The Beat VS. K-HITS

[radiogooob]

will The Beat ever be able to "beat them?"

 

[DogEStyle]

Not they way they are trying now, if you call that effort trying. No music in the mroning has to kill them, after that it's a puzzle pieced together with voice tracking and low to no street presence. K-hits can be better, they are on a lot of billboards today, maybe they're nervous.

 

[JetBlack1015]

Apparently neither one of you have access to any numbers but the "beauty pagent" 12+....If you did, you'd see that we are beating K-Hits in every daypart 18-34 (both station's target). I can't leagally quote specifics, but I can say that 6a to Mid 18-34 we're winning, 6a to 10a 18-34 we're winning, 10a til 3p 18-34 we're winning, 3p to 7p 18-34 we're winning and during my show, 7p to Mid, we're dominating again. As well, weekends we've been consistently beating them for well over a year now. Where it matters, we're winning. They haven't mass marketed that radio station in YEARS, to say that they are trying to stop the bleeding is a good assumption, to say billboards will do it is not. We're not heavily voicetracked, BTW, we're live in the AM drive, PM drive, at night during my show and on the weekends.

The 12+ love that K-Hits is getting is from a fairly strong 25-54 showing, while we still are showing alot of growth in that demo, that is the one place they are beating us. And that's fine by me.

 

[DogEStyle]

That's a load Jet. Two questions;

1. Who's winning the battle for the dollar?
2. So you DO NOT voice track the back end of your show?

 

[JetBlack1015]

A load huh? Find someone with access to the latest trends and look for yourself, I refuse to get into a pissing match with someone on this site reguarding what they speculate as fact, it is a waste of my time and yours.

And to answer your questions...

1) I don't work on the sales side of this building, I don't have access to market billing info. I don't lie about anything I throw out there with my name on it, so I can't honestly tell you anything in that reguard.

2) I have a 5 hour show, to say the "back end" of my show I really don't know what you mean. I will say that YES I do track ONE hour of my show some nights. VTing one hour of a five hour show doesn't make a station or a show "puzzle pieced together with voice tracking." The fact is, I'm in the market, period.

 

[DogEStyle]

Thanks for admitting the VTing question. I do believe you.

As for the money, I don't have the details either but from listening to both it seems they bury the Beat in revenue. Maybe it's their success with the older listeners as you said.

One thing I do know is that your guys in the AM sure talk about them. Is that smart?

 

[JetBlack1015]

Thanks for admitting the VTing question. I do believe you.
Anytime, I don't lie about stuff, there's no need.

As for the money, I don't have the details either but from listening to both it seems they bury the Beat in revenue. Maybe it's their success with the older listeners as you said.
Don't mis-construe more spot load with more money. Our Less Is More plan allows for more content with fewer spots, but again I don't know how much they are billing so I don't have anything to compare it to. I just know that listener research shows the perception of KHTT is that they play an ENORMOUS amount of commercials, and that's just bad for everyone.

One thing I do know is that your guys in the AM sure talk about them. Is that smart?
If it's point out their weaknesses, why not. So far it has worked, and if you listen quite a bit you'll notice that they've been talking about them less and less. Right now the focus is on NARD vs. [EDIT], the UFC Fight of the Century at the Greenwood Cultural Center this Friday.

[EDIT-inappropriate language]

 

[DogEStyle]

So all that being said, what is in store for us all to see? Predictions????

 

[ElCheapo]

Not a commentary on either station, but here in the "red states" it's entirely possible (and typical) that a mainstream CHR can get its butt kicked in every daypart and demographic by a rhythmic competitor and still win the revenue battle.

 

[radiocommentary1]

1) KTBT will beat KHTT in the 12+, in addition to their already existing 18-34 lead, ratings within the next six months.. if not sooner.

2) The K-HITS morning show is STALE, beginning with Carly Rush. It would not surprise me if Tod Tucker, Jon Phillips, and Mark St. John are looking around for someone to replace her.

3) I can't say much about the current night jock, but KTBT has had the better show for the past year or so.

4) KHTT is WAY TOO RHYTHMIC, not to mention that there are some very suspicious titles in rotation right now. It makes me wonder if there isn't some shady activity going on in the Copper Oaks building these days? Does KHTT still use an independent promoter?

4B) KHTT is WAY TOO TIGHT. Has anyone else noticed how much music they've dropped in the past month or so that a true CHR ought to be playing?

