Talk radio ... and its old listeners

[oldmanradio]

http://www.sacbee.com/1190/story/2324415.html

 

[OKCRadioGuy]

Yup. Most of them are old and crotchety men. Personally, I can't understand why the ad agencies would buy talk radio but neglect older formats like oldies and smooth jazz, etc. It's the same OLD people demo, but if it's talk, all of a sudden it's OK with agencies it seems. I suppose it's about a logical as the big boys overpaying for stations up to something like 15 times cashflow or so. Lots of things in radio just don't make any sense at all...

 

[donicus]

Yup. Most of them are old and crotchety men. Personally, I can't understand why the ad agencies would buy talk radio but neglect older formats like oldies and smooth jazz, etc. It's the same OLD people demo, but if it's talk, all of a sudden it's OK with agencies it seems. I suppose it's about a logical as the big boys overpaying for stations up to something like 15 times cashflow or so. Lots of things in radio just don't make any sense at all...

Just for the record, I'm not crotchety. And I'm only 50, so I don't consider myself old. While I don't listen to local radio, except for Hal Jay, I do listen to some talk shows on my sat radio. And personally, I hate smooth jazz, I like my rock and roll (even a little metal now and then). So where do I fit in? Apparently, nowhere. ;D

 

[radioaircheck]

Agencies will not think outside the box. They think they know more than anyone else. I worked in radio and hated dealing with agencies. I have no use for them. They don't have the radio stations best interest in mind when it comes to advertising. They miss the boat on so many demo's such as an older demo. They spend money too. Agencies need to get their head out of their a---- s and wake up!

 

[salemjedi54]

Its real simple, those crotchety old men have money to spend. Talk is a demo made for 35-54 year old men.

Radioaircheck, I agree with you. Folks over the age of 45 buy things as well. My father is 63 years old, never owned a PC or Mac, but has an iPhone. Why would he need a iPhone but can't even use half of the stuff?

Folks over 45 need toilet tissue and soap too.

 

[little1]

They need shampoo and soap, but they're also MUCH more likely to tell you "I've been using Head and Shoulders for 30 years, why change now?"

While that 30 year old is much more likely to believe that women will smell their hair in a nightclub and try to rip his clothes off right there on the dancefloor, all because he used Axe bodywash and shampoo...

Google it. Older people are much more set in their buying habits. So Johnson and Johnson can spend twice as much trying to convince the 50 year old to buy product B instead of product A, or they can take the same shampoo formula, market it under a different brand ('Product C, it'll drive the women crazy!!!) and spend half as much to get twice as many 20-somethings to start using their product.

See: "product life cycle".


(And SJ- your dad doesn't 'need' an iphone, especially if he's not using half it's features. Most likely he got sucked into the 'with it' trap- why go with that old phone, that's just a phone, when all the cool kids are getting these iphones. But do you think Apple (or AT&T, whoever) is going to talk Dad into that boring plain cell phone when their profit margin is higher on iphones....)

 

[salemjedi54]

They need shampoo and soap, but they're also MUCH more likely to tell you "I've been using Head and Shoulders for 30 years, why change now?"

While that 30 year old is much more likely to believe that women will smell their hair in a nightclub and try to rip his clothes off right there on the dancefloor, all because he used Axe bodywash and shampoo...

Google it. Older people are much more set in their buying habits. So Johnson and Johnson can spend twice as much trying to convince the 50 year old to buy product B instead of product A, or they can take the same shampoo formula, market it under a different brand ('Product C, it'll drive the women crazy!!!) and spend half as much to get twice as many 20-somethings to start using their product.

See: "product life cycle".


(And SJ- your dad doesn't 'need' an iphone, especially if he's not using half it's features. Most likely he got sucked into the 'with it' trap- why go with that old phone, that's just a phone, when all the cool kids are getting these iphones. But do you think Apple (or AT&T, whoever) is going to talk Dad into that boring plain cell phone when their profit margin is higher on iphones....)

You are right, he does not NEED and iPhone, but he bought one. So again he saw something in it for him to buy it. I still think you can market products to the over 50 crowd. I don't care what the numbers say.

 

[317C50KW]

Tom Taylor mentioned in today's Radio Info column that NPR just conducted a study and found it too suffers from aging listeners.

