Television channels in other countries

[Neel]

When I travel outside of North America, I notice that over the air TV stations are not assigned a particular channel, but they have to be tuned in to the TV. So basically you can assign a network to whatever channel you want. I always wondered how this worked and couldn't find much about it on wikipedia or elsewhere. Do TV stations in other countries broadcast on the same frequency as US TV stations (ch 2-69)? or those countries using PAL have different frequencies all together. Are they equivalent to our UHF and VHF?

In a way it's kind of cool...for example in Australia, the call the networks simply seven, nine, and ten so no matter where you are in the country, you can assign the nine network channel 9.

 

[azumanga]

Do TV stations in other countries broadcast on the same frequency as US TV stations (ch 2-69)? or those countries using PAL have different frequencies all together. Are they equivalent to our UHF and VHF?

No -- stations in the Americas use the same frequencies, though they are different in other countries. Even in Japan, where they have different VHF frequencies for NTSC there. Even among PAL and SECAM countries, frequencies may differ.

This Wikipedia article explains more of this in detail:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_channel_frequencies

 

[w9wi]

When I travel outside of North America, I notice that over the air TV stations are not assigned a particular channel, but they have to be tuned in to the TV. So basically you can assign a network to whatever channel you want. I always wondered how this worked and couldn't find much about it on wikipedia or elsewhere. Do TV stations in other countries broadcast on the same frequency as US TV stations (ch 2-69)? or those countries using PAL have different frequencies all together. Are they equivalent to our UHF and VHF?

In a way it's kind of cool...for example in Australia, the call the networks simply seven, nine, and ten so no matter where you are in the country, you can assign the nine network channel 9.

Stations in Europe actually do have channels in the same sense as American stations. Those channels are generally in the same spectrum (more or less) as American stations.

(though they're phasing out VHF) (Japan does use different frequencies for low-band VHF)

Remember some of the TVs out of the 1970s here, where you used a little thumbwheel to tune each button to a channel? Or, on some Sonys at least, you scanned a channel into each button. That's more or less what happens in Europe. On modern TVs in the States, you scan in all the channels - and you can assign a name to each channel. Again more or less the same thing happens over there.

In Australia, the major networks did manage to land the same channels in the largest cities. "Channel 7" actually does broadcast on channel 7 in Sydney, Melbourne, and Adelaide; "Channel 10" on channel 10 in those cities, etc... More or less the same thing ABC tried to do here in the States with channel 7.

That does fall apart in smaller cities where "Channel 7" might actually be on channel 8. (I would imagine they use the same kind of channel labeling technology used in Europe)

 

[BRNout]

Well, the channel 'numbers' often correspond to the seniority or priority of the network. For example, in the UK, BBC-1 is their flagship, BBC-2 is their secondary, ITV was the first independent commercial channel. Most British televisions in the 70's programmed channels to slots (as aptly described by Neel) so that BBC-1 was in 1st place, BBC-2 was second and ITV was third. So, when additional independent OTA channels were approved, they became known as Channel 4 and Five, based on their respective premiere dates.

However, all analogue TV in Britain is on UHF so not one of the described channels is located at 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5! Similar stories can be told of channels in other countries, where the number describes the level of service more than the dial position.

Australia is probably more similar to the US with regard to the "Channel 7" moniker, but that is an exception. In most countries, over the air TV is dominated by public channels and those are located at pretty random channel numbers. Look to Canada as a 'local' example where channel number is very rarely used to identify a station.

Outside of the US, most stations are "branded" much as a cable network would be. Not by channel number - as the programming is usually national and rarely local.

And, transmission tends to be through a network of low-powered local transmitters on various channels...even within the same region.

One place that I know of that is much like here is Costa Rica. It's a relatively small country and its broadcasters use a system of on-channel repeaters around the country. There are only 2 significant commercial broadcasting companies there: Repretel (operating channels 4, 6 and 11) and TeleTica (operating channel 7). Each channel is identified strongly by number, just as we do here. Nicaragua and Panama do the same thing with certain stations as well.

Outside of those countries, stations in the rest of Latin America are branded. Venezuela, which has stations such as TeleVen, VT, Globovision, Venevision, and RCTV (now cable only - thanks to Chavez' disapproval of their 'opinions'), provides a fine example of this. If you have an OTA television, as most do in a place like Venezuela, you just have to dial around to find the proper station. People get used to it, just as our parents did.

 

[bpatrick]

Isn't the VHF band in Japan Channels 1-12?

 

[Markxxx]

An idea that floated around was to try and give each network a virtual channel in the 70s, when digital TV took hold. For instance "The CW" would be on Channel 71 in every city on the digital channel. In other words it would map to it's old analog channel as well as a channel in the 70s.

So like channel 9 WGN would be on actual channel 19, virtual channel 9 (it's old analog channel) and Channel 70.

