lives and the new high voltage electric lines along major roads create electrical noise that makes AM listening uncomfortable. The younger generations, especially women, have no reason to listen to AM and nobody is going to force them to. The free market is making the decision that AM should do a slow fade.
In the New York radio market, the three 50-kw non-directional AMs on clear channels, along with 50-kw directionals WINS and WOR have respectable ratings numbers, the rest are basement dwellers or don't show at all.
It's not just a problem in the US. In Canada they have been shutting down AM stations for years, and some of the 50-kw stations left, like Toronto's Zoomer Radio 740, are aimed at the retirement age demo.
In Europe, Australia, New Zealand, Malaysia, and India they are switching the AM Medium Wave band to full power digital broadcasting, that provides the fidelity of FM on the old AM frequencies. Ultimately, that is likely the way things will go in this country, but we will have to wait for many of the AM stations to die first. Let's hope the US follows the international standard.
The switch of AM talk formats to FM, or simulcasts is coming on rapidly because of competitive forces. Earlier this summer, Chicago got two FM all news stations, Philly got its second sports talk FM station, and last week Boston got its second FM sports talk station, and this week a Classic Rocker was dropped in D.C. and its FM channel is simulcasting a Washington talk station.
It looks like the change will happen faster than many people would have guessed since one competitor switching an AM format to FM gives it an advantage and the other competitors are being forced to follow suit. So, that means two, or more, stations switch instead of just one. Pretty soon you run out of FM music stations to bump. The Classic Hits FM dumped recently in Boston had respectable ratings, despite the fact that there were no DJs, and was profitable but its owner is more interested in being the sports leader in that market and its AM sports station no longer is because of a two year old FM rival.
Everything must change, nothing stays the same, the young become the old, and technologies become obsolete. AM had its glory days, but they are over and progress marches on. That said, I still think it will be years before the NYC 50-kw non directional AMs become obsolete for electrical noise and technical reasons, but their current formats may have to be moved to FM long before that happens just to get the younger audience.
Of course, FM itself is under threat from internet radio, WiFi and other new technologies, but that is for another thread and another time.
55 year olds aren't old. Thats ridiculous to say that younger people won't turn on AM radio. I'm young and I put on 880 sometimes to hear Yankee Games or 660 to listen to Giant games when I'm driving. In West Milford I have no problem picking up any NYC FM or NYC AM, so why is it hard for others?!
Does the average car HD radio “scan” AM HD as well as FM HD when the “scan” button is pushed? It should. The AM band really needs a major “reallocation”. The FCC should assign all of the class “D” AM’s with a COL of less than 50,000 to Class D FM. 250 watt or less translators. These signals should count against ownership caps. Set up 5 or six more “local channels” like the current class C 1230, 1240, 1340, 1400, 1450, and 1490 channels for the class D stations that can not fit in the FM spectrum. If you are an owner of an existing translator and this pushes you over the ownership cap then you have five years to sell the translator only to a class D operator that has to move. If the owner of an over cap translator can not or will not sell after 5 years then the license is revoked and the owner of the over cap translator get a tax credit for the book value of the translator and that allocation is put up for “auction” to “homeless” class D AM operators only. The moved class D’s that migrated from AM will be “protected” signal wise in the future just like a regular station (of course the current A, B, and C’s allowed interference in the class D’s signal will stay the same but not be allowed to increase). Then remain A’s and B’s on AM will run IBOC or if something is better that will not kill the existing AM receiver radios on at 15khz.daytime, (there should be room now with the D’s gone) 10 kHz night.
XCountry285, the answer is very simple. You can skip all the marketing fluff and supposed 'improved' results that makes consultants giddy but the fact is this...It boils down to money. Plain and simple. If you can simulcast a station and cut all that overhead, branding and staff where the only gain is potentially more listeners, why wouldn't you? Better yet, no music licensing fees! Cha-ching! The trend is only going to continue, not slow down.
XCountry285 said:
They won't. That's been proven for over 30 years. My generation (I'm 56) was the last to listen to AM on a regular basis for music, and that was only until FM rock became mainstream in the early '70s. Once we got rock on FM, AM was toast except for listening to a game. Now that's going to FM as well. It's also been online for years, and for a reasonable price (or free, in the case of the NBA , NHL, and some colleges).