It wouldn't surprise me if their P-1's had psoriasis and warts.

But it also answers the musical question "where have all the hippies gone."

 

[Lancer]

Likely most young people are less tolerant of the same ole same ole talk day after day. Why listen to that when you have an Ipod with 20,000 songs on it? Or at least music radio has a new song every now and again, unlike talk which is the same tired drivel over & over.

 

[sayitaintsojoe]

There’s a reason agencies and advertisers spend a lot of money with talk radio and not with smooth jazz. Talk radio gets results! They move product! And they are talking to an audience that has the money to spend. Good old capitalism at it’s best. If it didn't work....would you hear ANY spots on talk radio????

If you want to hear Smooth Jazz…get an iPod. If you want to hear what’s going on in the world around you…listen to talk.

 

[OKCRadioGuy]

I think it's mainly an illusion that talk gets more response than other older demo formats. Oldies, for example, done correctly, gets results too. The thing is (as others have mentioned), agencies have a concept in their brain that anyone over about 50 isn't worth talking to, unless it's talk. It's a strange concept that doesn't follow logic. Personally I think all older skewing formats are penalized by agencies when they shouldn't be. My only point is that the rules seem to change when it comes to "talk radio". For the guy that's 50, that's probably on the lower end of the normal talk demo. I like oldies and I'm no where in the normal demo of the format. We are talking about the majority of listeners, not a few here and there ya know...

 

[OKCRadioGuy]

Someone brought up NPR so I'll add to it. They are currently very concerned about the older demo they have. Since they are funded by listener support more than underwriting (support by stations that are lister supported mainly), they shouldn't care but they seem to be now caught up in the concern about getting too "old". Again, something that makes no sense to me. These are the same bunch in Washington, DC that likes to charge stations a ton of money for their programming then give it away on their web site they use stations' air to promote it with. Stations are generally treated like they are the dinosour media yet that's still where over 95 or better percent of the audience still is. Preceptions can certainly be different than reality!

 

[Turtle Creek]

They can have my bottle of Prell when they pry my cold, wet hands off it

 

[adub]

It's funny I never hear Cialis & Viagra spots. Agencies represent the advertiser not the stations. That's why they don't care. Smooth jazz does not work for the older demo's. It puts them to sleep. :

 

[davideduardo]

The thing is (as others have mentioned), agencies have a concept in their brain that anyone over about 50 isn't worth talking to, unless it's talk. It's a strange concept that doesn't follow logic. Personally I think all older skewing formats are penalized by agencies when they shouldn't be.

This is a totally erroneous set of assumptions.

First, agencies genenerally don't determine the demos of a buy. The agency accounts do.

Clients do extensive research on who buys by age and why, and this research determines things ranging from packaging to marketing. The clients then tell their agencies who their customers are so the agency can design campaigns and buy media to reach that target.

Generally, over-55's are not the target of advertising by the kind of goods that buy radio, but it is because of the return on investment... it takes more ads to get a sale from older consumers, and often the cost of the ads exceeds the profit on the sale.

 

[davideduardo]

Agencies will not think outside the box. They don't have the radio stations best interest in mind when it comes to advertising.

Ad agencies represent their clients. Their only interest in radio stations is to get the best rates from them whn they are used on a buy. That's it. They aren't supposed to have the interests of a radio station in mind.

 

[longtimelistener]

They need shampoo and soap, but they're also MUCH more likely to tell you "I've been using Head and Shoulders for 30 years, why change now?"

While that 30 year old is much more likely to believe that women will smell their hair in a nightclub and try to rip his clothes off right there on the dancefloor, all because he used Axe bodywash and shampoo...

Google it. Older people are much more set in their buying habits. So Johnson and Johnson can spend twice as much trying to convince the 50 year old to buy product B instead of product A, or they can take the same shampoo formula, market it under a different brand ('Product C, it'll drive the women crazy!!!) and spend half as much to get twice as many 20-somethings to start using their product.

See: "product life cycle".


(And SJ- your dad doesn't 'need' an iphone, especially if he's not using half it's features. Most likely he got sucked into the 'with it' trap- why go with that old phone, that's just a phone, when all the cool kids are getting these iphones. But do you think Apple (or AT&T, whoever) is going to talk Dad into that boring plain cell phone when their profit margin is higher on iphones....)