5) Those new jingles (TMCentury's KISSville package, I believe) sound gawd-awful. Bring back the KIIS ReelWorld package!

Just a few thoughts..

 

[DogEStyle]

Very detailed insight, from the inside maybe?????

What about the Beat mr. commentary? Would love to hear why the Beat is better.

 

[radiocommentary1]

"From the inside?" Nope, just from what I've observed hearing both stations live and on their respective streams. I have friends in the Tulsa area that I go out there to see on a fairly regular basis and K-HITS has been on a downhill slide, musically IMHO, for about the past eight months. As far as my comment on the morning show.. have you heard it lately? Stan the Jokeman and Lunchbox are holding that show together right now, Carly Rush is adding very little to the table.

I question the style of show that KTBT has on in the morning, but outside of that I believe KTBT to be the better radio station because it's tighter in presentation and IS WHAT IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE, unlike KHTT. KHTT is a CHR/POP that is abandoning records that it should be ALL OVER, as the only CHR/POP in the market.

Plus, again in my humble opinion, KTBT has better jocks from top to bottom.

 

[radiobratt]

I am always amazed at the comments from people on here. The wanton speculations, half facts and outright misleading statements are sad. I am not going to comment on anything KHITS programming plans because frankly that is no ones business but KHITS. As for the BEAT however, if you take a hard look at the ratings as you suggest Jet, you will see KHITS has the dominant cume and a listener profile that most advertisers want. ALL of the beats growth has come from frankly a less than desirable demographic. Perhaps that explains their listeners calling up and talking about "cheating on people and smoking crack".
I don't know about you but that's not very good radio or compelling radio. The fact of the matter is KHITS is the dominant CHR in the market with heritage. Certain radio companies have been gunning for KHITS for years. They tried to do it with KISS, they tried to do it with KISS & The Beat. While the Beat has some traction, if anyone seriously thinks the management of KHITS is going too idly sit by you are sadly mistaken.

Music content and imaging on KHITS:

For anyone to claim to know what KHITS should be playing or that they are too rhythmic or they aren't playing the right records simply goes to so show the ignorance that exists. KHITS has a long history of playing records that work for Tulsa. Who doesn't look at Mediabase and to national trends however at the end of the day they play what works for KHITS and the Tulsa market. They are cutting edge on music selection and play HITS. The last time I checked CHR's should have a tight play list. What rhythmic titles are KHITS playing that aren't hits? What rhythmic titles shouldn't KHITS play? What about Panic At The Disco, Hinder, All American Rejects, Snow Patrol, Blue October...those aren't rhythmic titles and yet KHITS has played the hell out of them. So clearly whomever you are that thinks you know what KHITS should be playing, maybe you should be the PD of the station before you presume to speak for what works for KHITS. As for the jingles. Jingles are clearly a subjective taste. What sounds good to one may not to the other. The fact of the matter is they are stepping out on a new trend in Jingles. Have you ever listened to some of the older Reel World packages? They were not that great. Kissville is fresh and clean sounding. Sorry if once again KHITS is a trendsetter that some people can't handle. But then again if KHITS programmed the music and imaging to people like you I guess they would sound more like a cookie cutter Clear Channel or lifeless Cumulus Station instead of an original standout radio station that people are passionate about.

With all of that said, I am glad to see a true radio battle. It's good for the listeners and it's good for people in radio. Would you rather be working for a station like KHITS who marches to the beat of its own drum and is successful both in terms of revenue and broadcasting excellence or a company like Cumulus who dictates everything to its programming staff? Or a station like the BEAT who appeals to the lowest common denominator, the worst things about radio and could careless about the market or the listeners they broadcast to everyday. HMMMM... that choice is easy for me!

 

[radiocommentary1]

You had to make me do it, didn't you? You had to make me pick apart your playlist, didn't you? Okay, here you go:


DANITY KANE - Showstopper.

75 spins on this song? This has got to be one of the absolute worst records of the year! It MIGHT test well with the extreme younger end, but I'd be very surprised to see 25-34 callout be worth a damn.


BELOW THA SURFACE - Sooner Girl

Listen, I'm well aware that you're in Oklahoma and this is football season. But give me five good reasons why a novelty song should be #6 on your playlist? Before you give me an answer of "phones," where are your phones coming from? For that matter, do you have personal reference to those phones? In other words, how do you know you don't have a jock or two screwing with their request logs? We all know how accurate those can be when you get someone that particularly likes a song and they personally would like to see it played more..