Even in the '60s, there were only a few - like a half-dozen or so, and that included WABC, WLS, WCFL, CKLW, etc. at night - stations per market catering to folks younger than 30. AM radio even then was geezer-fare, with programming that was the remnants of the pre-1955 "Old Time Radio" era: Long-form news, farm reports, Arthur Godfrey, Don McNeil's Breakfast Club, ad nauseum, were the norm on "full service" stations for "adults." Boring.
Sports is the last viable format on AM, and it's moving to FM as well. The big sports stations like WFAN and WSCR in Chicago will be sticking around for some time to come, but look for both to simulcast on FM in the next couple of years. Their all-news sister stations in NY and SF are already doing so.
Unless you are a 40-year-old housewife or her 18-year-old daughter, there just is no room for music on FM anymore. And even the daughter has better places to find her favorite music. So do her 55-and-up relatives, since we are no longer part of the Sacred Sales DemosTM. Want blues? You have to go online. Pre-1970s oldies? Same thing. Classic country? Jazz? Ditto. Sure, there are a few stations playing these kinds of music, but it may be only a few hours a week, and other than country, they're probably on a non-comm. But again, unless you happen to be in range, you'll be listening online, not on FM, and certainly not on AM.
XCountry285 said:
First of all I agree with you. The reason I got into radio was because of music.
However, the music industry, record labels, and artists don't like free music on FM. When their music gets played on digital media, they get a royalty. But not on FM. So they've cut back on services for OTA radio. They've been campaigning in Congress to get their royalty. They claim airplay of music doesn't help their sales. Just last week, the founder of Pandora spoke at a broadcasters convention in Chicago demanding that broadcasters pay this royalty. If the music industry doesn't appreciate the free airplay they get, and what it does for their artists and sales, then maybe it's time to stop the music on radio.
J
jhguthlac
Guest
Talk on FM is a waste? That's a crock.
WIP is to Philadelphia what WFAN is to NYC. WPEN decided to challenge 610. Zip. Maybe 0.5 to 1.0. Then they put their sports talk on FM. It sored and WIP went down. So in order tofight back, WIP is now AM & FM.
Likewise in news radio. WTOP in DC moved to FM. Number 1 in DC. Now, WBBM in Chicago will be AM & FM.
AM is on life support. Its over.
WIP is to Philadelphia what WFAN is to NYC. WPEN decided to challenge 610. Zip. Maybe 0.5 to 1.0. Then they put their sports talk on FM. It sored and WIP went down. So in order tofight back, WIP is now AM & FM.
Likewise in news radio. WTOP in DC moved to FM. Number 1 in DC. Now, WBBM in Chicago will be AM & FM.
AM is on life support. Its over.
E
ebownedcc
Guest
Talk on FM won't work at all if they don't have good content people want...
XCountry285 said:
For ad revenue, they might as well not exist.
L
Laurence Glavin
Guest
I remember when I was a yute and got my first good FM radio. It turns out that I listened to REAL music that took advantage of the capabilities of FM (I recall that the first piece of music I heard on FM was Beethoven's Seventh Symphony with glorious droning double-basses under the rhythmic top of the rest of the orchestra), but I was really bowled over by the presence of the human voice talking (as long as it wasn't a network feed). Announcers and lecturers seemed to be right in the room. Now talk shows are routinely heard on FM, and AM seems more and more dated. And I currently have an excellent AM radio for listening to Stephanie Miller among others. If she were on FM, that would almost take away the reason to have an AM receiver of high quality.
DavidEduardo said:
They do a pretty good job advertising to mostly seniors during daytime TV everyday,
Price is right, Jerry Springer, etc (HoverRound, Liberty, AARP, etc).
I'd think most people watching those 2 shows are under age 60, and the latter one under age 40.
TheBigA said:
They do get a royalty when it's played on the station's stream.
AM radio is dying and as such its content is moving to FM. The next generation will grow up listening to Internet radio and 40 years from now, we'll be having this same conversation about FM and the AM band will be given to the hams.
- Status