Since new digital tuners can tune in more than one virtual channel, that isn't a problem. But it never went over big.

 

[azumanga]

An idea that floated around was to try and give each network a virtual channel in the 70s, when digital TV took hold. For instance "The CW" would be on Channel 71 in every city on the digital channel.

Since new digital tuners can tune in more than one virtual channel, that isn't a problem. But it never went over big.

Mainly due to FCC regulations, in which virtual channel numbers must be the same as analog, and, apparently, there could only be one virtual channel number.

 

[pabsungenis]

Once the DTV transition is completed in the U.S. and we see new stations applying for allotments again, how long before we see someone apply for a station with a PSIP virtual channel number of 37?

 

[w9wi]

Once the DTV transition is completed in the U.S. and we see new stations applying for allotments again, how long before we see someone apply for a station with a PSIP virtual channel number of 37?

Won't happen. New stations are required to use their RF channel as their major virtual channel, and RF channel 37 is still off-limits in the DTV world.

 

[arc23]

why cant you use 37 ? is it govt thing , or just a retired number?

 

[necrat123]

The frequencies used by Channel 37 (608-614 MHz) are valuable to astronomers for radio astronomy.
There is something about this range that is very important to them, and to this day, they still claim the importance of it.

 

[pabsungenis]

Yes, but virtual channel numbers have nothing to do with real channel numbers. A TV station could be broadcasting on DT channel 14, for example, and identify as Channel 37.

 

[BRNout]

But what's the incentive to virtually track to 'channel 37'? That channel number does not represent a familiar "brand" anywhere, thanks to the prohibition against its use. So, there's no reason for anyone to do it.

 

[MotoMuzak]

Well, there could be....for example a local/indie niche channel comprising its schedule of, say, science-fiction & astronomy programming daytimes and NASA Select nights could brand itself as being on channel 37, while it's actually on 36 or 38.

"STAR 37", anybody?? ;o)

Just a thought...........

 

[pabsungenis]

Well, let's take a theoretical example.

In Atlantic City, NJ, there was an allocation for Channel 36 to be non-commercial Public TV, which had not yet been applied for when the DTV process began.

WMGM-TV 40 licensed to Wildwood, NJ (about 30 miles south of A.C.) was given 36 as their DTV assignment, and they've elected to stay on 36 even though they're still going to be known as "NBC 40."

If someone wants to build a new non-commercial station in the Atlantic City market, they would most likely apply for and get the old Channel 40 allotment, since it would be easier to prove a lack of interference on a frequency that had been allocated before the whole transition started. They couldn't call themselves "Channel 40" no matter what the regulations say, since WMGM-DT is still "Channel 40." They wouldn't want to call themselves "Channel 36" because that would directly conflict with the actual channel allotment for WMGM-DT. What channel number would be available in those situations, and never conflict with anything past or present? The one channel number that was never assigned to anyone: Channel 37.

 

[dhett]

In the theoretical example you cite, the FCC's rules require that the new station ID as channel 36, even though they're actually on 40.

Again, speaking theoretically, any station should be able to use a virtual channel number of 37. However, in practice, in the United States, the FCC has set down rules for virtual channel identification.

There is one reason a station might want to ID as channel 37: if their assignment on the dominant cable system is channel 37, but that's not likely, as stations on the most basic tier of cable is usually assigned a channel between 2 and 30 (more or less). But even if the station was assigned to cable channel 37, the FCC regs on virtual channel ID are specific.

 

[Markxxx]

There's nothing to stop anyone from mapping to Channel 37, except the FCC. WCIU-TV Channel 26 (DT 27) mapped to Channel 1, till the FCC told them to quit it.

The problem is not all digital tuners are created equal. The newer generations are much better.

For instance I know of a man south of Philly and on certain nights he can pull in BOTH Channel 2 from Baltimore and Channel 2 from New York City on one TV with a fifth generation tuner, but the other TV he has has a fourth generation digital TV tuner won't let him. It'll pull in ONE of the channel 2's and then he has to enter the actual number of the second channel 2.

Of course not many people live in areas where you can point an antenna in a direction and pick up two different stations on the same channel.

 

[dhett]

Of course not many people live in areas where you can point an antenna in a direction and pick up two different stations on the same channel.

No, but when LPTV goes digital, it could get sticky, as the LPTV repeater is supposed to use the primary station's channel number as its ID. Case in point: Kingman, Arizona. KAET 8 Phoenix is repeated on ch. 49 in Kingman, while KLAS 8 Las Vegas is on ch. 31. Who will ID as ch. 8?

It'll be even worse in Bullhead City, Arizona, and its neighbor across the river, Laughlin, Nevada. From Phoenix, Bullhead City has KTVK 3, KPHO 5, KAET 8, KSAZ 10 and KNXV 15, while from Las Vegas, Laughlin has KVBC 3, KVVU 5, KLAS 8, KLVX 10 and KINC 15. Who gets what?