YUNG JOC - Goin' Down

You can't tell me that a late 20something mom in a minivan wants to hear that drivel 30x/week. Again, you might have phones, you might have some callout, but where is it coming from? The younger end? Oh, that's great.. that younger end sure does spend a TON of money with the upscale retail advertiser! I'm sure they just waltz in there with their $20 weekly allowance and just go buckwild.


BLUE OCTOBER - Hate Me

To see that song at less than 30x is disgraceful. That song is a power, period, because - unlike some of the other crap above it on your playlist - it has mass 18-34 and perhaps even older appeal.


BLAKE O - O'La

Who? What? Payola? Probably.


CADILLAC DON & J MONEY - Peanut Butter and Jelly

This one's not so bad.. oh wait, KHTT isn't an URBAN? My bad..


Top 40 Songs That You Either Are Not Playing or Have Buried at Less Than 20 Spins

SNOW PATROL - Chasing Cars
BLUE OCTOBER - Hate Me
FRAY - How to Save a Life
RASCAL FLATTS - What Hurts the Most (The Hot Mix)
NICK LACHEY - I Can't Hate You Anymore
KT TUNSTALL - Black Horse and the Cherry Tree [You NEVER played this?]
FORT MINOR - Remember the Name
JOSH HOGE - 360
CHRISTINA AGUILERA - Hurt



Oh, and did I mention that you have WAY TOO DAMN MUCH REVERB ON THE MICS? I'd love to see the wave forms on-screen in your phone editor when the jocks try to record bits with callers! How much do you want to bet that I'd see a wave form that peaks like this ----------------------- rather than something like this -'-'-'-'-'-'-'-'-'-'-'-'-'-''-'-'-''-''-'--, you know, a wave form that actually gives a jock some room to do fine edits on an exact spot in the wave form without having to attempt it three dozen times?

 

[Givers]

damn you have a point about the mics the sound bad. here is what KHTT needs http://www.bswusa.com/proditem.asp?item=6200AT

 

[EZ Hits]

Mr. Commentary,

Exactly which #1 station in what market are you the VP of programming for? You seem way over qualified for this board, but seriously-thank you for gracing us with your wisdom.

Jon Phillips

 

[Givers]

Right Way+Wrong Way+Cheap way=The Renda Way. oh and hey DC thats funny.

 

[thecook]

hey radiocommentary1,
want some "colby" cheese on that bitterness sandwich?

 

[JetBlack1015]

WOW! I didn't ever think that this thread would spark such passion and dis-taste among the readers of this board, but this is radio info, I shouldn't ever be shocked.

While I disagree and frankly don't appreciate your "analysis" Matt, It's good to hear from you none the less, it's been what 5 years since we last spoke? But, I'd be willing to have a private conversation with you individually reguarding what you refer to as "The wanton speculations, half facts and outright misleading statements" that I've listed in my previous posts. You and I both have access to the numbers and breakouts in their individual demos and dayparts and what I list as FACT is exactly that, what you are listing as fact, which to quote you would be "ALL of the Beat's growth has come from frankly a less than desirable demographic" and "KHITS has the dominant cume and a listener profile that most advertisers want," is total speculation and personal preference as there is no solid data to support that, just mere numbers. While I understand your loyalty to your company, as it should be, I would suggest re-evaluating your statement as to not contridict your own words. Besides, I kinda felt like your statement was a bit of a personal attack, and I thought you would be above that.

As for the basis of this thread, which I think we've all gotten too far away from, is that both stations have their positivies and negatives. Any compeditive situation will have this kind of feature. But both stations have talented individuals, in their own right respectively, and on a personal level i've been friends with most of the staff at K-Hits for most of my career and longer. It's competition that makes it better for the listener, I'm ok with it, are you Matt?

 

[JetBlack1015]

P.S.
cookie cutter Clear Channel = Incorrect, maybe a few years ago it was more of a truth, but when you own most of the stations in the format it's hard NOT to sound alike. It's simple math. We don't have corporate mandates or playlists, imaging is done locally by Chase and myself as is the music and we don't have anybody breathing down our neck about what we have to do or not do.

lifeless Cumulus Station = VERY true. Enough said.