Little one is correct.

 

[longtimelistener]

A few thoughts:

1.The author clearly does not like talk radio.

"if the demographic radio trends continue, he and the rest of talk radio's partisan ilk – left or right – may have little audience to talk to about it.

Maybe that won't be such a bad thing"

2. His bias makes me wonder how a sacramento freelancer got access to Major Market & national PPM numbers and question the veracity of some of his numbers:

"The first wave of PPM numbers is out for Sacramento and there's a stunning revelation: Nearly half of Rush's listeners are over age 65. This trend holds true in Los Angeles, San Francisco and nationwide. According to Arbitron, the radio ratings service that developed the PPM concept, nearly two-thirds of talk radio's listeners are over age 50 (half of them also over 65), 90 percent are over age 35 and almost 90 percent are white."

3. I am a 58 yr. old Baby Boomer. Be the author's opinion aside, as I said above, Little1 is correct about the whole brand preference for a lot of ever-day consumer goods. ALL the advertising in any medium is not going to make me switch from coke to pepsi.

While KISS is a likely spot for an agency soft drink national/regional buy and for certain local business that cater to the teens that aren't listening to their ipods, WBAP and other major talk stations are better buys for certain higher-priced goods & services. I'm more likely to buy national/regional agency business services for my company and area lake-front property than a 20 something is.
Radio is still a good place to spend advertising dollars for certain products. TV works better for others. Same thing for the internet. The beat goes on.

 

[oldmanradio]

A few thoughts:

1.The author clearly does not like talk radio.

"if the demographic radio trends continue, he and the rest of talk radio's partisan ilk – left or right – may have little audience to talk to about it.

Maybe that won't be such a bad thing"

That may have been tongue firmly in cheek.

2. His bias makes me wonder how a sacramento freelancer got access to Major Market & national PPM numbers and question the veracity of some of his numbers:

His wife is general manager of The Wolf in Sacramento. And he is a former talk-show host in California..

Frankly, he should have made such disclosures known in his opinion piece.

"The first wave of PPM numbers is out for Sacramento and there's a stunning revelation: Nearly half of Rush's listeners are over age 65. This trend holds true in Los Angeles, San Francisco and nationwide. According to Arbitron, the radio ratings service that developed the PPM concept, nearly two-thirds of talk radio's listeners are over age 50 (half of them also over 65), 90 percent are over age 35 and almost 90 percent are white."

Do you disagree that Rush's listeners are older?

Do you think many 30-year-old listeners tune in to Rush?

3. I am a 58 yr. old Baby Boomer. Be the author's opinion aside, as I said above, Little1 is correct about the whole brand preference for a lot of ever-day consumer goods. ALL the advertising in any medium is not going to make me switch from coke to pepsi.

It's Coke and Pepsi -- two brand names. Capital C and Capital P.

But I agree with one exception: most younger listeners would not switch from Coke to Pepsi or vice versa just because of a saturation of commercials.

iWhile KISS is a likely spot for an agency soft drink national/regional buy and for certain local business that cater to the teens that aren't listening to their ipods, WBAP and other major talk stations are better buys for certain higher-priced goods & services. I'm more likely to buy national/regional agency business services for my company and area lake-front property than a 20 something is.
Radio is still a good place to spend advertising dollars for certain products. TV works better for others. Same thing for the internet. The beat goes on.

And on ... and on ... Sonny and Cher

Sonny and Cher.

 

[TheBigA]

There’s a reason agencies and advertisers spend a lot of money with talk radio and not with smooth jazz. Talk radio gets results! They move product!

I agree. This is a big problem for music radio in general. Music radio listeners view commercials as interruptions and annoyances, regardless of number. Talk listeners don't share that opinion. When Stern was on broadcast radio, he ran 20 minutes of commercials and hour in two 10-minute blocks. Do that in music, and no one will listen.

Regarding the age of the listeners, I attribute that to the age of the hosts. Do you know any 30 year olds who hang around with 55-year olds? People tend to hang with people their own age, not older or younger. The reason there are so many older listeners for talk radio is the hosts are mainly old white men. The only reason Stern got younger listeners is he deals with subjects they're interested in, in a way that appeals to them.